Behold . . . Robot Legs

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

MechaPilot

Oct 10, 2010 23:49:28
Linky
#2

pluisjen

Oct 11, 2010 3:20:51
Cool. Those seem to be working pretty well. I think I saw a TED talk about the same kind of thing, but it's been a while...

Can't find it right now Frown 
#3

ADHadh

Oct 11, 2010 11:38:00
Now, first to make stable enough to make the canes unnecessary. Then miniaturize it and sew it into the flesh. Lastly, make it affordable. Or maybe first and foremost?
#4

pluisjen

Oct 11, 2010 12:58:46
I'd definately start with making it affordable first. People are willing to use a wheelchair, and you heard from the comments how much they loved the current rig. Start making it available to people, then work on improving it.

'sides, you get much more feedback on what to improve once you've had some people walking around in it.
#5

Klirshon

Oct 12, 2010 6:16:47
Only if their massive legs can be strapped to the machines properly. Not that I approve of such manipulation.

As for the lower-body, exoskeletal machine: Until this symbiosis creates a modification that is superior to a standard human, I will remain unimpressed with the direction this technology is going.
#6

idhriniel

Oct 12, 2010 6:21:40
Cool. Thanks for giving me the motivation to hack onto youtube @ school. Because my school blocks youtube. Easy fix, though. Secure links, anyone?
#7

jesse.two.coins

Oct 12, 2010 6:45:15
sharing is caring lol i can't go on youtube either :p
#8

EscherEnigma

Oct 12, 2010 11:40:20
As for the lower-body, exoskeletal machine: Until this symbiosis creates a modification that is superior to a standard human, I will remain unimpressed with the direction this technology is going.


Um, you mean like what they said it was originally designed for before they modified/advanced it for paraplegics?  You know, the whole "allowing humans to carry an extra hundred or two pounds without fatigue in rough environments" part?
#9

jesse.two.coins

Oct 12, 2010 11:56:41
HOOMIN GLITTERBOYZ FT-DUBYA!!!!!!  lol that felt weird typing that
#10

Klirshon

Oct 12, 2010 17:46:43
Um, you mean like what they said it was originally designed for before they modified/advanced it for paraplegics?  You know, the whole "allowing humans to carry an extra hundred or two pounds without fatigue in rough environments" part?



Yes I do know that it allows extra carrying weight. I'd rather see a physical representation of a cyborg than a utility that is used for increasing carrying capacity and enabling the ability to walk again. Of course once humanity obtains cyborg technology, I will remain unimpressed until the human mind can be transferred to a mechanised body structure.
#11

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 22:14:54
As for fat people, they only have themselves to blame.



Mostly true.  Some of the onus falls on the shoulders of parents for not teaching healthy food choices (and there is, of course, an exception for those with medical causes like thyroid diseases).

I can honestly say that much of my weight comes from my parents.  My mother came from Kentucky and could cook her butt off.  Unfortunately, she got lazy and started replacing healthy home-cooked foods with McDonalds meals (all while concealing this fact from my father).  Do this for about a decade and you can easily see that being fat can be a parentally caused issue.
#12

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 22:20:14
As for fat people, they only have themselves to blame.



Mostly true.  Some of the onus falls on the shoulders of parents for not teaching healthy food choices (and there is, of course, an exception for those with medical causes like thyroid diseases).

I can honestly say that much of my weight comes from my parents.  My mother came from Kentucky and could cook her butt off.  Unfortunately, she got lazy and started replacing healthy home-cooked foods with McDonalds meals (all while concealing this fact from my father).  Do this for about a decade and you can easily see that being fat can be a parentally caused issue.



I do not wan to get personal here, but how does anyone confuse McDonald's with healthy home cook food?



It's not a matter of confusion.  It's a matter of 1) parental control over food options, and 2)building either bad or good personal eating habits that will follow you through your adult life.

Of course, just because a person's weight issue may have been parentally caused, doesn't mean they shouldn't do what they can to get rid of the issue once they are in control of their own lives.  This is why I have been dieting and exercising, and I have lost 80 pounds in the last year.
#13

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 22:28:33
Wow, 80 is a lot. Gratz. How old are you?



30.  I've gotten into fencing and martial arts.  Plus I've started replacing items in my original diet with healthy items like brown rice.  Granted, I'm still 135 lbs above the high end of average weight for my height.
#14

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 22:31:31
Who that is a lot. I am bitching because I need to lose 15 pounds.



Well, you're probably at a decent weight.  One of the things they don't usually tell people is that fat people burn more calories for doing the same amount of exercise.
#15

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 22:46:48
Probably because it demands more of an effort. Don't give up!

So you said somewhere else that you hav been attending mass for the last 15 years. Why did you start going at 15 and not earlier?



That also is a parental matter.  My father was raised Catholic (he even attended a catholic grade school) and demanded I go with him when he went to church (my mother also went).  Given that my grandparents were still alive at the time, and could thus exert parental pressure on my father, I ended up being baptised then receiving my first communion; all the while being effectively dragged out of bed so I could fall back asleep during mass.
#16

toastedamphibian

Oct 12, 2010 22:56:25
I'm like, ~5'8" and 210 lbs, so yeah, I'm a fat ass. I was actually much thinner when I was 255lbs. Stupid fat, being all light and ****.
#17

EscherEnigma

Oct 12, 2010 23:05:31
I play video games, spend time here, and am only 145† lbs.
_________
†This is after gaining 10 pounds in the last four months from going to the gym 3-4 times a week.
#18

toastedamphibian

Oct 12, 2010 23:14:12
Stop playing video games and spending time here. Enjoy the world! Enjoy youself.



Can't. I'm kind of required to stand here infront of this computer for 8-13 hours a day 4-5 days a week. I really can't afford to just leave and ride my bike right now. I do miss unloading those trucks though. Is alot more fun.
#19

toastedamphibian

Oct 12, 2010 23:15:26
I play video games, spend time here, and am only 145† lbs.
_________
†This is after gaining 10 pounds in the last four months from going to the gym 3-4 times a week.



