Right now I am getting ready to run East1-2 here is what I have and what I could use some suggestions for:
East1-2 Minis:
- Gnoll Adept - Demonic Gnoll Priestess #46 Blood War D&D Miniatures
- Gnoll Pack Runners - Gnoll Marauder #31 Dungeons of Dread D&D Miniatures
- Hyena Welps - Hunting Hyena #47 War of the Dragon Queen D&D Miniatures
- Crocotta - Hyena #67 Harbinger D&D Miniatures
- Halfling Campers - Halfling Sneak #19 Underdark D&D Miniatures
- Zombie Abomination - Yuan-Ti Anathema #10 Against the Giants D&D Miniatures or Yuan-Ti Abomination #59 Aberrations D&D Miniatures (not sure he is a large base)
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There's also the Yuan-Ti Champion of Zehir (Desert of Desolation). The Anathema is Huge sized, which I don't think is the correct size for the zombie, though I only played the mod - never saw the actual description.
There's the Gnoll Demon Adept (Demonweb), as well.
There's the Gnoll Demon Adept (Demonweb), as well.
I like to choose a mix plastic and metal minis to find minis representative of the type of monster (goblins, etc.) but that aren't all the same (three exactly the same minis to represent three goblin blackblades). Instead, I use something the miniatures have in common so I can remember what they are. For example, the ones with swords might all be blackblades, while the ones with other types of melee weapons are a different goblin type. Because I'm using so many different figures, it doesn't tactically hurt the game - I know what they are and the players see goblins. (If they make their knowledge checks, I tell them what they learn based on the DC, but not things like "minion" that aren't normally part of the check).
Unlike Alphastream, I prefer to run with matched sets of minis. The last thing I need when running a large battle is to lose track of which random mini is representing which monster.
He used Starburst candies as the bad guys and put a number on them to keep track of which was which. When you killed the enemy you got to eat the starburst.
While I like having a close resemblance in minis, I did enjoy the use of starburst alot too
I've also toyed with the idea of making certain creatures "better" candies than others, or making elites "nastier" ones. I'm pretty certain if I used black licorice as a Sharran, most people would avoid attacking it if they HAD to eat it. (Myself, I'd go right for him. Black licorice is AWESOME.)
Back on topic, I've put together a fairly good combination of things for CORM1-1: The Black Knight of Arabel. Below is my list.
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Encounter 1:
Shadow Creatures: There really aren't creatures exactly as Mike Lee describes, so miniatures are hard to come by. The Shadow from Night Below would be a good representation of the Seekers, but I've only got one, so that's really not an option. For the Seekers, I grabbed several Mad Slashers I received as a GM Reward a LONG time ago, and used them in this and subsequent battles. The Motes were just whatever monstrous Small figures I could grab; as minions, they weren't going to be around long. The Hulks and Juggernauts were the only two similar Larges I had: Marids. Not exactly optimal, but it's worked just fine.
Oh, and Dark Skull? Lord Soth. Placing his figure out there tends to worry people.
Encounter 2:
Shadow Creatures: Same as Encounter 1.
Encounter 3:
Dark Skull: Same as Encounter 1, only this time, they fight him. Maybe.
Encounter 4:
Shadow Creatures: Same as Encounter 1.
Cultists: The module says these guys are citizens of Arabel, so I grabbed whatever commonery looking people I could and used them. Dalelands Militia, Human Commoners, and so on make up these guys. For the Initiates, I used Human Bandits from Harbinger. The stats say they have chakrams, and I think the round shield they have can visually double as that.
Nightcloak: As an elite, he should look cool. I chose a character I figured that would inspire a desire to beat up and brag about defeating. Thus far, everyone has instantly gravitated towards being the guy who beat up Driz'zt, so I think that choice is a success.
Encounter 1:
Shadow Creatures: There really aren't creatures exactly as Mike Lee describes, so miniatures are hard to come by. The Shadow from Night Below would be a good representation of the Seekers, but I've only got one, so that's really not an option. For the Seekers, I grabbed several Mad Slashers I received as a GM Reward a LONG time ago, and used them in this and subsequent battles. The Motes were just whatever monstrous Small figures I could grab; as minions, they weren't going to be around long. The Hulks and Juggernauts were the only two similar Larges I had: Marids. Not exactly optimal, but it's worked just fine.
