A quick check suggests this won't fall afoul of the forum rules -if so,my sincere apologies to the admins.
As you may be aware, a recent ruling banned D&D as likely to promote gang-related activity in prison.
I thought the community might be interested in seeing a copy of an email I recently sent to the relevant authority.
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As you may be aware, a recent ruling banned D&D as likely to promote gang-related activity in prison.
I thought the community might be interested in seeing a copy of an email I recently sent to the relevant authority.
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To :Wisconsin Department of Corrections.
DEAR SIRS,
As I have no doubt you are very busy , I shall be brief.
With regards to the ruling in the case: KEVIN SINGER vs RICHARD RAEMISCH,. PHILLIP KINGSTON,BRUCE C . MURASK I, and MARC J. MASSIE,(Waupun Correctional Institution)
As I understand it, this ruling supports a ban on all roleplaying games in prison enviroments.
Are you aware that this is unenforceable -in its current state, anyway - without infringing the first amendment (as I understand it) ?
Allow me to very quickly demonstrate, in two simple sentences.
Imagine you are the president and China invade Taiwan with conventional forces....What do you do ?
Whatever you answered, you just played a roleplaying game.
As I hope I've just demonstrated, dice and other props are not required...merely a means of communication between two individuals, and an imagination. You can even replace dice with paper-stone-scissors, "Which hand am I holding the stone in" or have no random factor at all.
The only way to prevent prisoners from playing this sort of game is to keep them all in solitary confinement...as I hope you can see, not a sensible proposition. Certainly you can confiscate their paraphenalia - thats your decision - but banning the playing of the game is impossible, surely, as to prevent a convict from playing it, they must not be allowed to speak to anyone !
Let me be clear; I support efforts against criminal gang culture, and I do not have any sympathy for the felon who brought the case - he is after all a convicted murderer.I am sure you and your colleagues are acting in good faith in order to provide the correct environment ... ...but I would suggest the ruling (as it stands) is unenforcable from a practical stand-point, unless you remove all inmates' rights to assembly and place them in solitary.
Might I suggest that some sort of process where games are allowed under supervision by guards (or even with prison staff taking part as part of the team to channel the stories to ones that encourage positive behavoir) ?
Thank you for taking the time to read this.
yours sincerely
(Tigger_mk4),
DEAR SIRS,
As I have no doubt you are very busy , I shall be brief.
With regards to the ruling in the case: KEVIN SINGER vs RICHARD RAEMISCH,. PHILLIP KINGSTON,BRUCE C . MURASK I, and MARC J. MASSIE,(Waupun Correctional Institution)
As I understand it, this ruling supports a ban on all roleplaying games in prison enviroments.
Are you aware that this is unenforceable -in its current state, anyway - without infringing the first amendment (as I understand it) ?
Allow me to very quickly demonstrate, in two simple sentences.
Imagine you are the president and China invade Taiwan with conventional forces....What do you do ?
Whatever you answered, you just played a roleplaying game.
As I hope I've just demonstrated, dice and other props are not required...merely a means of communication between two individuals, and an imagination. You can even replace dice with paper-stone-scissors, "Which hand am I holding the stone in" or have no random factor at all.
The only way to prevent prisoners from playing this sort of game is to keep them all in solitary confinement...as I hope you can see, not a sensible proposition. Certainly you can confiscate their paraphenalia - thats your decision - but banning the playing of the game is impossible, surely, as to prevent a convict from playing it, they must not be allowed to speak to anyone !
Let me be clear; I support efforts against criminal gang culture, and I do not have any sympathy for the felon who brought the case - he is after all a convicted murderer.I am sure you and your colleagues are acting in good faith in order to provide the correct environment ... ...but I would suggest the ruling (as it stands) is unenforcable from a practical stand-point, unless you remove all inmates' rights to assembly and place them in solitary.
Might I suggest that some sort of process where games are allowed under supervision by guards (or even with prison staff taking part as part of the team to channel the stories to ones that encourage positive behavoir) ?
Thank you for taking the time to read this.
yours sincerely
(Tigger_mk4),
I have a brother-in-law (also a gamer) who works as a guard in a WI prison.
