Wow. Poor girl had cancer, a head injury and then mysteriously caught fire.
Well, she ain't a celebrity and she ain't dead, so don't blame me...
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for fact. bad things do not happen to nice people...and there are presents.
Let's avoid that topic - it usually deevolves pretty fast.
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for fact. bad things do not happen to nice people...and there are presents.
You make no sense. Gve your self 30 lashes.
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for fact. bad things do not happen to nice people...and there are presents.
You make no sense. Gve your self 30 lashes.
Yes Krampus
Then again, such comments are par for the course for some people around here.
The fire was most likely caused by the alcohol fumes, combined with either a spark of static electricity or combining with something that was in the paint she was using (chemical combustion).
Wow...really not funny.
Then again, such comments are par for the course for some people around here.
The fire was most likely caused by the alcohol fumes, combined with either a spark of static electricity or combining with something that was in the paint she was using (chemical combustion).
You have faith in this?
Thanks.
Wow...really not funny.
Then again, such comments are par for the course for some people around here.
The fire was most likely caused by the alcohol fumes, combined with either a spark of static electricity or combining with something that was in the paint she was using (chemical combustion).
What's not funny?
I do not find that amusing in the least. However, given the proclivities and lack of manners/taste of some people in this forum, I'm not surprised to see it.
Yes, I've been away for a while. I've been busy developing my first novel, and am on the road to publication. I let my membership lapse because of the hype (undeserved, imho) over D&D Next, but realized that 4e is (as they said in Monty Python and the Holy Grail) "not quite dead." I have also found sources of material that seem compatible with 4e AND my vision of the game. These will help me in many ways as aids to my imagination.
It's reasonably nice to be back.
The beginning statement: If there is a god, He may want her dead.
I do not find that amusing in the least. However, given the proclivities and lack of manners/taste of some people in this forum, I'm not surprised to see it.
The title could be true.
Yes, I've been away for a while. I've been busy developing my first novel, and am on the road to publication. I let my membership lapse because of the hype (undeserved, imho) over D&D Next, but realized that 4e is (as they said in Monty Python and the Holy Grail) "not quite dead." I have also found sources of material that seem compatible with 4e AND my vision of the game. These will help me in many ways as aids to my imagination.
Give it time. It'll die.
It's reasonably nice to be back.
Give us time.
Fath in.....what exactly? Please be specific so that I can give a proper response.
Thanks.
In your "explanations" as to why she flamed up. The title sounds more plausible.
It would only be true if God Almighty, Yah'Veh Elohim, were as depraved as Hipster Dog seems to be, which He is not. Having been gone for a good while, it would not surprise me to learn that Hipster Dog is Goldomark in yet another disguise.
I am reasonably sure that my explanation, that of chemical combustion (possibly accelerated by the presence of pure oxygen) is the real answer. However, we should wait until the investigation is complete before commenting further.
However, I will say that if a natural explanation is lacking, it does not mean that "God wants her dead." That would be confusion, and God Almighty is NOT the author of confusion. Rather Satan is the author of confusion (I Corinthians 14:33), the one who seeks the death of all of us, not just Christians. Read the Book of Job for insight.
Peace.
First off, death was never part of the deal that God put together. We were all destined to live forever with Him.
Not really. He didn't want us to eat fromthe Tree of Life so he cast us off Eden.
It was only when Adam and Eve sinned that death came into the picture (yes, both of them; the Bible makes clear, btw, that it was Adam's fault: Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin; and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned (Romans 5:12)). Furthermore, God has no desire for anyone to die, either physically or spiritually: The Lord is not slack concerning his promise, as some men count slackness; but is longsuffering to us-ward, not willing that any should perish, but that all should come to repentance. (2 Peter 3:9) Therefore, Hipster Dog's statement is absolutely untrue.
It would only be true if God Almighty, Yah'Veh Elohim, were as depraved as Hipster Dog seems to be, which He is not. Having been gone for a good while, it would not surprise me to learn that Hipster Dog is Goldomark in yet another disguise.
I am reasonably sure that my explanation, that of chemical combustion (possibly accelerated by the presence of pure oxygen) is the real answer. However, we should wait until the investigation is complete before commenting further.
However, I will say that if a natural explanation is lacking, it does not mean that "God wants her dead." That would be confusion, and God Almighty is NOT the author of confusion. Rather Satan is the author of confusion (I Corinthians 14:33), the one who seeks the death of all of us, not just Christians. Read the Book of Job for insight.
Peace.
I worship a vengeful and wrathful God. He punishes those who have sinned. Like that girl. Learn to fear him to save your soul. Those who fear not God will commit sins.
And bake cakes that resemble the Devil.
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
I am the one and only true Lord.
*Gasp*
Blasphemer!
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
If the ORCs were serious about religion not being allowed as a topic, they would have shut down this thread before the first reply came out. As it is, hits against Christianity seem to be fair game.
Edit: Corrected Scripture reference
I am the one and only true Lord.
*Gasp*
Blasphemer!
Bow before your Squirrel God or I'll strike you dead!
God didn't want Adam & Eve to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil because it would kill us: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. (Genesis 3:3)
If the ORCs were serious about religion not being allowed as a topic, they would have shut down this thread before the first reply came out. As it is, hits against Christianity seem to be fair game.
Then stop spreading lies about our Lord and Savior. Repent and fear him.
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
It is only in those that find me genuine whom I am interested.
I am the one and only true Lord.
*Gasp*
Blasphemer!
Bow before your Squirrel God or I'll strike you dead!
Vade retro!
God didn't want Adam & Eve to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil because it would kill us: But of the fruit of the tree which is in the midst of the garden, God hath said, Ye shall not eat of it, neither shall ye touch it, lest ye die. (Genesis 3:3)
If the ORCs were serious about religion not being allowed as a topic, they would have shut down this thread before the first reply came out. As it is, hits against Christianity seem to be fair game.
You know, God isn't a Christian only thing. Now bow before me, your true God.
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
It is only in those that find me genuine whom I am interested.
There is nothing genune abut you! You're a Brit who immigrated to the US. You are not a genuine United-Statians.
I am the one and only true Lord.
*Gasp*
Blasphemer!
Bow before your Squirrel God or I'll strike you dead!
Vade retro!
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
It is only in those that find me genuine whom I am interested.
There is nothing genune abut you! You're a Brit who immigrated to the US. You are not a genuine United-Statians.
Call immigration on him!!!
Damn brits always trying to invade everything.
I liked him, he was hilariously funny, even when he was serious in movies like Forbidden Planet.
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
It is only in those that find me genuine whom I am interested.
There is nothing genune abut you! You're a Brit who immigrated to the US. You are not a genuine United-Statians.
The States seemed the most pliable place to further my prophetic career.
God didn't want Adam & Eve to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil because it would kill us: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (Genesis 2:17)
Personally, I'd rather gain some understanding of the world around me and die a free man than live for an eternity blinded and enslaved.
