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Action Points as Rewards?

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
terradyne
Jan 25, 2010 20:36:08 This actually just crossed my mind, but has anyone ever done that? I mean obviously you keep XP and Wealth, but say a player does something really spectacular like hold a fire line while the rest run to the LZ, or stop a bomb that would take out the station, you know doing something that as the DM you feel deseves a reward but XP would just unbalance the game. It's not like it be given like water, no maybe a max 1-2 per adventure.
#2
rustam1
Jan 25, 2010 21:11:20 Well, I have. It was done very rarely and for just reasons like you mentioned. All the other players were in agreement on those occasions. It had the side effect of the players looking for ways to improve their own role playing during following sessions. It got them to thinking. Improved their descriptions of in game actions and reactions. Really cut down on the "I got a 15 for my tumble past to flank and a 17 to hit, did I? (nod), with a unarmed strike for 6 points." Over time game play improves, fun storylines.
Later, when it got to be a kind of normal (expected), I switched to something we called "OMG" cards. PC attempts crisis maneuver (Refex save or die), cool description fits great wthin storyline so far, all of the players lean in to see the roll --- and he rolls a 1 -- everyone at the table says "Oh My God! No!"
I saw this type of thing used by somebody else -- they called the card "A Lesser Man Would Have Died" card.
#3
Master_Vega
Jan 25, 2010 22:25:49 I remember "A Lesser Man Would have Died", but I don't remember who posted it. Wasn't part of that rule that the PC lost a limb or took otherwise permanent damage?

Also, yes. The main GM of my main gaming group gives out action points instead of XP for rewards.
#4
TheRealOrion
Jan 25, 2010 23:39:45 I had a very similar idea in Phoenix; it's an optional system that grants an "Awesome" bonus. If a player comes up with some beautifully ridiculous, action-movie idea, like leaping out the building to grab onto the hover-droid that was observing you (a la Revenge of the Sith), they get an Awesome bonus for that task alone. I figure, it's a way to reward people for trying to pull off the crazy stuff that we all see in action movies and get a real kick out of. It has to be agreed by the table as a whole, though. You don't want it getting competative, and you don't want to go back to that well too often. Also, if one person manages to find the "formula" for how to impress the GM, then that person has an artificial advantage. It's supposed to promote fun for all; if it doesn't do that, then it's not working.

There's also a "Bogus" penalty, but that's only half-related.
#5
narukagami
Jan 26, 2010 0:29:58 I did it in a kind of combination of role playing reward, and Orion's "awesome" bonus. If a player had a really spectacular moment where he spent an action point for some reason, I'd usually reward back the point for good roleplaying. But if they didn't spend any points, I'd still reward a point if it was an above and beyond spectacular moment. Essentially, stricter on gaining extra points than on getting spent points back.

You have to be really careful on how often you give out points though, especially if you have action point hoarders like I do. :P
#6
TheRealOrion
Jan 26, 2010 0:56:05 Yeah, the problem is that Action Points are what you spend to do cool stuff, so handing them out when you do cool stuff is just a wash. I have to tweak the idea before I really like it.
#7
winternova
Jan 29, 2010 15:42:18 Glad to see "A Lesser Man Would Have Died" has caught on! :D

I will award Action Points for extremely heroic actions. I used a similar system back in my 2E days too.

I have a campaign I'm working on now where AP aren't gained per level, and have a maximum cap. AP are gained through breakthroughs in the goal, heroic maneuvers, and in pursuing one's allegiances but can be lost throughout play as well.

I've also placed a requirement on the Heroic Surge feat that requires a character to have completed a significantly heroic act to be eligible for it. I've been considering adding more requirements to other feats as well, but I'm still on the fence about it, but I digress.
#8
Shado
Feb 02, 2010 22:17:39 I used Action Points as reward/penalties in my Saga game.

From the days of yore, XP bonuses for RPing well were the norm in my groups. I didn't like the disparity in levels it eventual brought with it. So, I instead awarded action points to my players anytime they surprised me with their creativity and roleplaying.

I took away action points for horrific puns... too much movie quoting (only if it got excessive) and ANY mention of midiclorians.

Not in my world!

Anyway, the system worked really well and the players really liked it.

I also made action points refresh based on intervals of the story arc. Not levels.
#9
TheRealOrion
Feb 02, 2010 22:26:03 The more I think about this, the more it strikes me as kind of ass-backwards. You get APs as a reward for levelling-up so that you can do "cool stuff." They're what allow you to do "cool stuff." If you are awarded APs for doing "cool stuff," then you're basically just giving them out for free. You might as well just allow players to roll and extra couple of d6's whenever they do something cool. The way to go about this logically is to grant XP bonuses for doing "cool stuff," which I believe we have always called role-play awards.
#10
Shado
Feb 02, 2010 23:12:14
The more I think about this, the more it strikes me as kind of ass-backwards. You get APs as a reward for levelling-up so that you can do "cool stuff." They're what allow you to do "cool stuff." If you are awarded APs for doing "cool stuff," then you're basically just giving them out for free. You might as well just allow players to roll and extra couple of d6's whenever they do something cool. The way to go about this logically is to grant XP bonuses for doing "cool stuff," which I believe we have always called role-play awards.

