But here's a quesiton... just what is the purpose of the mother and father lines on your average birth certificate2? Is it to establish biological parents? Legitimacy? Protect the family structure? Legality?
I'm curious what people think the importance there is.
Things to keep in mind:
- Adoption changes your birth certificate.
- A paternty test for the "father" is not a routine part of filling out a birth certificate.
- The "father" line can be left blank if the mother doesn't know/refuses to tell who the father is.
- If the mother has a husband, his name is often written down, even if the people involved know that's not right.
So what do people think?
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1You have doctors in the 1800s and early 1900s to thank for that one.
2Yes, most are sexed like that. Some are neutral, just saying "born to __ and __" but most are "father ___ and mother ___"
So most people have a birth certificate. It's the sort of thing you get shortly after birth at a hospital, and as mid-wives are out of fashion1, most people are born in the hospital.
But here's a quesiton... just what is the purpose of the mother and father lines on your average birth certificate2? Is it to establish biological parents? Legitimacy? Protect the family structure? Legality?
I'm curious what people think the importance there is.
Things to keep in mind:
- Adoption changes your birth certificate.
- A paternty test for the "father" is not a routine part of filling out a birth certificate.
- The "father" line can be left blank if the mother doesn't know/refuses to tell who the father is.
- If the mother has a husband, his name is often written down, even if the people involved know that's not right.
So what do people think?________
1You have doctors in the 1800s and early 1900s to thank for that one.
2Yes, most are sexed like that. Some are neutral, just saying "born to __ and __" but most are "father ___ and mother ___"
I think it is there to help establish who the mother and father are (even if it isn't the biological father, it establishes the legal parents of the child).
Midwives are coming back into fashion. Both my children were born at home with the assistance of a midwife, and it's officially recognized in my province. This made me very happy, as it was covered by the provincial medical plan; we didn't pay a cent (and from the state's perspective, a home birth costs about half of a hospital birth, so they win too).
As for the purpose on the birth certificate, I guess it mostly indicates who's responsible for the child. Because it's so easy for the father to walk away from it (compared to the mother), it's easiest to leave out who the father is. It's always obvious who the mother is except when it's not by way of surrogate parents. In those cases, there are huge stacks of legal forms that need to be filled in. My cousin did it for a friend, and my wife and I were discussing the theoretical possibility of my wife doing it for some friends of ours.
Anywho, yeah. Legal responsibility for the child.
I think there is also the option to have a carrier mother only; so you take an egg from a woman, a sperm sample from a man, combine the two and then implant them in another woman who can actually carry the child.
As for the certificate; I'd say it's mostly legal. Down here, unless you are married before the state, you aren't automatically the father and have no legal say about the child. So you need to put your names on that certificate, or the only person who has anything to say about the child is the person it came out of.
As for the certificate; I'd say it's mostly legal. Down here, unless you are married before the state, you aren't automatically the father and have no legal say about the child. So you need to put your names on that certificate, or the only person who has anything to say about the child is the person it came out of.
Really? Disgusting. Seriously, that's really alarming that you have to be married to have any rights to the kid you are the father of. Not all marriages are stable relationships, not all stable relationships are marriages. My aunt had two kids with her boyfriend, and they were together for over twenty years. Compare that to Britney Spears who was married the first time for, what, 52 hours?
Yeah. Bizarre and archaic.
From then on, you have the same rights as a married partner would.
If you are married, then you are automatically the father of anything that came out of your wife, regardless of who put it there.
(Also, marriage isn't a religious thing, it's as simple as signing a few forms for city hall with a witness, no church involved)
You don't have to be married, but if you aren't married it doesn't happen automatically, you actually have to go down to city hall and sign the paper, and the mother has to let you (sfar as I know)
From then on, you have the same rights as a married partner would.
If you are married, then you are automatically the father of anything that came out of your wife, regardless of who put it there.
(Also, marriage isn't a religious thing, it's as simple as signing a few forms for city hall with a witness, no church involved)
Yeah, obviously I didn't read carefully enough. Nevermind.
Over in Canada, we didn't have a church wedding. I didn't do what both my parents and my wife's parents did and just go to city hall, but we did have a secular ceremony outside with a marriage commissioner. I think you can do similar things in the USA, but I wouldn't really know. The fact that a priest can perform the marriage doesn't mean s/he has to.
Yeah the traditional church marriage is losing out over here as well, we don't intend to have one either. We might get married in city hall at some point, and we might host a party, but there will be nothing religious about it
Pah, that's because you don't know how to do a proper wedding reception. ;)
We could host a damn awesome wedding reception if we wanted to.
Every religious reception I've been to was absolutely awful. No booze. At one, no booze, no dancing and no food. Have your wedding in a church if you wish, but make damned sure you have your reception as far away from it as possible. Or your friends will kill you.
As I was saying, you have no idea how to do a proper wedding reception.
Poland is one of the most religious European countries. Traditionally weddings are in churches, even "modern" couples prefer to have a church ceremony. But the reception lasts until no single drop of vodka is left (usually 2-3 days) :D
Weddings are Serious Business.
Of course, should I ever have a wedding and my grandfathers are still alive to see the day, it'll be dry too, but still.
I don't mind having a few drinks, or being around people who've had a few drinks, but when the goal of the party is "get roaring drunk", count me out
Ugh, a reception with a lot of booze would be one attend as shortly as possible for going home without being a jerk, it's really not my thing.
I don't mind having a few drinks, or being around people who've had a few drinks, but when the goal of the party is "get roaring drunk", count me out
No no, that would be pointless. You can get drunk on any occasion.
Weddings are a big thing.Usually you get most members of at least two families at one, a huge table, many meals, dance hall and a live band. There are also many centuries old traditions concerning weddings. Hell, my cousin held his in an open-air museum, with an old-timey band singing mostly forgotten songs.
Now everyone's looking expectantly at my older brother and his fiancée ;)
Weddings are a big thing.Usually you get most members of at least two families at one, a huge table, many meals, dance hall and a live band. There are also many centuries old traditions concerning weddings. Hell, my cousin held his in an open-air museum, with an old-timey band singing mostly forgotten songs.
My parents got married in a court house. I give it about 50-50 that my grandparents weren't much better, specially as I've never been shown wedding photos. The only reason me and the SO won't be married in a court house is if we let his mother get involved1...
Having a big wedding with all the family invited... that just sounds... weird2.
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1Provided either the NM legislature finally passes that bill or we move to a state that allows us to, that is.
2Then again, I didn't meet any of my first cousins till I was in high school (still haven't met half of them), didn't meet half of my aunts or uncles until I was an adult, and have only met one batch of 2nd cousins because they came out to attend my grandmother's funeral.