I just came back from watching an episode of The Gamers 2: Dorkness rising.
The gamer walks into a gaming store. This establishment is utterly huge, well stocked, brightly lit with enormous store windows facing at least two sides, and the clerk actually treats him somewhat nice.
Here in Sweden the scenario is this. There are no gaming stores in your town. If you are lucky, there are two gaming stores in your town, but the only decent RPG store is situated in a dungeon beneath an old brick building that looks like its about to collapse. You walk down into a tiny room that feels totally hostile. (this is like one of those New York basement places I have seen in movies)
There is nobody there. You stand in the store, not knowing if you should just grab a random product and run away, because you could easily do so without being caught. After a horrible amount of time some dork dressed in hippie clothing drags his slow ass into the store... You ask him if he has the product you want... And he doesn't have it, of course... So you end up having to mail order it from the states... of course... You knew you would have to do this even tho you took the detour to their store... of course...
There are very valid reasons for RPG stores in Sweden to be like this, but still I get angry.
Sure, but Sweden has a good public health care system, so it evens out.
See there's this difference between movies and real life...
Sure, but Sweden has a good public health care system, so it evens out.
Sweden does indeed have a good public health system. I am still saying this after it got a little bit worse during the last fifteen years. It's like this-- it doesn't pwn anymore, but it rules.
Socorro, NM has no gaming stores... Not even bad ones...
Maybe you should open up one, then? ;)
Maybe you should open up one, then? ;)
HA! I don't have the kind of capital, business sense, time, or ... well... any of the required things, really. Not to mention that if all goes well I've moved far away from here by this time next year.
There are very valid reasons for RPG stores in Sweden to be like this, but still I get angry.
Ok, now I'm just plain curious....
I know just how you feel
over here in britain in it's the same, liverpool is the closest place with gaming stores to me, the 40 min bus journey isn't that bad, i can live with it, but it's the places themselves. Their mostly comic book stores for one so their range of RPG stuff is lacklustre to say the least, their dark dingy places that will always feel like that no matter how much lighting is there and the people that work behind the till are complete elitists and hate the entire universe for not seeing life their way!
it annoys me too because my dad lives over in the states and i have been to (and seen) quite a few really lovely gaming stores over there that i'd love to just pop round to over here in blighty
-Kraik
So you end up having to mail order it from the states...
Why not try a Finnish, Norvegian or Danish gaming store or site?
Hey, no fair! We have lousy gaming stores and bad public health care system! Luckily at least the former seems to be improving.
So you end up having to mail order it from the states...
Why not try a Finnish, Norvegian or Danish gaming store or site?
All those countries are smaller than Sweden (at least population wise), so the chance of finding a gaming store that's both good and well-stocked, and delivers anything by mail (especially outside the country) is very small. And then there's the price, D&D books here usually cost 50$ or more. I sometimes get stuff sent from Britain, it's usually about the same price as the US, but it's cheaper to get delivered and there's no additional taxes.
Here in Denmark, it's not that bad. The most popular gaming store in my town is somewhat smaller than what I'd prefer, but that's mostly because the rent must be huge. It's located on the pedestrian street in the middle of town, it looks a little like a clothing store, with some racks of clothes (medieval or military style) outside, and a huge front window to display what's on sale. It's well lit and clean, there's good amount of customers, many of them mothers with their children, and the service is friendly.
On the downside, it doesn't have a very large selection of roleplaying books or fantasy fiction (it deals mostly in miniature games, LARPing equipment, and trading cards), and it's pretty expensive, though not more than most book stores. There's another gaming store that's a little more what you expect, large and with more room for gaming, but after it changed owners and the other store moved to a much more desirable location, it lost a lot of customers, and I'm not even sure it's there any more.
HA! I don't have the kind of capital, business sense, time, or ... well... any of the required things, really. Not to mention that if all goes well I've moved far away from here by this time next year.
If you had the business sense, you'd know opening a gaming store would be a bad idea. :P
Here in the Netherlands we have game stores that are pretty good, you can just come in and the guy behind the counter actually knows what he's talking about and if you feel like it you can just sit down, grab one of their games, and play in the store to see if it's good enough to buy 
I really like that 
There are very valid reasons for RPG stores in Sweden to be like this, but still I get angry.
Ok, now I'm just plain curious....