I don't put "cool stuff" and good roleplaying/creativity in the same pool.

Just because you spent an action point to make the critical attack land in a fight won't get you an action point reward from me. Actually... I don't think I ever awarded one for anything that relied on d20 roll.
#11
winternova
Feb 02, 2010 23:20:05 I've never had my group spend action points to do "cool stuff" - just to activate class abilities, and to save themselves from certain doom. If a character takes an incredible risk to do something heroic (or something foolish that just so happens to work) then I don't think an action point reward is out of the question.

If the player decides to spend action points while taking that risk, then it is ass-backwards, but it's on the player at that point.
#12
Master_Vega
Feb 03, 2010 0:02:53

Just because you spent an action point to make the critical attack land in a fight won't get you an action point reward from me. Actually... I don't think I ever awarded one for anything that relied on d20 roll.

Same here, for me and my group's normal GM. We give out action points for good roleplay/innovative thinking. Generally I give them out for approaching things differently as I planned... that is, of they do so intelligently. lol
#13
TheRealOrion
Feb 03, 2010 10:22:31 Perhaps I'm misunderstanding. I had assumed that you'd give out an AP for coming up with an interesting idea, making a no-guts-no-glory attack, pulling some kind of ridiculous acrobat lunacy, that kind of thing. You're giving out points for the idea, the role-play, the sheer chutzpah. But then PCs will turn around and use those points to aid them to execute those cool ideas. In essence, then, if you come up with a cool idea, the GM gives you a +1d6 to your d20 roll. Unless I'm misunderstanding how you do this.
#14
Master_Vega
Feb 04, 2010 10:22:58 They don't always use the action points they gain to aid in their super-cool attacks, nor is it easy in my group to do/RP/think of something that warrants an action point reward. I also award them after the encounter.
#15
TheRealOrion
Feb 04, 2010 14:03:58 I think I understand, but it's not something I'm going to do in my games. It seems like a circular excercise. Glad to hear it's working at your table, though!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 terradyne Jan 25, 2010 20:36:08	This actually just crossed my mind, but has anyone ever done that? I mean obviously you keep XP and Wealth, but say a player does something really spectacular like hold a fire line while the rest run to the LZ, or stop a bomb that would take out the station, you know doing something that as the DM you feel deseves a reward but XP would just unbalance the game. It's not like it be given like water, no maybe a max 1-2 per adventure.
#2 rustam1 Jan 25, 2010 21:11:20	Well, I have. It was done very rarely and for just reasons like you mentioned. All the other players were in agreement on those occasions. It had the side effect of the players looking for ways to improve their own role playing during following sessions. It got them to thinking. Improved their descriptions of in game actions and reactions. Really cut down on the "I got a 15 for my tumble past to flank and a 17 to hit, did I? (nod), with a unarmed strike for 6 points." Over time game play improves, fun storylines. Later, when it got to be a kind of normal (expected), I switched to something we called "OMG" cards. PC attempts crisis maneuver (Refex save or die), cool description fits great wthin storyline so far, all of the players lean in to see the roll --- and he rolls a 1 -- everyone at the table says "Oh My God! No!" I saw this type of thing used by somebody else -- they called the card "A Lesser Man Would Have Died" card.
#3 Master_Vega Jan 25, 2010 22:25:49	I remember "A Lesser Man Would have Died", but I don't remember who posted it. Wasn't part of that rule that the PC lost a limb or took otherwise permanent damage? Also, yes. The main GM of my main gaming group gives out action points instead of XP for rewards.
#4 TheRealOrion Jan 25, 2010 23:39:45	I had a very similar idea in Phoenix; it's an optional system that grants an "Awesome" bonus. If a player comes up with some beautifully ridiculous, action-movie idea, like leaping out the building to grab onto the hover-droid that was observing you (a la Revenge of the Sith), they get an Awesome bonus for that task alone. I figure, it's a way to reward people for trying to pull off the crazy stuff that we all see in action movies and get a real kick out of. It has to be agreed by the table as a whole, though. You don't want it getting competative, and you don't want to go back to that well too often. Also, if one person manages to find the "formula" for how to impress the GM, then that person has an artificial advantage. It's supposed to promote fun for all; if it doesn't do that, then it's not working. There's also a "Bogus" penalty, but that's only half-related.
#5 narukagami Jan 26, 2010 0:29:58	I did it in a kind of combination of role playing reward, and Orion's "awesome" bonus. If a player had a really spectacular moment where he spent an action point for some reason, I'd usually reward back the point for good roleplaying. But if they didn't spend any points, I'd still reward a point if it was an above and beyond spectacular moment. Essentially, stricter on gaining extra points than on getting spent points back. You have to be really careful on how often you give out points though, especially if you have action point hoarders like I do. :P
#6 TheRealOrion Jan 26, 2010 0:56:05	Yeah, the problem is that Action Points are what you spend to do cool stuff, so handing them out when you do cool stuff is just a wash. I have to tweak the idea before I really like it.
#7 winternova Jan 29, 2010 15:42:18	Glad to see "A Lesser Man Would Have Died" has caught on! :D I will award Action Points for extremely heroic actions. I used a similar system back in my 2E days too. I have a campaign I'm working on now where AP aren't gained per level, and have a maximum cap. AP are gained through breakthroughs in the goal, heroic maneuvers, and in pursuing one's allegiances but can be lost throughout play as well. I've also placed a requirement on the Heroic Surge feat that requires a character to have completed a significantly heroic act to be eligible for it. I've been considering adding more requirements to other feats as well, but I'm still on the fence about it, but I digress.
#8 Shado Feb 02, 2010 22:17:39	I used Action Points as reward/penalties in my Saga game. From the days of yore, XP bonuses for RPing well were the norm in my groups. I didn't like the disparity in levels it eventual brought with it. So, I instead awarded action points to my players anytime they surprised me with their creativity and roleplaying. I took away action points for horrific puns... too much movie quoting (only if it got excessive) and ANY mention of midiclorians. Not in my world! Anyway, the system worked really well and the players really liked it. I also made action points refresh based on intervals of the story arc. Not levels.
#9 TheRealOrion Feb 02, 2010 22:26:03	The more I think about this, the more it strikes me as kind of ass-backwards. You get APs as a reward for levelling-up so that you can do "cool stuff." They're what allow you to do "cool stuff." If you are awarded APs for doing "cool stuff," then you're basically just giving them out for free. You might as well just allow players to roll and extra couple of d6's whenever they do something cool. The way to go about this logically is to grant XP bonuses for doing "cool stuff," which I believe we have always called role-play awards.
#10 Shado Feb 02, 2010 23:12:14	The more I think about this, the more it strikes me as kind of ass-backwards. You get APs as a reward for levelling-up so that you can do "cool stuff." They're what allow you to do "cool stuff." If you are awarded APs for doing "cool stuff," then you're basically just giving them out for free. You might as well just allow players to roll and extra couple of d6's whenever they do something cool. The way to go about this logically is to grant XP bonuses for doing "cool stuff," which I believe we have always called role-play awards. I don't put "cool stuff" and good roleplaying/creativity in the same pool. Just because you spent an action point to make the critical attack land in a fight won't get you an action point reward from me. Actually... I don't think I ever awarded one for anything that relied on d20 roll.
#11 winternova Feb 02, 2010 23:20:05	I've never had my group spend action points to do "cool stuff" - just to activate class abilities, and to save themselves from certain doom. If a character takes an incredible risk to do something heroic (or something foolish that just so happens to work) then I don't think an action point reward is out of the question. If the player decides to spend action points while taking that risk, then it is ass-backwards, but it's on the player at that point.
#12 Master_Vega Feb 03, 2010 0:02:53	Just because you spent an action point to make the critical attack land in a fight won't get you an action point reward from me. Actually... I don't think I ever awarded one for anything that relied on d20 roll. Same here, for me and my group's normal GM. We give out action points for good roleplay/innovative thinking. Generally I give them out for approaching things differently as I planned... that is, of they do so intelligently. lol
#13 TheRealOrion Feb 03, 2010 10:22:31	Perhaps I'm misunderstanding. I had assumed that you'd give out an AP for coming up with an interesting idea, making a no-guts-no-glory attack, pulling some kind of ridiculous acrobat lunacy, that kind of thing. You're giving out points for the idea, the role-play, the sheer chutzpah. But then PCs will turn around and use those points to aid them to execute those cool ideas. In essence, then, if you come up with a cool idea, the GM gives you a +1d6 to your d20 roll. Unless I'm misunderstanding how you do this.
#14 Master_Vega Feb 04, 2010 10:22:58	They don't always use the action points they gain to aid in their super-cool attacks, nor is it easy in my group to do/RP/think of something that warrants an action point reward. I also award them after the encounter.
#15 TheRealOrion Feb 04, 2010 14:03:58	I think I understand, but it's not something I'm going to do in my games. It seems like a circular excercise. Glad to hear it's working at your table, though!