God didn't want Adam & Eve to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil because it would kill us: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (Genesis 2:17)
Personally, I'd rather gain some understanding of the world around me and die a free man than live for an eternity blinded and enslaved.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Leslie Nielsen
I liked him, he was hilariously funny, even when he was serious in movies like Forbidden Planet.
Love the Tempest!
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
It is only in those that find me genuine whom I am interested.
There is nothing genune abut you! You're a Brit who immigrated to the US. You are not a genuine United-Statians.
The States seemed the most pliable place to further my prophetic career.
It is ful of sheeple.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Thanks to the Serpent you now can think for yourself. Of course you refuse that and prefere to be told what to think by the fascist in chief.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
I'd like to thank Iqwinn for getting this thread shut down.
Do you fear The Lord?
As The Lord giveth, so shall he taketh away. grehnhewe 4:20
*Gasp*
False prophet!
It is only in those that find me genuine whom I am interested.
There is nothing genune abut you! You're a Brit who immigrated to the US. You are not a genuine United-Statians.
The States seemed the most pliable place to further my prophetic career.
It is ful of sheeple.
...and Steeples
And Staples, thanks to Mitt.
One man's church, another man's company.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
Again, serious question here.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
Again, serious question here.
I would rather be able to choose and comprehend my actions. I would rather everyone have that freedom, for better or worse. We are better off, because at least we can think for ourselves and find our own answers in life. I would never surrender that power, and I suspect most, if given the choice, would choose the same.
God didn't want Adam & Eve to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil because it would kill us: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (Genesis 2:17)
If the ORCs were serious about religion not being allowed as a topic, they would have shut down this thread before the first reply came out. As it is, hits against Christianity seem to be fair game.
Edit: Corrected Scripture reference
...And you really don't even read your own Sky Wizard book, do you?
I can count the number of times I've been to church in the bast 3 years on one hand, and that was purely to hang out with a gorgeous guy, and I appear to have vastly more complete understanding of your theology than you. It's kinda depressing, really.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
To be fair, and this is pretty much unanimous amongst the Church Fathers and other Grand Poobahs, death was a result of expulsion from paradise, which was a result of Adam's lying, rather than direct consumption of the fruit of free will.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
You do realize where this argument goes down, right? It's free will, plain and simple. I could make very accurate comparisons to slaves in antebellum south.
Of course, this is really all the fault of the omnipotent and omniscient one who set the entire system up knowing it would fail like that. He's an accessory to the fall, and basically sacrificed his own kid to soothe his wounded ego.
Again, serious question here.
I've seriously having trouble believing that.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
Again, serious question here.
I would rather be able to choose and comprehend my actions. I would rather everyone have that freedom, for better or worse. We are better off, because at least we can think for ourselves and find our own answers in life. I would never surrender that power, and I suspect most, if given the choice, would choose the same.
You have ALWAYS had that choice. All human beings, once they reach the age of reason, have that choice. Adam and Eve chose the path of death, the path of separation from God, and ever since then Man has been trying to restore that connection to God.
You can continue on your own path, and I will not force you to stop. I have no right to, as you own your own life. However, know that the ultimate destination of your path is a place most unpleasant. If you wish to spend eternity separated from God, you will have your desire, and you will spend eternity in a place called the Lake of Fire (Revelations 19 and 20). Taking its name at face value, it's not a pleasant place to be, but if that's where you wish to be, that's where you will be.
As for Satan "teaching critical thinking skills", if Adam and Eve had been thinking critically, they would have thought, "Well, God made us, God loves us, and God wants us to be happy; if He says that we must not eat of that one tree, then He must not want us to know evil; if God is good, then evil must be not good; I don't want to be evil, that is, not good; therefor, I will refrain from eating of that tree."
When you compare our limited mentality and comprehension abilities against God Almighty, why wouldn't we trust in Him?
You can continue on your own path, and I will not force you to stop. I have no right to, as you own your own life. However, know that the ultimate destination of your path is a place most unpleasant. If you wish to spend eternity separated from God, you will have your desire, and you will spend eternity in a place called the Lake of Fire (Revelations 19 and 20). Taking its name at face value, it's not a pleasant place to be, but if that's where you wish to be, that's where you will be.
We'll see. I'm not quite dead yet, and I've never seen proof of this place's existance. Besides, fear is weakness, especially if it's of something which may well not exist. Honestly, it doesn't seem like much of a threat. Especially seeing as, if it exists, most of humanity's dead are there already.
You have ALWAYS had that choice. All human beings, once they reach the age of reason, have that choice. Adam and Eve chose the path of death, the path of separation from God, and ever since then Man has been trying to restore that connection to God.
Except they couldn't reasonably have made that choice in a meaningful way. Without knowledge of good or evil, they really couldn't have properly consented to it.
You can continue on your own path, and I will not force you to stop. I have no right to, as you own your own life. However, know that the ultimate destination of your path is a place most unpleasant. If you wish to spend eternity separated from God, you will have your desire, and you will spend eternity in a place called the Lake of Fire (Revelations 19 and 20). Taking its name at face value, it's not a pleasant place to be, but if that's where you wish to be, that's where you will be.
Even more ignorance of your own book.
Here's a tip: Don't preach until you've graduated from seminary school. You'll get torn to shreds otherwise.
As for Satan "teaching critical thinking skills", if Adam and Eve had been thinking critically, they would have thought, "Well, God made us, God loves us, and God wants us to be happy; if He says that we must not eat of that one tree, then He must not want us to know evil; if God is good, then evil must be not good; I don't want to be evil, that is, not good; therefor, I will refrain from eating of that tree."
That actually sounds more like abuse victim mentality than critical thinking.
Plus, if god really wanted all that, being, you know, omniscient and stuff, he could have just not, you know, put the tree there.
When you compare our limited mentality and comprehension abilities against God Almighty, why wouldn't we trust in Him?
And here we have more abuse victim mentality. And the better question: Why should we trust him? Adam and Eve were, in being unable to comprehend evil, unable to distrust the snake. See where that got them? And going by his pettiness and incredible shortsightedness for an omniscient being, I think it's time for a Designated Diety to take over the wheel while Yahweh sleeps off whatever got his so drunk in the first place.
So, between critical thinking plus a much, much lower death toll, I'm gonna go with Big L there every single time. Well, actually I'lm gonna go with FSM, but Lucy there is a decent second.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
Again, serious question here.
So you do want to be a slave and you try to achieve that state by following the bible.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
Again, serious question here.
I would rather be able to choose and comprehend my actions. I would rather everyone have that freedom, for better or worse. We are better off, because at least we can think for ourselves and find our own answers in life. I would never surrender that power, and I suspect most, if given the choice, would choose the same.
You have ALWAYS had that choice.
Not really since we hadn't eaten the fruit yet.
You can continue on your own path, and I will not force you to stop. I have no right to, as you own your own life. However, know that the ultimate destination of your path is a place most unpleasant. If you wish to spend eternity separated from God, you will have your desire, and you will spend eternity in a place called the Lake of Fire (Revelations 19 and 20). Taking its name at face value, it's not a pleasant place to be, but if that's where you wish to be, that's where you will be.
