Why do I do this?
For the lulz baby. For the lulz. Expect the break downs (of myself and the episodes I watch) in this thread.
Lets start with The Thaw. it's a four parter on youtube.
(so you can watch it with me if you like. And cry with me)
Not even two minutes into the episode and we already break Continuity. "This ship was built for combat harry, nobody expected us to be taking long trips" Paris to Harry after someone in the next quarters over complains about harry's playing.
Guess what? VOYAGER WAS A DEEP SPACE RESEARCH VESSEL DUR HUR HUR HUR. LONG TRIPS ARE PART OF THE JOB. THIS IS NOT THE DEFIANT! Yeah you can bet your ass it's going to get worse from here. This break in continuity and logic comes in at a whopping 37 seconds into the episode. Apparently Harry boy here is going to be making a program with some "hawt babe" that Mr. Paris here has been chasing for six months. How is any of this relevant to the Main Plot? Son didn't you know? This is Voyager. Nothing is relevant to the Main Plot!
Their conversation is cut short THANK YOU GOD by Chakotay (and you wonder why he's my favorite on this show) and we are sent to a nice little scene of the ship moving through space. I have to comment that the model quality (because IIRC Voyager was the last to use Models instead of pure CG) is extremely high and looks right. Even after all of these years, effects wise this show is still quite presentable so far.
They stumble upon a planet frozen over after a solar flare totally **** the planet, all the way around. Presumably Chaotic Evil I mean Janeway here is probably thinking SALVAGE TIME. We'll see.
Of course they discover stasis pods and decide to save these poor people. By Plugging into the Stasis Pods the natives are stuck in in the first place. Yeah that's right. Oh did I mention they have a ***** telepath on the crew?
And this is one of their better episodes. Okay easy enough just go home this is star trek they tramp across the galaxy all the time. Small problem. Apparently the QUADRANT is farking HUGE, because it will take them 70 years to get home. Never mind the fact that Starfleet space takes up almost the full alpha QUADRANT and routinely in TNG* and TOS they traipsed around end to end. (and voyager only takes place a few years after the TNG*) So it's a break in Continuity just from premise alone, but thats another tangent and we'll play ball with. I can live with Star Trek, who is infamous for not respecting it's own pseudo science to not respect it's own psuedoscience.
It's a good plot for a show really though. Or should be. With a multitude of new content they could put into the Trek Verse, being that whole big bad unexplored quadrant and all. But Voyager will as I will demonstrate endlessly rips off of TNG every chance it gets, particularly the multiple borg sagas.
*The Next Generation.
But anyway, the post is very good. I'm glad I stopped watching Voyager.
Are you preparing for a FATAL campaign based on actual Voyager episodes? Where can I sign up?
Okay easy enough just go home this is star trek they tramp across the galaxy all the time. Small problem. Apparently the QUADRANT is farking HUGE, because it will take them 70 years to get home. Never mind the fact that Starfleet space takes up almost the full alpha QUADRANT and routinely in TNG* and TOS they traipsed around end to end. (and voyager only takes place a few years after the TNG*) So it's a break in Continuity just from premise alone, but thats another tangent and we'll play ball with. I can live with Star Trek, who is infamous for not respecting it's own pseudo science to not respect it's own psuedoscience.
1. According to Kosinzki in "Where No One Has Gone Before", the Federation has only charted 11% of the Milky Way galaxy, while the Alpha Quadrant is, by definition, 25%, just like the Delta Quadrant (more than twice the total area explored in the three centuries since the Federation's conception). Also remember that there are other powers in the Alpha Quadrant, including the Cardassians and the Ferengi. Interestingly, because of how the quadrants are defined, the Klingons and Romulans are largely in the Beta Quadrant, but in Deep Space Nine are regarded as being part of a kind of Alpha Quadrant neighborhood.
Starships frequently travel across Federation space, though rarely across the entire length of Federation territory. Also bear in mind that the Federation is much smaller than their total explored space (11%). Voyager was knocked clear to the furthest edge of the galaxy, meaning they must travel about 70,000 lightyears to get home. The figures in the premise are sound, as much as I hate to defend Voyager. The galaxy is still a very big place in Star Trek.