Not letting the inmates play D&D is about punishment. Heck these guys get better medical treatment than most people I know! They get 3 meals a day and some prisons have cable TV (although not in the cells). These guys don't even have to work (most choose to do so). Would it be fair for the tax payer to provide even more recreation for pedophiles, rapists, thieves, drug dealers/ manufacturers, and murders?
My sister and brother-in-law work at a State prison in WI. I have had a tour of the prison and gotten a glimpse of the "behind the scenes".
If you envy them so much, why not join them?
Because he always drops the soap.
If you envy them so much, why not join them?
Because he always drops the soap.
I don't envy them. Feel sorry they have made bad choices in life. I just think that these felons have comitted serious and often repeated crimes and that not allowing them to play D&D is fair punishment. It isn't like they got a few speeding tickets.
As far as dropping soap. Rather a shallow reply ADHadh. Can you discuss this topic with mature respect? How about an intelliegent retort?
As far as dropping soap. Rather a shallow reply ADHadh. Can you discuss this topic with mature respect? How about an intelliegent retort?
What fun would that be?
Think about it. What would be more fun?
A)serious dicussion
B)Crude immature comments
Choose Now!!!
As far as dropping soap. Rather a shallow reply ADHadh. Can you discuss this topic with mature respect? How about an intelliegent retort?
Pleased to meet you!
That being said, D&D is a luxury, not a necessity, so I have no problem with prisoners not being allowed to play.
Yeah, that happened here, on multiple occasions.
________
1See, if we don't treat prisoners well, then we're taking away people's ability to provide for themselves while failing to do so for them, and that's unfair. We can't force them to "work it off" 'cause then we're toeing the line with the 13th amendment, not to mention that if a city could, for example, force prisoners to work on a road crew without compensation (save for the accommodations given to all prisoners) then the city now has an incentive to get more prisoners (regardless of actual guilt) as the prisons then have the possibility of turning a profit for the city instead of a debt.
Throw in the full text of the 8th and 13th amendments and it seems very unwise for constitutional and ethical reasons to force labor from prisoners, regardless of how practical it might be.
Ah, if only things were so easy.
It's a less-then-ideal, and less-then-simple, situation. Especially when you throw in practicality and what actually works (as far as recindivism and such) goes.
Because while it might be philosophically purer to say that prisons are for punishment, going that route leads to more prisoners in the long-run then a prison that makes some effort to give people the skills to lead a life-more-legal once they get out.
/shrug
Ultimately though it's not a subject I've delved into too deeply, so I have no solutions, just a "it's more complicated then that" to most "simple" solutions.
/shrug
It's a less-then-ideal, and less-then-simple, situation. Especially when you throw in practicality and what actually works (as far as recindivism and such) goes.
Because while it might be philosophically purer to say that prisons are for punishment, going that route leads to more prisoners in the long-run then a prison that makes some effort to give people the skills to lead a life-more-legal once they get out.
/shrug
Ultimately though it's not a subject I've delved into too deeply, so I have no solutions, just a "it's more complicated then that" to most "simple" solutions.
Haven't thought about it much either. It's kinda like the whole unemployment thing... it doesn't work as it is, but it's hard to change. I have... ideas... but I've also little regard for the quality of life of people in general so they might not be the nicest ideas, although some could be pretty effective.
If you envy them so much, why not join them?
Because he always drops the soap.
I don't envy them. Feel sorry they have made bad choices in life. I just think that these felons have comitted serious and often repeated crimes and that not allowing them to play D&D is fair punishment. It isn't like they got a few speeding tickets.
As far as dropping soap. Rather a shallow reply ADHadh. Can you discuss this topic with mature respect? How about an intelliegent retort?
Put your comment was about how good their life is in prison. So I said why don't you join them. Cause let's face it, even if they eat everyday, they still have lost their freedom and that is a huge punishement that none of us wants.
And we should "torture" them because fo the crimes the yahve commited. They still can be rehabilitated. Let's not make them bitter about society.
Goldo I am not a criminal. I work two jobs, own a small house, pay taxes. If I became a criminal I couldn't play D&D
