****** off at WotC - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

****** off at WotC

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
the_animaster
Jul 22, 2009 23:48:29 That's right. I just want to express my utter disappointment at the job that WotC is doing with two of my most favourite titles -- D&D and Magic: the Gathering.

Both were great in the beginning. Both were great for sometime, and then SOMEHOW, somewhere down the line, both are going to (edited)

Just take a look at these boards. I remember WotC at one point saying that they wanted to utilise the web as a platform that would bring together players and for people to be able to access information online easily.

You call this cräpjob-of-a-forum 'easily accessible information'?? I've never seen a forum with a billion categories and sub-categories. I'm a D&D 3.5 player and I'm STILL searching for topics on 3.5 ed. I'm not new to the internet either -- I'm a graphic designer and web developer and I ~still~ can't see the structure behind this website~!

And what about that flame war over PC-versus-MACs because of character builder for D&D? The thing could have been done on a web platform easily from the beginning, yet WotC decided in all their righteousness to stick to Windoze... brilliant. Where are all these suggestions going? Is there anyone even listening or taking down notes or is someone gonna fart out an order to hack up some other good gaming line?

Again... what about that forgotten statement where WotC said they were going to UTILISE THE WEB as a platform to bring together information etc. etc.??

Ok. So enough of this cluttered, sad website. Let's talk about GRAPHIC DESIGN. Now, for those of you unversed in the arts... Graphic Design and Game Art are 2 different things. Game Art is all the nice drawings and paintings. Graphic Design however, is how the text and drawings are arranged on a book or website ... or in the case of Magic The Gathering -- card. A Game Artist's job is to draw nicely and make the thing more appealing. A Graphic Designer's job is to also make the overall look appealing as well through the use of borders, colours textures and other details that don't require a professional painter/artist to do (Graphic Designers don't really need to know how to draw... they just need to know how to do good layouts, patterns, texturing and stuff... but it IS an advantage to have some drawing skills too).

Right. Now that that definition is clear: How did we come from a simple design and layout with white borders, to one that was deeper, better and FUNCTIONAL to one that is utterly CR
#2
toastedamphibian
Jul 23, 2009 0:20:57 Click forums, click dungeouns and dragons, scroll down to the bottom. Your looking for "Previous Edtions". Here: http://forums.gleemax.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8
#3
ORC_Sinister
Jul 23, 2009 1:10:17 I’ve removed content from this thread because masking, flaming, hate speech, and off topic disruption is a violation of the Code of Conduct. You can review the Code of Conduct here: http://forums.gleemax.com/community_coc.php

Please keep your posts polite, respectful, and on-topic, and refrain from making personal attacks.
#4
Arcane_Guyver
Jul 23, 2009 2:32:27
Again... what about that forgotten statement where WotC said they were going to UTILISE THE WEB as a platform to bring together information etc. etc.??

It's called 'Gleemax' and the downward spiral of hopelessness known as the US economy, son. WotC thought they were in a position to not only publish some of the biggest titles in the CCG and RPG world, but also create *THE* online gaming network. I'm not sure which came first, the staggering realization of the work that would entail or the economy requiring them to lay people off, but it pretty much killed the Gleemax thing.

Don't tell me you honestly think the GD of 4th edition is an improvement over 3rd ed???

I do. I feel white space is a welcome change to yellowish pages. The covers are distinctive without feeling formulaic (no more poo-brown covers with christmas tree lights surrounding a tiny picture on the front). The new logo actually fits on the spine of books. The visual sorting of rules elements makes me very happy (with such 'new ideas' as color-coding powers to determine frequency at a glance).
#5
boj0
Jul 23, 2009 8:07:39 New art is prettier than ever (for M:tG and D&D) both quality and grandeur
#6
zombie_babies
Jul 23, 2009 9:53:13 Why is this in the OTT? Put the hate where it belongs (4e General), let the regulars launch their attack and lock the ****er. This is a happy fun place where players of all editions should feel welcome not to talk about D&D. OP, you suck.
#7
ace_of_time
Jul 23, 2009 14:43:34 I think it is a welcome for a change for the 4e General.