I drink too much soda....
#20

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 23:18:02
I play video games, spend time here, and am only 145† lbs.
_________
†This is after gaining 10 pounds in the last four months from going to the gym 3-4 times a week.



I drink too much soda....



I did too, then I switched to diet.  Diet mountain dew is the devil's dishwater (something as great as mountain dew should never be diet, it's an abomination), but it's the only diet pop that's palateable to me.
#21

EscherEnigma

Oct 12, 2010 23:26:58
I drink too much soda....


I'm on 3 or four cans of Dr. Pepper a day.
#22

toastedamphibian

Oct 12, 2010 23:32:35
I drink too much soda....


I'm on 3 or four cans of Dr. Pepper a day.



I've had 4 cans of Cherry Coke and a 32 oz fountain drink (Barks) since 3pm, and will probably have a few more before bed. Probably with booze in them, but thats not really the point at the moment.
#23

MechaPilot

Oct 12, 2010 23:35:59
I used to drink a 12-pack of mountain dew a day.

I would say that I won, if it wasn't for the fact that I so obviously lost.
#24

EscherEnigma

Oct 12, 2010 23:37:46
... Ok, you guys do have me beat on the soda.  I'll give you that small concession.
#25

pluisjen

Oct 13, 2010 3:38:55
I drink 6-8 glasses of water a day... it beats diet soda by a mile.

I'm still 200 pounds because I have a desk job and I like snacks but I'm also 6 feet 1, so I don't think it's really that overweight. According to my BMI I'm at 26, which is just above the "healthy limit" so I think I'm not doing so bad.

Now if only I could find the time and energy to do some more sports I might actually hit the healthy weight again Smile 
#26

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 6:57:41
theres a gym here at school lol open to all :D but if you're weak they don't like for you to be in there lmao I bench 310 Yell
#27

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 9:14:56
I'm losing weight but my middle is growing.  I like beer too much.  And I've been pretty unmotivated in the exercise department as of late.  At least I'm back down to about 168-ish (5'10").  Still, I could use some work.
#28

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 9:25:35
alas, tis what happens in old age :p
#29

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 10:09:03
Ya, dat be da truf, mon.
#30

scypio

Oct 13, 2010 10:33:08
I'm 5'9" and 135lb.

That's pretty heavy for me. I don't think I've ever weighed more. I was thinking of starting a jogging routine now that the weather is nicer, but it seems like its been raining most days which I'd have time. I also saw an ad in the local newspaper about an adult soccer league. Even though its probably not adult in the sexy sense, I might check it out next Spring.

But yeah, I work a partial desk job and eat pretty bad. Speaking of which, I'm off to McDonalds right now =P
#31

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 11:15:15
Dood.  You're tiny.  Have trouble finding clothes that fit right?  I know I do.  Though with my expanding waistline, things have gotten a li'l easier. 
#32

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 11:36:38
I'm 5'9" and 135lb.

That's pretty heavy for me. I don't think I've ever weighed more. I was thinking of starting a jogging routine now that the weather is nicer, but it seems like its been raining most days which I'd have time. I also saw an ad in the local newspaper about an adult soccer league. Even though its probably not adult in the sexy sense, I might check it out next Spring.

But yeah, I work a partial desk job and eat pretty bad. Speaking of which, I'm off to McDonalds right now =P



taco bell is better
#33

EscherEnigma

Oct 13, 2010 11:44:44
I do have trouble finding clothes that fit right.  If it fits around the shoulders, it's too baggy at the waist or the sleeves aren't long enough.  If it fits at the waist, the inseam is too short.  If the inseam is long enough, then the waist is too big.
#34

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 11:46:39
mhm mhm you need to wear womens shirts lmao
#35

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 11:48:36
I do have trouble finding clothes that fit right.  If it fits around the shoulders, it's too baggy at the waist or the sleeves aren't long enough.  If it fits at the waist, the inseam is too short.  If the inseam is long enough, then the waist is too big.



Yep.  Us slight of frame guys typically have a more difficult time finding clothes.  Most of my work stuff is actually from the Junior section at Kohl's.  Apparently kids aren't as bulky overall.  Or something.
#36

scypio

Oct 13, 2010 11:53:16
I was actually debating if I wanted to go to Taco Bell or McDonalds. But I'm just a sucka and fell for their promotion (Monopoly time). I do think I craved Taco Bell more. I do like that volcano taco.

I don't really have a problem finding clothes. I wear 30-32 pants, which seem not too hard to find. I normally will get medium shirts if its for casual wear (I like loose clothing) and small if its more formal.

But I don't really wear clothes which "fit well", so its not really a problem for me. It seems like the only things that I wear which need to fit are suits and the like which are tailored anyway. That reminds me, I should get a new suit. I kind of want one very similar to what Joseph Gordon Levitt wore in "Inception" and I have a wedding to go to soon, so it seems like a good enough reason.
#37

EscherEnigma

Oct 13, 2010 11:54:24
mhm mhm you need to wear womens shirts lmao


Don't fit right.  The flares for the hips end up just hanging in air looking silly, and if I don't stuff the shirt the baggy front just looks weird.  And if I get a shirt tight enough that those aren't problems, I'm then wearing a shirt that's uncomfortably and unflatteringly tight around my shoulders, ribs and stomach.

That is to say: women's shirts are fitted differently then men's shirts; it's not just a matter of scale. 
#38

pluisjen

Oct 13, 2010 11:55:41
Maybe you need to learn how to modify shirts to your liking? Tongue out I think a lot of people could use that skill.

Not me though, I like baggy clothing xD 
#39

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 11:56:21
I don't really have a problem finding clothes. I wear 30-32 pants, which seem not too hard to find. I normally will get medium shirts if its for casual wear (I like loose clothing) and small if its more formal.