So I was right, it is all about fear.
When you compare our limited mentality and comprehension abilities against God Almighty, why wouldn't we trust in Him?
Cause he is a vain and cruel tyrant. "Worship me without question or die and suffer" is his message. Only spouses victim of domestic violence think this is love.
God didn't want Adam & Eve to eat from the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil because it would kill us: But of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, thou shalt not eat of it: for in the day that thou eatest thereof thou shalt surely die. (Genesis 2:17)
If the ORCs were serious about religion not being allowed as a topic, they would have shut down this thread before the first reply came out. As it is, hits against Christianity seem to be fair game.
Edit: Corrected Scripture reference
...And you really don't even read your own Sky Wizard book, do you?
I can count the number of times I've been to church in the bast 3 years on one hand, and that was purely to hang out with a gorgeous guy, and I appear to have vastly more complete understanding of your theology than you. It's kinda depressing, really.Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
To be fair, and this is pretty much unanimous amongst the Church Fathers and other Grand Poobahs, death was a result of expulsion from paradise, which was a result of Adam's lying, rather than direct consumption of the fruit of free will.And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
You do realize where this argument goes down, right? It's free will, plain and simple. I could make very accurate comparisons to slaves in antebellum south.
Of course, this is really all the fault of the omnipotent and omniscient one who set the entire system up knowing it would fail like that. He's an accessory to the fall, and basically sacrificed his own kid to soothe his wounded ego.Again, serious question here.
I've seriously having trouble believing that.
Of course, I read the Bible, just about every day. I know what it says.
Yes, I know that it is free will, plain and simple. God made us with free will, but free will without an alternative is rather pointless. If you only love God because He's the only game in town, it's meaningless. I love God in spite of the fact that there are different avenues. I know that He has good things for me. Being human, though, I sometimes get it in my head that I'd like to try a different path, or a different tack. When I do that, I try and compare it with what the Bible says and see if it can work. What I read in the Bible, and how I feel when I pray about it, indicates the direction I should go. I'm not perfect, though. I can be as stubborn and pig-headed as a dog playing tug-of-war on a rag, even though the crane holding the rag has hoisted me 20 feet into the air! Yes, I'm that stubborn.
Blaming God for the situation does no good for anyone. Again, free will without an alternative is pointless. God sent Jesus, not to "soothe His wounded ego", but to provide a way for those who love Him to be connected to Him, without fear of being lost or forsaken. It would be as if you were the mother of two children, and one of the children was killed by a murder. If you could be moved with enough compassion, the governor tells you, the man who murdered your child could be pardoned, but only if your other child took the murderer's place in the electric chair.
Now, I don't expect any mother to do that, but that is precisely what God Almighty has done for us, by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. The best news is, He is resurrected, and lives, and awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
How am I blinded and enslaved? Serious question here.
Your book claims that your God cast Adam and Eve out for trying to learn some part of the nature of the world, specifically knowledge of good and evil. That suggests that He didn't want them to gather knowledge. You are not blinded and enslaved, but Genesis at least seems to suggest that was the original plan. I don't take Hebrew oral traditions as fact, but if that story were true, I'm glad they chose to learn.
And is Man better off knowing evil? Look at the 20th Century alone, and all the innocent people who were murdered, the majority of them by their own government. Adam's disobedience brought death, destruction, and depravity into the world. Do you seriously think we are better off?
Again, serious question here.
So you do want to be a slave and you try to achieve that state by following the bible.
If I am a slave to God Almighty, then I am the most free man in the world. The very worst that you or anyone in this world can do is kill me. If you do, then I will be in the presence of God Almighty forever.
When you love and follow a loving God, who didn't spare His own Son to provide salvation to a world of sinners like me, following anything or anyone else makes no sense at all.
awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So how much do you hate your life to look forward to the end of the universe when everyone will be cast into hell?
awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So how much do you hate your life to look forward to the end of the universe when everyone will be cast into hell?
No, I do not.
Only an insane person looks forward to destruction. Only a madman would cheer as they hear the voice of God say to an unrepentant sinner, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." (Matthew 25:41)
What is even worse, though, is when people are told the way to avoid that fate, and they refuse it.
I really don't want you to suffer that fate.
Of course, I read the Bible, just about every day. I know what it says.
I have no information about the former, but the latter is pretty obviously very, very wrong. Unless you believe you know more about the book than the great theologians and church fathers. Or you're an old-school Southern Baptist, but it doesn't look like that.
Yes, I know that it is free will, plain and simple. God made us with free will, but free will without an alternative is rather pointless.
The fruit disagrees with your story.
If you only love God because He's the only game in town, it's meaningless. I love God in spite of the fact that there are different avenues. I know that He has good things for me. Being human, though, I sometimes get it in my head that I'd like to try a different path, or a different tack. When I do that, I try and compare it with what the Bible says and see if it can work. What I read in the Bible, and how I feel when I pray about it, indicates the direction I should go. I'm not perfect, though. I can be as stubborn and pig-headed as a dog playing tug-of-war on a rag, even though the crane holding the rag has hoisted me 20 feet into the air! Yes, I'm that stubborn.
"He didn't MEAN to eternally damn me! He loves me!"
Yeah, you see where you were going?
Blaming God for the situation does no good for anyone. Again, free will without an alternative is pointless. God sent Jesus, not to "soothe His wounded ego", but to provide a way for those who love Him to be connected to Him, without fear of being lost or forsaken. It would be as if you were the mother of two children, and one of the children was killed by a murder. If you could be moved with enough compassion, the governor tells you, the man who murdered your child could be pardoned, but only if your other child took the murderer's place in the electric chair.
Except god was already all-powerful. He could have just snapped his metaphorical omnipresent fingers and said "ooga booga!" and have it be done. Or just drop down from the skies and yell "Hey there. Yeah, y'all're forgiven now. Have fun!"
Very nice false metaphor, though. It would be more accurate to take someone who has a very, very distant relation to Hitler, try to shove all the blame onto said relative, and the nturn around and stab your own kid in a self-aggrandizing theatre of forgiveness.
Now, I don't expect any mother to do that, but that is precisely what God Almighty has done for us, by the sacrifice of Jesus Christ. The best news is, He is resurrected, and lives, and awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
This paragraph shows me two things. First off, you're totally incapable of looking at things from a rational and unbiased perspective, and two, you really haven't read the book. Or just think you're above the church fathers. Or believe in some flavor of heresy(And I do see a bit of Arian rhetoric in your post). Not that I particularly care, it's just I'd really prefer honesty.
awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So how much do you hate your life to look forward to the end of the universe when everyone will be cast into hell?
No, I do not.
Only an insane person looks forward to destruction. Only a madman would cheer as they hear the voice of God say to an unrepentant sinner, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." (Matthew 25:41)
What is even worse, though, is when people are told the way to avoid that fate, and they refuse it.
I really don't want you to suffer that fate.
You want the return of Jesus, this spells destruction for us all, even you.