Note: Seems more of a customer serve issue to me.
#8
crimson_lancer
Jul 24, 2009 0:16:54
Why is this in the OTT? Put the hate where it belongs (4e General), let the regulars launch their attack and lock the ****er. This is a happy fun place where players of all editions should feel welcome not to talk about D&D. OP, you suck.

Seriously, OP! I had to search for this stupid PoS so I could flame you, ya dumbass! That takes time, and there are way too many Trolls and n00bs in the world (much less in 4E General!) for me to have to take the time to come to you so I can light your biased, rose-colored goggles-wearing, ill-informed self on FIRE!

SIGH. So many to burn, and so little time. If only I were payed to do this, then I could do it 40 hours a week! :D

[/tongue-in-cheek]:P
#9
Dark_Stryke
Jul 24, 2009 3:08:07
SIGH. So many to burn, and so little time. If only I were payed to do this, then I could do it 40 hours a week! :D

Stroking my massive ego is reason enough for me to flame pretty much continuously... You waste of oxygen and space.

[tongue wedged so far into my cheek that it may never come out]
#10
stealthmarmot
Jul 24, 2009 20:49:38 Okay I didn't read the OP (too long), do I have any reason to believe it is anything but generic crying about how things are different and aything different is bad and how everything was wine and roses in X edition or when X was different?
#11
toastedamphibian
Jul 24, 2009 21:18:27 Strangely, he seems to be *****ing about card, book, and website layouts instead of actually making any comment to the content of said prodcuts.
#12
tiwaztyrsfist
Jul 24, 2009 22:33:17
Strangely, he seems to be *****ing about card, book, and website layouts instead of actually making any comment to the content of said prodcuts.

Maybe this will **** him off as well. He 's CLEARLY a design snob, so my gratuitous use of a novelty font should set his teeth on edge.
#13
KillerGM
Jul 24, 2009 22:37:43 Rabble! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!
#14
toastedamphibian
Jul 24, 2009 22:41:22 Whats that? You want to play Scrabble?
#15
KillerGM
Jul 24, 2009 22:42:51 Nah, I just like being a part of an angry rant.

RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!!

... and I might have been watching a wee bit much South Park lately.
#16
Rustmonster
Jul 25, 2009 17:47:37
Maybe this will **** him off as well. He 's CLEARLY a design snob, so my gratuitous use of a novelty font should set his teeth on edge.

As a graphic designer myself, I must ask you to inform me of your current place of residence so that I may come and burn your house along with everything and everyone you have ever loved immidiatly.

Comic Sans is an unforgivable sin.
#17
tiwaztyrsfist
Jul 25, 2009 20:03:54
As a graphic designer myself, I must ask you to inform me of your current place of residence so that I may come and burn your house along with everything and everyone you have ever loved immidiatly.

Comic Sans is an unforgivable sin.

My wife, also a Graphic Designer, swatted me for doing that.

My only regret is that the forum doesn't support the Papyrus font. :P
#18
turbowombat
Jul 25, 2009 21:07:26 Hi, My name is Devil's Advocate.

Hey OP, did you notice the MASSIVE # of typos in the DMG, and other errors. Check out the suggested build for lvl 1 Ensnaring Swordmage. It suggests that you take an Encounter Power as an At-Will Power. Or page 33 of the DMG "something has something they fun among the encounter mix,..." I mean really wizards? Did you have to lay off the whole editing staff?
#19
crimson_lancer
Jul 25, 2009 23:22:08
My only regret is that the forum doesn't support the Papyrus font. :P

I'm a Programmer, and Papyrus is my personal favorite of all the Fonts. :D:D
#20
pigknight
Jul 26, 2009 15:27:28 WotC has had their egos hurt by this thread.