Really.  Hmm, I never could find pants that size.  Like, ever.  Plenty of friggin' 36-32s and the like, though.  Maybe Ohio's a fatter place than New York.  Heh. 
#40

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 11:59:23
ok 1. two dollar meal deal, number four. walk up to taco bell counter and say that
2. wear polo shirts
#41

scypio

Oct 13, 2010 12:02:27

I actually meant 30-32 (sometimes 34) waist. Typically, I get 32-34 for length. So its some combination of that (32-34 is probably the best for my comfort, but 30-30 probably fits the best). And I do find it harder than it used to be (I have to look a little longer), but I still find stuff. So people are getting fatter, but maybe at a slower rate in New Jersey. (I rarely buy clothes in New York since they actually tax it there.)

#42

pluisjen

Oct 13, 2010 12:04:40
Two dollar meal? That sounds insanely cheap. You'd have trouble making your own taco's for two dollars where I live, let alone get them at a fast food joint Surprised
#43

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 12:08:13
Two dollar meal? That sounds insanely cheap. You'd have trouble making your own taco's for two dollars where I live, let alone get them at a fast food joint Surprised



actually the one i said was a 5 layer burrito with sour cream, cheese, beans, meat, and another layer of cheese then you get a medium drink and a bag of doritos :D its like a one pound burrito
#44

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 12:08:17
I actually meant 30-32 (sometimes 34) waist. Typically, I get 32-34 for length. So its some combination of that (32-34 is probably the best for my comfort, but 30-30 probably fits the best). And I do find it harder than it used to be (I have to look a little longer), but I still find stuff. So people are getting fatter, but maybe at a slower rate in New Jersey. (I rarely buy clothes in New York since they actually tax it there.)



Yeah, I meant 36 waist and 32 inseam, heh.  I used to wear 30 waist but now 32 is better.  Stupid beer and general laziness.  ;)  Still, it's tough to find pants that aren't made for someone that's grotesquely overweight.  Kinda makes clothes shopping even more annoying. 
#45

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 12:10:40
brings a tear to my eyes lmao

I just realized I put eyes plural so i'll, instead of correcting my mistake, say that there is 1/2 tear in each eye
#46

pluisjen

Oct 13, 2010 12:11:41
Two dollar meal? That sounds insanely cheap. You'd have trouble making your own taco's for two dollars where I live, let alone get them at a fast food joint Surprised



actually the one i said was a 5 layer burrito with sour cream, cheese, beans, meat, and another layer of cheese then you get a medium drink and a bag of doritos :D its like a one pound burrito



Holy crap. That's... insane. I suddenly start to realise how people can afford to eat this stuff everyday Tongue out
#47

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 12:14:32
lol yeah it's the cheapest deal in town :p kfc has a sandwich with no bread, two chicken filets, two pieces of cheese, two pieces of bacon, and a mayonaisse like sauce lol it's disgusting
#48

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 12:15:38
Holy crap. That's... insane. I suddenly start to realise how people can afford to eat this stuff everyday 



Yeah, we've also got dollar menus at every fast food joint you can think of.  So, every day you could eat a fast food burger, fries and drink a soda for about $3 (a little over due to soda tax).  The standard menu items do get a bit pricier but you can still have a basic meal for about $5.  It's cheap, easy to get and kinda tasty.  Er, tasty enough for the required expenditure and effort, I suppose.
#49

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 12:18:38
waffle house has a dollar menu now lol
#50

scypio

Oct 13, 2010 12:21:24
Yeah, I meant 36 waist and 32 inseam, heh.  I used to wear 30 waist but now 32 is better.  Stupid beer and general laziness.  ;)  Still, it's tough to find pants that aren't made for someone that's grotesquely overweight.  Kinda makes clothes shopping even more annoying.

Yeah, fat people kind of ruin everything =P

I actually have to do some clothes shopping. Besides the suit, I need to buy more work clothes since my shirts are getting to a pretty bad level of worn-ness... which I mean, visible holes are popping up everywhere.
#51

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 12:21:47
Know what's messed up?  I have to literally try to say 'soda' instead of 'pop'.  Pop is what we say 'round these parts but it just sounds so stoopid.

EDIT: Yeah, I wear my stuff 'til it starts to get all frayed an' stuff.  As it is, I'm kinda shoppin' for crap a lot cuz my stuff was bought over a period of time instead of mostly at the same time.
#52

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 12:23:10
In atlanta they call all soda coke. thats it lol they don't even consider or acknowledge anything else
#53

pluisjen

Oct 13, 2010 12:28:04
Meh, general Dutch term is "fris", which means "fresh", so that's not much better. It comes from "frisdrank", which, as you might guess, means "fresh drink". I have no idea where the term comes from.

And yeah, that's really cheap. For a macdonalds menu, I think you pay something like 6 euro's? That's regular sized, even. I think they have like one or two burgers that you can get for a euro, and that's really, really basic stuff. 

And the other joints are even more expensive, I think mac donalds is the cheapest. Most snackbars charge about 2 euro's just for a bag of fries. 
#54

zombie_babies

Oct 13, 2010 12:31:19
Yep, they make it easy here to eat crap.  I'm pretty sure our portions are also much, much larger - even in the same restaurant (McD's, for example).  Thing is, in some ways it's a good thing.  For us (me an' the gal), with our schedules there's sometimes nothing else that's really practical.  For a lot of others, though, it's a matter of finances.  When people are struggling to afford groceries, I think a cheap ready food-like substance is a pretty ok sort of thing.
#55

EscherEnigma

Oct 13, 2010 12:34:32
Cheap food is good.  There's a local burrito place in town where I can get a real nice burrito (not fast-food crap) with steak, potatoes, beans, cheese and green chile all for 3.75 (including tax).  Not as cheap as a dollar menu, but it's a friggin' huge burrito.  Most of the time I end up eating only half and saving the other half for later.