Well its because (I believe):
1: RPGs aren't as popular in Sweden anymore. A majority of adult roleplayers jumped on the MORP bandwagon and didn't come back, since Sweden is one of the leading nations in the world when it comes to delivering broadband connections to households. I pity those FOOLS... "There is no life... In the WoW... Only... DEATH"
2: Sweden has less than the population of London spread out over a surface that is larger than Great Britain. For some reason you seem to need cities of 1.000.000+ for really well stocked RPG stores to survive and thrive. I would NEVER open up a RPG store in my town of 500.000. The one "pure" one we have now is sorta withering away. We actually go there and buy stuff we don't really need just to keep it around- dice, markers, etc. The other one is a bookstore that has an almost reasonably well stocked RPG hm, department?
Just to make clear... 99.99% of gaming stores in the States are NOT the gamers 2 store. In fact, to me FLGS is an inside joke, well the friendly part. Outside of Campaign Headquarters in VABeach, I have uh...found local 'gaming' stores. Ran for 'profit'.
Its part of why, the death of the LGS isn't a surprise to me. Niche industries tend to favor the mail order anyway, and well...the fact that gaming tends to attract pedagogues only makes matters worse not better.
HA! I don't have the kind of capital, business sense, time, or ... well... any of the required things, really. Not to mention that if all goes well I've moved far away from here by this time next year.
If you had the business sense, you'd know opening a gaming store would be a bad idea. :P
I'm not so sure about that... Socorro used to have a gaming store that was doing "OK". Not great, but "OK". Then it got burned down a few July 4ths back due to some drunken idiot not realizing that aiming a firework at a building might be a bad idea. We lost the gaming store, a karate dojo, and a few other small businesses, none of which re-located as far as I can tell.
So I don't think it's that it wouldn't be (at least moderately) successful, but that the setup costs are too high at the moment.
Least, thats what I think. Anyway, I still blame those idiots with fireworks. Damn firework-using idiots.
Well, it's possible that it'd be more viable in your area than it is in mine. I know of two that were 'doing ok' for a while and then were sold once things became slightly less than ok. By sold I mean that the merchandise was sold at a discount online and that the business effectively died. There's a couple of stores in more built up areas (less suburb-y) that are still around, I guess. It's a risky venture, though, and not one that I'd take on myself.
Just to make clear... 99.99% of gaming stores in the States are NOT the gamers 2 store. In fact, to me FLGS is an inside joke, well the friendly part. Outside of Campaign Headquarters in VABeach, I have uh...found local 'gaming' stores. Ran for 'profit'.
Its part of why, the death of the LGS isn't a surprise to me. Niche industries tend to favor the mail order anyway, and well...the fact that gaming tends to attract pedagogues only makes matters worse not better.
Could you translate that note into.... Uhm.... English? That someone without your "Avenger's Mastery of Acronyms" class feat could understand? ;)
FLGS = Favorite Local Gaming Store or Friendly Local Gaming Store
Yeah, most of us over don't actually have good game stores or even a game store at all. A lot of us get our books at Borders, which means if we want anything other than the current most popular titles we have to mail order.
FLGS = Favorite Local Gaming Store or Friendly Local Gaming Store
Yes... *eyes widen* Yes, it is starting to make sense now!
But not quite. I suppose one acronym means "roleplaying game store" or something but the one that seems to refer to a location in the US (?) still doesn't make sense to me.
FLGS = Favorite Local Gaming Store or Friendly Local Gaming Store
Yes... *eyes widen* Yes, it is starting to make sense now!
But not quite. I suppose one acronym means "roleplaying game store" or something but the one that seems to refer to a location in the US (?) still doesn't make sense to me.
VA = Virigina (a state). The location is Virginia Beach. I don't see another acronym, other than FLGS/LGS (Friendly Local Game Store/Local Game Store).
FLGS = Favorite Local Gaming Store or Friendly Local Gaming Store
Yes... *eyes widen* Yes, it is starting to make sense now!
But not quite. I suppose one acronym means "roleplaying game store" or something but the one that seems to refer to a location in the US (?) still doesn't make sense to me.
VA = Virigina (a state). The location is Virginia Beach. I don't see another acronym, other than FLGS/LGS (Friendly Local Game Store/Local Game Store).
Seems like a nice place to live. They don't get the bad North Atlantic weather either like we do in Gothenburg.... I hope for their sake.
In my experience it seems it is almost always cheaper to buy gaming products or the internet like on Amazon and other places. Gaming stores have to jack up the price to stay alive rightfuly so, but I'd still go for the cheaper online alternative. I don't know if shipping costs negate that for you over-seas types.
Just to make clear... 99.99% of gaming stores in the States are NOT the gamers 2 store. In fact, to me FLGS is an inside joke, well the friendly part. Outside of Campaign Headquarters in VABeach, I have uh...found local 'gaming' stores. Ran for 'profit'.
