4th:
Orb of Cold
Freedom of Movement
Solid Fog
Dimension Door
5th:
Heroism, Greater
Fly, Mass
6th:
Disintegrate
Leveling will net me another 5th and 6th level spell, and give me the option to trade out a 4th level spell. I was also planning to retrain out Greater Heroism at some point, since i've crafted my Vest of Legends already. (The other retrain bait is Eagle's Splendor, assuming i get my cloak to +6 before leveling).
Spells i get from items: I have a Canniath Mandolin, which gives me 1/day Dispel Magic, Summon Monster III, and Cure Serious at CL 8. Doesn't look so great until you see that activating the item is a swift action
I've also got a Cli Lyre, which gives me 1/day Dimension Door, Break Enchantment, and Shout at CL 11. Finally, i've got metaregional access to a Runestaff of Evocation, so Chain Lightening, Wall of Force, and Ice Storm will eventually be covered.
My thoughts: I need to grab Greater Dispel Magic as a 5th level spell, but i'm not sure of a second 5th level spell to grab via the retraining.
At 6th, Otto's, Heroes Feast, and Greater Shout are the current front-runners, though picking Freezing Fog would let me change out solid fog.
Otherwise, i've been thinking about changing out Dimension Door for something. (Greater Invis, Cure Crit, and even Trollshape look appealing). Between One More Slip, anklet of translocation, FoM, and the 1/day use of the Lyre, Dim Door doesn't seem all that necessary.
Thoughts?
Sublime Cords are bards with more spell options. They are not sorcerers on a bard backdrop. You don't have the slots known to be a sorcerer, despite having the same spell list. Don't try to fit a square peg in a round hole.. it doesn't fit and only leads to frustration (and splinters).
-James
What did you take after Sublime Chord? What does FoL stand for?
FoL probably stands for Fochlucan Lyrist, an open PrC from Complete Adventurer.
What I bring to the table: a fairly versatile support character. The Sublime Chord spells are mostly utility stuff, with some damage when needed. (Thanks to all who insisted on Mass Fly). The low level druid spells also provide options in specific situations (Listening Lorecall with the requisite ranks is good, and I got a lot of mileage from Gust of Wind, so a thank you to the Keoish wizard that asked me to take it in case we ran into a Prismatic Wall)
As for what i do, a typical first round might be: Swift inspirational boost, Standard harmonize, move action Inspire Courage +4, right after my turn is over Immediate Badge of Valor to get a +5 bard song. Subsequent turns I'd inspire greatness as a move action on two PCs (3 next level) and cast a spell or use a magic item with my standard.
If I only had the one 6th level spell, and I was a support character, I'd rethink.
Maybe Heroes' Feast, Shadow Walk, or Veil?
Also, be sure you look at the spells which are 6th level BARD spells too. Some, like Otto's Irresistible Dance, are 8th level Sor/Wiz spells. Legend Lore's in there too, if you're interested, it is very useful vs. high-level foes if you know their name.
I'd keep dimension door. It's a anti-grapple spell par excellence, and you can get multiple people, which freedom of movement does not do.
I'd also swap out Eagle's Splendor as fast as you can. If you haven't made the Charisma item, buy a few scrolls to tide you over, which should be affordable enough at 14th level.
As a sublime Chord, spells are the most limited item that you have. Don't use a spell known when you use skill points to do the job, and don't use skill points when you can use gold.
I load it into my ring of counterspells (this has been useful twice already), and I keep it around in case there is a wall of force or similar that needs to be broken.
My fort save is my primary weakness, and Death Ward armor/shield keeps the death effects off me for a little while, so disintegration is the big scary at the moment.
Greater Shout also falls into the category of Bard 6 or Sorc/Wiz 8, and i do have a normal rod of Sculpting, which makes it very tempting. The damage isn't as interesting as the deafening it will cause.
As for another 5th level spell, Mislead seems cute. I know it doesn't have quite the utility of Greater Invis (as it is Personal instead of Touch), but if I'm in the back playing my bardic music, putting up an image of myself, 5footing, and continuing to play music seems like it could benefit me a good bit, depending on the situation.
First of all, be careful about storing Disintegrate in your ring. I'm pretty sure that the ring doesn't counter spells that don't target you... and Disintegrate is an "effect: ray" spell.