Re: pants
When I was buying a suit last month we found a jacket that everyone agreed looked good on me and fit and all that jazz.  So then we looked for the matching pants.  They didn't have any in 30-30.  So we wound up ordering it online.  Kinda annoying. 
#56

jesse.two.coins

Oct 13, 2010 12:35:03
unless you have food stamps which i'm not a fan of
#57

pluisjen

Oct 13, 2010 12:39:15
Cheap food isn't a bad thing, but it gets dangerous when the really unhealthy food gets much cheaper then anything resembling healty stuff. When you pay more to get fresh vegetables at the supermarket then you do to get a complete meal at McD, you're getting into a situation where the financially smart option is to eat crap.

You can get close to that here, but for now it's cheaper to get at least semi-healthy food at lower prices then you can get junk food, but the price difference between a healthy restaurant meal (+/- 15 euros pp if you're going cheap) and junk food (+/- 8 euros pp if you're getting a big meal) is still pretty big.

Also, I know about the sizes. I was on vacation in Egypt, and according to some other people they used US sized meals. My girlfriend and I shared a single Medium Quarterpounder Menu and it was enough for us. Madness.


(As for pants, I'm sized 36-34 these days I believe. But I only buy new clothes when I can literally see holes in the old ones, and even then it often takes a few weeks, so I'm never really sure about that stuff)
#58

scypio

Oct 13, 2010 14:00:15
In atlanta they call all soda coke. thats it lol they don't even consider or acknowledge anything else

My wife sometimes calls generic soda "Coke". I make fun of her for it. But she's not from the South or anything like that; she's from Taiwan, so I guess its pretty common in other places in the world.

Also, I know about the sizes. I was on vacation in Egypt, and according to some other people they used US sized meals. My girlfriend and I shared a single Medium Quarterpounder Menu and it was enough for us. Madness.

Yeah, from my memory, Eyptian fast food was the same size as American portions. Normally, if we get fast food and the wife gets a normal burger (whopper or quarter pounder), she'll save half for another meal. And I know a few people (females) who like to eat "children meals" because they think adult portions are too big. Some places seem to actually require a child, but others allow it.
#59

toastedamphibian

Oct 13, 2010 17:38:37
Cheap food isn't a bad thing, but it gets dangerous when the really unhealthy food gets much cheaper then anything resembling healty stuff. When you pay more to get fresh vegetables at the supermarket then you do to get a complete meal at McD, you're getting into a situation where the financially smart option is to eat crap.



Getting into? That is a simple fact here. Actually making good food takes longer, uses more gas, makes a bigger mess to clean up, and costs more. [Is a big part of why poor people are fat.]

The basic options are to get something prepared at the grocery store that I can microwave, or hit a fast food joint. An actual home cooked meal is a luxury. Buying a loaf of fresh bread, some sliced deli cheese, and some peperone cost more than buying a large peperone pizza (about 14$ vs 5$ for the pizza) and took longer.
#60

EscherEnigma

Oct 13, 2010 19:03:58
I imagine most people would.
Still a luxury though.
#61

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 13, 2010 19:36:47
I'm like, ~5'8" and 210 lbs, so yeah, I'm a fat ass. I was actually much thinner when I was 255lbs. Stupid fat, being all light and ****.



As if it matters, or anyone cares, but I'll give my vitals too...

6'2" and ~200 lbs.
But I ain't all cut or super strong or nuthin'...

And EE's abs look waaayyyy better than mine... if I could find them...
#62

toastedamphibian

Oct 13, 2010 20:51:16
I was wrong! I'm 5'9.5"!
#63

Mad_Jack

Oct 14, 2010 1:00:07

Shirts need to be 3x just to get my shoulders into them. Long sleeve shirts, no they just don't fit. If I can find a dress shitr that can close on my neck, the sleeves are short, or the length is such that I cannot even tuck it in. 



Oh, I hear ya there, brother. I'm only 5'11", but I've got an 18-in. neck and a 54-in. chest. If I grew my beard long enough, I'd look like a supersized dwarf. If I find a shirt that fits across my shoulders, the stomach area is huge on me.
 And it sucks trying to find 44 waist pants with only a 30 inseam.

#64

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 1:33:27
Interesting pricing system you have... it does explain a lot. I´m used to supermarkets selling premade meals at higher prices then home made ones, especially once you start cooking for more then 1 person, and fast food joints being priced even above that. 

It does seem to help somewhat in keeping poor people a little bit healthier. Now if they also stopped selling really cheap beer... 
#65

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 7:39:02
alcohol....is bad...I don't care what anyone says...alcohol is terrible. I've never seen a responsible drinker under the age of 35. And alot of them still aren't.
#66

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 7:41:23
It depends highly on the people you hang out with. I'm a responsible drinker (or at least think I am). I never get drunk, and I only drink more then 1 glass of anything if I'm with people I feel very comfortable with (of which there are, at this time, only 2)

But yes, alcohol is a very dangerous drug, and should be treated as such Wink 
#67

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 7:45:07
mostly americans that i've consciously noticed. for instance the hundreds upon hundreds of american college kids that multiple times a year flock to places like cancun only for the alcohol and lower drinking age
#68

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 7:51:44
Yeah, I know plenty of those. Down here, the battlecry for many, many people, especially in the age category of +/- 14 to 28 seems to be "Zuipen!". Which is a verb for "Drink excessively". (I mean, come on, we have a verb for it? How bad is that)

The goal of such an endeavour is to get drunk before your friends do, and the one that remembers least from the previous evening wins.
#69

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 7:55:13
wow alright you got me beat with the 14 y.o.'s lol never seen that. no age restriction i'm guessing?
#70

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:00:43
16+ for light alcohol (beer) and 18+ for strong stuff. But kinda hard to enforce when the 16 year olds can just buy it and take it home to drink with their younger friends. Many parents don't really seem to care and I don't think there's a very hefty fine on it either.