Its part of why, the death of the LGS isn't a surprise to me. Niche industries tend to favor the mail order anyway, and well...the fact that gaming tends to attract pedagogues only makes matters worse not better.
Have you looked at Atlantis Games & Comics?
It is a gamestore franchise with locations in Virginia Beach [1920 Centerville Turnpike #120
Virginia Beach, VA 23464 (757) 479 5400], Norfolk [145 E Little Creek Rd Norfolk, VA 23505
(757) 502 8954], and Portsmouth [6231 Portsmouth Blvd Portsmouth, VA 23701 (757) 465 1617] where I play.
The link, if it works, should also have a link to their message boards although the message boards do not receive a lot of traffic.
So, 10 years ago, we didn't have any nice game stores in the Mid-west, I.E. an area between California and New York roughly the size of continental Europe. None. They were ALL holes like the one you describe.
Gamers went, "This is crap, I can do better than this!" and started their own stores that were bright, well lit, friendly, and located not in basements.
Even now, the closest GOOD gaming store to me is over 50 miles away.
For you metric Europeans, that's basically the distance from Stockholm to Vasteras.
Or I can go to a comic shop that doesn't stock RPGs, or down into a hole that's in the basment of a medical prothesis factory...
Or I can go to a comic shop that doesn't stock RPGs, or down into a hole that's in the basment of a medical prothesis factory...
The one out by the stadiums?
So, 10 years ago, we didn't have any nice game stores in the Mid-west, I.E. an area between California and New York roughly the size of continental Europe. None. They were ALL holes like the one you describe.
Gamers went, "This is crap, I can do better than this!" and started their own stores that were bright, well lit, friendly, and located not in basements.
Even now, the closest GOOD gaming store to me is over 50 miles away.
For you metric Europeans, that's basically the distance from Stockholm to Vasteras.
Or I can go to a comic shop that doesn't stock RPGs, or down into a hole that's in the basment of a medical prothesis factory...
"Dr. Benway runs a roleplaying store in the basement of a medical prothesis factory..."
Isn't that from Naked Lunch? :P
How many people live in this area the size of continental Europe?
The store I was talking about isn't really under a building that's about to collapse... Its a real cozy old building in a nice part of town with stores, cafés etc. and I believe there is a good chocolatier right next to it. The store is called Goblin Games I believe. Problem with the store is, it never seems to be open! I went there to buy the sourcebooks but when I got there it was closed, so I went to the sci-fi bookstore and bought them instead... Bad for Goblin Games.
The books cost 249 kr. each; I don't even know how much that is in dollars...
(I saw a kid shoplifting dice in the bookstore real obvious like, but I didn't say anything cause I think the staff there are a bunch of Manga Munchkins who should pay attention instead of blabbering with the customers about how cute the boy in "Yin Ge Oh Nagazakimira" or something is... (it's a cartoon character for pete's sake!))
Back when there was a "real" rpg store in Gothenburg, gamers were spoiled and stupid. Some people didn't even shop there because "I don't like that they stock paintball products" or "I don't like that they sell conventional games" like they didn't want to mingle with the peasants who play othello... Then Tradition (as the store was called) shut and a few stores opened but they didn't really last for long.
I've never bought RPG books mail order. The only one I know who does this is a fanatic who has EVERYTHING Wotc. has published for 4th. Ed... I think he even pre-orders the books. I think he has about 1.5 square meters of minis packed tight together, base to base. How many is that, I can't even count them.
Whenever I see this thread's title, I always giggle.
Y'know... cause of the Ecenomic kerfuffle.
Whenever I see this thread's title, I always giggle.
Y'know... cause of the Ecenomic kerfuffle.
I really think the U.S. Goverment should initiate serious measures to combat the kerfuffle!
The kerfuffle is one of the greatest threats to morals, ethics, religion, sobriety, decent behavior, right-handed traffic and general crop output.
The kerfuffle must be adressed. The kerfuffle must be countered. In the name of rethorics I also state, that the kerfuffle must be eradicated!
This may be hard to believe, but the kerfuffle is pretty high on the US gov't's agenda.
This may be hard to believe, but the kerfuffle is pretty high on the US gov't's agenda.
I could say something that a certain Roman senator would have said about Carthage about the kerfuffle. But I won't. Because that would be silly, like starting this thread.
Yeah but a lot of the people that hold office in this country either a) know nothing about kerfuffles, b) can be scared/bought into doing nothing about the kerfuffle, or c) know exactly how to manage the kerfuffle, but have been demonized or discredited by people who profit from kerfuffles.