No one can live up to god's standards. The only one who could was Jesus and he was god. See how this is unachievable? You hoping it will happen during your life time even if it will kill us all is insane. You want destruction of Earth and all humans. Quite disturbing.
You're lke a beaten wife who think her husband is doing for her own good. Which leads me to believe you have a history of abuse in your childhood and probably are abusing people close to you right now. Abuse you think it's for their own good. Like the shepherd breaking the lamb's leg so it won't stray. Jesus was called himself a shepherd. And we are back at the egotistical and cruel tyrant.
Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So, just to be clear: that is the only criterea? The only thing that determines what happens to you is what entity, if any, you choose to venerate? Because not everyone in the world is part of an Abrahamic faith, and most people are far from evil. Will your god condemn good people just because they firmly believe differently from what He wants? That sounds rather oppressive.
If you want the Bible broken down into its simplest terms, here it is: 1) Love God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength; 2) Love your neighbor as yourself; 3) Whatever you want others to do for you, do likewise for them.
What I see in your statements is that you are making yourself equal to God. Yes, we are made in His image in that we have body, soul/emotions, and spirit, just as God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit/Comforter; and we have free will, just as He does. But we human beings are NOT equal to God Almighty. We are His creation, but we are not creators, not even if we become parents.
Satan, formerly known as Lucifer, had such pride in his heart that he sought to throw God off of His throne. He was cast out of Heaven for that betrayal. His ultimate place is the Lake of Fire, and he wants to take as many of you with him as possible.
I really hope you don't follow him.
awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So how much do you hate your life to look forward to the end of the universe when everyone will be cast into hell?
No, I do not.
Only an insane person looks forward to destruction. Only a madman would cheer as they hear the voice of God say to an unrepentant sinner, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." (Matthew 25:41)
What is even worse, though, is when people are told the way to avoid that fate, and they refuse it.
I really don't want you to suffer that fate.
You want the return of Jesus, this spells destruction for us all, even you.
No one can live up to god's standards. The only one who could was Jesus and he was god. See how this is unachievable? You hoping it will happen during your life time even if it will kill us all is insane. You want destruction of Earth and all humans. Quite disturbing.
You're lke a beaten wife who think her husband is doing for her own good. Which leads me to believe you have a history of abuse in your childhood and probably are abusing people close to you right now. Abuse you think it's for their own good. Like the shepherd breaking the lamb's leg so it won't stray. Jesus was called himself a shepherd. And we are back at the egotistical and cruel tyrant.
You really have no idea who I am.
Yes, Jesus was the only one who lived up to God's standards. He had to, because He was the sacrificial Lamb for all of us. He suffered and died on the cross so that we would not have to suffer hell, so that we had remission of our sin nature, that we could spend eternity in Heaven with Him. The love that He has for us in unimaginable, to suffer that fate. You should really look up what happens in a crucifixion, especially a Roman crucifixion. It's not pretty at all.
By His death, He took what I, as a sinner, deserved. By His resurrection, He conquered death, and established the promise that I would be raised up as well, along with all those who follow Him.
If His giving of Himself like that to us, to come into a human fleshly form, to suffer incredible pain and an excruciating death, does not demonstrate boundless love, what does it demonstrate.
Now, now. We're still being fairly civil, and this is still mildly entertaining. We don't need to end this just yet.
Fine fine... *takes deep breath and composes self*
WHY YOU DIRTY PIECE OF *Insert Bad words, mean phrases, and a long stream of things the Code of Conduct does not allow me to type out*! HOW DARE YOU FORCE YOUR BELIEFS ON ME?!
But in all seriousness, you clearly don't understand the line in Genesis where God says "now they shall be like us" when referring to Adam and Eve after the eating of the fruit. Before they ate the fruit, everything they did was something they were told to do. Only after eating did they show any free will whatsoever. The Fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil is a metaphor for free will and the ability to use it to make our own choices.
Satan, formerly known as Lucifer
Actually, Lucifer was the Greek (or maybe it was Roman, I always get those mixxed up) of light, Infact they called the morning star (Venus) Lucifer, somehow mornigstar is also associated with the devil too, but it was all Greek (or Roman) and actually had nothing to do with the devil, much like witchcraft.
The only reference to Lucifer in the Bibile is actually referencning the morningstar (Venus), not 'The Devil'
The more you know!
EDIT: And the name "Lucifer" sounds Latin, though I cannot remember with certainty.
So the Lucifer thing is all Milton's fault?
As far as I know, though the idea is probably a bit older. Still, not Biblical and not canon (to the best of my knowlege, at any rate.) Paradise Lost is a good read and a significant work, however, so I do recommend it.
Sir, I find you intolerant of mine and others beliefs and I wish that you would no longer post here as long as you are going to try and force your Wikipedia-derived arguments for Christianity on a forum that has strict rules against religious discussions. Please leave and do not return if you are not willing to obey the rules of the Code of Conduct.
Respectfully, if religious discussions really were against the Code of Conduct, then this thread would have been deleted before the first reply had been posted. Just examine the title of the thread: If there is a God...(continued in the first post) He must want her dead").
If you or the ORCs do not wish to deal with religious discussions, then there should be no mention of God or gods allowed at all, and it must be rigorously enforced across the board. As it is, bashing Christianity seems to be the approved sport here by the ORCs. I stand against that, and will argue against spurious statements about Christianity and God with Scripture. Yes, I know that not everyone accepts the Bible. Nevertheless, it is my reference and my resource, and I will freely use it in my arguments, until the ORCs become more stringent in their rules against religious discussion.
Peace.
Now, now. We're still being fairly civil, and this is still mildly entertaining. We don't need to end this just yet.
But in all seriousness, you clearly don't understand the line in Genesis where God says "now they shall be like us" when referring to Adam and Eve after the eating of the fruit. Before they ate the fruit, everything they did was something they were told to do. Only after eating did they show any free will whatsoever. The Fruit of the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil is a metaphor for free will and the ability to use it to make our own choices.
I disagree. If Adam and Eve did not have free will, then they would not have chosen to partake of the forbidden fruit. The serpent, Satan, said to Eve, "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil." (Genesis 3:5) Eve actively chose to take of the forbidden fruit when she mulled it over in her own mind: And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. (Genesis 3:6) When Adam was presented with the forbidden fruit, he could have taken a stand and refused. Instead, he actively chose to heed Eve's voice over God's. He knew as well as she did, and yet chose disobedience.
When God called them on the carpet about it, Adam passed the buck to God via Eve: "The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. (Genesis 3:12, emphasis mine). Adam blamed God for Eve, but (as my brother-in-law would say,) He weren't hearin' any of THAT noise! Eve tried to shift the blame onto the serpent, with similar results. The reason they were driven from the garden, though, was so they would not eat from the Tree of Life, and live forever (Genesis 3:22-24 - just a note, the Cherubim's sword kinda reminds me of a lightsaber, especially the twirling blade model used in the original Star Wars movie).
The point is, Adam and Eve both had free will living in the garden, and they exercised that free will.
