So, are they really around? I've met a good amount of people, and I've yet to see someone play them. Are they really as bad in LG as I've heard? Thanks guys!
Church
I know a good couple of the Hexblade feats were in a Dragon Magazine, but not one that's open to us...(But it's not closed either! :D )
I just wouldn't count on getting access to something like that -- the only Dragon magazine content that I've ever seen being used in LG were the two issues with Greyhawk-specific feats.
And, no, I've never seen someone play a Hexblade. Of the 5434 LG PCs that players have listed on the Nyrond website, there are only 53 Hexblades. While they're a relatively recent addition to LG, and the Nyrond database is by no means a scientific sample, at only 1% of that database, it would certainly suggest that there are fairly few Hexblades out there. (Compare that to 153 Warmages, 128 Swashbucklers, or 78 Favored Souls -- some of the other base classes from the "Complete" books.)
Are Hexblades generally accepted in LG? I know they're an open base class, but I generally don't see much that helps them out. I know a good couple of the Hexblade feats were in a Dragon Magazine, but not one that's open to us...(But it's not closed either! :D )
So, are they really around? I've met a good amount of people, and I've yet to see someone play them. Are they really as bad in LG as I've heard? Thanks guys!
Church
They're an OK way to get into Dragon Disciple more easily, but other than that there's not much exciting about them.
There are some classes and PrCs that really help them out, though. Dragon Disciple, Outcast Champion, a level of Barbarian+Extra Rage, Marshal, Monk(+Enlightened Fist, Ascetic Mage) and/or Fighter can all work pretty well. The big thing is to justify putting points into Charisma. A Barbarian 1/Hexblade 10/Marshal 2/Outcast Champion 2 has more than enough justification.
They also do eventually cast 3rd level spells, so they can pick up Arcane Strike, but that really needs memento access to work out well.
Derek
I created a tertiary character that was going into Occult Slayer by way of Hexblade 3/Figther 2 thanks to the fact that Hexblades have spellcraft and knowledge (arcana) as class skills and also have +1 BAB per level. Mettle is very nice and having good will saves and arcane resisitance is great if you multiclass with a Fighter or Paladin to offset the fort saves. I just don't see much use for taking more then 3 levels in the class.
Derek
Arcane Archer and Dragon Disciple make taking 4 or 5 levels worth it.
They're an OK way to get into Dragon Disciple more easily, but other than that there's not much exciting about them.
Arcane Archer. The best advantage a hexblade gets is being able to use scrolls and wands to buff without help from a caster.
Race:Human
Alignment:
STR-15 (8)
DEX-14 (6)
CON-14 (6)
INT-10 (2)
WIS-8 (0)
CHA-14 (6)
Lv1(Hexblade)Intimidating Strike, Ability Focus (Curse)
Lv2(Hexblade)
Lv3(Hexblade)Power Attack
Lv4(Hexblade)Dark Companion, +1 STR
Lv5(Hexblade)Spell Focus (Enchantment)
Lv6(Hexblade)Brutal Strike
Lv7(Hexblade)
Lv8(Hexblade)+1 STR
Lv9(Rogue)Staggering Strike
Lv10(Hexblade)
Lv11(Rogue)
Lv12(Hexblade)Unsettling Enchantment, Greater Spell Focus (Enchantment), +1 STR
Lv13(Hexblade)
Lv14(Hexblade)
Lv15(Hexblade)Feat
Total Penalties:
Cursed (greater): –2(-4) penalty on all attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks (Will negates, limited curses per day).
Dark Companion: -2 to saves and AC (No save)
Shaken: –2 penalty on attack rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks(intimidate vs. HD+wis+d20).
Sickenened: –2 penalty on all attack rolls, weapon damage rolls, saving throws, skill checks, and ability checks (Fort Save 10+ power attack damage).
Distract Assailant+Unsettling Enchantment: Flat footed 1 round (will negates), -2 to attacks and AC (no save) (Limited spells per day).
Staggered: Move action or standard action each round but not both (Fort Save DC 10+ damage dealt on sneak attack).
Good campaign cards to use with this build are of course Charm of the Fortunate for even more stacking penalties and One More Time for an additional use of your curse. Obvious vulnerabilities are a poor fort save as well as low AC. Damage output won't be huge, but that's not the point of this build. Also, unfortunately against things like undead and constructs, most of these penalties are unuseable, though the curse and dark companion work on absolutely everything. Weapon needs to be some 2 hand-able bludgeoning weapon to use with brutal strike. Can also be a basic party face by maxing out bluff, intimidate, and diplomacy. You'll never dominate a table with this guy, but save based casters will love you.
Ed
Although you do gain abilities, they are of limited use. AND you're restricted to light armor.
A well built fighter can be much stronger than a Hexblade, simply by virtue of getting feats like weapon specialization. Rogues will easily outclass a hexblade against sneak attackable enemies. Even a PALADIN will be able to do more.
If you do play a hexblade, I recommend that you choose a specific role and stick to it. Make that role as good as you can. If you want to do melee damage, take Weapon Finesse and power attack, as you'll need power attack to stay within shouting distance of other melee characters. (and seriously consider Dragon Disciple 4 and fighter 4)
If you want to be an archer, take levels in Arcane Archer. It's the bes t bet for a Hexblade Archer.
