Alchemist: is it worth the feat?

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

psykick

Jun 09, 2009 18:40:16
Mechanically speaking, is there any in-game advantage to taking Alchemist instead of Ritual Caster? Alchemist would fit my character better, but without any real advantage, I wouldn't want to burn a feat just for character fluff.

#2

WolfStar76

Jun 09, 2009 19:07:41
Mechanically speaking, is there any in-game advantage to taking Alchemist instead of Ritual Caster? Alchemist would fit my character better, but without any real advantage, I wouldn't want to burn a feat just for character fluff.


Not really, no.

In fact, with all Player Resources available to anyone in LFR - once might argue that taking the Alchemist feat is a detriment because you must both take the feat AND buy the forumlas AND pay the full cost of the alchemical items you make.

Where as someone without the feat can just walk up to the store, and buy the alchemical item.

The one exception might be (and I'm not familiar enough with alchemy to know if this would even be conceivable) if, in the midst of a module you needed to make and because you have the feat and the formula you could convince the DM to let you make it on the fly.

Barring that - unfortunately it doesn't have much purpose in RPGA games.

Though a little birdy tells me about an Artificer Paragon Path that requires Alchemy in the Eberron Player's Guide.
#3

Dragon9

Jun 09, 2009 19:22:32
Except that, just like other consumables, you can't buy an alchemical item that is higher than your level. So if you want to be bale to possibly have items higher than your level then you'd need the feat and hope you find formulas in a game (but I haven't seen any in mods since they clarified you could buy alchemical items with open access)
#4

kinevon

Jun 09, 2009 20:22:40
Except that, just like other consumables, you can't buy an alchemical item that is higher than your level. So if you want to be bale to possibly have items higher than your level then you'd need the feat and hope you find formulas in a game (but I haven't seen any in mods since they clarified you could buy alchemical items with open access)

You would need more than the formula, you would need a document (like a story award) that allows you to create something over your level, just like for making potions with Brew Potion...
#5

Dragon9

Jun 09, 2009 21:10:12
You would need more than the formula, you would need a document (like a story award) that allows you to create something over your level, just like for making potions with Brew Potion...

ummm... yeah...

So if you want to be bale to possibly have items higher than your level then you'd need the feat and hope you find formulas in a game (but I haven't seen any in mods since they clarified you could buy alchemical items with open access)

#6

kinevon

Jun 09, 2009 22:57:34
ummm... yeah...


Maybe I am mis-reading what you intended, but you didn't mention what I did, which is permission to create over-level items.

After all, all the alchemical formula are open access, so you don't need to find them to be able to create them, as long as they are of your level or below, and you have the alchemist feat, and have bought the formula.

Just like rituals, really.
#7

sithobi1

Jun 09, 2009 23:55:46
You can't craft an item above your level with alchemy...so I don't know what you're talking about.
#8

kinevon

Jun 11, 2009 4:12:09
You can't craft an item above your level with alchemy...so I don't know what you're talking about.

You can purchase any magic item that is equal to or less than your level with your gold, as long as you have access to it. See “Player Resources” on page 2 of the RPGA Character Creation Guide to determine what magic items and rituals/formulas are accessible by your character. Other items are restricted resources, meaning that you need to gain access to the item to purchase it, even if you are of the same level as the item. If you have a character option that allows you to create items of a higher level than your character, you may also purchase items of the higher level specified as long as you have access to the items.

That is what I was thinking of, myself. Whatever that "character option" part refers to is the only way/time you can buy/create an item of higher level than you are.
#9

Dragon9

Jun 11, 2009 6:20:13
You can't craft an item above your level with alchemy...so I don't know what you're talking about.

Well, for example, i have a story award that gives me access to about 5-7 formulae. If they were above my level, I could buy them or buy the formula and make them. Especially since it says "You have access to all levels of the following formulas..."