People were sorta looking to Obama to fix the kerfuffle RIGHT NOW DO IT RIGHT NOW, and that's not how it works. It took eight years to ruin the country, and it may very well take eight more to make it right again.
Be patient y'all.
Actually, your American Kerfuffles have a tendency to hit us here in Sweden a few months later. And it did. But we don't have a jazzy cool new president to deal with it... Just this boring moderate white minister of state... (come to think of it, boring moderate white sounds a lot like most Swedish men!)
IT BEGINS
Kerfuffle sounds like some kind of dessert.
IT BEGINS
No, it began with post 36. :-)
But, maybe that was a general obsevation coincidentally posted after The_Hated's post.
Yeah but a lot of the people that hold office in this country either a) know nothing about kerfuffles, b) can be scared/bought into doing nothing about the kerfuffle, or c) know exactly how to manage the kerfuffle, but have been demonized or discredited by people who profit from kerfuffles.
People were sorta looking to Obama to fix the kerfuffle RIGHT NOW DO IT RIGHT NOW, and that's not how it works. It took eight years to ruin the country, and it may very well take eight more to make it right again.
Be patient y'all.
Really?
Well, since you started...
Obama is RUINING this country with his assinine, socialist, liberal, wealth destroying, crazy ideas.
I can only hope he will be done after 4... I pray every day he will be gone after 4.
So you gonna steal my dice, jack my thread?
*sharpens Flaming Fullblade of Arguments +4*
So what am I going to do with this sword now that I don't have anything to add to the conversation?
Kerfuffle sounds like some kind of dessert.
It does, it does. I like truffles and I'm good at making them too.
Yeah but a lot of the people that hold office in this country either a) know nothing about kerfuffles, b) can be scared/bought into doing nothing about the kerfuffle, or c) know exactly how to manage the kerfuffle, but have been demonized or discredited by people who profit from kerfuffles.
People were sorta looking to Obama to fix the kerfuffle RIGHT NOW DO IT RIGHT NOW, and that's not how it works. It took eight years to ruin the country, and it may very well take eight more to make it right again.
Be patient y'all.
Really?
Well, since you started...
Obama is RUINING this country with his assinine, socialist, liberal, wealth destroying, crazy ideas.
I can only hope he will be done after 4... I pray every day he will be gone after 4.
Hated, I love and respect you. You're a pretty decent and intelligent person. I'd rather not argue about this with you.
Kerfuffle sounds like some kind of dessert.
Definitely sounds like foodstuff. My first thoughts* were like...
Kerfuffle with vanilla custard or...
Kerfuffle with lots of garlic and extra spicy?!
*And I'm glad that I'm not the only person thinking of food fist! 
People were sorta looking to Obama to fix the kerfuffle RIGHT NOW DO IT RIGHT NOW, and that's not how it works. It took eight years to ruin the country, and it may very well take eight more to make it right again.
Be patient y'all.
It took a lot more than GB Jr to ruin the country. Really, the last eight years were simply an extension of the years and years before. They all had a hand in it. I do agree that it's not fair to ask Obama to have it done NAO!, though, and agree patience is what's called for here. The thing is, it's hard to be patient when Obama's supposed solutions to the kerfluffle are going to continue to add to the kerfluffle. If I know anything about kerfluffles, it's that you can't solve them by throwing money at them that doesn't exist. Even though the gov't is telling you it isn't adding to the deficit - which is a part of the kerfluffle - they are. Now they'll come right out and tell us that their propsed programs (cash for clunkers, healthcare reform, etc) don't add to the deficit, but the reason they give leaves much to be desired. What reason, you ask? Well, they say these programs don't add anything to the deficit because they say they don't. Awful 1984, IMO, but that's what we got. And it's adding to the kerfluffle much the same as anything the oft demonized G Dub came up with. Obama is not a savior. He is a politician - just like the rest of 'em. Hell, he won in part because he lied to us. He said he wasn't a normal politician. He was different. He wanted bi-partisan efforts. And then he promptly used bail out money to 'aid' the companies that sponsored his campaign (to be fair, McCain's got theirs, too). And then he appointed Dems to office and recommended a Dem for the Supreme Court. And then he threatened to force the healthcare resolution through without so much as one Republican signing off on it. He's doing just what anyone else would. And that's why the kerfluffle will continue until it miracles itself into oblivion. Cuz the situation, my friend, is perfectly normal. All ****ed up.
Now I would love it if the kerfluffle was a food item. Cuz then we could eat it and it would go away. Considering the approach we're taking, eating it is even more likely to work than what's being attempted as we speak.
