Ello i have been playing dnd for about 2 years now and my mom cant stand it. My mom thinks dnd is a "satanist" game. I tried to explain to her that its not and its just a game that you use your imagination. But she thinks otherwise. She cant stand the game and shes about to make me quit. What should i do? 0.0
Have her sit in and watch an actual game (make sure everyone in your group knows to play nice, the last thing you need is some **** deciding to play a CE character who eats babies). Have you talked to your (or her, since I don't know your whole scenario) pastor at church? Mine actually gave me a copy of an AD&D computer game and fully supported it. Or put covers on all your D&D books and call it something else. My conservative religious grandma was ok with me playing Dragonstrike (even with houserules that basically made it D&D), but as soon as we called it D&D, it was a problem.
I would suggest making an argument using logic and facts, but I already know from experience that neither of these have any bearing on a religious nut (no offense intended to your mom).
What should i do? 0.0
Have you tried summoning a demon?
Have you guys tried cutting your hair, getting a job and maybe playin' the game looking like respectable young guys and gals?
agreed
Have you guys tried cutting your hair, getting a job and maybe playin' the game looking like respectable young guys and gals?
lol
Try telling her it is simply [...] a game of "make-believe" for older people.
Like the game that adults play bedroom. What do they call it? Roleplay?
Then show her some of the books, [...] and explain how it helps in problem solving and encourages teamwork.
....in the bedroom.
She may end up thinking it's good for you.
agreed. It's never too early to start teaching youngers about bein' a grown up.
If a swear of two isn't too much of an issue, have them listen to www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4... so they actually understand the game a bit.
if she refuses to even look at them have her go online:
www.religioustolerance.org/d_a_d.htm
www.fansforchrist.org/phpBB2/articles/ar...
www.theescapist.com/spells/ (ok, this is satire, but it's still funny and relevant)
Wait, that's right, that doesn't actually work. Hey, that's something! You can show her the Chick tracts, and point out "look, if this were anything other then fantasy, then I could stop you from stopping me. That you can stop me shows that I can't stop you from stopping me, so it's obviously just fantasy, and not reality."
... then again, if any kid came to me with that kind of logic I'd probablly ground them for being a smart-ass.
Clearly the solution is to cast a mind bondage spell on your mother to stop her from stopping you.
Wait, that's right, that doesn't actually work. Hey, that's something! You can show her the Chick tracts, and point out "look, if this were anything other then fantasy, then I could stop you from stopping me. That you can stop me shows that I can't stop you from stopping me, so it's obviously just fantasy, and not reality."
... then again, if any kid came to me with that kind of logic I'd probablly ground them for being a smart-ass.
I'd show them the "additude adjuster" (aka a leather belt).
If a swear of two isn't too much of an issue, have them listen to www.wizards.com/DnD/Article.aspx?x=dnd/4... so they actually understand the game a bit.
Thank you!
-Sarena
Wait, that's right, that doesn't actually work. Hey, that's something! You can show her the Chick tracts, and point out "look, if this were anything other then fantasy, then I could stop you from stopping me. That you can stop me shows that I can't stop you from stopping me, so it's obviously just fantasy, and not reality."
But if I accept that argument, then you have stopped me from stopping you, so maybe you already geassed me-
...
It seems we have an infinite loop .
Have you guys tried cutting your hair, getting a job and maybe playin' the game looking like respectable young guys and gals?
Seriously, Great reply. Outsiders wouldn't look down on the hobby if the people participating in the hobby didn't look like sideshow freaks. (no offense to any sideshow freaks reading this)
Clearly the solution is to cast a mind bondage spell on your mother to stop her from stopping you.
Wait, that's right, that doesn't actually work. Hey, that's something! You can show her the Chick tracts, and point out "look, if this were anything other then fantasy, then I could stop you from stopping me. That you can stop me shows that I can't stop you from stopping me, so it's obviously just fantasy, and not reality."
... then again, if any kid came to me with that kind of logic I'd probablly ground them for being a smart-ass.
Magefingers' mother might see that sort of logic as satan's logic. Sure she could stop forcing her offspring from playing the game, but then she might think that magefingers indeed caused her to stop through devil-tongue words and evil magic. Thus now magefingers will be branded a witch and put to the torch.
Face it, somethings parents won't let you do no matter how you reason with them (whether they're right or wrong {they tend to make the rules of the house which govern those that live within}). This may not be the advice you seek but play the game away from home (perhaps at school). Do not bring your books/accessories home or you risk them being taken from you.
I'm still in touch with him. He's now Head of Physics at a Catholic school and another is now career military!!
Playing without your mom knowing will only cause more trouble if your mom finds out & believe me PARENTS FIND OUT as i am now a parent of two boys LOL - try to reason with her first.
This problem comes from misunderstanding the facts. Tell her why you like it: socialising with your friends, problem solving, working out group dynamics (like role-playing seminars for 50+ company execs), tell her that your playing the 'good guys' (hopefully! Sort of!) and hopefully you will forge friendships that will last. I am still in touch with two guys from that very first group which was started in 1985!!!!
and seriously, DON'T EVEN THINK OF PLAYING DEMON: THE FALLEN.
I didn't say to play the game behind her back, I simply presumed reasoning had already been tried and had failed. Continuing an attempt to reason with someone can be very difficult if one sticks to a mindset (especially when one feels one is right). I do not advocate playing the game behind her back but do not advise to stop playing the game either. It is why I suggested playing it at school while not keeping the books and other accessories at home, otherwise magefingers will be asking for trouble. Maybe with time she'll come around if magefingers continue to reason with her but that doesn't mean magefingers should stop until then.
Edited: bloody usage of double negatives...
Make it abundantly clear of just how much worse your hobby choices could be. Be sure to point out any local stoners, and druggies you know of in your school and point out the direction they are heading.