The only "church fathers" to whom I pay attention are the disciples who penned the New Testament, as well as the prophets who wrote the Old Testament. I don't need any books on Canon and Dogma to tell me what the Bible says; I can read it for myself, and I do.
Now that, my friend, is pretty clear heresy. One really can't ignore the ecumenical councils and call yourself a christian. Even the disciples were relatively clear about an organized church.
If you want the Bible broken down into its simplest terms, here it is: 1) Love God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength; 2) Love your neighbor as yourself; 3) Whatever you want others to do for you, do likewise for them.
...No. Methinks you need to reread the Magic Sky Wizard books of yours.
What I see in your statements is that you are making yourself equal to God. Yes, we are made in His image in that we have body, soul/emotions, and spirit, just as God is Father, Son, and Holy Spirit/Comforter; and we have free will, just as He does. But we human beings are NOT equal to God Almighty. We are His creation, but we are not creators, not even if we become parents.
Now this is further supporting both the "You haven't read it" and "no free will" arguments.
Satan, formerly known as Lucifer, had such pride in his heart that he sought to throw God off of His throne. He was cast out of Heaven for that betrayal. His ultimate place is the Lake of Fire, and he wants to take as many of you with him as possible.
Yeah, the fall was nowhere is the Magic Sky Wizard books.
I really hope you don't follow him.
And I really hope you don't seriously believe free will is evil. Or look at the bible and be incapable of counting. Remember the story of Job? Yeah, Lucifer was still an angel, a being of no free will. See, he had to have god say "Okay, sure, seems interesting" before anything happened. Plus, did Lucy cause the Pharaoh to chase Moses and then kill him? No. When you do some very basic arithmetic, Big G has a significantly higher death toll.
Now, now. We're still being fairly civil, and this is still mildly entertaining. We don't need to end this just yet.
Agreed.
You really have no idea who I am.
I have a good idea. Someone who likes to call themselves Christian simply because it's what's done wherever you're from, feels morally superior for it, and goes to church maybe twice a year, if that, to some happy-clappy super low-cloth church.
Yes, Jesus was the only one who lived up to God's standards. He had to, because He was the sacrificial Lamb for all of us. He suffered and died on the cross so that we would not have to suffer hell, so that we had remission of our sin nature, that we could spend eternity in Heaven with Him. The love that He has for us in unimaginable, to suffer that fate. You should really look up what happens in a crucifixion, especially a Roman crucifixion. It's not pretty at all.
Now THIS is incredibly heretical. Coequal and of one essence. He did not "live up to" gods standard because, according to your magic sky wizard book, he was god.
That's Arianism, bro. And has been a heresy, grounds for excomunication, since rouchly 325AD, at the first Council of Nicea.
By His death, He took what I, as a sinner, deserved. By His resurrection, He conquered death, and established the promise that I would be raised up as well, along with all those who follow Him.
Which he was capable of doing any time. Unless you beleve such a feat was beyond the omnicient creator, which I'm pretty sure is heretical.
If His giving of Himself like that to us, to come into a human fleshly form, to suffer incredible pain and an excruciating death, does not demonstrate boundless love, what does it demonstrate.
A wounded ego and a love of theater.
Lucifer's fall is the subject of Paradise Lost, by John Milton and, as far as I recall (it's been some time since I've read the Bible) doesn't show up in any actual religious text. A lot of post-Roman Western literature (at least of the Medieval and Renaissance stuff that survives) is essentially a fanfiction EU for Christianity. That tends to happen when a bunch of bored monks are the largest proportion of the literate, and no one understands the world well enough to do more than argue theology.
EDIT: And the name "Lucifer" sounds Latin, though I cannot remember with certainty.
To be fair, it is based in some hebrew oral tradition which is supposed to be taken at least into consideration in beliefs.
I disagree. If Adam and Eve did not have free will, then they would not have chosen to partake of the forbidden fruit. The serpent, Satan, said to Eve, "For God doth know that in the day ye eat thereof, then your eyes shall be opened, and ye shall be as gods, knowing good and evil." (Genesis 3:5) Eve actively chose to take of the forbidden fruit when she mulled it over in her own mind: And when the woman saw that the tree was good for food, and that it was pleasant to the eyes, and a tree to be desired to make one wise, she took of the fruit thereof, and did eat, and gave also unto her husband with her; and he did eat. (Genesis 3:6) When Adam was presented with the forbidden fruit, he could have taken a stand and refused. Instead, he actively chose to heed Eve's voice over God's. He knew as well as she did, and yet chose disobedience.
No. This is a perfect example of no free will. If she seriously had genuine love and fear of Magic Sky Wizard, then she wouldn't have. It's simple following the most recent command.
When God called them on the carpet about it, Adam passed the buck to God via Eve: "The woman whom thou gavest to be with me, she gave me of the tree, and I did eat. (Genesis 3:12, emphasis mine). Adam blamed God for Eve, but (as my brother-in-law would say,) He weren't hearin' any of THAT noise! Eve tried to shift the blame onto the serpent, with similar results. The reason they were driven from the garden, though, was so they would not eat from the Tree of Life, and live forever (Genesis 3:22-24 - just a note, the Cherubim's sword kinda reminds me of a lightsaber, especially the twirling blade model used in the original Star Wars movie).
Sigh...
And this is further proof you don't read the book. The sword and the cherubim were independent beings. Cherubim were busy covering their body with two of their four wings, anyways, so they wouldn't actually be capable of moving it properly with any of their heads.
The point is, Adam and Eve both had free will living in the garden, and they exercised that free will.
Except they didn't. Did you ever do litcrit? Like, at all?
The only "church fathers" to whom I pay attention are the disciples who penned the New Testament, as well as the prophets who wrote the Old Testament. I don't need any books on Canon and Dogma to tell me what the Bible says; I can read it for myself, and I do.
Now that, my friend, is pretty clear heresy. One really can't ignore the ecumenical councils and call yourself a christian. Even the disciples were relatively clear about an organized church.
As a Protestant, I recognize the first seven Ecumenical Councils. I do NOT recognize any of the others, as they are of the Roman Catholic church, a political body that has tried to repress individual reading of the Scriptures and true faith in God, and instead have their parishioners rely upon the Sacraments to save them, something that is plainly not Biblical.
My salvation rests soley on this, that Jesus Christ is the Son of God; that He lived on this Earth in human form, and lived perfectly in accordance with God's Law; that He died upon the cross to make atonement for my sins; and that He rose from the dead, and that He will return one day to judge the whole Earth.
In accordance with that salvation, I do my best to comport myself as someone who loves God by doing good works. HOWEVER, good works are NOT my salvation, but they are the evidence of it; The just shall live by faith (Habbakuk 2:4; Romans 1:17; Galatians 3:11; Hebrews 10:38).
If you want the Bible broken down into its simplest terms, here it is: 1) Love God with all your heart, soul, mind, and strength; 2) Love your neighbor as yourself; 3) Whatever you want others to do for you, do likewise for them.