Wizards needs a hug now. <(^o^)> *Hug*
#21
Dane_McArdy
Jul 26, 2009 16:12:44
You call this cräpjob-of-a-forum 'easily accessible information'?? I've never seen a forum with a billion categories and sub-categories. I'm a D&D 3.5 player and I'm STILL searching for topics on 3.5 ed. I'm not new to the internet either -- I'm a graphic designer and web developer and I ~still~ can't see the structure behind this website~!

Perhaps you should read more, and you might realize, they don't support 3.5 anymore, and the main part of the forum is 4e?

I guess you did a cräpjob in being informed, if it's ok to use your own words.
#22
Dane_McArdy
Jul 26, 2009 16:13:55
I'm a Programmer, and Papyrus is my personal favorite of all the Fonts. :D:D

Grew Oss
#23
funkyv
Jul 26, 2009 22:09:07 I would like to know the OP's diet. Cause he really seems to like the smell of his own ****, and I know mine smells like...well, ****.
#24
ace_of_time
Jul 26, 2009 22:13:24
WotC has had their egos hurt by this thread.

Wizards needs a hug now. <(^o^)> *Hug*

I always took them to being a shake hands type of people.:D
#25
bigtony
Jul 26, 2009 22:41:30 The OP is a lot more amusing if when you read it in your head you do so in the voice of the Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future.
#26
mock26
Jul 26, 2009 23:22:54 Here! Here! Wizards of the Coast killed 2nd Edtion Advanced Dungeons & Dragons! Time to bring it back! :D
#27
mnemonicsv
Jul 27, 2009 0:27:57 I don't play 4e (not yet anyway), but even I don't have a major problem with the layout. It's simple to read, and gets to the point. The coverart/logo seems a little bland to me, but it's still a far sight better than quite a few other RPGs out there.

I just wish I hadn't ended up with some of the few copies that had the "smudging" issue. :P

I can't say much about M:tG. Haven't played that game in many many years.

Comic Sans is an unforgivable sin.

Oh c'mon now... Comic Sans ain't all that bad... :D
#28
zombie_babies
Jul 27, 2009 9:13:42
The OP is a lot more amusing if when you read it in your head you do so in the voice of the Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future.