Explain to her that frankly D&D and your choice in friends, not her and her hokey false god are partly what kept you out of trouble thus far. Also explain to her your own religious practices are none of her business, so if you did choose to start worshiping Satan she could take her and her preachy beliefs and shove them up her ass.
Sorry I have a real thing against bible thumpers.
Explain to her, for one thing D&D is not a Religion. Explain for another, it's just a damn game. Like a boardgame. Also, explain that frankly it's a great hobby because it doesn't involve possible legal problems, or physical injury, while it also promotes being social. Show her the books without actually letting them into her hands, and if she tries to destroy them call the cops for vandalism.
If that doesn't work, tell her to stuff it keep your D&D books in your locker at school, and play anyway.
I rarely see a picture of Satan or Lucifer with hair...
And I though that the D&D haters disappeared in the '80s....
I guess they all moved to (or originated from) the US... You still have those in 2009? woah...
Seriously, Satan and his bunch are out in 2009, tell your mom to get over it, have her watch some TV or something....it's so much worse than what you find in a D&D game.
because it doesn't involve possible (...) physical injury, while it also promotes being social.
No physical injury? I take it you've never had a metal D20 thrown at you? LOL
Another is to discuss it with her. I don't mean trading "No it isn't!", "Yes it is!" back and forth but actually discuss it. Ask her why she thinks it is satanist? Instead of jsut saying "It's not" really sit down and explain the game to her. Take her through the books and show her what it's all about. Point out that it is published by Hasbro, the same people that do Littlest Pet Shop and My Little Pony.
Don't get defensive, get reasonable.
What should i do? 0.0
Quit.
-------
1Either as father or mother.
Now here is something you could do if she sits in on a session but it might not be the best thing to do.
Everyone can draw little symbols and designs on their arms and faces. Dress in black robes that have something like a deep purple and red trim or under robes. When ya all get to the table you can start a chant that is just a bunch of gibberish that sounds like some kind of hymn. Have your hands raised or whatnot why'll doing this. Oh, and you should totally have one of the books open in your hand while doing this. i'm thinking the DMG but the monster manual has all the demons in it so maybe you should stick to that one. Now that she's likely adequately freaked out by now you can cut the act, grab the phb, walk to her, plant your ass next to her, open up the book, and proceed to go through the intro of the phb that explains what D&D is and that it ain't anything to worry about.
Ya know I never had this problem and my mom is catholic, went to catholic school, and her parents are catholic and I was even raised catholic. yep, never had the problem you dudes are havin'.
Or point out that the guy who wrote several of the anti-D&D articles on chick's website (William Schnoebelen or something like that), if you read all his articles, he will at various times claim to be a Wiccan High Priest, a Gnostic Archbishop, a high-ranking Jesuit and privy to the secrets of the Catholic Church, a high ranking Freemason, and a Luciferian Vampire (that's right, he claims to have been a vampire before he met Jesus), quite the busy life. He says he was a baby-sacrificing satanist. He claims to have killed people. Were there any hint of truth to that crap, that would be taken as a confession and the police would have been knocking on his door long ago.
1) Cut your hair. The emo hair isn't helping the cause.
2) Have her sit down.
3) Have a seizure and start spouting the names of demons (wiki "list of demons") while whacking off.
4) When you have your exorcism pretend to be demonically possesed.
5) After the exorcism tell your mom that it was only through the friendship invoked by D&D that you could break away from Samael.
3) Have a seizure and start spouting the names of demons (wiki "list of demons") while whacking off.
Talk about over-kill... she'll probably think magefingers has even more issues then playing demonic games...
3) Have a seizure and start spouting the names of demons (wiki "list of demons") while whacking off.
Talk about over-kill... she'll probably think magefingers has even more issues then playing demonic games...
That's the point.
She might skip the exorcism and send magefingers to an asylum instead.
Even better!
She might skip the exorcism and send magefingers to an asylum instead.
You could probably get a mean game of Paranoia going in an asylum...
She might skip the exorcism and send magefingers to an asylum instead.
You could probably get a mean game of Paranoia going in an asylum...
I'd rather play Call of Cthulhu there. :P
I doubt asylums are as cool as DC comics make them out to be...
I doubt asylums are as cool as DC comics make them out to be...
...Yet
Ask her if she would rather you be a drug dealing junkie, getting into trouble with the law.
Not really a great example. Just because someone doesn't play D&D doesn't mean that they're going to be a junkie, or always be in trouble with the police.
Also, just because someone is a junkie who ends up in troble with the police doesn't mean that they don't play D&D.
Make it abundantly clear of just how much worse your hobby choices could be. Be sure to point out any local stoners, and druggies you know of in your school and point out the direction they are heading.
This won't achieve anything. Using an extreme example like this is only going to make things much much worse in the end.
Explain to her that frankly D&D and your choice in friends, not her and her hokey false god are partly what kept you out of trouble thus far.
He might share her religious views. I'm pretty sure he won't sell out his faith in order to keep playing a game.
Also explain to her your own religious practices are none of her business, so if you did choose to start worshiping Satan she could take her and her preachy beliefs and shove them up her ass.
They actually are her business. She's his mother. She has a right to know what his religious beliefs are, and what he's doing. He's clearly still living in her house (I'd be damned if my mother told me I couldn't play D&D in a house that I owned or was paying rent for). She sets the rules, and if he doesn't like them, he can move out.
I also don't think that anyone should tell their own mother to shove anything up anywhere. It's his mother for crying out loud! He may still want to play D&D, but being disrespectful to her and her religous beliefs are 100% not the way to go. It's almost a given that she'll attribute his new rude attitude to D&D, and that'll give her even more ammunition.
Sorry I have a real thing against bible thumpers.
Well, at least you approached the subject with an open mind, and no bias whatsoever. Oh wait...
Explain to her, for one thing D&D is not a Religion. Explain for another, it's just a damn game. Like a boardgame. Also, explain that frankly it's a great hobby because it doesn't involve possible legal problems, or physical injury, while it also promotes being social. Show her the books without actually letting them into her hands, and if she tries to destroy them call the cops for vandalism.