So, as Kinevon posted fromt he CCG, that story award allows me access to craft those items (or purchase them) at a level higher than my own. If I have the feat.
#10

sithobi1

Jun 11, 2009 6:21:24
Right, but Alchemy is not that character option. Read the feat.
Benefit: You can make alchemical items of your level or lower. You must have the correct formula and an appropriate skill.

#11

Dragon9

Jun 11, 2009 6:27:31
The story award is the character option that allows it.
#12

sithobi1

Jun 11, 2009 6:32:56
If you're talking about Week 1-2...The story award still doesn't let you create items above your level. It specifically says so.
#13

kinevon

Jun 11, 2009 7:07:06
If you're talking about Week 1-2...The story award still doesn't let you create items above your level. It specifically says so.

WEEK04 Mysteries of Alchemy
While searching through the Haunted Halls of Eveningstar, you’ve discovered a red vellum tome that was written in a very stylized common hand called “Mysteries of Alchemy.” The tome gave insight into various alchemical processes. You have access to all levels of the following formulas from Adventurer’s Vault (you must still purchase the formulas in order to use them, must possess the Alchemist feat, and cannot create items greater than your level): Alchemist’s Acid, Alchemist’s Frost, Clearsense Powder, Clearwater Solution, Alchemist’s Acid (ammunition), Alchemist’s Frost (ammunition), Blinding Bomb, Dragonfire Tar, Ghoststrike Oil, Herbal Poltice, and Slow-Step Oil,

Highlight on the relevant part of the text added by me, but Sithobi is correct on this specific story award. And the timing was a pain, too, as AV became completely open just a week or two before WitR was available to play. So it became a completely irrelevant award, too.
#14

kildaere

Jun 11, 2009 10:43:51
I remember there was confusion over this when WitR was ran locally. I never followed up (as I do not have an alchemist). But I remember the discussion was left off thus:

You have access to all levels of the following formulas from Adventurer’s Vault (you must still purchase the formulas in order to use them, must possess the Alchemist feat, and cannot create items greater than your level). This was determined to mean that you CAN NOT make the items greater than your level (just as it says), but that you can purchase all levels of an item if you meet the requirements (purchase the formula in order to use them, must possess the Alchemist feat).

I am not saying that is the correct interpretation. Just how I have seen it run. With 4th eds sturcture of specific rules trumping broad, how else would you rule it?

Without the reward: You only have purchase access to items of your level or lower.
With reward: You have purcahase/use access to all levels of a specific list of special items(meeting feat/formula requirements of corse), if you want to make them however the regular rules of your level or less apply (pretty much just what the reward says).

Seems to make sense. I am not sure I would rule it differently.
#15

Dragon9

Jun 11, 2009 16:20:09
Bah, I missed that part of it. Thanks for pointing that out. Anyway, ti still stand that if you did get a story award and it allowed you to do so, then you could.
#16

JohnduBois

Jun 12, 2009 7:52:05
That is what I was thinking of, myself. Whatever that "character option" part refers to is the only way/time you can buy/create an item of higher level than you are.

I think that the "character option" bit might be referring in part to rumored Artificer feats that allow you to use EMI to make items of your level + INT, or Alchemy to make items of your level +2...
#17

sithobi1

Jun 12, 2009 18:29:47
I think that the "character option" bit might be referring in part to rumored Artificer feats that allow you to use EMI to make items of your level + INT, or Alchemy to make items of your level +2...

1:Combine Master Crafter with Mark of Making.
2:Make magic items way above your level.
3:Go on adventures.
4:???
5:Profit!
#18

amysrevenge

Jun 13, 2009 0:20:30
1:Combine Master Crafter with Mark of Making.
2:Make magic items way above your level.
3:underpants
4:???
5: Profit!

:P
#19

JohnduBois

Jun 13, 2009 8:46:09
1:Combine Master Crafter with Mark of Making.
2:Make magic items way above your level.
3:Go on adventures.
4:???
5:Profit!

I think step 4 would be "breed rust monsters"...