As a Protestant, I recognize the first seven Ecumenical Councils. I do NOT recognize any of the others, as they are of the Roman Catholic church, a political body that has tried to repress individual reading of the Scriptures and true faith in God, and instead have their parishioners rely upon the Sacraments to save them, something that is plainly not Biblical.
So now you're ignorant of history as well as theology. The First Council of Nicea was is 325. Before the first schism. The First and Second Councils were the ones that declared Arianism and any other form of nontrinitarianism as heresy.
And that's excluding your obvious ignorance of Protestant theology.
My salvation rests soley on this, that Jesus Christ is the Son of God; that He lived on this Earth in human form, and lived perfectly in accordance with God's Law; that He died upon the cross to make atonement for my sins; and that He rose from the dead, and that He will return one day to judge the whole Earth.
... Yeah, you really didn't pay attention at all.
In accordance with that salvation, I do my best to comport myself as someone who loves God by doing good works. HOWEVER, good works are NOT my salvation, but they are the evidence of it; The just shall live by faith (Habbakuk 2:4; Romans 1:17; Galatians 3:11; Hebrews 10:38).
And yet more heresy. Next you'll be preaching Calvinist doctrine...
Then one of them, which was a lawyer, asked him a question, tempting him, and saying, Master, which is the great commandment in the law? Jesus said unto him, Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind. This is the first and great commandment. And the second is like unto it, Thou shalt love thy neighbour as thyself. On these two commandments hang all the law and the prophets. (Matthew 22:35-40)
Therefore all things whatsoever ye would that men should do to you, do ye even so to them: for this is the law and the prophets. (Matthew 7:12)
I do read the Bible.
And you really don't get it do you? I suggest you go back to your church and sit in with the grade schoolers for sunday school. You might learn a thing or two, even in an obviously low-cloth church like that.
Let this mind be in you, which was also in Christ Jesus: Who, being in the form of God, thought it not robbery to be equal with God: But made himself of no reputation, and took upon him the form of a servant, and was made in the likeness of men: And being found in fashion as a man, he humbled himself, and became obedient unto death, even the death of the cross. Wherefore God also hath highly exalted him, and given him a name which is above every name: That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow, of things in heaven, and things in earth, and things under the earth; And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord, to the glory of God the Father. (Phillipians 2:5-11).
Let's look at Arianism: The belief that Jesus Christ is subordinate to God the Father. Jesus is of one being with the Father and the Holy Spirit. If what I have written has somehow led you to think I believe otherwise, I offer my apologies.
It obviously is Arianism. Simply, to follow gods laws, one must be inferior to god. .That is another absolute fact of Christian dogma. It is accepted that both John the Baptist and the Theotokos were sinless. Yet they were not of the same level as Junior. Any declaration or belief otherwise, such as what you haverepeatedly done is heresy.
No, it is NOT beyond the power of God Almighty. However, God does things in HIS own time, not ours.
So you concede that he could have done it at any time, but instead chose to have his brat killed, just to make a point?
I find it highly amusing that you accuse me of not reading the Bible, and all the while I have been refuting what you say with Scripture, in context.
No, you really aren't. Your "analyses," and I use the term loosely, have all been dismantled by various ecumenical councils or church fathers.
You also denigrate me as being part of "low-cloth church". I assume that you mean that my church doesn't have a "proper" altar or sanctuary or pews that have knee-pads for prayer, and/or that our communion services don't use the perfectly round 1-inch diamater flat and flavorless cookies or fermented wine. And you're right, we have none of those. We rent out a building for our services, and the Pastor and his crew set up the chairs on Saturday afternoon. When services are over, we pack up the chairs and other things and put them away and leave the building cleaned and swept, ready for business on Monday morning.
And now you demonstrate a lack of knowledge of culture, as well as history and theology.You see, low-cloth means casual, not in accordance with the guidelines set out by various authorities, and generally happy-clappy or otherwise not serious. This generally means that parishoners at low-cloth churches tend to show ,assive ignorance of church doctrine and dogma.
Then again, if you were both christian and had a knowledge of history, you wouldn't be in a Catholic-offshoot of a church anyways, so I guess the point is moot.
What we do have is the love of God in our hearts, support for missionaries, and ministries for our local areas, which are demonstrations of the love of God. We serve families in our area who have terminally ill children, a ministry that our preacher was inspired to start up after the death of his 4 year old grandson. We also have a music ministry that plays to retirement homes in our area.
Publican and pharisee, bro.
You apparently belong to some high-falutin' church that has silk altar cloths and linen yokes for your priests and fold-down knee pads on the pews in front of you, where the Bible is mentioned in passing at best, and you concern yourselves with the quality of the arabica coffee beans and the texture of the lemon bars. To you, I say: Psalm 50:16 - 23; Matthew 23:13 - 39. Stick that into your ivory pipe and smoke it.
Nope. Pastafarian. I believe that the world was created sometime while the great Flying Spaghetti Monster was seriously drunk, and it all began with a hill, some trees, and a midget. I'm just saying I shouldn't know more about your religion than you, and I recommend you go to a higher-cloth church for a while and pay attention. Maybe an Orthodox church of some sort, they tend to be as high as it gets.
The beginning statement: If there is a god, He may want her dead.
I do not find that amusing in the least. However, given the proclivities and lack of manners/taste of some people in this forum, I'm not surprised to see it.
Yes, I've been away for a while. I've been busy developing my first novel, and am on the road to publication. I let my membership lapse because of the hype (undeserved, imho) over D&D Next, but realized that 4e is (as they said in Monty Python and the Holy Grail) "not quite dead." I have also found sources of material that seem compatible with 4e AND my vision of the game. These will help me in many ways as aids to my imagination.
It's reasonably nice to be back.
But don't you think he may want her dead? I mean, even in the 'calling her home' context of the idea?
Meh, I thought it was amusing. It's certainly an interesting way to look at her misfortune. Kinda makes ya think. Maybe that's the issue? That it makes ya think about stuff that isn't pleasant to contemplate?
Nope. Pastafarian. I believe that the world was created sometime while the great Flying Spaghetti Monster was seriously drunk, and it all began with a hill, some trees, and a midget. I'm just saying I shouldn't know more about your religion than you, and I recommend you go to a higher-cloth church for a while and pay attention. Maybe an Orthodox church of some sort, they tend to be as high as it gets.
Ah, an atheist who doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to call himself/herself as such.
Thank you for letting me know your viewpoint on life and eternity. I know now to not waste my time trying to debate you, at least on the subject of Scripture and the Bible. Maybe there's something else we can debate on these forums, but not this.
Do take care, EA
Peace.
Ah, an atheist who doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to call himself/herself as such.
Oh, the irony.
Thank you for letting me know your viewpoint on life and eternity. I know now to not waste my time trying to debate you, at least on the subject of Scripture and the Bible. Maybe there's something else we can debate on these forums, but not this.
Because you've realized I know more about your Magic Sky Wizard book and the historically significant Zombie Jew-Ism organizational leaders, and can't deal with admitting you were wrong?
awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So how much do you hate your life to look forward to the end of the universe when everyone will be cast into hell?