I've seen my brother host a "party" for his 16th birthday. Really, it was a total disgrace. I've never felt so bad for being related to him. It was just a bunch of 14-17 year olds locked up in a small shed with +/- 2 liters of strong alcohol PP guzzling away. Up to the point where I had to hold a girl pinned to a chair because she couldn't sit on it by herself while we waited for her parents to come pick her up because she couldn't even walk anymore (not like swerving, like dropping like a sack of potatoes when you didn't support her) and she still kept muttering "I'm not drunk" to us.

Yeah, that's the general state of things when it comes to youngsters and drinking. It's really quite horrible. It doesn't surprise me in the least that the general braincapacity of people seems to be going down the toilet when you realise this is the normal way to do things for lots of people. 
#71

boraxe

Oct 14, 2010 8:04:36
alcohol....is bad...I don't care what anyone says...alcohol is terrible.


You are wrong.

I've never seen a responsible drinker under the age of 35. And alot of them still aren't.


Personal anecdotes are not proof. Maybe you just hang out with dumbasses.
#72

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:07:07
You are wrong.



While you are right that personal anecdotes aren't proof, I'm curious why you don't think alcohol is bad for you... because it really is. It's quite poisonous and bad for the brain. I mean, it doesn't kill you if used in moderation, and I can see why some people like getting the buzz, or just completely wasted, but it's kinda hard to argue that it's healthy or even "not hurting anything".
#73

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:07:18
mhm thats what happened the third time I tried alcohol. first time was flirtation. second time was a buzz. third was a half gallon of tequila. It was a progressive experiment that I did for a scince contest :P theres videos somewhere. There were all kinds of tests but I forgot alot :/ the increments were 1. one beer. 2. 2litre of half coke half rum over course of two hours 3. half gallon of cheap tequila.
#74

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:08:33
That sounds like a pretty dangerous experiment... especially for someone your age.
#75

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:09:39
alcohol....is bad...I don't care what anyone says...alcohol is terrible.


You are wrong.

I've never seen a responsible drinker under the age of 35. And alot of them still aren't.


Personal anecdotes are not proof. Maybe you just hang out with dumbasses.



I was giving unnecessary examples. Not proof. But I respect your opinion.
#76

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:12:03
That sounds like a pretty dangerous experiment... especially for someone your age.



that was the point. we did it by weight height and BMI and the subject was "effects of alcohol on an underage brain" or something like that. there were I.q. tests involved. we were careful to calculate it so I didn't die or anything. and for the last one we had an E.M.T. present
#77

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:16:12
That's at least smart thinking, to get someone with first aid skills involved. But still... that might've docked a few permanent points of IQ in addition to the temporary ones.
#78

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:17:57
well I contributed them to science in a small way lol no university could have ever done that ya know?
#79

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:24:50
Did you put the research online and/or turned it in to big universiteit/research labs? Because otherwise I'm not sure if your sacrifice was really worth much in the big picture Tongue out
#80

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:30:43
Did you put the research online and/or turned it in to big universiteit/research labs? Because otherwise I'm not sure if your sacrifice was really worth much in the big picture Tongue out



yes lol its posted somewhere I can try to find a link but we emailed and submitted in paper all of our raw data to a bunch of universities a few seemed interested I heard but I didn't handle that aspect :P
#81

scypio

Oct 14, 2010 8:31:36
Interesting pricing system you have... it does explain a lot. I´m used to supermarkets selling premade meals at higher prices then home made ones, especially once you start cooking for more then 1 person, and fast food joints being priced even above that. 

It does seem to help somewhat in keeping poor people a little bit healthier. Now if they also stopped selling really cheap beer... 

It seems natural to me. The better quality food is more expensive. So fresh produce and fresh meats are more expensive than lesser quality materials which are heavily preserved like the frozen dinners or fast food meals.

Although, I think people overestimate how much it cost to make food. Stuff like pasta is insanely cheap. If you have pasta and generic sauce, its probably cheaper than McDonalds.
#82

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:34:43
its equivalent but it lasts longer (i.e. leftovers and what not) someone did an experiment where they left out a mcdonalds burger and fries for like 6 months and nothing changed about it. it looked the same lol not even mouldy. just got rock hard. thats scary to me.
#83

zombie_babies

Oct 14, 2010 8:37:59
3. half gallon of cheap tequila.



Umm.  I've seen alcohol related experiments and they never, ever require that this much alcohol be consumed.  Cuz it's incredibly dangerous.  So, either you simply forgot what was asked, are exaggerating for some reason, are just making the whole thing up or the 'experiment' was not an experiment in the classical sense.  Or they lied to you about its legitimacy and put you in danger.  Or it actually happened, there is proof and I am wrong.  Heh. 
#84

zombie_babies

Oct 14, 2010 8:41:37
its equivalent but it lasts longer (i.e. leftovers and what not) someone did an experiment where they left out a mcdonalds burger and fries for like 6 months and nothing changed about it. it looked the same lol not even mouldy. just got rock hard. thats scary to me.



That 'experiment' has been performed twice - at the least.  Thing is, it's in dispute.  McDonald's only uses real meat with no preservatives of any kind and has gone on record stating it.  They contend that no unaltered piece of meat could last that long without rotting and, therefore, some sort of shenanigans must be at play.  Considering the photos of the food are taken at interval and there's no time lapse stuff going on, it's incredibly possible the people performing these 'experiments' are altering the results for personal gain (notoriety).  Until someone actually performs the experiment in a proper fashion, all we have is rumor and to suppose this rumor equates to some sort of fact is a mistake. 
#85

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:44:36
It seems natural to me. The better quality food is more expensive. So fresh produce and fresh meats are more expensive than lesser quality materials which are heavily preserved like the frozen dinners or fast food meals.

Although, I think people overestimate how much it cost to make food. Stuff like pasta is insanely cheap. If you have pasta and generic sauce, its probably cheaper than McDonalds.



Hrm, well I'm not sure how expensive it is to actually put all those generic components together; apparently it's more affordable in the US? I don't know.

But yeah; making a cheap meal is also an acquired skill. I could probably whip up a 3 person meal for 4 euro's if I wanted to, but I guess I'm kinda used to a little bit of luxury.