2. Voyager begins the year after TNG ends, not a few years after.
3. I'm pretty certain that Intrepid-class starships are, indeed, battleships, but I'm not going to call you out on that one until I've had a chance to double-check my facts. It's certainly more heavily armed than your typical Starfleet vessel.
4. It's the Maquis rebellion, after the French resistance group of the same name.
Why would you want to subject yourself to a non-comedy, sci-fi version of Gilligan's Island?
I'm pretty sure the presence of a character like Neelix is indication that Voyager is not meant to be taken seriously.
Why would you want to subject yourself to a non-comedy, sci-fi version of Gilligan's Island?
I'm pretty sure the presence of a character like Gilligan is indication that Voyager is not meant to be taken seriously.
Fixed.
Yeah, Voyager blows. Micha, you're one crazy bastard. FATAL and then Voyager? You must be damaged, son. If not now, you damn sure will be.
The poor bastard read through (& played??) FATAL. There's no doubt he's been damaged & should be in therapy.
After FATAL though Voyager is likely therapuetic. It's certainly a (small) step up/back towards the light.....
He's weird and the visual style used in the backgrounds and in the characters would be much more fitting there. It's an earlier episode of Voyager (Kes is not only in it, but she's not in the Over 9000 hotness we see her later as). So they couldn't have been shooting for Farscape Ripoffage.
Instead this episode reminds me heavily of the Episode of TNG where the crew of the Enterprise find Evil Itself and have to confront it. The episode where Yar dies. The only difference of course is none of the main cast die in this episode. Harry and Tores are held hostage more or less by a being of ultimate evil (Just like Troi was) and they discover that it is simply afraid of dying and being Alone. (Just like how Evil was Depressed that he was the cast off remains of another race that became Light) Oh and the other difference of course is that episode of TNG is infact fitting to the style of Trek and this isn't.
The dialog is also much better in the Evil Itself episode of TNG. The acting quality is about the same but frankly there's no memorable lines. I remember that episode of TNG very vividly and it's one of my personal favorites.
They resolve it with no one in the Main Cast Dying, and it pretty much never comes up again, no major plot points are introduced. It's filler of the worst sort. It's a mediocre episode of Trekdom, (which for Voyager is a GOOD THING) but utterly forgettable. The only reason I watched it was because it was the first 4 parter that came up in my search for voyager episodes. If someone could point me out to a Wiki Episode Guide of some sort that'd be fantastic so we can do this more or less in "order".
Novacat: I'm 90 percent sure Voyager is a Science Vessel. That's why it has the Astrometrics Lab and a very advanced sensor suite. For it's time it's not more heavily armed than at a typical starfleet vessel (actually a Galaxy is more armed and has better shields. To say nothing of how well armed the Defiant is in comparison) Remember Defiant is also the First True Warship of starfleet. They actually state this in a couple of episodes that Voyager is a Research Vessel, and in STO she's a Science Vessel. (Actually in the tier of play I'm in right now too. But I'm rolling a Defiant
) Which STO does an excellent job of keeping true to where the ships are in terms of fluff.When you get to the episode where Paris begins to "evolve" into a giant salamander can you just sum it up with "this episode sucks" and move on? There is so much wrong about that episode it's really not worth going into any of it in detail.
Oh no Threshold needs to be picked apart end to end. Actually it's going to be most likely my most detailed summary.
Oh no Threshold needs to be picked apart end to end. Actually it's going to be most likely my most detailed summary.
Can you at least scream "EVOLUTION DOESN'T WORK THAT WAY!" while watching it? For me?
So there's a fairly good chance you won't get to just see it typed out on a screen followed by emotes and swears of my choice, but actually see my face as I watch the horror unfold and hear the rage in my voice.
But Novacat is right about the galaxy and quandrants. I want to say that basically most of Star Trek takes place in a small area near the border of the Alpha and Beta Quandrant. I want to say the Klingons are in the Beta Quandrant.
And Threshold is one of the few episodes that I vaguely remember. And yes, its one of the dumbest episodes I've ever seen...but I didn't watch lots of Voyager.
Why would you want to subject yourself to a non-comedy, sci-fi version of Gilligan's Island?
He will have all the glory of saying that he did it.
And he is a masochist. Obviously.
