no matter what the situation, or if there is a rule that isn't totally clear whatever stance they take is the correct way.
they will argue to no end seemingly out of fear of being wrong, even when the the truth is staring them in the face. Even to the point to where they are embarrassing theirselves.
Well i have this player (we will call him CW) who is very unreasonable, and CW is always walking all over the other players with his infinate knowledge...
Should i say something to him? he seems to be making things less fun for everyone....
Its at the point where no one wants to play anymore because they have to listen to him up on his High Horse, and he is always questioning all the rules just to start arguments with people.
I have gotten messages from my players saying how they are not really interested in playing with him anymore.
It seems like the other players are trying to deal with him as politely as possible, but us being reasonable doesnt seem to get through his thick skull...
should we kick him out of the group to make the game fun again?
i feel bad just booting someone and im not sure how to do it in a nice way...
any advice? have any of you had a player like this before?
Its a simple manner. The other players are NOT having fun with him. Why is his fun more important then the groups? It should be group fun, not high horse player fun and his sidekick/lackies.
i really dont want to go the FULL IGNORE route...
like when you ignore his phonecalls, never return messages, never invite him to anything....
Its give and take. In his case, all he is doing is taking, and not giving. But its only fair that you give him a chance. Talk to him in private. Let him know, that rule calling is in the DM's favor. (I'm assuming you). So once the DM says so, save it for AFTER the game. Then you can make an excuse about going to bed or something. Before next game, talk to him though if your the DM. Its one of those things that is a requirment. DMing is a full time job. Let him know that he is disrupting the other players. That they are not having fun. Don't name names. He'll be upset enough about it, no need to give him more ammo. Then play the game. If he starts going after a rule call or something, this part requires the group effort, say thank you, we'll read about after the game. if he keeps crying, keep ignoring anything that deals with rule calls. If he plays his character, then yeah, treat him with respect.
He'll likely threaten to quit. If he does, say "Ok, sorry to lose you. Its your choice. Your always welcome back".
And let him. He may quit a few times, he may shutup. Ether way, the game goes on.
People that behave like they are always right are either incredibly arrogant to the point I wouldn't be able to stomache them in or out of the game, or they are masking some deep rooted psychological problem and they need more help than you can likely provide.
You need to grow a set and ask yourself who is more important, him or everyone else.
Flat out tell him to lay off the massive insecurity and stop pretending he can't be wrong.
Rule Two: If The DM Is Not Right, Check Rule One.
Works every time :D
Spell it out for him letter by letter so he understands exactly where he stands at the moment. Don't let him sidetrack or derail you or bog you down by trying to argue over the minor or specific points.
And ask him to make a decision on whether or not he wants to start making changes or leave the game.
That should be enough to make him at least make an effort to tone it down to an acceptable level...
If not, just inform him that as of that moment he's out of the group.
And that it's his own damn fault.
And then, because he likes to argue so much, make him argue his cause, and sucessfully convince you (using logic, not emotion or rhetoric) why he should be allowed back in.
Not if, but why - tell him if he can't give you good, valid reasons beyond just nagging or arguing until you give in, then there's no real reason to keep him in the group since he can't argue against being outnumbered on the issue of whether or not he stays.
Really, I've always been of the opinion that no matter how serious or casual the game is, you earn your spot at the table, and you work to keep it...
If you don't show up every time with all your ducks in a row and a good, professional "All for one and one for all" attitude, ready to ensure that everyone has a good time, then you don't deserve to be at the table.
That's just bad form.
It's a group effort, and what's bad for the group needs to get dealt with or dropped.
Shock Collar...
He gives you lip you have the button to press at your finger tips...
Grow some!!
Seriously, just lay down the law. You can't have one player running the game. Thats your job.
Grow some!!
Seriously, just lay down the law. You can't have one player running the game. Thats your job.
this is all actually hypothetical...if this person had actually been in my group we would have him chopped to pieces and stored in zip lock bags in the freezer by now.
The another important principles is that it is the search for the truth. Ask him if he has considered the possibility that he is wrong. If he will not admit to the possibility then there is no point in arguing with him. Starting from the stance you cannot be wrong allows you to reject all rebuttals no matter the quality or quantity of the evidence.
In all it seems that he is more interested in "winning the argument" instead of finding the truth. So I suggest that you take him aside and say "Steve, your being a douche bag. Stop it."
The one of the most important principles of logic is fallibility. Think of all the brightest people both philosophers and scientist over the years that have been wrong. As him if you is somehow exempt from making the same errors that those people can and have made.
The another important principles is that it is the search for the truth. Ask him if he has considered the possibility that he is wrong. If he will not admit to the possibility then there is no point in arguing with him. Starting from the stance you cannot be wrong allows you to reject all rebuttals no matter the quality or quantity of the evidence.
In all it seems that he is more interested in "winning the argument" instead of finding the truth. So I suggest that you take him aside and say "Steve, your being a douche bag. Stop it."
that was beautiful!!! especially the part where you said...
Starting from the stance you cannot be wrong allows you to reject all rebuttals no matter the quality or quantity of the evidence.
that is exactly the problem i was facing....and this is something you really can NOT deal with...all you can do is walk away... or call him a douche bag! hah hah
well i think its time this thread is laid to rest...i appreciate the input.
take it easy all! and may your gaming be without douche bags.
1) Keep allowing this guy to dictate what's what at your table & bog down gaming sessions with endless arguments, until one day you simply snap & beat him to death with your Dungeon Master's Guide - which might be a better use for it, since you seem to be letting him run the show, instead of the other way around.
2) Grow a pair like ciaran suggested & just kick him to the curb.
Either way, the other players at the table will probably thank you for finally doing something, & if he's being as much trouble as you claim he is, they may even help with digging a shallow grave in your backyard, should you go with the first option.
any advice? have any of you had a player like this before?
Nah. You won't want my advice. It involves an actual dungeons and shackles.
You could turn it around and make the alpha-player be the DM, and conspire with your fellow players to make him see how hard it to be a DM.