No, I do not.
Only an insane person looks forward to destruction. Only a madman would cheer as they hear the voice of God say to an unrepentant sinner, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." (Matthew 25:41)
What is even worse, though, is when people are told the way to avoid that fate, and they refuse it.
I really don't want you to suffer that fate.
You want the return of Jesus, this spells destruction for us all, even you.
No one can live up to god's standards. The only one who could was Jesus and he was god. See how this is unachievable? You hoping it will happen during your life time even if it will kill us all is insane. You want destruction of Earth and all humans. Quite disturbing.
You're lke a beaten wife who think her husband is doing for her own good. Which leads me to believe you have a history of abuse in your childhood and probably are abusing people close to you right now. Abuse you think it's for their own good. Like the shepherd breaking the lamb's leg so it won't stray. Jesus was called himself a shepherd. And we are back at the egotistical and cruel tyrant.
You really have no idea who I am.
Yes, Jesus was the only one who lived up to God's standards. He had to, because He was the sacrificial Lamb for all of us. He suffered and died on the cross so that we would not have to suffer hell, so that we had remission of our sin nature, that we could spend eternity in Heaven with Him. The love that He has for us in unimaginable, to suffer that fate. You should really look up what happens in a crucifixion, especially a Roman crucifixion. It's not pretty at all.
By His death, He took what I, as a sinner, deserved. By His resurrection, He conquered death, and established the promise that I would be raised up as well, along with all those who follow Him.
If His giving of Himself like that to us, to come into a human fleshly form, to suffer incredible pain and an excruciating death, does not demonstrate boundless love, what does it demonstrate.
So you like a religion that celebrates human sacrifices?
No wonder you offered yourself as a sacrifice to god to safe the life of your pastor's grandson. Now tell me you do not want the end of times to end your life cause you are not happy.
Ah, an atheist who doesn't have the intestinal fortitude to call himself/herself as such.
Oh, the irony.Thank you for letting me know your viewpoint on life and eternity. I know now to not waste my time trying to debate you, at least on the subject of Scripture and the Bible. Maybe there's something else we can debate on these forums, but not this.
Because you've realized I know more about your Magic Sky Wizard book and the historically significant Zombie Jew-Ism organizational leaders, and can't deal with admitting you were wrong?
Oh, and now you're admitting that besides being anti-Christian, you are also an anti-Semite.
Now I see that I have no further reason to discuss ANY subject with you.
Take care.
Peace.
awaits the Father's command to begin the events in Revelations, and to bring His Kingdom to Earth. Those who hate God will be given their chosen place, the lake of fire, and those who love God will be given their chosen place, Heaven.
So how much do you hate your life to look forward to the end of the universe when everyone will be cast into hell?
No, I do not.
Only an insane person looks forward to destruction. Only a madman would cheer as they hear the voice of God say to an unrepentant sinner, "Depart from me, ye cursed, into everlasting fire, prepared for the devil and his angels." (Matthew 25:41)
What is even worse, though, is when people are told the way to avoid that fate, and they refuse it.
I really don't want you to suffer that fate.
You want the return of Jesus, this spells destruction for us all, even you.
No one can live up to god's standards. The only one who could was Jesus and he was god. See how this is unachievable? You hoping it will happen during your life time even if it will kill us all is insane. You want destruction of Earth and all humans. Quite disturbing.
You're lke a beaten wife who think her husband is doing for her own good. Which leads me to believe you have a history of abuse in your childhood and probably are abusing people close to you right now. Abuse you think it's for their own good. Like the shepherd breaking the lamb's leg so it won't stray. Jesus was called himself a shepherd. And we are back at the egotistical and cruel tyrant.
You really have no idea who I am.
Yes, Jesus was the only one who lived up to God's standards. He had to, because He was the sacrificial Lamb for all of us. He suffered and died on the cross so that we would not have to suffer hell, so that we had remission of our sin nature, that we could spend eternity in Heaven with Him. The love that He has for us in unimaginable, to suffer that fate. You should really look up what happens in a crucifixion, especially a Roman crucifixion. It's not pretty at all.
By His death, He took what I, as a sinner, deserved. By His resurrection, He conquered death, and established the promise that I would be raised up as well, along with all those who follow Him.
If His giving of Himself like that to us, to come into a human fleshly form, to suffer incredible pain and an excruciating death, does not demonstrate boundless love, what does it demonstrate.
So you like a religion that celebrates human sacrifices?
No wonder you offered yourself as a sacrifice to god to safe the life of your pastor's grandson. Now tell me you do not want the end of times to end your life cause you are not happy.
If you want to study up on human sacrifices, look at the worship of Moloch, who demanded the sacrifice of a family's first-born child in exchange for wealth.
Or look at today's humanism, which extols abortion as its sacrament, again for the sake of money.
But that requires a mind to study, and a heart to be broken by the depths of depravity that some people take. I suppose, though, that if one is wallowing in those depths, or maybe even basking in the monetary rewards of that system, it's easy for someone to ignore how evil it is.
If you want to study up on human sacrifices, look at the worship of Moloch, who demanded the sacrifice of a family's first-born child in exchange for wealth.
You aren't adressing the question of your religion's human sacrifices or your need to die. You're dodging.
Or look at today's humanism, which extols abortion as its sacrament, again for the sake of money.
Humanism is a bout choices and independant thoughts, something you do not want people to have. You want them enslave to a book writen by people 2,500 years ago.But that requires a mind to study no independant thougt to understand what I am saying and need to fear the grand wizard with all your heart to be broken by the depths of depravity that some people take.
I suppose, though, that if one is wallowing in those depths, or maybe even basking in the monetary rewards of that system, it's easy for someone to ignore how evil it is.
Just how much is your pastor making off your guliblity anyway? 10% of your income at the source or 10% net income?
I know this is the OTT but can't everyone juyst really sotp trolling each other? or atleast take it the group?
Saddly, Iqwinn is not trolling. He hates none christians (according to his definition) and fears them cause they are free, unlike him.
Just ask Iqwinn what he thinks of your faith, mormonism. He doesn't consider catholics to be christians, just imagine what he thinks of you.
I know this is the OTT but can't everyone juyst really sotp trolling each other? or atleast take it the group?
Saddly, Iqwinn is not trolling. He hates none christians (according to his definition) and fears them cause they are free, unlike him.
Just ask Iqwinn what he thinks of your faith, mormonism. He doesn't consider catholics to be christians, just imagine what he thinks of you.
so,it's just everyone else hwo is trolling? lol
And EA never said anything anti-Semetic. YOU JUMPED TO THAT IQWINN. Zombie-Jew (while an interesting descriptor) is a fairly accurate though farcical descriptor of a Jewish person rising up from the grave even after his obvious demise. Go read your Bible and see who fits the decription.
Oh, and now you're admitting that besides being anti-Christian, you are also an anti-Semite.
...Uh, what?