Yes. Yes it is.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 the_animaster Jul 22, 2009 23:48:29	That's right. I just want to express my utter disappointment at the job that WotC is doing with two of my most favourite titles -- D&D and Magic: the Gathering. Both were great in the beginning. Both were great for sometime, and then SOMEHOW, somewhere down the line, both are going to (edited) Just take a look at these boards. I remember WotC at one point saying that they wanted to utilise the web as a platform that would bring together players and for people to be able to access information online easily. You call this cräpjob-of-a-forum 'easily accessible information'?? I've never seen a forum with a billion categories and sub-categories. I'm a D&D 3.5 player and I'm STILL searching for topics on 3.5 ed. I'm not new to the internet either -- I'm a graphic designer and web developer and I ~still~ can't see the structure behind this website~! And what about that flame war over PC-versus-MACs because of character builder for D&D? The thing could have been done on a web platform easily from the beginning, yet WotC decided in all their righteousness to stick to Windoze... brilliant. Where are all these suggestions going? Is there anyone even listening or taking down notes or is someone gonna fart out an order to hack up some other good gaming line? Again... what about that forgotten statement where WotC said they were going to UTILISE THE WEB as a platform to bring together information etc. etc.?? Ok. So enough of this cluttered, sad website. Let's talk about GRAPHIC DESIGN. Now, for those of you unversed in the arts... Graphic Design and Game Art are 2 different things. Game Art is all the nice drawings and paintings. Graphic Design however, is how the text and drawings are arranged on a book or website ... or in the case of Magic The Gathering -- card. A Game Artist's job is to draw nicely and make the thing more appealing. A Graphic Designer's job is to also make the overall look appealing as well through the use of borders, colours textures and other details that don't require a professional painter/artist to do (Graphic Designers don't really need to know how to draw... they just need to know how to do good layouts, patterns, texturing and stuff... but it IS an advantage to have some drawing skills too). Right. Now that that definition is clear: How did we come from a simple design and layout with white borders, to one that was deeper, better and FUNCTIONAL to one that is utterly CR
#2 toastedamphibian Jul 23, 2009 0:20:57	Click forums, click dungeouns and dragons, scroll down to the bottom. Your looking for "Previous Edtions". Here: http://forums.gleemax.com/forumdisplay.php?f=8
#3 ORC_Sinister Jul 23, 2009 1:10:17	I’ve removed content from this thread because masking, flaming, hate speech, and off topic disruption is a violation of the Code of Conduct. You can review the Code of Conduct here: http://forums.gleemax.com/community_coc.php Please keep your posts polite, respectful, and on-topic, and refrain from making personal attacks.
#4 Arcane_Guyver Jul 23, 2009 2:32:27	Again... what about that forgotten statement where WotC said they were going to UTILISE THE WEB as a platform to bring together information etc. etc.?? It's called 'Gleemax' and the downward spiral of hopelessness known as the US economy, son. WotC thought they were in a position to not only publish some of the biggest titles in the CCG and RPG world, but also create THE online gaming network. I'm not sure which came first, the staggering realization of the work that would entail or the economy requiring them to lay people off, but it pretty much killed the Gleemax thing. Don't tell me you honestly think the GD of 4th edition is an improvement over 3rd ed??? I do. I feel white space is a welcome change to yellowish pages. The covers are distinctive without feeling formulaic (no more poo-brown covers with christmas tree lights surrounding a tiny picture on the front). The new logo actually fits on the spine of books. The visual sorting of rules elements makes me very happy (with such 'new ideas' as color-coding powers to determine frequency at a glance).
#5 boj0 Jul 23, 2009 8:07:39	New art is prettier than ever (for M:tG and D&D) both quality and grandeur
#6 zombie_babies Jul 23, 2009 9:53:13	Why is this in the OTT? Put the hate where it belongs (4e General), let the regulars launch their attack and lock the ****er. This is a happy fun place where players of all editions should feel welcome not to talk about D&D. OP, you suck.
#7 ace_of_time Jul 23, 2009 14:43:34	I think it is a welcome for a change for the 4e General. Note: Seems more of a customer serve issue to me.
#8 crimson_lancer Jul 24, 2009 0:16:54	Why is this in the OTT? Put the hate where it belongs (4e General), let the regulars launch their attack and lock the ***er. This is a happy fun place where players of all editions should feel welcome not to talk about D&D. OP, you suck. Seriously, OP! I had to search* for this stupid PoS so I could flame you, ya dumbass! That takes time, and there are way too many Trolls and n00bs in the world (much less in 4E General!) for me to have to take the time to come to you so I can light your biased, rose-colored goggles-wearing, ill-informed self on FIRE! SIGH. So many to burn, and so little time. If only I were payed to do this, then I could do it 40 hours a week! :D [/tongue-in-cheek]:P