That actually sounded like ok advice, until you got to the part where he calls the police. That's insane. She's his mother.
If that doesn't work, tell her to stuff it keep your D&D books in your locker at school, and play anyway.
Ok, this isn't just some random girl in the street that he's talking about. It's his MOTHER. If she doesn't want him to play, then she'll do everything in her power to make sure he doesn't, and that cna include (but isn't limited to) stopping him from seeing his D&D friends outside of school, asking the school to isolate him during lunch periods and all sorts of other things.
More to the point, is that how you speak to your mother? He needs to have some respect for her and tolerence of her religious beliefs. She's most likely just worried that her son is becoming tangled in weird Satanic practices because she doesn't know any better.
The best thing for you to do, Megafingers, is to have her sit in on a session, show her your books, let her actually see what D&D is. That way, she'll either see that it isn't demonic or satanic, or you'll be able to present cases and solutions for her fears.
Also, a little help, one thing that's bound to come up: "If it's not Satanic, why are their demons and devils in the book!?"
Your answer is simply: "The characters slay them. The characters kill these demons and devils because they are usually champions of all that is good and right."
Also, just because someone is a junkie who ends up in troble with the police doesn't mean that they don't play D&D.
This won't achieve anything. Using an extreme example like this is only going to make things much much worse in the end.
He might share her religious views. I'm pretty sure he won't sell out his faith in order to keep playing a game.
They actually are her business. She's his mother. She has a right to know what his religious beliefs are, and what he's doing. He's clearly still living in her house (I'd be damned if my mother told me I couldn't play D&D in a house that I owned or was paying rent for). She sets the rules, and if he doesn't like them, he can move out.
I also don't think that anyone should tell their own mother to shove anything up anywhere. It's his mother for crying out loud! He may still want to play D&D, but being disrespectful to her and her religous beliefs are 100% not the way to go. It's almost a given that she'll attribute his new rude attitude to D&D, and that'll give her even more ammunition.
Well, at least you approached the subject with an open mind, and no bias whatsoever. Oh wait...
That actually sounded like ok advice, until you got to the part where he calls the police. That's insane. She's his mother.
Ok, this isn't just some random girl in the street that he's talking about. It's his MOTHER. If she doesn't want him to play, then she'll do everything in her power to make sure he doesn't, and that cna include (but isn't limited to) stopping him from seeing his D&D friends outside of school, asking the school to isolate him during lunch periods and all sorts of other things.
More to the point, is that how you speak to your mother? He needs to have some respect for her and tolerence of her religious beliefs. She's most likely just worried that her son is becoming tangled in weird Satanic practices because she doesn't know any better.
The best thing for you to do, Megafingers, is to have her sit in on a session, show her your books, let her actually see what D&D is. That way, she'll either see that it isn't demonic or satanic, or you'll be able to present cases and solutions for her fears.
Also, a little help, one thing that's bound to come up: "If it's not Satanic, why are their demons and devils in the book!?"
Your answer is simply: "The characters slay them. The characters kill these demons and devils because they are usually champions of all that is good and right."
No, but you are alot less likely. Free time being eaten up rolling dice and all.
I doubt he would too, however it's already obvious that they have different religious beliefs due to him not thinking D&D is Satanic. She's obviously more Fundamentalist than he is.
Just like her and her self righteousness is causing the problem anyway?
You know I find it laughably sad, that you wouldn't punish your mother for Unlawful Behavior, and the Active Destruction of someone else's property. I would do it precisely because she was my own mother and not some random idiot. (If it were some random idiot. They'd probably meet the end of my steel toed boots or maybe a crowbar. Certainly at the very least they'd find their car keyed later) If she wasn't raised properly to respect someone else's property she deserves a night in a cell. You know that whole she broke the law part.
No actually, it isn't her business. Contrary to some people's beliefs the parents don't have an Empirical Right over everything of their spawn.
Do you really think the school would even for a moment go along with that? I don't know about you, but every school I've been to seemed to take great pains to stay out of family disputes, and even feuds on the school grounds. They would much rather, ignore the problem because it is easier to do so.
Some people deserve to get told to shove it. Regardless of their relationship to you. It's not sticking up for yourself in the first place which leads to these sorts of problems.
Sure if you can be reasonable do so. But in my experience someone that's that religious rarely is because they dwell in the Extreme. The first problem with your take is you are assuming that someone that thinks demon summoning is real, is capable of rational thought when it comes to Good Old Religion, and their Righteous Ways, and the Heretical Ways of the Non Righteous.
Also, I would think it was pretty clear to read the one part as being serious where you sit down and explain to her it's not a religion etc. And so yes, in that post calling the cops if she destroys your books is serious. Again, if she can't control herself enough to not destroy someone else's property then she deserves a night in the cell to correct the problem. Lest it continue or get worse. It also has a boon of, teaching if ever so subtely that acting out in the name of God is not good or right.
Hey you, magicfingers guy, has your mother ever seen you playing WoW or other similar video game? Simply tell her that D&D is nothing more than a video game but with a group of friends and imagination instead of computer. It is no more satanic than any of those games. In fact, many Christians play this game (here on forums I've seen people admitting to being Protestant, Baptists, Born-again... I am myself a Catholic from a quite religious family).
No, but you are alot less likely. Free time being eaten up rolling dice and all.
Not all the time.
Just like her and her self righteousness is causing the problem anyway?
I'm sure that's not how she sees it.
You know I find it laughably sad, that you wouldn't punish your mother for Unlawful Behavior, and the Active Destruction of someone else's property. I would do it precisely because she was my own mother and not some random idiot. (If it were some random idiot. They'd probably meet the end of my steel toed boots or maybe a crowbar. Certainly at the very least they'd find their car keyed later) If she wasn't raised properly to respect someone else's property she deserves a night in a cell. You know that whole she broke the law part.