Now I see that I have no further reason to discuss ANY subject with you.
And this, kids, is an example of someone who prefers to ignore or dodge any challenge to their beliefs. This is why we need to teach critical thinking skills at school.
If you want to study up on human sacrifices, look at the worship of Moloch, who demanded the sacrifice of a family's first-born child in exchange for wealth.
So? "They did it, too" is not an appropriate defense.
Or look at today's humanism, which extols abortion as its sacrament, again for the sake of money.
I do believe the only appropriate response to this is lolwut.
But that requires a mind to study, and a heart to be broken by the depths of depravity that some people take. I suppose, though, that if one is wallowing in those depths, or maybe even basking in the monetary rewards of that system, it's easy for someone to ignore how evil it is.
And now we see the piling of self-aggrandizement and selfrighteousness on top of blind ignorance.
As much as you've probably already reported it, no we're not trolling. We're trying to power some reason into his skull but it's proven thicker than we expected.
I really did forget how difficult it could be.
Oh, well, at least he's not a Young-Earther.
Angels have no free will. Satan was an angel. Satan left god. It was - since he had no free will - obviously god's decision that he do so. Ergo, god is the root of all evil.
Jesus loves each and everyone of you.
Hopefully he uses condoms.
As much as you've probably already reported it, no we're not trolling. We're trying to power some reason into his skull but it's proven thicker than we expected.
so instead of just letting him be you're trying to convert him from his belives..yeah good luck with that
so instead of just letting him be you're trying to convert him from his belives..yeah good luck with that
First off, seriously, it's bad form to post in the same thread you're trying to report and close.
Second, no, we're trying to encourage basic critical thinking. Unless basic critical thinking is against his religion, in which case I guess we are. But it's not. Then again, the heresies kinda make this difficult.
Neither Christianity nor Judaism has never been about sacrificing innocent humans for any reason and I defy you to prove it. Hipster Dog's obfuscation only demonstrates that he has no critical thinking skills, only that he has a list of insults. EA's "Zombie-Jew" insult is nothing more than that, an insult, with the added bonus of exposing blatant anti-Semitism.
EA tells me that I am espousing heresy, yet does not provide any Scripture to show it, relying on Ecumenical councils that may or may not be relevent. HD is nothing more than a troll who hurls insults. I have backed up my claims and statements with Scripture.
Those of you who insist upon refering to Jesus Christ as a zombie need to remember that a zombie has no personality. Jesus was resurrected with His personality intact AND His body made whole. The only exceptions were the holes in His hands and feet, the the hole in his side where the spear was thrust. (John 20:25 - 29)
...Lulz. I'm not sure whether your ignorance or your missiiing the point is more amusing.
Neither Christianity nor Judaism has never been about sacrificing innocent humans for any reason and I defy you to prove it.
Then what do you call Jesus' death?
Hipster Dog's obfuscation only demonstrates that he has no critical thinking skills, only that he has a list of insults.
That would be you, actually.
EA's "Zombie-Jew" insult is nothing more than that, an insult, with the added bonus of exposing blatant anti-Semitism.
...I'm really curious to see how stating exactly what your scriptures say, a jew getting back up after dying while still carrying mortal wounds, is antisemitic.
EA tells me that I am espousing heresy, yet does not provide any Scripture to show it, relying on Ecumenical councils that may or may not be relevent.
The first and second Councils of Nicea are all that are needed. And your obvious lack of knowledge of scripture is to the point I don't even know where to begin. It's like you running up to Paul Krugman yelling about supply side economics and the wonders of austerity. It's past amusing and rapidly approaching pathetic.
HD is nothing more than a troll who hurls insults.
No. As much as I hate to support HD, he's just calling you out on holes in your argument.
I have backed up my claims and statements with Scripture.
No, you haven't. A most generous parallel would be you quoting the constitution while ignoring mountains of case law. Except, that's not even good enough becuase you've misquoted and otherwise been in error on the parts you've quoted. So go back to Sunday school, maybe we'll be able to have a reasonable discussion in a decade or so.
Enjoy your Flying Spaghetti Monster...try it with alfredo sauce and grilled chicken.
It hurts my ego too much to admit EA just beat me.
Yeah, I can tell. I'd hoped you were of better character, but can't say I'm surprised.
Those of you who insist upon refering to Jesus Christ as a zombie need to remember that a zombie has no personality. Jesus was resurrected with His personality intact AND His body made whole. The only exceptions were the holes in His hands and feet, the the hole in his side where the spear was thrust. (John 20:25 - 29)
Man, humor just goes over your head, don't it?
Neither Christianity nor Judaism has never been about sacrificing innocent humans for any reason and I defy you to prove it. Hipster Dog's obfuscation only demonstrates that he has no critical thinking skills, only that he has a list of insults. EA's "Zombie-Jew" insult is nothing more than that, an insult, with the added bonus of exposing blatant anti-Semitism.
With cirtical thinking it's pretty obvious god is an egotistical tyrant. To believe otherwise, like you, you need faith, which is certainly not critical thinking.
As for backing stuff up with the bible, well duh. It's circular logic: the bible is true cause it says so in the bible. To really defend your points you need to get out of the bible and actually use critical thinking. Good luck, cause you've never exercised it.
It hurts my ego too much to admit EA just beat me.
Yeah, I can tell. I'd hoped you were of better character, but can't say I'm surprised.
rofl...you're the one who insults me and my religion, but when I fire off a parting shot, you bring up character? You really are something else.
I hope that your life goes well, EA, and you too, HD. I hope that you get over yourselves and really do some Biblical reading.
God save you both.
Rolling eyes...whatever, EA.
Enjoy your Flying Spaghetti Monster...try it with alfredo sauce and grilled chicken.
here incase you haven't read up on it en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flying_Spaghetti_M...
rofl...you're the one who insults me and my religion, but when I fire off a parting shot, you bring up character? You really are something else.
This is a case where you need to get over yourself. I'm not sure whether you didn't read the thread, have trouble wit hthe English language, or have some form social development impairment. Somewhere on the high-functioning end of the Spectrum, much like Calron.
I hope that your life goes well, EA, and you too, HD. I hope that you get over yourselves and really do some Biblical reading.
Given both the above and the below, I find the irony here hilarious. Especially since I appear to have done more religious reading than you.
God save you both.
And you definitely have some problems.
And this is why arguing with fundies is boring. They're quite fun for a while, but once they cross a certain line they shut down.
Man, I go an' try to make a srs point and nobody cares! What. The. Fudge.
Iqwinn had no answer for it so he just ignored it. Now stop your cray cray, girl.
As a Protestant, I recognize the first seven Ecumenical Councils. I do NOT recognize any of the others, as they are of the Roman Catholic church, a political body that has tried to repress individual reading of the Scriptures and true faith in God, and instead have their parishioners rely upon the Sacraments to save them, something that is plainly not Biblical.
Interesting. Your claim is that ORCs only allow the bashing of Christians... and then proceed to prove it by bashing Catholics. Self-fulfilling prophecy at its finest!