... I envy you, Micha.
I thought it was okay then again only ever caught a few episodes though normally I hate star treck due to the existince of the vulcans.
Yeah, I think in TNG, they say quite often how the Federation does not make warships anymore. I do think the Defiant was the first true warship in modern Star Trek.
NU-UNH! It's an Escort. The federation does not make 'battleships'. They make battleships and then call them by other names. Like 'escort' and 'deepspace exploration vehicle'. It is amazing how often 'deepspace exploration' means shooting stuff in startrek.
Voyager isn't heavily armed or armored enough to be considered a battleship in the Trek Verse.
The thing to remember is that at the end of the day Starfleet isn't supposed to Suck in ST. (Even though they are rather incompetent in everything but DS9 and Enterprise, militarily speaking) The reason Voyager seems like God's Battleship in the Delta Quadrant is because frankly most of the cultures not assimilated by the Borg are no where near on the level that the Klingons, Romulans, and Starfleet are.
But I have more problems with the power level of the Defiant. I don't have any specific examples, but it seems ALOT stronger than it should. It seems MUCH stronger than any other war vessel in the Alpha/Beta Quandrant.
Conceptually, I think it makes sense that the Voyager is stronger than most other technology it faces because anything strong would have been raped by the Borg for their tech, although I still think the power level in Voyager is off.
But I have more problems with the power level of the Defiant. I don't have any specific examples, but it seems ALOT stronger than it should. It seems MUCH stronger than any other war vessel in the Alpha/Beta Quandrant.
The defiant is litterally flying guns, crewed by Tactical Officers with a token amount of non tacticals onboard. It is armed with no less than 3 heavy phaser cannons upfront, and a torpedo launcher. a beam system in the rear and an aft torpedo.
It has a crew compliment of just 50, to stuff as many guns and as thick of armor as they could cram onto a tiny manuverable package.
The Defiant however wouldn't stand up too well in a sustained firefight. Most of it's engagements are it, unloading everything into the target's face, and then getting the heck out of dodge. That's what the Galaxy wound up being proved good for. And later the Sovereign. (Which would wipe the floor with the Defiant.)
the Jemhadar ships are nasty too however. But they are generally armed with weapons that do not pack as much punch as a heavy cannon will. They usually roll with Tetryon Beams (which are bloody murder on shields) and have a greater firing arc.
Basically the Jemhadar ships are made for longer engagements and to work in larger groups of their own type where as the Defiant is made to operate alone.
a beam system in the rear
Tee hee hee.
For TNG, I'd say the Enterprise was better than most warships. That was fine since it was the flagship and newest boy around. But it wasn't THAT much better.
Just from my impressions, I'd say the Enterprise would defeat a Romulan Warbird, but lose to two. It would probably do something similar to a Klingon Battlecruiser. The Enterprise is probably on par with 2 Klingon Birds of Prey, but the Birds of Prey are smaller anyway (3-4 should defeat it). So the Enterprise is the best, but not by a huge margin over the other top level ships.
It seems like on DS9, the Defiant has no problem engaging multiple warships of the other races. I really can't be specific because my memory of DS9 isn't as good as TNG, but that's my impression. Its possible that I'm just inaccurate, but I always got the impression that the Defiant was "too good".
The Romulans, Klingons and Cardassians weren't really doing as much to advance their ship technology at the time too. After the Dominion War though, they start really building up. (which is why we got the Scimitar in Nemesis)
The Defiant also frequently got its ass kicked. It was destroyed at least once, too. Every time the Defiant lost, it was facing superior odds - which it was built for - for a sustained period of time - which it was not built for. The Defiant's battles were also frequently fought in the company of other ships. It also had a unique and superior design that allowed the armor itself to take disruptor and torpedo shots after the shields failed. So it could take a real beating for a short time. It was meant as a hit and run vessel and wasn't always used that way because the enemy had so many warships.
Coincidentally that's pretty much how every Escort in STO plays
One on One I can mow down almost anything. Groups and bad things can happen very quickly. Even on normal difficulty.Though to get "defiant armor" you equip various consoles. I technically have one upped the Defiant with my baby. She's Tetryon, Disruptor, Phaser, Polaron resistant :-p