Damn, I feel bad. Between Sci-Fi City, Yodda Quest, Clifton Comics & Games, Queen City Comics, Violet Vortex and bla bla bla, well, this beggar can actually be a chooser. I mean, you get your garden variety Border's and Barnes & Noble's too, though I tend to traffic on Amazon more and more the older I get. Though I didn't get jack from them on my b-day last week. Still, I digress. There's a great abundance of venues in my city for gamers. High concentration in these parts I suppose. Hence the move to migrate Gencon to Indie? Ohio is like the great national average. Not as cosmopolitan as the coasts, but surely not as provincial as the little burgs dotting the Great Plains and South I suppose. IDK, just a lot of electoral votes...whatever.
Speaking of which, politics has slithered its way in here again. The only partisan-anything we should be reading about are the ones in the 3rd world sandboxes duking it out. And even then, probably not the best format for discussion, savvy? Yes, kerfluffle. Bad aftertaste.
No game stores in Modesto except for Krier's, and they're all hung up on Magic the Gathering. I used to live in San Jose, where back in the day we had D&J Hobbies, the Game Gallery, the Game Table, and any number of smaller ones that popped up from time to time. In Prescott, Arizona, we had Roy's Toys and The Crafty Fox. When I lived in Mayer, Arizona, I was among the "suspect" crowd who played D&D. The town had 600 people and the crusty old farts had way to omuch time on their hands. They insisted the local rec hall ban D&D from being allowed. Mind you, getting drunk and driving your 4X4 off a cliff was just something that happened to kids (well, specifically it happened to Ramona, Virginia, and Rachel, but Rachel didn't live to see the ambulance), but BY GOD! DON'T YOU DARE PLAY THAT EVIL GAME! (Insert eye-roll here)
People were sorta looking to Obama to fix the kerfuffle RIGHT NOW DO IT RIGHT NOW, and that's not how it works. It took eight years to ruin the country, and it may very well take eight more to make it right again.
Be patient y'all.
It took a lot more than GB Jr to ruin the country. Really, the last eight years were simply an extension of the years and years before. They all had a hand in it. I do agree that it's not fair to ask Obama to have it done NAO!, though, and agree patience is what's called for here. The thing is, it's hard to be patient when Obama's supposed solutions to the kerfluffle are going to continue to add to the kerfluffle. If I know anything about kerfluffles, it's that you can't solve them by throwing money at them that doesn't exist. Even though the gov't is telling you it isn't adding to the deficit - which is a part of the kerfluffle - they are. Now they'll come right out and tell us that their propsed programs (cash for clunkers, healthcare reform, etc) don't add to the deficit, but the reason they give leaves much to be desired. What reason, you ask? Well, they say these programs don't add anything to the deficit because they say they don't. Awful 1984, IMO, but that's what we got. And it's adding to the kerfluffle much the same as anything the oft demonized G Dub came up with. Obama is not a savior. He is a politician - just like the rest of 'em. Hell, he won in part because he lied to us. He said he wasn't a normal politician. He was different. He wanted bi-partisan efforts. And then he promptly used bail out money to 'aid' the companies that sponsored his campaign (to be fair, McCain's got theirs, too). And then he appointed Dems to office and recommended a Dem for the Supreme Court. And then he threatened to force the healthcare resolution through without so much as one Republican signing off on it. He's doing just what anyone else would. And that's why the kerfluffle will continue until it miracles itself into oblivion. Cuz the situation, my friend, is perfectly normal. All ****ed up.Now I would love it if the kerfluffle was a food item. Cuz then we could eat it and it would go away. Considering the approach we're taking, eating it is even more likely to work than what's being attempted as we speak.
And this pertains to the quality of gaming stores in your city how?
Suppose this is the off-topic tavern after all!
You seem to be ranting a little bit, my friend ;)
I dont need you to tell me what I wrote was off-topic. I also dont need you to tell me I seemed to be 'ranting'. If you've got nothing to say about what I wrote, dont say anything about it.
There. Now how nice do I seem pointing crap out about how you're posting? Fun, innit? ;)
Remember, kiddies, comment on the post, not the author. This message brought to you by the CoC and an **** with little to no regard for other peoples' feelings.
... Just this boring moderate white minister of state... (come to think of it, boring moderate white sounds a lot like most Swedish men!)
You're not moderates, you're socialists
Or maybe communists, people haven't decided yet.Due to complaints received about this thread, I've closed it. The thread will be reviewed to determine if it should be permanently closed, re-opened, and/or a new thread or threads created in its place.