And I find it sad that you would. I also find it slightly worrying that any circumstance would lead you to take a crowbar to someone, or key their car. That's worrying.
No actually, it isn't her business. Contrary to some people's beliefs the parents don't have an Empirical Right over everything of their spawn.
It is her business. At the very least, it's her business what her son does under her roof, and if you don't understand that then I don't know what to tell you.
Do you really think the school would even for a moment go along with that? I don't know about you, but every school I've been to seemed to take great pains to stay out of family disputes, and even feuds on the school grounds. They would much rather, ignore the problem because it is easier to do so.
If she requests that her son be isolated during lunch breaks, the school has to do their best to honour that request.
Some people deserve to get told to shove it. Regardless of their relationship to you. It's not sticking up for yourself in the first place which leads to these sorts of problems.
In this case, sticking up for yourself might very well end up with you out on the streets. She's his mother. If you don't understand why she deserves respect regardless of what she's done, then there's nothing anyone can tell you to make you understand, but she does deserve respect.
Sure if you can be reasonable do so. But in my experience someone that's that religious rarely is because they dwell in the Extreme. The first problem with your take is you are assuming that someone that thinks demon summoning is real, is capable of rational thought when it comes to Good Old Religion, and their Righteous Ways, and the Heretical Ways of the Non Righteous.
Your experience is not universal. And hearing you calling people unreasonable is quite ironic.
Guys, guys, guys, you're forgetting an ally in educating people about RPGs we didn't have those 20+ years ago: video games.
I thought video games were often looked down upon and often resented (for their content) by the religious powers-that-be...
Remember videogames aren't exactly held in high standard either to these kinds of people.
I'm pretty sure videogames aren't the answer. Unless you want to risk her thinking you're going to be the next Columbine Kid.
Remember videogames aren't exactly held in high standard either to these kinds of people.
Especially WoW, what with it's zombie PCs and female night elves and what have you (Not to mention the two or three people with no self control that the media blows out of proportion).
I'm pretty sure videogames aren't the answer. Unless you want to risk her thinking you're going to be the next Columbine Kid.
Remember videogames aren't exactly held in high standard either to these kinds of people.
True, what with all the publicity games like GTA 4 and Manhunt draw towards themselves. There's also a game about a group of soldiers in the Iraq war coming out soon, and it's drawing a load of controversy as well.
You seem awful hung up on the fact that the kid is dealing with his mother. And while I can empathize with that position, that's not a free-pass to whatever she wants to do. Mother's aren't perfect, they're not magical, they're just people that happen, by choice or accident, to be a mother. And like every other person on the planet, they can be unreasonable, stupid, biased, and so-on.
Giving her some kind of free-pass on being a ravening loon (if she is indeed one) isn't doing a favor to anyone.
By getting defensive she thinks she is hitting close to the mark. BAsically, every time you scream "no it isn't!" when she claims it is Satanic she thinks she must be right or you wouldn't get so upset.
Sit down with the books, walk her through the game and talk to her about it. Find out her specific fears and address them. Start from general principals like "it's really just cops-and-robbers with rules" and build from there.
Do not try to play stupid mind-games like "Jesus was persecuted too, you know" to "trick" her into letting you play.
Do not say stuff like "I could be doing drugs or sleeping around" cos that will only serve to introduce those concepts into the discussion and to enforce an association in her mind between them, you and D&D.
If she is a moron, a fanatic, or a nutjob she cannot be reasoned with. Give all your D&D books to a friend for safe keeping (with the proviso you get them back from him later), play somewhere else, avoid mentioning D&D or having any D&D material around her, and hope you can ride it out until you move out.
There's also a game about a group of soldiers in the Iraq war coming out soon, and it's drawing a load of controversy as well.
?
You serious?
...
... oh. NM. You mean as in a game about a "group of soldiers in the Iraq war" that's going to be released soon. That's quite a bit different, and more likely, then my first reading. Moving along now...
Unless your mother is a moron, a fanatic, or a nutjob she has your best interests at heart and will likely respond much better to a reasonable discussion than arguments or theatrics.
By getting defensive she thinks she is hitting close to the mark. BAsically, every time you scream "no it isn't!" when she claims it is Satanic she thinks she must be right or you wouldn't get so upset.
Sit down with the books, walk her through the game and talk to her about it. Find out her specific fears and address them. Start from general principals like "it's really just cops-and-robbers with rules" and build from there.
Do not try to play stupid mind-games like "Jesus was persecuted too, you know" to "trick" her into letting you play.
Do not say stuff like "I could be doing drugs or sleeping around" cos that will only serve to introduce those concepts into the discussion and to enforce an association in her mind between them, you and D&D.
If she is a moron, a fanatic, or a nutjob she cannot be reasoned with. Give all your D&D books to a friend for safe keeping (with the proviso you get them back from him later), play somewhere else, avoid mentioning D&D or having any D&D material around her, and hope you can ride it out until you move out.
+1
Arguing like a child will probably result in being treated like one.
But if she is irrational and goes with a "my way or the highway" approach, then there's not much you can do. At best, you'll have to risk playing in secret or taking a break.
And to Cpt_Micha, if you call the cops on your parents, I'm pretty sure they could inconvience you more than what the cops would do to your parents. Goodbye any sort of priviledges. If you actually have to resort to that kind of measure, you probably have bigger problems than DnD.
So calling in the cops on your parents for you being a dumb ass stupid kid might not work depending on where you live. Plus if your parents get in trouble then you've put your self in a more troublesome spot. Also, if the area is a religious area then more likely the police would share similar views with your parents and would support them and not you.
Calling the cops on your parents? As someone who grew up as a "ward of the state", let me tell you - that's a one-way ticket to a harder life than you would have ever known. Her house, her rules - you don't like it, leave - try the real world on for size.
Yes, since you should just be a doormat whenever someone destroys personal property.
I think the idea is that, in most cases, there's probably a better option.