Uncooked pasta, a few tomatoes (fresh or preminced), a small pot of italian spices, some substance (frozen or fresh veggies, maybe some minced meat or spam) and a bit of cream (either sour cream, ground cheese, or just a bit of milk) and you can quickly and easily make a tasty meal. I mean it'd take like 15 minutes to get ready, so it's probably about on par with going to the McD and I'm guessing about the same price... but it's a lot healthier. And it'll probably taste better as well.
#86

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 8:45:57
its equivalent but it lasts longer (i.e. leftovers and what not) someone did an experiment where they left out a mcdonalds burger and fries for like 6 months and nothing changed about it. it looked the same lol not even mouldy. just got rock hard. thats scary to me.



That 'experiment' has been performed twice - at the least.  Thing is, it's in dispute.  McDonald's only uses real meat with no preservatives of any kind and has gone on record stating it.  They contend that no unaltered piece of meat could last that long without rotting and, therefore, some sort of shenanigans must be at play.  Considering the photos of the food are taken at interval and there's no time lapse stuff going on, it's incredibly possible the people performing these 'experiments' are altering the results for personal gain (notoriety).  Until someone actually performs the experiment in a proper fashion, all we have is rumor and to suppose this rumor equates to some sort of fact is a mistake. 



Macdonalds should perform it themselves to end the myth once and for all Smile
#87

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:49:37
3. half gallon of cheap tequila.



Umm.  I've seen alcohol related experiments and they never, ever require that this much alcohol be consumed.  Cuz it's incredibly dangerous.  So, either you simply forgot what was asked, are exaggerating for some reason, are just making the whole thing up or the 'experiment' was not an experiment in the classical sense.  Or they lied to you about its legitimacy and put you in danger.  Or it actually happened, there is proof and I am wrong.  Heh. 



that was an approximation lol the container looked big so i was guessing lol it wasn't marked with the measurements it's prolly close though
#88

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:50:29
its equivalent but it lasts longer (i.e. leftovers and what not) someone did an experiment where they left out a mcdonalds burger and fries for like 6 months and nothing changed about it. it looked the same lol not even mouldy. just got rock hard. thats scary to me.



That 'experiment' has been performed twice - at the least.  Thing is, it's in dispute.  McDonald's only uses real meat with no preservatives of any kind and has gone on record stating it.  They contend that no unaltered piece of meat could last that long without rotting and, therefore, some sort of shenanigans must be at play.  Considering the photos of the food are taken at interval and there's no time lapse stuff going on, it's incredibly possible the people performing these 'experiments' are altering the results for personal gain (notoriety).  Until someone actually performs the experiment in a proper fashion, all we have is rumor and to suppose this rumor equates to some sort of fact is a mistake. 



Macdonalds should perform it themselves to end the myth once and for all Smile



shoot i'll do it lol
#89

scypio

Oct 14, 2010 8:53:13
Hrm, well I'm not sure how expensive it is to actually put all those generic components together; apparently it's more affordable in the US? I don't know.

But yeah; making a cheap meal is also an acquired skill. I could probably whip up a 3 person meal for 4 euro's if I wanted to, but I guess I'm kinda used to a little bit of luxury.

Uncooked pasta, a few tomatoes (fresh or preminced), a small pot of italian spices, some substance (frozen or fresh veggies, maybe some minced meat or spam) and a bit of cream (either sour cream, ground cheese, or just a bit of milk) and you can quickly and easily make a tasty meal. I mean it'd take like 15 minutes to get ready, so it's probably about on par with going to the McD and I'm guessing about the same price... but it's a lot healthier. And it'll probably taste better as well.

Yep, making food isn't as hard or expensive as people say. People just don't know what to make and are too lazy/afraid to experiment for the most part.
#90

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 8:55:41
isn't four euros like 6.8 USD?
#91

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 9:06:16
5.6 dollars according to google. It's about the amount of money you pay for a one-person microwave meal (unless you go really low quality... the barely recognisable stuff) and less then you pay for a regular sized menu at McD. You might be able to get a serving of chips and some manner of deep-fried snack thing for it.

And yes Scypio, the lazy part is true. I don't always feel like making stuff. The experimenting... it's just something you should get over. Assuming you add edible things together, at worst it's going to taste poorly, but it's not going to be dangerous. And if it's really nasty, you could always throw it out and go microwave instead. (Somewhat more expensive, though) 
#92

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 9:08:29
It's out of balance to be honest. there are examples but it varies from state to state and vastly from country to country so somebody should find a study :D
#93

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 9:09:23
What's out of balance? You really should try to explain stuff more, it makes posts easier to read.
#94

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 9:16:04
sorry, the whole concept of healthy food= more money and unhealthy food= cheaper. there are infinite possibilities. at least thats the way I see it.
#95

ADHadh

Oct 14, 2010 10:36:05
alcohol....is bad...I don't care what anyone says...alcohol is terrible. I've never seen a responsible drinker under the age of 35. And alot of them still aren't.


I'm one! And my mead is not terrible. Beer is though.
#96

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 11:10:30
Heh, tomatoes are one of the things that make easy pasta easy and healthy. You could replace the tomato sauce with a somewhat heftier cheesecream sauce though, if you use some butter and flour, and then mix in milk and cheese. Goes great with various mushrooms, greenpeas, maybe corn, and maybe some ham.
#97

boraxe

Oct 14, 2010 11:22:16
I'm curious why you don't think alcohol is bad for you... because it really is.


First, the claim was "alcohol is bad", not "bad for you". It was a generalized declarative statement ascribing moral characteristics to an inanimate substance and as such is patently untrue.

Second, many studies have shown that moderate drinking can actually have many health benefits including reduced risk of dementia, stroke, heart disease, hypertension, high blood pressure, diabetes, rheumatoid arthritis, bone fractures and osteoporosis, kidney stones, digestive ailments, stress and depression, poor cognition and memory, Parkinson's disease, hepatitis A, pancreatic cancer, macular degeneration (a major cause of blindness), angina pectoris, duodenal ulcer, erectile dysfunction, hearing loss, gallstones, liver disease and poor physical condition in elderly.