Second of all, I strongly advise retraining Greater Heroism for a Greater Dispel - that's great utility and a nice spell to store in your ring. If you have two Sublime Chord levels (which I hope you do), you can really push that caster level to dispel almost anything. If you pick up a lesser quicken rod, you can quicken a Harmonic Chorus (or Hymn of Praise, I forget which one targets a specific caster) and get your caster level even higher. At 14th level, that gets you to CL 20.
Lastly, I would recommend an Otto's in your 6th level slot. While I'm not a huge fan of it, it's a pretty nice offensive spell that should work on like 60% of the creatures you fight. Greater Shout is pretty crappy (I wouldn't bother trying to deal damage at your APL) and I would let the cleric worry about Heroes' Feast. You shouldn't be sitting at an APL 14/16 table with no cleric capable of casting it. I've had people argue with me on this one....
1) You absolutely need Greater Dispel. Lacking the Spellpower hurts a lot here but take it anyway.
2) I agree with the above: Disintergrate does nothing in a Ring of Counterpells (use the Immediate Counterspell function on the Ring for that one-it's gotta be greater to fit Disintergrate). Feeblemind is the usual favourite for that ring.
I would not have chosen it with an SC myself; you can almost always DDoor past the walls of force after all.
3) Otto's is a ridiculously powerful spell in this context (even more so if you can Extend it to be sure it lasts long enough). If you take this you will not feel it was wasted (unless you have a very poor perception of what is going on.
Otto's almost says: "Anything without SR is dead"
You do risk being accused of 'cheesyness' though.
4) Heroes' Feast is a very good option.
- You may not always have a Cleric; I've certainly sat at tables without one at all levels.
- If you do have a Cleric they can always make good use of that slot.
- You don't get a lot of spells/day and you might want to use Metamagic in some of them anyway (and you always have Disintergrate) so you're not going to feel a lack of things to cast with those slots.
5) Look for a Rod of Extend (especially if you have/can take Rapid Metamagic)
6) Wall of Force is the traditional 2nd choice for 5th level (GDM being 6th normally).
7) I would not take Freezing Fog -it doesn't offer enough extra for the bump from Solid Fog imo
8) Veil is nice and potentially thematic.
1) You may not always have a cleric. If you get, say a druid as your primary healer, you'll want the spell.
2) Will you use it every mod? Heck ya you will.
3) If you -do- have a cleric, so much the better. That allows another 6th level cleric spell, and cleric can adjust to fill what's needed. Look at the options....
Heal, Fire Seeds, Summon Monster VI, Wild Walk, Energy Immunity, Bolt of Glory
That makes it a nice set-up spell for the rest of your party.
Jimbo,
First of all, be careful about storing Disintegrate in your ring. I'm pretty sure that the ring doesn't counter spells that don't target you... and Disintegrate is an "effect: ray" spell.
This is one of those infinite-monkeys table variation problems. The ring doesn't say "targeting the wearer", it says "should that spell be cast upon the wearer". Also, the prerequisite spell is Imbue with Spell Ability, and not Spell-turning or anything that implies targeting is important. If a judge decides that's not how it works, then i'll stick with Greater Dispel in the ring.
As for greater shout: the stunning allows a fort save, but the deafness is only halved, so casters get the 20% miscast chance, and enemies with hearing-based blindsight are blind.
Otto's is very nice; i guess i'm just holding out that small bit of hope that i'll see another runestaff of forced happiness. It's a shame I wasn't high enough level to play the core special with the big boys.
This is one of those infinite-monkeys table variation problems. The ring doesn't say "targeting the wearer", it says "should that spell be cast upon the wearer".
Yeah. On my tables, the ring of counterspells stops just about anything, including AoEs that happen to include the wearer of the ring. (Despite this being the most common ruling at tables I've sat at, my L15 cleric's ring of counterspells has still NEVER triggered - so I'm inclined to feel this ruling doesn't make the basic ring broken for its price.)
I'd go with the people recommending Heroes' Feast or Otto's, they're both great spells. I do like Disintegrate as a utility spell - I've been in dimensionally locked areas (or areas with anticipate teleport active) with bad guys throwing walls of force and forcecages on several occasions, and it's really unpleasant if you don't have Disintegrate available (Greater Blink works vs anticipate teleport, but it doesn't help in a dimlock).
