Welcome back, by the way. We missed ya!
Well, so then I was right when I said 5E was in the works? Go figure, and some people said it would take them years to pump out a new edition. Hopefully they realized how bad a mistake 4.5E was. I don't mind having less choices, I do mind not having any meaningful choices at each level. What are they doing with all the 4E stuff, are they just gonna drop it?
I'm not sure. I wonder if they've already stopped publishing stuff for 4E.
They published the last book with 4e crunch. Dungeon Delve I think.
The next books coming out are edition neutral. No 4e crunch in them.
As for the designers realizing Essentials was a mistake and that Essentials sunk 4e, is not the proper assumption. Essential was made to reunite a already divided fan base. It was 4e who divided the fan base and didn't bring in the estimated profits. The Mearls/MTV interview sheds some light on Essentials and the divided fan base.
Each edition fractures the fan-base, its just that each edition is coming faster and faster so they are fragmenting a fragment, before long there will be 20 camps each with such a small fan-base that WotC won't find D&D to be profitable anymore. Maybe they will get smart and release fluff for adventures (locations, maps, descriptions) separate from game data (stats for monsters, traps, DM Advice, etc...). So you buy the thick Adventure book, and than snatch up the edition you are playing thin companion book that has the stats and rules for the adventure in it... Nah, WotC is not that smart...
No. Scott Rouse disagrees with you: www.enworld.org/forum/news/316069-wizard...
So does Ryan Dancey: www.enworld.org/forum/news/315975-wizard...
And Mike Mearls: geek-news.mtv.com/2012/01/20/lead-develo...
4e fans need to take the financial failure less personally and understand that it doesn't reflect on the quality of the mechanics of 4e, just it's appeal to some fans.
All party liners because they'll get fired if they so much as breathe differently. Its readily apparent. People that liked 3.5E stayed with pathfinder. People that like Pre-E 4E stayed with Pre-E 4E. People that like Essentials will stay with Essentials. its just a matter of course. If they released their edition changes far enough out they could build up a fanbase for the current edition, as it is each new release of major rule changes such as 4.5E (Essentials, whether its compatible or not changed some rules) will divide their fanbase. It would have been better to incrementally change a few things every 6 months.
No. Scott Rouse disagrees with you: www.enworld.org/forum/news/316069-wizard...
So does Ryan Dancey: www.enworld.org/forum/news/315975-wizard...
And Mike Mearls: geek-news.mtv.com/2012/01/20/lead-develo...
4e fans need to take the financial failure less personally and understand that it doesn't reflect on the quality of the mechanics of 4e, just it's appeal to some fans.
All party liners because they'll get fired if they so much as breathe differently.
You didn't read. Rouse and Dancey do not work for WotC anymore and are free to say what they want.Its readily apparent. People that liked 3.5E stayed with pathfinder. People that like Pre-E 4E stayed with Pre-E 4E. People that like Essentials will stay with Essentials. its just a matter of course. If they released their edition changes far enough out they could build up a fanbase for the current edition, as it is each new release of major rule changes such as 4.5E (Essentials, whether its compatible or not changed some rules) will divide their fanbase. It would have been better to incrementally change a few things every 6 months.
You mean like they were already doing with the regular errata?
Essentials was a symptom of the division, not a cause, as Mearls' said:First, we had a divided audience. Second, if we kept altering the core of 4th Edition, the division would only become more apparent.
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They also started making 5e not long after Essential was release:In late 2010 we started looking at the long term future for the tabletop RPG.
. Aside from the speculation that early Essential sail figures might not have been encouraging and prompted the developpement of 5e, what is really important here is that they are think of long term, which might imply a durable edition. Creating a new rules system cost a lot as opposed to milking a system.
Mearls confirmed he wants a durable edition with 5e. Fractioning of the base, like 4e did, is not what they want. Like Scott Rouse said, 4e was supposed to last 8-10 years.
Now do you think everyone is lying and you are the only one who "understands"?
No, I think what they "think is going to happen" and "what IS going to happen" are two very different things. Take a look at the forums, people are already drawing lines. "If this is in 5E I'm staying with 3.5E". "If this isn't in 5E, I'm sticking with 4E". "If DDi isn't done halfway decent in 5E, I'm not subscribing." Its all over. Its just a fact they are going to lose people, unless 5E turns out to be a single book that describes how to play a 1E character at a table with 3.5E character, that is being DM'd by a 4.5E DM...not likely...
My only real point is that if they don't fully embrace the digital age (barring some kind of freak solar flare[which we are about 100 years overdue for]) they will lose players to the less complicated social apps and video games. They've had all of 4E to try and get it right, and instead they are barely treading water... I mean take a look at some of the crappy facebook games, they have more interaction than DDi, and WotC should know it, so they can do something about it.
Can anyone give me a summary of what's happened in the past 3-4 months concerning WotC and D&D?