Using your familiar as a mount is another approach I've consider with hexblade. Usually, I end up looking at a multiclassed build since you need a lot of feats and hexblade spell progression is too slow.
With even a modicum of luck it works quite nicely.
Are Hexblades generally accepted in LG? I know they're an open base class, but I generally don't see much that helps them out. I know a good couple of the Hexblade feats were in a Dragon Magazine, but not one that's open to us...(But it's not closed either! :D )
So, are they really around? I've met a good amount of people, and I've yet to see someone play them. Are they really as bad in LG as I've heard? Thanks guys!
Church
Here's a funny anecdote. I was DMing at a convention a few weeks back, and a player of a 10th level Hexblade came up to me from another table and said "Hey Dave, do you know what a Hexblade's curse does by any chance?"
I looked at him quizzically and responded with "Don't you play a Hexblade?"
He laughed and said "Yeah, but this is the first time my Hexblade's curse has ever worked, and I've forgotten what the ability does. I just try to curse things out of habit."
Here's a funny anecdote. I was DMing at a convention a few weeks back, and a player of a 10th level Hexblade came up to me from another table and said "Hey Dave, do you know what a Hexblade's curse does by any chance?"
I looked at him quizzically and responded with "Don't you play a Hexblade?"
He laughed and said "Yeah, but this is the first time my Hexblade's curse has ever worked, and I've forgotten what the ability does. I just try to curse things out of habit."
It's funny because it's true. Every time I've seen a Hexblade Curse used by a PC or NPC at an LG table, the target makes the save against it.
It's funny because it's true. Every time I've seen a Hexblade Curse used by a PC or NPC at an LG table, the target makes the save against it.
Our Hexblade is reasonably focused in Charisma(against our advice) - it usually works about a third of the time. It does influence combats greatly when it does work, especially as a penalty of -4 tends to be horrendous.
He's also gotten Memento access, CWI, and Arcane Strike, which has helped - he crafted a Belt +6 and a Cloak +6, and now he's able to toss a couple of +3 to hit/+3d4 damage Arcane Strikes. It puts him roughly where he ought to be in terms of doing damage at 12th. He's not supertweaked, but his damage isn't that bad.
I think Hexblades benefit a LOT from multiclassing. You can go into rogue, marshal, fighter, just about anything.
They benefit a lot from improved familiar. With a good con, that familiar can have a lot of hit points, and be a pretty solid base for a mounted build.
And, I'd grab Ability Focus just as fast as you can.
I'd wager that most LG Hexblades lack both of those virtues, unfortunately.
There's no denying, however, that the first 3 levels are fantastic as (someone has already mentioned) they're effectively a paladin-dip for the not-so-LG PCs.
1st level: Curse and high Will save. The Curse is best for PCs devoted to the debuffing aspects of it -- and who have a minimum buy of 16 CHA. I've heard of a Hexblade who destroyed Red Hand by Cursing everything with a tweaked-out Curse and then hitting the Cursed monsters with Tasha's Hideous Laughter. The high Will save and allotment of skills helps melee PCs move nicely into a number of PrCs: Occult Slayer, Dragon Disciple and Arcane Archer among them (Dragon Disciple and Arcane Archer, presupposing an eventual 4-level trip for spells).
2nd level: CHA to saves vs magic. 'Nuff said.
3rd level: Mettle. Yes, you could be a Pious Templar, but that would require a fairly lame feat and Weapon Focus in your deity's favored weapon... And though, as a matter of course, every Pious Templar worships a deity *based on* weapon selection (rather than roleplay), some PCs might actually worship a deity that suits their characters... regardless of if they have favored weapon (halberd) or not... (dratted deities with no favored weapon, halberd).
Beyond the 3-levels, debuffers are quite nice. The Hex scales like a top-level spell (which it is, honestly), and Dark Companion access is plentiful (lots of metaorgs, etc.).
As already mentioned, it's a nice platform for Arcane Archer or Dragon Disciple.
The key is, basically, not to build a Hexblade like another melee character that would be better off with other class levels. If you build a Hexblade like it's a Barbarian/Fighter, you've screwed up. If you build a Hexblade like it's an Eldritch Knight, you've screwed up. If you build a Hexblade like you understand the class abilities and know how you plan to make the best use possible of them... then it's fun. And since there aren't that many around, it's relatively novel.
Plus, the MIC has some sweet Hexblade swag... I've already handed out Hexbands in an interactive or two. If you can find them, they're quite nice. (+1 DC to the Hex and 5/day, swift activate to add CHA to damage against a hexed opponent for a round.)
Beyond the 3-levels, debuffers are quite nice. The Hex scales like a top-level spell (which it is, honestly), and Dark Companion access is plentiful (lots of metaorgs, etc.).
I don't suppose you could point out some of the meta-orgs with this access. I know its Greyhawk ruins now, but my hexblade predated that by a good margin.
I don't suppose you could point out some of the meta-orgs with this access. I know its Greyhawk ruins now, but my hexblade predated that by a good margin.
SHL Incandenti. But the Triad website is down, so you'd have to join the Yahoo group and then peruse the Files section in order to find the metaorg.
Actually, beside that and the Greyhawk ruins option, I guess I don't know of others -- only that I've heard other players talk about Hexblades from other regions with the same alternate class feature.
Good luck.