It's quite poisonous and bad for the brain.


Actually it is only very mildly toxic, far less so than many everyday prescription medications. Appreciable long-term brain damage from alcohol requires excessive drinking over an extended period of time.

I mean, it doesn't kill you if used in moderation, and I can see why some people like getting the buzz, or just completely wasted, but it's kinda hard to argue that it's healthy or even "not hurting anything".


The key word here is "moderation". Abuse of alcohol is the problem, not alcohol itself.
#98

boraxe

Oct 14, 2010 11:24:59
mhm thats what happened the third time I tried alcohol. first time was flirtation. second time was a buzz. third was a half gallon of tequila. It was a progressive experiment that I did for a scince contest :P theres videos somewhere. There were all kinds of tests but I forgot alot :/ the increments were 1. one beer. 2. 2litre of half coke half rum over course of two hours 3. half gallon of cheap tequila.


I find it difficult to believe you imbided 64 1oz shots and did not die.
#99

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 11:33:08
mhm thats what happened the third time I tried alcohol. first time was flirtation. second time was a buzz. third was a half gallon of tequila. It was a progressive experiment that I did for a scince contest :P theres videos somewhere. There were all kinds of tests but I forgot alot :/ the increments were 1. one beer. 2. 2litre of half coke half rum over course of two hours 3. half gallon of cheap tequila.


I find it difficult to believe you imbided 64 1oz shots and did not die.



I already elaborated that 1. It wasn't exactly that much. I exaggerated. and 2. whose to say it stayed down? haha
#100

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 11:37:17

First, the claim was "alcohol is bad", not "bad for you". It was a generalized declarative statement ascribing moral characteristics to an inanimate substance and as such is patently untrue.



True point. Misread his sentence.


Second, many studies have shown that moderate drinking can actually have many health benefits including reduced risk of dementia, stroke, heart disease, hypertension, high blood pressure, diabetes, rheumatoid arthritis, bone fractures and osteoporosis, kidney stones, digestive ailments, stress and depression, poor cognition and memory, Parkinson's disease, hepatitis A, pancreatic cancer, macular degeneration (a major cause of blindness), angina pectoris, duodenal ulcer, erectile dysfunction, hearing loss, gallstones, liver disease and poor physical condition in elderly.



Hm I'm getting a lot of contradictionary results from google. Some suggestions that moderate alcohol usage (defined in most places as no more then 1 drink per day) is beneficial, but also sources indicating that this is mostly true only for males over the age of 50/60 instead of for everyone.

Most sources seem to agree that it's always a bad idea to drink under the age of 21.

It's quite poisonous and bad for the brain.
Actually it is only very mildly toxic, far less so than many everyday prescription medications. Appreciable long-term brain damage from alcohol requires excessive drinking over an extended period of time.



Excessive drinking? I don't know the numbers but I do remember hearing when I was in University that the guidelines for calling someone an "alcoholic" were at something like drinking more then 6 glasses per week or more then 4 glasses on an evening, and that they "discarded" these guidelines because it made 80% of all students alcoholics.

Would you happen to know when it gets excessive? Because if that happens at around 5 glasses on an evening, then people need to be made aware that they're drinking excessively. Many people currently feel that 10 glasses isn't too bad, and 30 glasses is a good thing, not "excessive drinking".


The key word here is "moderation". Abuse of alcohol is the problem, not alcohol itself.



Abuse of anything is always a problem, but I don't have too much faith in the healing properties of alcohol just yet.

#101

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 11:43:16
btw its called alcohol poisoning. so yeah its poisonous. and I did mean to put bad for you. I would edit it but it would be pointless
#102

boraxe

Oct 14, 2010 12:21:42
btw its called alcohol poisoning. so yeah its poisonous. and I did mean to put bad for you. I would edit it but it would be pointless


"Alcohol poisoning" refers to a level of alcohol in one's system which endangers their life by impairing the nervous system's control of autonomous functions. Simply being tipsy, or even flat-out drunk, is not "alcohol poisoning".

One can also suffer from Sun Poisoning and Water Intoxication if taken to excess. Again, abuse of alcohol is the issue not alcohol itself.
#103

jesse.two.coins

Oct 14, 2010 12:24:31

that was what I was implying.

#104

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 15:20:00
I don't really like mushrooms either, but they taste good in this dish. It's a very basic recipe at any rate; you can vary endlessly. Use peas, should work just as well.

Can you eat tomatoes you cooked yourself? Could be the skin that's being the problem maybe, I think they remove the skin when they make smooth sauce. 
#105

zombie_babies

Oct 14, 2010 15:45:40
I had water intoxication once.  I can't tell the story and don't really feel like it, but I can tell you that that experience was a damn sight more frightening than any experience I've had with alcohol - up to and including blackout.  That was not a good evening/three days.
#106

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 16:08:03

While you are right that personal anecdotes aren't proof, I'm curious why you don't think alcohol is bad for you... because it really is. It's quite poisonous and bad for the brain. I mean, it doesn't kill you if used in moderation, and I can see why some people like getting the buzz, or just completely wasted, but it's kinda hard to argue that it's healthy or even "not hurting anything".



Too much of anything is poison, even oxygen and water.
And alchol is the same way. Drinking a beer per day won't hurt you, and is probably good for you.

I could probably look up some evidence that supports my position, but I think most educated, reasonable people already are aware of this.

*shrug*
#107

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 16:09:36
I don't really like mushrooms either...


I don't either...
Except for one very specific type...


;)
#108

toastedamphibian

Oct 14, 2010 16:35:40
Drinking half a bottle of Jagermeister when already drunk on vodka and rum makes for a bad 3 days. Yup. Don't do that. [Forms a black sludge in your stomach, or at least in mine, that just will not come up]
#109

pluisjen

Oct 14, 2010 16:50:17
Too much of anything is poison, even oxygen and water.