Heroes' Feast is a nice support spell that won't eat a lot of your spellslots, but it is better done by a cleric if there's one at the table. That said, I've played plenty of APL 14-16 games with no cleric at the table, and immunity to poison and fear is really nice.
Also: runestaff of evocation? Sigh. My sorcerer really needs to die so I can play more Sheldies with her... (the problem is she's pretty heavily immersed in some Core plotlines, and those mods will quickly provide enough XP to level her to 16, and taking 0 gp / mod is painful
)Also: runestaff of evocation? Sigh. My sorcerer really needs to die so I can play more Sheldies with her... (the problem is she's pretty heavily immersed in some Core plotlines, and those mods will quickly provide enough XP to level her to 16, and taking 0 gp / mod is painful
Jimbo,
Agreed on ETV regarding the ring - I run into ETV problems more and more as of late and to be honest, I didn't actually read the item description before posting... I went off of memory which often has a few holes in it. How bad is your Fort save that you need to protect yourself from a Disintegrate?
I am aware of what Greater Shout does. I can't imagine that your DC is high enough to warrant wasting an action trying to stun creatures that mostly have really high Fort saves. I think you can find something better to do with your action.
Tracy - Sorry about the Runestaff... you should have come to TotalCon ;)
Agreed on ETV regarding the ring - I run into ETV problems more and more as of late and to be honest, I didn't actually read the item description before posting... I went off of memory which often has a few holes in it. How bad is your Fort save that you need to protect yourself from a Disintegrate?
Pretty bad for APL 14/16. I've got 4 from class levels, another 2 from Con, and a +3 resistance item that I can't upgrade, for a grand total of +9. It'll be +10 when i take my third FoL level, and +11 when I craft my Ioun Stone of Con. Inspiring greatness in myself gives me an additional +1.
Now, death and energy drain effects aren't as bad; i've got an extra +3 against those, as well as a CA death ward armor and MIC death ward shield. Hell should freeze over before i fail a Will save against an illusion, so disintegrate is the big scary at the moment. I suppose needing a Res at high APL is covered by over cap gold at least in part, but it would still suck.
Edit: Hmm, maybe at level 15 i'll finally get around to grabbing a Squirrel Familiar, and a Dire Squirrel animal companion. It'll help with the Fort save deficiency I've got going, as well as let me load up Not This Time if I still don't find myself an Ioun Stone of Alertness.
Edit the 2nd: Okay, I think i've mostly made up my mind. I'll grab Greater Dispel and Hero's Feast, trade Heroism for Greater Blink, and *perhaps* train out Dimdoor to something. At 15th, i'll most likely pick up Lim Wish, retrain Disintegrate to Ottos (and put back Dimdoor if I find i'm really hurting without it). A DC 25 Solipsism is very tempting, but I don't think it can beat the utility (and XP-burning) of Limited Wish.
If you swap Dimension Door at 4th, you can pick up Enervation.
If you retrain Greater Heroism at 5th, you can pick up both Teleport and Wall of Force.
6th level take Otto's.
I agree that the choice at 6th level is "either Heroes' Feast or Otto's." The reality is that the cleric can do the Heroes' Feast *most* (but not all) of the time -- meaning that most often the spell is dead to you. Otto's is one of those Bard spell bargan basement deals... an 8th level spell for Sor/Wiz, you can basically end a bunch of combats (if you want). It's a great ace in the hole.
Teleport provides much of the same mobility as Dimension Door, making the swap of Dim Door all that much less painful, while also providing all that traveling "from here to someplace far away" option that HL adventures expect of you.
Wall of Force is -- like Mass Fly -- one of those great tricks that you can pull out of your hat to completely change the course of a battle.
Enervation is a spell that sets up other players (like the rest of this list, it's a good spell on its own, but even better from a supporting PC's vantage point) by lowering saves and attack rolls, etc. And it translates into damage -- if you care about that. And if you pick up Split Ray at 15th, Split Ray Enervation is just.... well, it's effectively a 9th level spell in a 6th level slot.
I recommend you avoid Greater Dispel Magic unless you intend to take the 2nd level of Sublime Chord. GDM is *all* about caster level, and if you have a class that boosts CL and don't pursue that feature... a spell that targets that ability is almost insulting...