#9 Dark_Stryke Jul 24, 2009 3:08:07	SIGH. So many to burn, and so little time. If only I were payed to do this, then I could do it 40 hours a week! :D Stroking my massive ego is reason enough for me to flame pretty much continuously... You waste of oxygen and space. [tongue wedged so far into my cheek that it may never come out]
#10 stealthmarmot Jul 24, 2009 20:49:38	Okay I didn't read the OP (too long), do I have any reason to believe it is anything but generic crying about how things are different and aything different is bad and how everything was wine and roses in X edition or when X was different?
#11 toastedamphibian Jul 24, 2009 21:18:27	Strangely, he seems to be ***ing about card, book, and website layouts** instead of actually making any comment to the content of said prodcuts.
#12 tiwaztyrsfist Jul 24, 2009 22:33:17	Strangely, he seems to be ***ing about card, book, and website layouts instead of actually making any comment to the content of said prodcuts. Maybe this will ** him off as well. He 's CLEARLY a design snob, so my gratuitous use of a novelty font should set his teeth on edge.
#13 KillerGM Jul 24, 2009 22:37:43	Rabble! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!! RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE RABBLE!!
#14 toastedamphibian Jul 24, 2009 22:41:22	Whats that? You want to play Scrabble?
#15 KillerGM Jul 24, 2009 22:42:51	Nah, I just like being a part of an angry rant. RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! RABBLE!! ... and I might have been watching a wee bit much South Park lately.
#16 Rustmonster Jul 25, 2009 17:47:37	Maybe this will **** him off as well. He 's CLEARLY a design snob, so my gratuitous use of a novelty font should set his teeth on edge. As a graphic designer myself, I must ask you to inform me of your current place of residence so that I may come and burn your house along with everything and everyone you have ever loved immidiatly. Comic Sans is an unforgivable sin.
#17 tiwaztyrsfist Jul 25, 2009 20:03:54	As a graphic designer myself, I must ask you to inform me of your current place of residence so that I may come and burn your house along with everything and everyone you have ever loved immidiatly. Comic Sans is an unforgivable sin. My wife, also a Graphic Designer, swatted me for doing that. My only regret is that the forum doesn't support the Papyrus font. :P
#18 turbowombat Jul 25, 2009 21:07:26	Hi, My name is Devil's Advocate. Hey OP, did you notice the MASSIVE # of typos in the DMG, and other errors. Check out the suggested build for lvl 1 Ensnaring Swordmage. It suggests that you take an Encounter Power as an At-Will Power. Or page 33 of the DMG "something has something they fun among the encounter mix,..." I mean really wizards? Did you have to lay off the whole editing staff?
#19 crimson_lancer Jul 25, 2009 23:22:08	My only regret is that the forum doesn't support the Papyrus font. :P I'm a Programmer, and Papyrus is my personal favorite of all the Fonts. :D:D
#20 pigknight Jul 26, 2009 15:27:28	WotC has had their egos hurt by this thread. Wizards needs a hug now. <(^o^)> Hug
#21 Dane_McArdy Jul 26, 2009 16:12:44	You call this cräpjob-of-a-forum 'easily accessible information'?? I've never seen a forum with a billion categories and sub-categories. I'm a D&D 3.5 player and I'm STILL searching for topics on 3.5 ed. I'm not new to the internet either -- I'm a graphic designer and web developer and I ~still~ can't see the structure behind this website~! Perhaps you should read more, and you might realize, they don't support 3.5 anymore, and the main part of the forum is 4e? I guess you did a cräpjob in being informed, if it's ok to use your own words.
#22 Dane_McArdy Jul 26, 2009 16:13:55	I'm a Programmer, and Papyrus is my personal favorite of all the Fonts. :D:D Grew Oss
#23 funkyv Jul 26, 2009 22:09:07	I would like to know the OP's diet. Cause he really seems to like the smell of his own **, and I know mine smells like...well, **.
#24 ace_of_time Jul 26, 2009 22:13:24	WotC has had their egos hurt by this thread. Wizards needs a hug now. <(^o^)> Hug I always took them to being a shake hands type of people.:D
#25 bigtony Jul 26, 2009 22:41:30	The OP is a lot more amusing if when you read it in your head you do so in the voice of the Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future.
#26 mock26 Jul 26, 2009 23:22:54	Here! Here! Wizards of the Coast killed 2nd Edtion Advanced Dungeons & Dragons! Time to bring it back! :D
#27 mnemonicsv Jul 27, 2009 0:27:57	I don't play 4e (not yet anyway), but even I don't have a major problem with the layout. It's simple to read, and gets to the point. The coverart/logo seems a little bland to me, but it's still a far sight better than quite a few other RPGs out there. I just wish I hadn't ended up with some of the few copies that had the "smudging" issue. :P I can't say much about M:tG. Haven't played that game in many many years. Comic Sans is an unforgivable sin. Oh c'mon now... Comic Sans ain't all that bad... :D
#28 zombie_babies Jul 27, 2009 9:13:42	The OP is a lot more amusing if when you read it in your head you do so in the voice of the Cybernetic Ghost of Christmas Past from the Future. Yes. Yes it is.