You don't even need an awful lot of oxygen, it's pretty dangerous. Especially if it´s concentrated.

Anyway. Whether or not one beer is good for you appears to be in doubt, you can find various conflicting resources. I do agree that it's not going to kill you, if you stick to one. That appears to be the real challenge for most people, though. 
#110

Klirshon

Oct 14, 2010 19:45:12
... someone did an experiment where they left out a mcdonalds burger and fries for like 6 months and nothing changed about it. it looked the same lol not even mouldy. just got rock hard. thats scary to me.



While the experiment is not well documented and could be an exaggeration, the likely reason for those food items to sustain its "integrity" over a long period of time is the salt content.
#111

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 19:51:02

Not that I want to be trolling or baiting RH, but you do know that you probably insulted Plu with the "most educated people know this" comment. Just saying.


Nah... he knows I wasn't specifically talking to him.
He would expect a more subtle, witty insult from me... or a more vicious, direct attack...

Either way, he can report it as such if he wishes, or you can report as such...
*shrug*
#112

EscherEnigma

Oct 14, 2010 20:07:39
You can be subtle, RH?  You been holdin' out on me or sumthin'?
#113

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 20:17:03
Can't we talk between adults?


Yeah, most of us can.

I'm not so certain about you...
#114

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 20:17:39
You can be subtle, RH?  You been holdin' out on me or sumthin'?


I think I've just been insulted
#115

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 20:23:35
Can't we talk between adults?


Yeah, most of us can.

I'm not so certain about you...

Your humor is indeep subtle.





#116

EscherEnigma

Oct 14, 2010 20:30:13
You can be subtle, RH?  You been holdin' out on me or sumthin'?


I think I've just been insulted


Only if you think there was a value judgement in there.
#117

toastedamphibian

Oct 14, 2010 20:34:10
You can be subtle, RH?  You been holdin' out on me or sumthin'?


I think I've just been insulted


Only if you think there was a value judgement in there.



Eschey? Judgmental? Pish!
#118

EscherEnigma

Oct 14, 2010 20:36:54
Seeing my restraint in calling people trolls, I'd say I'm fairly good about being non-judgemental.
#119

toastedamphibian

Oct 14, 2010 21:14:46
Seeing my restraint in calling people trolls, I'd say I'm fairly good about being non-judgemental.



Nu-unh. Your good at avoiding having to straight say it, like you think your too good to spend time actually explaining your judgements to us. Like, your an elitist or something.
#120

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 14, 2010 22:06:45


Its actually rather incredible that a construction worker is given information like this, isn't it?


Not really.
I am HAZWOPER trained and certified for confined space entry as well... and we have tons of info like that.
#121

EscherEnigma

Oct 15, 2010 1:27:25
Seeing my restraint in calling people trolls, I'd say I'm fairly good about being non-judgemental.



Nu-unh. Your good at avoiding having to straight say it, like you think your too good to spend time actually explaining your judgements to us. Like, your an elitist or something.


Hrm... not entirely fair.  While I am an elitist and don't want to explain my views on many things, I also don't feel that it's my place to judge people on many things, so even if I do have a strong view either way, I would hold my tongue because I don't feel it's my place to say it. 
#122

pluisjen

Oct 15, 2010 1:56:10
Feeling insulted pretty much requires caring about the person who´s insulting you, so I think I´ll be fine. Smile
#123

zombie_babies

Oct 15, 2010 10:55:03
HAZWOPER?

I'm not familiar with this one; obviously military, but it’s something I haven't come across in print.



Wiki sez ...

Had to look it up myself.  All I got out of it was 'hazardous' and 'operations'.  Heh.  ;)

EDIT: Sounds lolcat to me: I can haz whopper?
#124

scypio

Oct 15, 2010 12:26:44
ok 1. two dollar meal deal, number four. walk up to taco bell counter and say that
2. wear polo shirts

I just had meal deal number 4 plus 2 volcano tacos today for lunch. I don't I was a big fan of the beefy 5 layer buritto. It just wasn't beefy enough. But I did try it just because you mentioned it... so your credibility is falling!
#125

MechaPilot

Oct 15, 2010 15:46:17
Not really.
I am HAZWOPER trained and certified for confined space entry as well... and we have tons of info like that.



HAZWOPER?




HAZWOPER = The state of being that follows going to Burger King.
#126

ADHadh

Oct 16, 2010 13:28:07
There's also the fact that applying oxygen too quickly could be lethal as well. This practice is also called "setting people on fire" ;)
#127

Robin_Hoodlum

Oct 16, 2010 16:59:24
HAZWOPER?

I'm not familiar with this one; obviously military, but it’s something I haven't come across in print.



Wiki sez ...


Yeah this.
Also, you have to take an 8 hour refresher course every year... the skills are perishable...
#128

jesse.two.coins

Oct 18, 2010 7:17:26
ok 1. two dollar meal deal, number four. walk up to taco bell counter and say that
2. wear polo shirts

I just had meal deal number 4 plus 2 volcano tacos today for lunch. I don't I was a big fan of the beefy 5 layer buritto. It just wasn't beefy enough. But I did try it just because you mentioned it... so your credibility is falling!



 I eat it cuz I don't like spicy things. And sorry you didn't enjoy it
#129

scypio

Oct 18, 2010 9:40:46
 I eat it cuz I don't like spicy things. And sorry you didn't enjoy it

It definately was a good deal, so I'll probably try some of the other meals (supplementing them with volcano tacos). And you should learn to eat spicy foods; they're great.
#130

zombie_babies

Oct 18, 2010 10:18:30
The older I get, the more I like spicy foods.  Thing is, the older I get, the worse spicy foods are for me.  I indulge on occasion, but I can't make it a habit.  And that sucks.
#131

jesse.two.coins

Oct 18, 2010 11:59:32
yeah theres double decker tacos and you can get them to put a volcano taco inside