Yeah, there's a point where it is better to be a ward of the state then to put up with crap from your parents, but it's a pretty far one in most cases. And if your folks are reasonable there's probably some things you can do before it gets to that point. Maybe not. But probably.
Yes, since you should just be a doormat whenever someone destroys personal property.
Not at all - first: there is very little personal property involved here. Most everything you may own is a direct or indirect result of the fact that you are being supported. So unless you can do so yourself - you lose that right. Of course, as I said - it goes back to the not knowing how good you have it. You'd have to sell a lot more than your books just to afford a security deposit. As I said, I was a ward of the state - there is no such thing as personal property.
Yes, since you should just be a doormat whenever someone destroys personal property.
Unless he's 18 and/or has a job and is paying rent, very few people are going to consider that his personal property. If he's a minor, his parents are responsible for his wellbeing as well as everything he does. So if she takes his books and throws them in the trash, no judge is going to sentence her to jail, make her pay a fine, or order her to pay him damages. If she considers the material inappropriate for her household, then she has every right to get rid of it. Her house, her rules. You don't like it? Get a job and move out.
Guys, guys, guys, you're forgetting an ally in educating people about RPGs we didn't have those 20+ years ago: video games.
Hey you, magicfingers guy, has your mother ever seen you playing WoW or other similar video game? Simply tell her that D&D is nothing more than a video game but with a group of friends and imagination instead of computer. It is no more satanic than any of those games. In fact, many Christians play this game (here on forums I've seen people admitting to being Protestant, Baptists, Born-again... I am myself a Catholic from a quite religious family).
My mom hates WoW, i play runescape, it seems more kiddish to her. All my friends who play dnd, are christian.
You guys are acting like i can move out but im 13 sooo no.. lol...i should have mentioned that..lol okay now i would like to say that my mom does not accept or let me show her the book. She doesnt like to talk about DnD...But rarely she lets me have it at my house. Shes not a freak just stubborn.
You guys are acting like i can move out but im 13 sooo no.. lol...
I wasn't - mine was conditional. Provided you are under her roof, you are under her rules.
i should have mentioned that..lol okay now i would like to say that my mom does not accept or let me show her the book. She doesnt like to talk about DnD...But rarely she lets me have it at my house. Shes not a freak just stubborn.
and there is the disconnect - it is her house. The only amount to which it is yours is the extent that she allows it to be.
Just pay D&D over at your friend's places and at school or whatnot.
rock and roll
comic books
gambleling
telephones
the internet
Austin Powers
its co-op game, nothing more; nothing less, and it should be treated as such.
besides, you could throw your mother a bone, and ask her what she thinks you should be doing, and then tell her what you really could be doing instead, there are worst things out there to do....
(on that note, you could get into live action role playing, and ott start attending celtic fairs)
Yes, since you should just be a doormat whenever someone destroys personal property.
At thirteen, you legally can't own anything, but that doesn't seem to be the issue. I would think that if you had someone a little older(or better yet, female) with the group it might work a little better. Most parents I know aren't particularly mussed about more than general activities where their teenagers are involved, as long as they know where and have a way to reach you.
Only the true Psycho-Christians usually take issue with such things. I've seen a couple that're okay with it, but not many. Usually being "Born Again" to Psycho-Christianity is accompanied by a free Frontal Lobotomy.
I had a very lovely man some years ago, raised Baptist(not a denom known for tolerance), no problems whatsoever... I was even considering strongly marrying him, within the walls of his church, no less.
Then he ran into a particularly Penecostal group at work, and he stopped being the man I was so smitten with, and turned into something truely vile. Gone was more than a year of love and understanding, replaced by intolerance and the LORD(caps intentional, not a stab, but the way he emphasized it). He cursed me for rejecting my Episcopal upbringing in favor of Bhuddism.
He finally found his truth, and his new world could not include me. He turned into a complete idiot(in my opinion) overnight. I can only ascribe this to radical removal of cognitive function. He wasn't the first I saw undergo this particular transformation, nor was he the last... He was just the one that hurt most. Extreme fundamentalism is as has been stated, rarely rational.
However, maybe take an interest in The Lord of the Rings and explain that D&D is similar in extant. That might get you a little farther in the discussion than hyperbole.
-Sarena
Then come home one day with a female friend. If your mom submits an inquiry then respond with something like "Oh, we're just going to roleplay in my room for a few hours". ;)
Just remember that you're 13 and so your duty is to try and give your mom a heart attack with your teen antic.
You guys are acting like i can move out but im 13 sooo no.. lol...i should have mentioned that..lol okay now i would like to say that my mom does not accept or let me show her the book. She doesnt like to talk about DnD...But rarely she lets me have it at my house. Shes not a freak just stubborn.
Ok, here's what we're gonna do. Have your mom give me a call. I'll straighten the broad out. You can trust me, dood. Just look at my post history. I may need to ask df along to consult ...
Talk to the padre, see if you can use a meeting room a couple times a month, and post a message on the bulletin board looking for players. Stubborn or no, it's kind of hard to back the "D&D is Satanic!" message when the players are Christian, the game is being held on Church property, and it's sanctioned buy the cleric in charge.
That or just play in hiding. Just call it something else.
Or if you don't want to lie, just play another RPG with a more mellow name.
Or if you don't want to lie, just play another RPG with a more mellow name.
Like F.A.T.A.L.
Bad Zb. Bad!
see what you've done?You guys are acting like i can move out but im 13 sooo no.. lol...i should have mentioned that..lol okay now i would like to say that my mom does not accept or let me show her the book. She doesnt like to talk about DnD...But rarely she lets me have it at my house. Shes not a freak just stubborn.
Ok, here's what we're gonna do. Have your mom give me a call. I'll straighten the broad out. You can trust me, dood. Just look at my post history. I may need to ask df along to consult ...
Or if you don't want to lie, just play another RPG with a more mellow name.
Like F.A.T.A.L.
Yeah i she doesnt want to talk about it shes stubborn :P. Also i think thatll almost give me in more trouble, possibly i dont know how but she just grounds me for stuff like that.