Oh, and Dark Skull? Lord Soth. Placing his figure out there tends to worry people.
Encounter 2:
Shadow Creatures: Same as Encounter 1.
Encounter 3:
Dark Skull: Same as Encounter 1, only this time, they fight him. Maybe.
Encounter 4:
Shadow Creatures: Same as Encounter 1.
Cultists: The module says these guys are citizens of Arabel, so I grabbed whatever commonery looking people I could and used them. Dalelands Militia, Human Commoners, and so on make up these guys. For the Initiates, I used Human Bandits from Harbinger. The stats say they have chakrams, and I think the round shield they have can visually double as that.
Nightcloak: As an elite, he should look cool. I chose a character I figured that would inspire a desire to beat up and brag about defeating. Thus far, everyone has instantly gravitated towards being the guy who beat up Driz'zt, so I think that choice is a success.
I struggle to find good miniatures that are close enough as it is, I would really have trouble making each a different figure.
Just to be clear, I don't necessarily make each a different figure. It is just about having something other than a complete block of equal minis for one stat block type.
So, in a battle with:
2 Goblin Blackblades (melee rogue types)
3 Goblin Warriors (ranged skirmishers)
4 Goblin Cutters (melee minions)
Using three different minis, one for each type, would be a pretty big give-away to which ones are minions. That isn't terrible, but it does impact the game strategically.
Instead, I would take a 2-second look at the groupings and see that I need:
- GB = 2 goblinish minis with one type of melee weapon (example: axe)
- GW = 3 goblinish minis that use ranged weapons
- GC = 4 goblinish minis with any type of melee weapon that isn't the one I chose above. This could even be two sets of two mini types. I've found this works just fine to prevent metagaming and preserve surprise.
What the Players see is a bunch of different minis, some painted, some not, but they track them according to behavior ("ah, those two are ranged guys, the others are melee, but some are minions").
What the DM sees is very easily recognizable minis ("My mini with the bow and the crossbow are GWs, my two with the axes are GBs, my others are the minions"). It is really easy to track, actually.
From the cash standpoint, it saves a lot of cash. You can buy a mix of minis, instead of worrying about having to get 3 rares or tracking down specific minis because you need one more. You also have a great reason to use those metal minis you purchased over the last gazillion years (if you are an old-timer) or recently (if you love the heavy metal and/or painting like many do).
From the game side, my players seem to like it. They seem pleased during play when they find out something is a minion ("Oh, that's a minion too! Cool!") and they like having a lot of eye candy ("I used to have that mini!").
I'm not trying to be pushy on this, just wanted to clarify what I was talking about. There are a lot of different ways to roll with the game and all are valid so long as they are fun.
Teos
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flaming skull I've used any old skeleton model that looks sufficiently different from all of the other models I'm currently using.
Minion is a keyword, so you are going to a lot of effort for something that a passive knowledge check will make moot.
1. Passive monster checks are a choice up to the GM.
2. Minion is a ROLE. role's aren't identified in monster lore.
From the Monster Manual:
Monster Knowledge
Name, type, and keywords: DC 15
Powers: DC 20
Resistances and vulnerabilities: DC 25
Paragon tier creature +5
Epic tier creature +10
Keywords
Some monsters have keywords that further define them.
These keywords represent groups of monsters, such as angel,
demon, devil, dragon, and undead. Others indicate that a
creature is made up of or strongly linked to a certain type of
elemental force: air, cold, earth, fire, or water. Monsters can
have more than one keyword.
Role
A monster’s role describes its preferred combat tactics, much
as a character class’s role suggests tactics for PCs. Monster
roles are: artillery, brute, controller, lurker, skirmisher,
and soldier. These roles are discussed in the Dungeon Master’s
Guide.
A monster might have the leader keyword in parentheses,
indicating that it grants some sort of boon to its allies in
combat, such as a beneficial aura.
To me, this implies that with monster lore, one should be able to work out if a monster gives other beneficial abilities, (As leader is a clear exception in the keywords - check the DMG page 55)
Most people I know who roll an appropriate check will get the following info:
This is a Skum, a weak but vicious servitor of the more powerful Aboleths, it attacks using it's claws. (Instead of: It's a minion.)
