Assassin Concept

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

ConsumedReality

Dec 11, 2014 9:47:45		I am working on an Assassin concept, Shortbow, main weapon. Was looking at the pros and cons between
Rogue 18/ Fighter 2 for Elusive and Second Wind, Action Surge and Deat Strike
Rogue 17 / Fighter 3 for above and Improved Crit firm champion. But lose Elusive.
Or Rogue 15/ Fighter 5 to snag Extra Attack, but lose Death Strike and Elusive.
I want to do decent damage and keep my versatility outside of combat, that's why I have been looking at these 3 concepts, would the R 15/ F 5 be better for damage consistently vs R 18/ F 2 or would Death Strike be better overall?
#2

cowleymen

Dec 11, 2014 10:19:00

What is your party make up? and how likely are you to get to your upper levels (15-20)? The hardest part about multiclassing is deciding just when you should start taking levels of your extra levels.

#3

ConsumedReality

Dec 11, 2014 10:27:58 		The party makeup is in determined most likely a 3-4 person group, and this can get to high level it's a group of my friends. Was thinking go rogue for 3 levels then switch to war till I reach the appropriate level then go back to rogue from that point.
#4

Nachturnus

Dec 11, 2014 10:31:40

You want Extra Attack. There is almost no situation in the game where a weapon-user doesn't want Extra Attack (or it's equivalent.)

The improved accuracy gained from Extra Attack more than makes up for the lost Sneak Die (all two of them) and +2 accuracy from fighting style is too good to pass up, especially because it will let you leverage Sharpshooter. The improved crit chance goes hand-in-hand with the improved accuracy.  You will lose an ability score buff/feat with this method however, so plan your feats carefully. 

#5

ConsumedReality

Dec 11, 2014 10:42:42 		Ok I was thinking that the Extra Attack was better than Death Strike, but wasn't sure if Elusive was too good to lose at the same time.
#6

cowleymen

Dec 11, 2014 11:28:36

So do you have a planned progression rate? which class at which character level

#7

ConsumedReality

Dec 11, 2014 11:52:28 		I was thinking of going Rogue till level 3 then pick up warrior till level 5 (8 character level ) then start picking up rogue levels again till 15. If how the multiclass is stated in phb where each level up you determine which class gets it.
#8

Coredump00

Dec 11, 2014 23:53:04

I would consider going Ranger instead of FIghter.  Granted the Action Surge is nice for the times  you can actually use the Assassinate ability (with surprise and a high roll),  but Ranger gives you some spell casting (hunter's mark) and either an extra D8 per hit on a wounded target, or an extra attack on an adjacent target.  Will make you slightly less effective for the initial strike, but a better archer over all.

 

You could still dip the 2 levels for action surge if you really want it.

 

 

 

If decide to stick with fighter....  also consider going fighter 6 for the extra feat pick up.  You will *need* Alert, and I think you need sharpshooter also.  As well as getting to 20 Dex asap......

 

 

 

#9

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 6:46:28 		Not keen on the spellcasting for this character, the one perk for rp wise from Ranger was going ranger 2 for Favored Enemy, and Fighting style, but going Fighter 5 would net an extra attack every turn, wouldn't that be more beneficial? I can see going 6 levels Fighter being beneficial, but havingSlupper mind could be great situationally. Decisions.
#10

Nachturnus

Dec 12, 2014 7:11:58

Pay attention to your sneak die. Taking fighter for more than 5 levels can net you an ability bump, and a lvl 7 path feature (though champion's lvl 7 feature is crap) but ever two levels you're losing another sneak die.

#11

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 7:28:39 		Yeah I understand that, I wouldn't go 7 levels in Fighter I would go 6 tops, so I would lose out on three sneak attack dice. Still have a little before campaign starts, so I'm trying to figure out what would be the best way to realize my concept. This has all been very helpful.
(Reply to #8)

Yuukale_Narmo

Coredump00 wrote:
#13

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 7:48:15 		But my concept is to have a mundane Assassin who does not cast/rely on spells to get the job done. Only problem with that setup.
#14

Nachturnus

Dec 12, 2014 7:58:45

ConsumedReality wrote:
#15

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 10:25:32

So it would look something like this?
.
Wood Elf
2 Dex, 1 Wis
Perception
Elf Weapon Training
Mask of Nature
Fleet Foot
.
Criminal/Spy
2 skills Stealth, Deception
thieves tools, Gaming set
.
Fighter 1.
Str/Con Saves
Fighting Style: Archery +2 Attack Rolls
Second Wind
1d10+Con for Hp
2 Skills Acrobatics, Insight.
.
Rogue 3 (Char lvl 4)
1d8+Con for Hp
1 Skill Persuasion
Sneak Attack
Thieves Can't
Bonus Proficiency
Assassinate
.
Fighter to lvl 5 (Char Lvl 8)
Action Surge
Champion: Improved Crit
Ability Score/ Feat.
Extra Attack
.
Rogue 15 (Char Lvl 20)
To pick up everything else.

#16

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 9:00:41 		Sorry formatting is crap using phone.
(Reply to #9)

Coredump00

ConsumedReality wrote:
#18

guachi

Dec 12, 2014 13:01:20

Sharpshooter is bad combined with high sneak attack damage if you use the - hit/+ damage effect. The other parts are nice. Alert and Skulker are also nice. The downside is that these are, at lower levels, at the expense of plus to Dex and all the benefits that entails. At least being a Fighter means you can wear a breastplate for better AC (or equivalent AC) until your Dexterity is 20.

 

I was thinking of a melee Ranger/Rogue and the damage is crippled until you get that second attack, then it improves.

 

The downside of,say, doing what ConsumedReality says is that your first feat doesn't come until level 7. Fighter first grants Con save (good) but you lose out on 1 skill versus going Rogue first. It's probably worth it but it's worth noting.

 

Fighter 1 grants +2 to hit with a bow. That might be worth it and then stop. It's roughly a 15% or so damage boost. As you gain Rogue levels, an extra attack becomes less and less useful as your sneak attack damage begins to dwarf your weapon damage and you can only sneak attack once per turn. If you have a high enough hit chance, then needing the second attack to ensure a sneak attack is less and less important.

 

If you want, I can mock up some math for you to see the typical damage as you increase in level. Just give me your progession, target AC, and feat choices and I'll get back to you.

#19

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 14:04:09 		Yeah ranger puts me off being a spellcaster, if it was a subclass spell caster it would be fine, I could avoid that subclass, but it's built into the main class.
#20

ConsumedReality

Dec 12, 2014 14:08:40 		I would probably try to max Dex as soon as possible, then look at what feats are available, main stats are going to be Dex, Cha, and Wis. Dump Stat will probably be Str or Int. I know my DM puts an equal amount into RP as well as Combat. Forgot level 15 for a rogue is kind of a dead level with Slippery Mind.
(Reply to #18)

Coredump00

guachi wrote:
(Reply to #20)

Coredump00

ConsumedReality wrote:
#23

guachi

Dec 14, 2014 12:03:13

Coredump00 wrote:
(Reply to #23)

Coredump00

guachi wrote: