Story goes that my friends and I are playing fantasy RP. Warhammer, faerun, eberron, plain dnd and a couple more.
Thing is that after 9 years we're on the lookout for more. The guys like to try out modern (or past, or future... meh). We've tried Starwars twice, I think we even made characters for past once, but neither of them lasted beyond the opening session.
Hence, I decided to pick up the glove. I'll try to GM a stand-alone, one night futuristic game.
So there I was, thinking of how it can be done and what should I do. A couple of hours latter I found out that I didn't quit grasp the whole concept. I mean, I knew what I wanted to do: I wanted to take the heroes to the story of starcraft in earth. Few years after the UPL sended the 4 massive spacecrafts into outerspace with the convicts in them, the opposition it's people (patched up from outcasts and renegades) to assault UPL's govermental building complexe.
However I'm still missing alot. For starters, I don't know how to compose the adventure itself - what should I place as obstacles? How can I challange the heroes? How many of obstacles from each type if any should I place? and the like...
Then I'm wonder about the heroes themself. After I stated that the adventure is a one time session I wouldn't want time to be wasted around the table with character building in a setting we have never played.
So things like - What level is a good level to play in? To low to be heroic? to high to be challanging and to much of a number-crunching? How a futuristic group should be assembeld (typical dnd group is 4 archtypes of: big fighter, utility guy, damage doer and healing. Thought it is still heavily disputed =D ).
Anyway...
I turn to you, dear forum dwellers, how I shall approach the task? Do you have any insight to share? any 101 rulebook that might help?
Thank you very much for all your help.
Otherwise,
while the game is not just D&D in space, the adventures are just D&D in space. You have NPCs the players have to deal with, smalltime & organizations. You have enviromental issues like traps/obstacles. You have monsters (which we can conveniently call aliens) of both the mission kind and random encounter.
What are D&D adventures?
Rescue the _______'s _______ from a bunch of _______ .
Investigate what happened up ZombieHollow (SPOILER: It was undead, go figure
)Defend the outpost from the approaching _____ .
And while the
And start your first party at 4th-6th level, so they actually have some skills & a chance to get things done right.
and read the D20 star craft thread.
Thank you!
@ Tema69 - I'll give it a look. Thanks.
@ Doomsought - Any game plots you can suggest? I know what the story will be. I just don't know how to import it into a d20 adventure build. And where's the starcraft forum? I hope you don't mean alternity's starcraft forums. I hoped there and it seemed silence has took the place since 2005.
@ backstabbist - It's not the name of the classes that bother me. It's their roles in the party d&d random group consist of the following:
- big fighter (meaning someone with a lot of hp. Fighter could be used for that but also barbarian, sheer supiriority in hp, paladin, self application of lay on hands ability, and the like...)
- damage doer (could take rogue with maxed sneak attack, warmage, etc.)
- utility (someone who can do other stuff then combat, bard for diplomacy, mages for knowledge and so forth...)
- some sort of healer (aka COD or it can be the rogue with use magic device skill holding wand of mass heal)
See, I wasn't asking about if a group should be formed from 1 this class and 1 that class. I was asking if a random group would need a:
- interogator
- medic
- drug addict
- hoola hop dancer
- a pack of plamengo
I spent enough time in the OP boards to know how to build things. Further, as the GM for this one time session I'm about to break alot of rulez to simplify the game. :D
You have enviromental issues like traps/obstacles
Random d&d adventure requires around 13 encounters:
2-4 combat encounters
1 mini boss
2 traps
3 arcane and divine puzzles
2 utility uses (negotiations)
((it's from I remembered reading. it might be a bit off))
So... What should I do with modern? bring in driving encounter?
And start your first party at 4th-6th level, so they actually have some skills & a chance to get things done right.
This is very helpful. Thanks.
Once again, thank you all for your input.
Cheers,
BB
Barring Houserules, the damage dealer would be Strong/Martial Artist. He can, as Backstabbist has pointed out, hit all the time with his guns, and still be a master of melee (Melee Smash talent, Living Weapon, etc for melee, then add feats for ranged überness). Tank would obviously be Tough with Improved Massive Damage Threshold. Utility , I'd go with Smart and/or Fast. Possibly Field Scientist for the Scientific Improvisation ability. And healer, well, that'd be Dedicated/Field Medic. But keep in mind that Ded/FM is only a healer, and sucks at pretty much anything else.
That's what I've learned from playing d20. And also why I'm such a fan of houserules.
lets stay out of the crunchy builds & work at the concept level for a while.
The Tank, the Fighter, Doc, & McGuyver
Sounds like a decent party.
While McGuyver would be the skill monkey (presumably a healthy mix of Smart levels) the hard part of Future is any Half-dTwo spidermonkey can shoot a 3d8 ParticlePistol. Or as a upgrade to the D&D mage taking crossbow potshots while the fighters fight, we have McGuyvers tosing grenades or hosing areas with autofire as just a passing hobby and not what they are actually good at. They say Colt made all men equal, and it holds true that McGuyver standing back & popping off a m1 Garrand without a lot of skill can get a lot of kills.
This is a significant deviation from the D&D mindset of limited damage capability at 1st level. Here, there is very little leveling to do to get very high damage weapons.... 1st level party can walk around with every member toting a 2d10 rifle, and that would be considered a bargain basement surplus gun.
Anyhoo, back to the pary...
Since any stooge can tote a dangerous rifle, and the difference in hurt-inflicting ability at 1st -4th level Combat guys and Non-Combat guys is not that great. So even Doc & McGuyver get to take an active & contributing role in handing out the pain. This (as you know) gets a big boost from the non-penalty multiclassing & dipping in d20Modern letting them pickup some extra combat prowess.
The party can easily have a good amount of ovelapping ability too. Any char can take a level in Smart and grab up a bunch of skills for the same d6 HD as the other 'non-combat' classes, instead of d8 from the combat ones.
The Tank doesnt really get that much more HP, any combat class with a high Con will be close. Toughs allow for DR, but then in the future they got silly and decided to make every gun a different damage type. And healing has its problems in RAW. This tank mentality of taking the punishment on the chin just shouldnt be relied on in a future with DISINTEGRATION Rifles. The damage has really gone up, but healing for themost part hasnt. Tank is almost more style that build.
Doc can be anyone with skill, even CC skill in Treat Injury. Pilot / ship-personel / computerguy / or grizley Vet can fit that role well. They will have a nice blend of skills to AideOther as well as taking those PotShots I mentioned earlier. With the proliferation of cellphones, serious medical attention is just a DustoffChopper away, which takes the pressure off the party medic. They can now get broader utility in the party.
2-4 combat encounters
1 mini boss
2 traps
3 arcane and divine puzzles
2 utility uses (negotiations)
Sounds good.
Everything from street crime to overzealous-rentacops can be your combat encounters. If a player indicates they want to go for a melee fighting guy, you need to import/create better than RAW non-Lethal rules (not really a problem, just needs to be done). Again do to prolific communications, many places have a much higher Law level than D&D, along with faster response times when calling for backup.
Traps can be as simple as Detection and a copcall.
Or a ClaymoreCluster TPK Special on a infrared TripBeam.
Use the D&D traps making stuff to make traps by CR rather than using named devices for desired effect. You wpuld quickly find the players will want to make a CR1 trap with a 12d8PlasmaCannon & a string. NO! They can use the plasmacannon as a componant of a 2d6 low CR trap of non-specific construction in accordance with the D&D trap making.
Utility gets used a ton in the Info Gather & investigation stuff. Plenty of buracracies to deal with, licensing/permits, covering tracks etc and NPCs. Even just filing a flightplan for an offworld trip can take an entire night of play.
hmmm, I seem to be writing a book.
I better hit send before my comp runs out of mem
Personally, I'd go with a Star Wars: A New Hope feel. Give the players a light sprinkling of whats going on in your lil universe, and then thrust them into the action (Metaphorically, it doesn't have to be a combat fest).
Oh, and Since my thread was mentioned (Starcraft D20) if you haven't poked around since my update; there is a link in mah sig.
Just a quick thing about healing in d20 Modern: barring magic healing, you better be Dedicated 3/Field Medic 10 if you want to be good at it. And then, as a Ded3/FM10, you can't really do anything besides patching folks together. So, once again, I'm gonna point you over to the Houserule thread, page 2, where we've discussed it, and seemed to have found a reasonable alternative to the 1d4-HP-once-per-day...
They don't need yo take FM since I won't stress healing that far. I'd like the player's characters to not die, but I don't really care. It's a one time game so a sad end is still acceptable for me. It would totally bum for the players, though.
Besides, it's the future. I'll introduce this drug addict whos also carries a bit of wound treating pills. err... Or something.
Barring Houserules, the damage dealer would be Strong/Martial Artist. He can, as Backstabbist has pointed out, hit all the time with his guns, and still be a master of melee (Melee Smash talent, Living Weapon, etc for melee, then add feats for ranged überness). Tank would obviously be Tough with Improved Massive Damage Threshold. Utility , I'd go with Smart and/or Fast. Possibly Field Scientist for the Scientific Improvisation ability. And healer, well, that'd be Dedicated/Field Medic. But keep in mind that Ded/FM is only a healer, and sucks at pretty much anything else.
That's what I've learned from playing d20. And also why I'm such a fan of houserules.
So... you're saying that, basicly; "this is just d&d in space"?!?
That's... so... wrong. That's silly. But who am I to judge. Anyway, I'll keep tha usefull info in mind when I create the characters sheets.
If I read it right,
lets stay out of the crunchy builds & work at the concept level for a while.
The Tank, the Fighter, Doc, & McGuyver
Sounds like a decent party.
You know, I wasn't bringing anything to set you people in stone. I just... blah never mind. Let's hear it out.
While McGuyver would be the skill monkey (presumably a healthy mix of Smart levels) the hard part of Future is any Half-dTwo spidermonkey can shoot a 3d8 ParticlePistol. Or as a upgrade to the D&D mage taking crossbow potshots while the fighters fight, we have McGuyvers tosing grenades or hosing areas with autofire as just a passing hobby and not what they are actually good at. They say Colt made all men equal, and it holds true that McGuyver standing back & popping off a m1 Garrand without a lot of skill can get a lot of kills.
This is a significant deviation from the D&D mindset of limited damage capability at 1st level. Here, there is very little leveling to do to get very high damage weapons.... 1st level party can walk around with every member toting a 2d10 rifle, and that would be considered a bargain basement surplus gun.
Exactly my point. I didn't think that you could copypaste the typical 4 gang into a futuristic setting. This is just one reason. I bet there are a lot more. It's just mean that (and this is the actual curiosity) If I wanted to invade an office complex in the future I'll have to emphasize what attributes in my party?
But, carry on.
Anyhoo, back to the pary...
Since any stooge can tote a dangerous rifle, and the difference in hurt-inflicting ability at 1st -4th level Combat guys and Non-Combat guys is not that great. So even Doc & McGuyver get to take an active & contributing role in handing out the pain. This (as you know) gets a big boost from the non-penalty multiclassing & dipping in d20Modern letting them pickup some extra combat prowess.
The party can easily have a good amount of ovelapping ability too. Any char can take a level in Smart and grab up a bunch of skills for the same d6 HD as the other 'non-combat' classes, instead of d8 from the combat ones.
The Tank doesnt really get that much more HP, any combat class with a high Con will be close. Toughs allow for DR, but then in the future they got silly and decided to make every gun a different damage type. And healing has its problems in RAW. This tank mentality of taking the punishment on the chin just shouldnt be relied on in a future with DISINTEGRATION Rifles. The damage has really gone up, but healing for themost part hasnt. Tank is almost more style that build.
Doc can be anyone with skill, even CC skill in Treat Injury. Pilot / ship-personel / computerguy / or grizley Vet can fit that role well. They will have a nice blend of skills to AideOther as well as taking those PotShots I mentioned earlier. With the proliferation of cellphones, serious medical attention is just a DustoffChopper away, which takes the pressure off the party medic. They can now get broader utility in the party.
OK. That's a lot to think about. :embarrass
But very informative at the same time. Thanks.
Sounds good.
Everything from street crime to overzealous-rentacops can be your combat encounters. If a player indicates they want to go for a melee fighting guy, you need to import/create better than RAW non-Lethal rules (not really a problem, just needs to be done). Again do to prolific communications, many places have a much higher Law level than D&D, along with faster response times when calling for backup.
I didn't get that part about RAW non-Lethal rules. Now, who's got the what with?
Traps can be as simple as Detection and a copcall.
Or a ClaymoreCluster TPK Special on a infrared TripBeam.
Use the D&D traps making stuff to make traps by CR rather than using named devices for desired effect. You wpuld quickly find the players will want to make a CR1 trap with a 12d8PlasmaCannon & a string. NO! They can use the plasmacannon as a componant of a 2d6 low CR trap of non-specific construction in accordance with the D&D trap making.
Utility gets used a ton in the Info Gather & investigation stuff. Plenty of buracracies to deal with, licensing/permits, covering tracks etc and NPCs. Even just filing a flightplan for an offworld trip can take an entire night of play.
Yeah, I guess. But that should matter only after I decide how much and what encounters I place.
hmmm, I seem to be writing a book.
I better hit send before my comp runs out of mem
Ya, you did. But as long as I have by answering you lot.
I think its 13 encounters (at party level =CR) will get the group a level... that being said, it could be a very long session you plan on writing and running. I try not to run more than 2 encounters (combat encounters) at least in a single session. I'll write more when I am awake, but I think you have the basic idea here.
I don't care about leveling. It's a one-time adventure. They won't go anywhere if they finish the mission succesfully.
If you say that 2 encounters are something that fill in one session then I'll take that into account. But I hardly believe that. I think that in 5-6 hours of gaming you could mount to some more.
Well it also depends on how long you have to play for your one night session aswell.
Personally, I'd go with a Star Wars: A New Hope feel. Give the players a light sprinkling of whats going on in your lil universe, and then thrust them into the action (Metaphorically, it doesn't have to be a combat fest).
Oh, and Since my thread was mentioned (Starcraft D20) if you haven't poked around since my update; there is a link in mah sig.
I did myself the tour in this parts to see what I can scavange without intefering but I couldn't get nothing. Not that I have something against you're work. It's admirable but it's not helping my case. I mentioned the StarCraft name because that's where I'm placing the plot. But the timeline is before the first colonies on Korprulo Sector (or whatever the name was, I forgot). And it's happaning on earth, against UPL. so...
------------------------
I had this chat with someone and we came up with a story:
There's this govermental's UPL's office building complex that hold lots of the UPL's data. The resistance known as "La libert'e" is trying to get that data so that they have an edge against the UPL. In order to do so they send a group of men scrumbled for all kind of places, each has his own reasons to resist the UPL.
So doing this fob is 5 (6) parts:
- Entry to complex grounds.
- Getting the infrastructure bluebrints.
- Nutrelizing or bypassing security (both guards and alarm) without suspition.
- Gaining Access to computer room.
- Downloading the data.
- Escaping.
That's so far. 'cause, you know, I've written alot.
seems every party worth its salt will come up wit 300 ways to hack it from their moms basement. Be prepared to explain why they have to put some pants on & go to the complex.
I'm not sure if you have the cart before the horse with the Blueprints & Entry. DeNiro said (Ronin) never walk into a place you dont know how to walk out of. If I was in the party, I would do the Intel before the heist, by charismatic NPC contact & CompUse methods. This could yeild some basic area knowlege layout & allow for acces by means other than Full Frontal Assaultity. If your party is anything like me,
It's something most people aren't aware off. But the answer to online threats on your most important digital info is to keep it seperated completely from the WWW.
I'll allow basic intel on the place by a series off Q&A with their boss from the resistance. That's because - A. I don't want them to waste time on Gath Info and B. a bunch of fugitive wondering 'round the streets now adays is a sure way to get oneself publictly executed.
However! There are things that you can't possibly get by the pre-infogathering. Like where everything is located. This should prove to be much more interesting - should you head for the 4th building? or the 5th building? should you split? or whatever...
I think not, especially when I have never ever played modern/future game.
I'm not going to be able to improvise on the spot like that. Sorry.
I need to make a couple encounter maps. Make the PC's stats. And we'll see.
:D
Anyway, I went throu the house rule thread and one of the things that poped was the split bab that you guyz been trying to put as a way of offsetting the omnipotent strong build.
It's an intresting idea but I'd like to suggest otherwise.
How 'bout you intreduce the "bab" concept as skill per weapon group?
i.e. you invest ranks in a specific weapon, say pistol, and you have an attack bonus equal to your skill bonus. you could then have small penalty for using another, pistol like weapon, and a huge penalty for something completely different.
It's something I saw worked out at the lord of the rings.
Just wind it? that simple?
I think not, especially when I have never ever played modern/future game.
I'm not going to be able to improvise on the spot like that. Sorry.
I need to make a couple encounter maps. Make the PC's stats. And we'll see.
:D
Anyway, I went throu the house rule thread and one of the things that poped was the split bab that you guyz been trying to put as a way of offsetting the omnipotent strong build.
It's an intresting idea but I'd like to suggest otherwise.
How 'bout you intreduce the "bab" concept as skill per weapon group?
i.e. you invest ranks in a specific weapon, say pistol, and you have an attack bonus equal to your skill bonus. you could then have small penalty for using another, pistol like weapon, and a huge penalty for something completely different.
It's something I saw worked out at the lord of the rings.
BESM d20 does something like that for allowing characters to be more skilled with certian weapons by buying ranks with the skill points from their class as normal (you can buy specalties within these groups) Melee Combat, Gun combat, Heavy Weapons, and Unarmed. Not to mention you can buy defenses in categories of ranged, melee, and unarmed. As a word of warning though you may want to restrict that or not even use it unless you are wanting astronomical defense and attack scores (I've been having a little trouble with it in my current game, but YMMV). Then again if a character invests heavily in weapon skills they have a lot less for everything else non combat related.
But having something instead of Personal Firearms Proficiency would be good. Break it up in groups. Every time a character takes the Firearms Proficiency, he/she chooses a couple of weapon groups that he becomes proficient in. The groups could be Autoloaders, Revolvers, Rifles & Carbines, Submachineguns, Assault Rifles, Shotguns, Grenade Launchers, Rocket Launchers, Machineguns, AntiMaterial Rifles, Splash Weapons & Grenades (Molotov cocktails, fragmentation grenades, etc.). These are the groups I use for the Weapon Focus feat in our game.
Weapon Focus: IllegalGuns
because they are constantly adding to that list
How many groups do you think would be appropriate? How about having Grenade Launchers, Rocket Launchers, Machineguns & AntiMaterial Rifles (all the exotic weapons) countin' as two? So if you got 3 proficiencies every time you took the Pers.Firearms.Feat, you could grab Rocket Launchers (2) and Assault Rifles (1).