Once 5e was announced, the trolling in 4e General ended and instead both sides troll each other in the D&DNext forums. Monte left WotC again, sparking more nerd rage and 3e fans immediately blamed the evil corporate empire Hasbro. The playtest begins later this month (24th?).
Moderation has gotten a bit lighter, possibly because using their old criteria would have the ORCs working overtime. And we still do most of our more interesting discussions in our private group.
And welcome back! Last time I saw you pop in you made two posts and then you were gone for months again.
But one thing remains, 4e divided the fan base more than previous edition switch and it was supposed to last longer. In other words, 4e wasn't a success.
Meh, it happens. I think every edition divides the fanbase. However, 3e had the advantage of the OGL, which led (for better or worse) to a lot of spin-offs. I personally hated 3e, but I really liked what I saw with a lot of the OGL material, so I bought a few WotC products and a lot of 3pp products so that I could make the game I wanted to play.
4e almost entirely killed 3pp support, not just with the GSL but also with the complete lack of CB support for anything other than official WotC material, not even homebrew support. Outside of a handful of products (and willingness to actually, *gasp*, create characters by hand), you drink the WotC kool-aid and if you prefer anything else, sucks to be you.
It also didn't help that the entire edition felt like one big experiment. Let's see if we can get people to pay us money every month to play the game like WoW. Let's see if we can sell them randomized card packs like MtG. Let's see if we can get more money every month by cutting off pdfs and offline tools. Let's release errata every month, making sure to hit minor things like clarifying the wording of a power that no one used, but see how long we can ignore broken items that were in PHB1.
Time for me to bust out the Risk Style map and start up the Edition War again?
Yes!!!
Can anyone give me a summary of what's happened in the past 3-4 months concerning WotC and D&D?
Once 5e was announced, the trolling in 4e General ended and instead both sides troll each other in the D&DNext forums. Monte left WotC again, sparking more nerd rage and 3e fans immediately blamed the evil corporate empire Hasbro. The playtest begins later this month (24th?).
Moderation has gotten a bit lighter, possibly because using their old criteria would have the ORCs working overtime. And we still do most of our more interesting discussions in our private group.
And welcome back! Last time I saw you pop in you made two posts and then you were gone for months again.
Thanks, and Yeah, they handed me a long temp ban. I'm no longer playing their games. Basically my signature sums up my feelings. If they want me to purchase their products they are going to have to learn to not treat their customers like idiots...
But one thing remains, 4e divided the fan base more than previous edition switch and it was supposed to last longer. In other words, 4e wasn't a success.
Meh, it happens. I think every edition divides the fanbase. However, 3e had the advantage of the OGL, which led (for better or worse) to a lot of spin-offs. I personally hated 3e, but I really liked what I saw with a lot of the OGL material, so I bought a few WotC products and a lot of 3pp products so that I could make the game I wanted to play.
4e almost entirely killed 3pp support, not just with the GSL but also with the complete lack of CB support for anything other than official WotC material, not even homebrew support. Outside of a handful of products (and willingness to actually, *gasp*, create characters by hand), you drink the WotC kool-aid and if you prefer anything else, sucks to be you.
It also didn't help that the entire edition felt like one big experiment. Let's see if we can get people to pay us money every month to play the game like WoW. Let's see if we can sell them randomized card packs like MtG. Let's see if we can get more money every month by cutting off pdfs and offline tools. Let's release errata every month, making sure to hit minor things like clarifying the wording of a power that no one used, but see how long we can ignore broken items that were in PHB1.
I agree completely (except I like 3.5E and I like 4E Pre-E even better). Hey can you throw me an invite to your group? Someone PM'd me and said you had started one...
Time for me to bust out the Risk Style map and start up the Edition War again?
Let's do!
Thanks, and Yeah, they handed me a long temp ban. I'm no longer playing their games. Basically my signature sums up my feelings. If they want me to purchase their products they are going to have to learn to not treat their customers like idiots...
Your sig also sums up my own feelings.
Also, I sent you a PM about the group.
Thanks, and Yeah, they handed me a long temp ban. I'm no longer playing their games. Basically my signature sums up my feelings. If they want me to purchase their products they are going to have to learn to not treat their customers like idiots...
Your sig also sums up my own feelings.
Also, I sent you a PM about the group.
Don't believe anything BN says about the group. We are very nice people who are very nice to each other. BN is just a hater.
Yes, and no one has ever been gang trolled into leaving. Ever.
Um... I was...no wait.. I was gang ORCed out...
Time for me to bust out the Risk Style map and start up the Edition War again?
I'm in!
Yes, and no one has ever been gang trolled into leaving. Ever.
He hasn't actually left, so you are right, it hasn't happened.
Yes, and no one has ever been gang trolled into leaving. Ever.
He hasn't actually left, so you are right, it hasn't happened.
Wait...
That's not funny!