In the case of monster powers, I say stuff like:
"It is resistant to fire, quite resistant to fire, strongly resistant to fire" (resist fire 5, 10, over 10)
It has a pervading aura of madness that ravages your mind and distracts your ability to attack. (instead of 'Aura that does 5 psychic and -2 to attack rolls)
I find keeping the metagaming out, and separating mechanic from game world increases the strength of the role-playing immersion, and whilst one or two folks have were resistant at first, Everyone I know now vastly prefers it.
There is a difference between 'gotcha' situations and turning the game world into a wargame/minis grid where PC and player knowledge are the same...
I tell them the info, I just do it in a different way... And I rely on description to idify minions, rather than the keyword. Descriptions are really important, like who has a big sword, who has a robes and a staff, who has a longbow, etc.
I don't think there are any such things as "passive knowledge checks" (unless you mean, they'll be able to role a check and know if its a minion 55% of the time).
Not quite. Check out page 179 of the PHB, under Passive Checks.
Passive Checks
When you're not actively using a skill, you're assumed to be taking 10 for any opposed checks using that skill. Passive checks are most commonly used for Perception checks and Insight checks, but the DM might also use your passive check result with skills such as Arcana or Dungeoneering to decide how much to tell you about a monster at the start of an encounter.
Not required, but, to me at least, it makes sense. A passive skill check is basically a way to see how much Darga the Wizard knows about that Elemental creature off the top of his head, or Driggit the Ranger knows about that natural creature they just ran across while traveling to a distant location.
Sure doesn't make sense to me that a Ranger with a Nature check of +8 wouldn't know the basics off the top of his head about a bear his party just crossed paths with, just from seeing it. YMMV.
Even without the revisions to DC, it is only a 15 to learn name, type and keywords. I was wrong, before, minion is not a keyword, it is a role. Fairly obvious role, but up to you whether it is obvious to the players that those 4 skeletons all look alike or not.
I was wrong, before, minion is not a keyword, it is a role.
Oh good. I was a tad confused by that. I didn't think roles were keywords.
Fairly obvious role, but up to you whether it is obvious to the players that those 4 skeletons all look alike or not.
I don't necessarily think of minions as looking alike. I have the same mini for them to keep things simple for me, but they could all look quite different (one might be a dwarven skeleton, one a minotaur skeleton, etc, etc). Plus if you see you've got 15 bad guys, you've got minions. So it can be obvious to anyone whose really interested.
You're just slowing the game down if you make the players keep asking about the equipment carried by each NPC.
I don't.
I describe them from the outset.
And some Minions are very well armed and armoured. (Hobgoblins, Devils, etc)
The DM who did SPEC has a special set-up, using a Metal Board and cylinders with magnets on both ends, that have numbers and interchangable tops for the rest.
When I DM'd, I just made sure I had enough of the right size. (I was doing CORM1-1, so there really isn't much of the right type.)
I few conventions ago, I found a series of wooden tile that have monster images on them and come in a variety of sizes (from medium to colosal). They even have numbers on them so tracking the hp's is easy. It also avoids the mix-up that sometimes can occur when players use plastic minis as their characters. More than once I've seen a player get confused about which figures are monsters and which fig belongs to a fellow adventurer (one of the main reasons that I will only use a metal mini for my characters).
It isn't a big pet peeve, but I have always liked minis. The more unusual the better. Custom painted? Awesome. With some terrain minis, like barrels or trees or crates? Absolutely amazing. I love looking at a mini and wanting to pick it up and look it over. And I like it when the battlefield has some objects on it. I don't do that enough, but some of my friends really do that well. Simple things, like placing a softcover novel down on the mat and placing grid-lined index cards on top to show high terrain... that's just wonderful to me.
I know we all have imagination, but for some reason Starbursts and silver teardrop chocolates just hurt the feel. For me.
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Above there was some discussion about what to share. I agree that minion is not a keyword. I thought it should be as a player, but I now like it better as a player and DM to not have that info so readily available. There is little guidance about what to share with players around Powers, but in general I too summarize (they have a horrid poisonous breath weapon that they can do every now and then, though they prefer to make blindingly fast claw attacks with their fearsome threatening reach so they can then make a bite attack, etc.).