Ask her how she feels about Flunitrazepam. Just tell her ZB wants to know. No reason, just curious.
Ask her how she feels about Flunitrazepam. Just tell her ZB wants to know. No reason, just curious.
Bad Otter! No beer.
-Sarena
Bad Otter! No beer.
-Sarena
If we don't have beer, what the hell am I supposed to put the Flunetrazepam in? You need to rethink this plan, I think.
In the meantime, there's a tap in the kitchen and a glass next to it. You can drink all of that you want. No feeding the poor kid's mother Flunitrazepam.
-Sarena
One question? What if his mom has a bad case of insomnia? She might need some Flunitrazepam. It's only right that ZB should provide some if she's in need for it. ;)
No, I'm locking up your beer for a week, just for thinking that.
No feeding the poor kid's mother Flunitrazepam.
-Sarena
I suppose I can put it in tap water. It won't taste as good, though. Oh, if it's not ok to feed it to the kid's mom, is it ok if I feed it to myself?
Even though Flunitrazepam has the bad rap, as I understand it the drug was suspected of having been used in few such cases.
One question? What if his mom has a bad case of insomnia? She might need some Flunitrazepam. It's only right that ZB should provide some if she's in need for it. ;)
Yeah! She needs me. She needs my help. I'm doin' a service, here. See? I is a good OTTer!
MF, banish the books from the house for awhile, and drop the subject. Play when you can, if you dare. Your mother's being silly, but assuming she's close to my age, there may be a reason.
Let the subject drop for awhile, and approach her for her own experiences with it later. It may be that she bought into the hype back when she was young(yes, there was such a time), or she may have had someone close to her badly effected by it. Try and look at it from her point of view, once you have it, and come to a decision.
If you've been playing for the last couple of years(occasionally in her house!), and she's just now coming to this conclusion, there's likely a reason.
Something you didn't mention that I think might be salient... How have your grades been recently? Have they been slipping?
-Sarena
I suppose I can put it in tap water. It won't taste as good, though. Oh, if it's not ok to feed it to the kid's mom, is it ok if I feed it to myself?
-dfsnip- Yeah! She needs me. She needs my help. I'm doin' a service, here. See? I is a good OTTer!
No, Bad Otter! Don't make me take away your hunting privileges. She doesn't need that, she needs someone to help her finance a clue.
-Sarena
Something you didn't mention that I think might be salient... How have your grades been recently? Have they been slipping?
-Sarena
I've actually seen a parent ban D&D because their kid's grades were improving. The logic was their son wasn't smart enough to get better grades on his own so he must have been cheating off of the people in the "D&D sessions." (Having been in said sessions personally I can tell you that was not happening)
Now I'm not sure how to fit D&D into that. I'm sure you can figure out that part.
I don't see it as a necessary step towards the goal here. I feel for him, but really, at his age, the last thing he wants to do is defy his mother, and we're really not right in encouraging him to do that.
Meh. There's a difference between encouraging defiance and encouraging openness. If you have a problem with family, I say, it's better to have it out in the open and aknowledged where it can be dealth with and handled, rather then hide it behind false smiles and little lies so it festers and rots.
... But I think D&D isn't really that important issue in the scheme of things. Pick and choose your battles and all that jazz.
I've actually seen a parent ban D&D because their kid's grades were improving. The logic was their son wasn't smart enough to get better grades on his own so he must have been cheating off of the people in the "D&D sessions." (Having been in said sessions personally I can tell you that was not happening)
Okay, that's just ridiculous on a horrifying number of levels. If my kids went to D&D at a friend's house, and their grades started improving, then I'd jump for joy and encourage them. I've even had study groups turn into D&D games, and vice-versa. Far from cheating.
Even if not, child+activity = being more successful is not a reason for punishment. I'd be buying the next set of D&D books. Then have them run games at my house. Anything to encourage the raising of the grades.
-Sarena
Could she be making a connection of D&D + kid dressing all punk emo like = D&D bad?
Did you start dressing in this style before she knew you played D&D or vice versa?
I highly recommend having your friend's mother explain how non-evil D&D is. She's programed to protect you from all bad influences and can essentially only be reprogramed by a fellow Mom (or Dadbot).
Other than that, be a useful, productive child around the house. I was a lazy slob as a kid, making any activities I was currently engaged in seem like contributors to my slobbish nature. Instead, do chores without being asked, express interest in learning skills from your parents, and generally go out of your way to improve yourself. It will make you, and your current activities, seem less threatening to your mother.
Naturally, teenage years are about rebellion, but rebelling also makes it harder to get permission.
No, Bad Otter! Don't make me take away your hunting privileges. She doesn't need that, she needs someone to help her finance a clue.
-Sarena
That was the plan! My beverage concoction has a way of making the imbiber ... malleable. And it makes for a wicked good time, too. Mmmmmm ... flunetrazepam ...
Actally my grades have been improving i used to have a 3.0 now i havea 3.5, she couldnt be mad at that.
I get it now. You wanna play D&D now so you can get a 4.0. Lame.
No, i've just been working harder in school, besides i like RPG's, and dungeons and dragons is like that except for its imanginative :D I like the challenge of roleplaying.
Actally my grades have been improving i used to have a 3.0 now i havea 3.5, she couldnt be mad at that.
I prefer 3.5 myself. ZING! :P
MF: Stop dressing like an emo kid. That might help. All else fails go for the "crazy" plan I said earlier.
You need skills with addition, subtraction, multiplication and division to play D&D. Then there's all the social skills. If you can't talk and interact with people, you can't play D&D or fit into real society. There's reading and comprehension, memory, association skills.
Failing that, Ia! Cthulhu fghan! Ia!
I'm sure Cthulhu's much more accepting of D&D.
the power of Cthulul compels you
try pathfinder, you can honestly tell her it is not dnd
I've been thinking though: is it all RPGs she's having a problem with? or is it just D&D? Perhaps you could find an game that doesn't contain demons or devils or vampires or the like. I know there was one "faith-based" RPG at some point -- though I can't remember its name -- which might appeal to her fundamentalist beliefs. There are also other games you could try: Traveller, Star Wars, Faerie. By choosing such a game you'd be able to continue enjoying the creativity and roleplaying without worrying about offending your mother (you might even get her to play a game or two.)
If it's the gaming, there are other outlets for roleplay: sci-fi and fantasy novels, acting classes, renaissance faires, and others. Don't think that just because you're not playing D&D that you're not roleplaying.
Actally my grades have been improving i used to have a 3.0 now i havea 3.5, she couldnt be mad at that.
So, it's about time to swithc to 4e ;P
If your D&D friends are Christian, the D&D group at church could work. Of course assuming your local priests aren't too crazy themselves ;) but I think most priests are a laid-back folk.
Talk to your friends as well. I assume they're thirteen as well and may have very stupid ideas, but they should understand that parents are sometimes an immovable force.
One think, do not try to be overly defensive about this. That's gonna make things worse for the rest of your life.
Okay, that's just ridiculous on a horrifying number of levels. If my kids went to D&D at a friend's house, and their grades started improving, then I'd jump for joy and encourage them. I've even had study groups turn into D&D games, and vice-versa. Far from cheating.
Even if not, child+activity = being more successful is not a reason for punishment. I'd be buying the next set of D&D books. Then have them run games at my house. Anything to encourage the raising of the grades.
-Sarena
Indeed. If I ever were to spawn I'd have much the same position as you. I'd like to think any sane parent would. But you know what they say about Sanity and common sense. Neither is normal.
I can't remember the name of that particular game. If I remember right though wasn't it canceled a long time ago?
I don't think it was. I read something about it on Wikipedia a couple of weeks ago when Bayonetta came out in the UK. It might have been delayed, or they might be changing a few sections however.
Samyueru:
You seem awful hung up on the fact that the kid is dealing with his mother. And while I can empathize with that position, that's not a free-pass to whatever she wants to do. Mother's aren't perfect, they're not magical, they're just people that happen, by choice or accident, to be a mother. And like every other person on the planet, they can be unreasonable, stupid, biased, and so-on.
Giving her some kind of free-pass on being a ravening loon (if she is indeed one) isn't doing a favor to anyone.
She's not perfect, no one is, and simply being his mother is not a free pass to do whatever she wants - I agree, however, being rude to her and disrespecting her is not the way to get her to see his point of view.
Let's say he takes the civil approach, his mother reads the books, and comes to a reasonable conclusion that she doesn't want her son playing a game that rewards violance and murder (a bit of a stretch as far as D&D goes, but we'll run with it for the sake of example), then he has to respect that, at least as long as he lives in her house.
It's nothing to do with giving her a free pass to being a raving loon, or whatever else, it's about respect. If he respects her, she is more likely to be reasonable. Even if she still doesn't want him to play D&D, that's her choice, and he has to respect it as long as he lives in her house.
Something you didn't mention that I think might be salient... How have your grades been recently? Have they been slipping?
-Sarena
I've actually seen a parent ban D&D because their kid's grades were improving. The logic was their son wasn't smart enough to get better grades on his own so he must have been cheating off of the people in the "D&D sessions." (Having been in said sessions personally I can tell you that was not happening)
I'm currently taking University exams, and I can say that if D&D helped to improve my grades in any way whatsoever, I'd be right on track for a full 100% at the end of the year.
As it stands, apparently, I'm an idiot.
She's not perfect, no one is, and simply being his mother is not a free pass to do whatever she wants - I agree, however, being rude to her and disrespecting her is not the way to get her to see his point of view.
Let's say he takes the civil approach, his mother reads the books, and comes to a reasonable conclusion that she doesn't want her son playing a game that rewards violance and murder (a bit of a stretch as far as D&D goes, but we'll run with it for the sake of example), then he has to respect that, at least as long as he lives in her house.
It's nothing to do with giving her a free pass to being a raving loon, or whatever else, it's about respect. If he respects her, she is more likely to be reasonable. Even if she still doesn't want him to play D&D, that's her choice, and he has to respect it as long as he lives in her house.
Threads like this make me really glad that my parents and I operate on a level of mutual respect and understanding. Then again, I've actually earned their respect and they've earned mine, so that's why that's worked out for us... Anyways, the point I wanted to make is that, ideally, yeah, he should respect and understand his mother, but she should also respect and understand him. If one of them hasn't earned the respect of the other, then there are probably problems between them other than D&D, problem that are likely none of our business...
I was one of those mouthy, know-it-all teens. And my life suffered for it. My parents were and are fantastic. I was just too stupid/self-absorbed to know it. They always tell you that you don't know something until you experience it. And that's true. My fiancee has a son. I had no idea what my parents went through until he became a part of my life. There's so much you can't possibly understand until you're a parent. Until that day, do everyone a favor (especially yourself) and quit speculating on what kind of a relationship a kid should have with his parents. You have no idea. The reason? You're on the receiving end. Until you need to worry about feeding, clothing, sheltering and protecting the interests of someone else, you can't understand the relationship. Look at it this way, you've seen only one side. Without knowing both, you know nothing.
It's more than mutual respect when you're living in their home, though. If you provide nothing for yourself, you need to respect their rules. It's that simple. They spend an inordinate amount of their time and lives working to the benefit of yours. You simply cannot equal what they do for you. Today, many kids forget this. They've been taught to expect. That's a problem. Like it or not, you owe your parents everything. If she doesn't want you to play a game, who cares? It isn't going to harm you either way. Accept it and move on. If it's really important, make your case - you do deserve that much. No matter the answer, however, abide by the decision. There are often reasons beyond what the parent wants the child to understand. Not that D&D is one of those sorts of things, of course, and this in no way absolves those parents that are kinda nutty.
I was one of those mouthy, know-it-all teens. And my life suffered for it. My parents were and are fantastic. I was just too stupid/self-absorbed to know it. They always tell you that you don't know something until you experience it. And that's true. My fiancee has a son. I had no idea what my parents went through until he became a part of my life. There's so much you can't possibly understand until you're a parent. Until that day, do everyone a favor (especially yourself) and quit speculating on what kind of a relationship a kid should have with his parents. You have no idea. The reason? You're on the receiving end. Until you need to worry about feeding, clothing, sheltering and protecting the interests of someone else, you can't understand the relationship. Look at it this way, you've seen only one side. Without knowing both, you know nothing.
Well done, Z_B. Though I don't want to advise to give up a hobby, I won't recommend agitating your mother further. Until you leave the house, she is considered your superior authority as far as family rules go (even if she is irrational about the situation). Talk to her all you want or try getting others to convince too. If she refuses to budge on the subject, drop it. She's your caregiver and as long as you are depending on her to support you, you remain in her care.
This is not a life or limb threatening scenario so you should abide by this.
I can't remember the name of that particular game. If I remember right though wasn't it canceled a long time ago?
I don't think it was. I read something about it on Wikipedia a couple of weeks ago when Bayonetta came out in the UK. It might have been delayed, or they might be changing a few sections however.
"Six Days in Fallujah" or something like that?
It's more than mutual respect...
It's never more than mutual respect.
EDIT: There was more, but never mind, it's not worth it.
It's never more than mutual respect.
EDIT: There was more, but never mind, it's not worth it.
I take it you're not a parent? ;)
EDIT: In case it wasn't clear, I didn't say mutual respect wasn't a necessary component, only that there is more to the relationship.
It's never more than mutual respect.
According to the Oxford English Dictionary, mutual respect is defined as “a proper regard for the dignity of person or position.
I suppose you're correct. Provided the child shows proper regard to the position of "parent", and the parent shows proper regard to the position of "child"
But D&D isn't hurting your grades either right?
Nah, not at all. In fact, I stopped playing over Christmas to get some decent study in.
And yes, the game we were discussing is called "Six Days in Fallujah". According to Wikipedia (here), it's still slated for a 2010 release, although no date has been set as of yet.
EDIT: After skimming the article, it appears that the developers of the game went out of business, or are so close to it as to make it a moot point. So apparently the game is cancelled, as of August 2009, apparently. There's more info in the Wiki article if anyone is interested.
It's more than mutual respect when you're living in their home, though. If you provide nothing for yourself, you need to respect their rules.
Wrong. You need to abide by their rules, but respect is entirely optional.
Wrong. You need to abide by their rules, but respect is entirely optional.
I can live with that.
Nah, not at all. In fact, I stopped playing over Christmas to get some decent study in.
And yes, the game we were discussing is called "Six Days in Fallujah". According to Wikipedia (here), it's still slated for a 2010 release, although no date has been set as of yet.
EDIT: After skimming the article, it appears that the developers of the game went out of business, or are so close to it as to make it a moot point. So apparently the game is cancelled, as of August 2009, apparently. There's more info in the Wiki article if anyone is interested.
Better student than me then. Though D&D has never hurt mine either. If anything it helped it, because I felt motivated to pay more attention in class. (back in high school at least. I could play D&D and hang out with my friends provided I did well enough grade wise.) I never study over holidays. Something about holidays and lazyness just go together in my mind.
Yeah, I remember hearing something about that. I was hoping someone would pick up the title and the design team at least to finish the game. I don't think it's "too soon" to do a game based on the current conflict. And at the end of the day isn't War, well War?
Better student than me then. Though D&D has never hurt mine either. If anything it helped it, because I felt motivated to pay more attention in class. (back in high school at least. I could play D&D and hang out with my friends provided I did well enough grade wise.) I never study over holidays. Something about holidays and lazyness just go together in my mind.
Yeah, same. I had to force myself to sit down and work. Even had to leave the house a couple of times, because I knew I wouldn't work if I stayed in. Had to treck to the library and study. Still, worth it in the end.
Yeah, I remember hearing something about that. I was hoping someone would pick up the title and the design team at least to finish the game. I don't think it's "too soon" to do a game based on the current conflict. And at the end of the day isn't War, well War?
It seemed like an interesting concept, but I was prepared for it to be a horrible game for some reason. I'd like someone to pick it up if they think they can do fun things with it, because quite frankly, I'm sick of all the WWII games out there, and playing something more modern would definatly be up my alley. Which reminds me, I need to pick up Modern Warfare (still).
What do u have aganst emo kids, pigknight?....:P
Fair question to piggles, there. But I've got one of my own: What do emo kids have going for them?
Not much, hence the emo-ness.
Not much, hence the emo-ness.
Which begs the question: Why would anyone want to be emo?
2) We're not arguing yet, we're discussing. Sure, I was playin' a bit, but I find this emo thing interesting in its own way. It's like a goth-lite kind of thing. Girly clothes, bad music but kinda cool hair (sometimes). And it has the same problem goth did (does) in that, in an effort to 'be yourself', you end up being just like everyone else in the group. A resistance to conformity through conformity. So the conversation has potential to evolve, I guess. You're not against evolution, are you?
EDIT: I also was under the impression that emos were, like the goths, just a subset of the nerd group.
*point to Satan-free logo photoshopped onto the fake book cover*
If your mom is only against D&D and not other FRPGs (I have encountered quite a few people like this, they are ok with the fantasy and pretending and gaming, but the name D&D just freaks them out), then take some time on photoshop to make some nice looking book covers and spend a few bucks to get them printed out on good quality glossy paper. Cover your D&D books with them, and next time she asks if you're playing D&D you can say "No mom, I'm done with that. Heroquest RPG is sooo much more fun and the books say they are Satan-free."
*point to Satan-free logo photoshopped onto the fake book cover*
"100% Satan Free, only natural ingredients!"