Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Sorxores Aug 17, 2014 5:22:23	I convince my girlfriend to try to play DnD with me at the store. I ask her what she want and she said she want an archer, she wan tto be able to go in a room and kill people before they can reach her to attack her.   So I want to help her build a super powerfull archer, because when Iplay the playtest with her, she had a not so good archer and she said she didn't like the game because she was not good enough and useless since she was doing no damage since she was alway missing, it was not really heroic..   So I was thinking of getting her the fighting style archery for a +2 bonus to ranged weapon, but from there I have no clue if it better to go rogue, and hide all the time as a bonus action to shoot a single arrow with advantage and sneak attack? or to go ranger hunter and gain some additional benefits, or go fighter champion and crit on a 18? We play in Adventurer league, so make the caracter legit please (point by system, average roll for HP ect...)   thanks
#2 Jay_Ibero_911 Aug 17, 2014 6:12:16	Variant Human for the Sharpshooter feat at level 1 so she can ignore cover and have the option to take a penalty to hit for massive extra damage. Battlemaster fighter for the precision attack maneuver for added accuracy when needed. Optional pushing attack manuever to keep enemies back. If she's ok with using a crossbow, Crossbow Expert feat at level 4 would let her keep shooting accurately even if enemies get in her face, and combined with the previously mentioned pushing attack maneuver she can knock them back off of her so she can get away safely.
#3 ShevarashG Aug 17, 2014 6:29:58	Sharpshooter feat Race - elf Class -  hunter ranger (with archery spells like cordon of arrows, lightnning arrow etc.)   optional battle master fighter eldritch knight fighter Skulker feat Crossbow expert
#4 Jay_Ibero_911 Aug 17, 2014 6:38:11	ShevarashG wrote:
#5 Kentus Aug 17, 2014 7:06:58	Depending how much experience your GF have. The best directly invested archers are imo Fighters (Champions), since you get without much trouble or thought all the stuff you need to be great. If your GF is a more-versed player, I'd consider the Battle Master, since it gives the character the chance to hinder the enemies at getting to you with trips, pushing, etc. For the race, human variant to get the Sharpshooter feat, like suggested earlier.   That's only as long we're talking about being an archer, who can kill as good as possible as early as possible.
#6 Grahmir Aug 17, 2014 8:29:25	Human Fighter Sharpshooter with archery style. Battlemaster gives you 4 dices that you can spend to gain advantage with Feinting Attack maneuer and use your feat (-5 attk +10 dmg) with no fear of miss. go for Crossbow Expert at lvl 4 or 6 and change your Longbow for Heavy Crossbow to increase damage from 1d8 to 1d10 and attack without disadvantage in melee range.
(Reply to #6) GladiusLegis	Grahmir wrote:
#8 Sorxores Aug 17, 2014 9:28:56	you all go for a human fighter?   I was thinking about 1 fighter (for the archery fighting style, then going rogue for sneak attack and a bonus action on every round to hide behind an other player (race would be halfling for this) to gain advantage, then when she get confortable with this set up then putting more fighter battle master for some maneuversor champion since with advantage she would have great chance to get crits and double the weapon and sneak attack damage. and yes for sure sharpshooter is a must have but I was thinking around level 12 (to get tp 20 Dex ASAP.
#9 Kentus Aug 17, 2014 9:35:27	It's always about, what your GF actually wants. If she's fine with the playstyle you suggested, it's a good one. If she wants just to shoot people, that'll be a hassle, since all this hiding and getting advantage, etc. takes a bit of patience, foreseeing and preperation, since your allies won't always stand in a way, you want to.
#10 Sorxores Aug 17, 2014 9:49:00	I'm playing the sorcerer and I'm a half elf, so I told here she can just hide behind me since I'll be medium size and I'll stay at range. So I'm procuring her a easy hiding spot. And unless the ennemy spend there action to see her, I beleive she simply need to beat there passive perception since if they are not actively looking for her, they might be too distracted by the barbarian smahing a greatsword in there face lol
#11 Myztek Aug 17, 2014 13:05:34	#1: Power does =/= fun.  A lot of players think they have to do a lot of damage and be the difference maker in every combat to have fun.  That is not true, and an entire group chasing that dragon ends up with a lot of frustrated people.    #2: There are a lot of builds that are above the effective threshold.  Players are going to have more fun playing the version that appeals to them thematically, generally, than the optimal damage build that doesn't seem fun.   #3: There are a lot of unknown factors right now.  We don't have a good feel for items, or variant rules in the DMG that people might widely embrace.  Further, DM style makes a huge difference - class balance changes when you get a long rest after every battle, a short rest after each battle, or if you have to go multiple battles before resting.... Plus, party composition will make a huge different.  Are you getting advantage from your allies?... bonus attacks?... clear shots without cover?   #4: You need to consider *when* you want the archer to be optimized.  The answer to the question of which PC has the most damage potential, using the materials we have right now, changes as you progress through the levels.  If you want the best level 1 archer, I'd go with the Human variant fighter with the archery option and sharpshooter feat (or resilient - if it gets you to an even number dexterity).  However, I think the other archery builds (ranger, rogue, etc...) bypass it in effectiveness eventually.    All that being said, I did a one shot for about 8 hours as a first level human variant fighter archer (pirate version of sailor).  We leveled to second at about the 5 hour mark and I was clearly effective and had a lot of fun.
#12 Sorxores Aug 17, 2014 13:23:08	Myztek wrote:
#13 Setzer_G Aug 17, 2014 16:35:41	After looking at it a little more now, it really looks like ranger is sort of a reskinned Sorcerer. The majority of it's damage seems to come from spells, rather than just fantastic archery. I know why, flavor wise, they did that. Speaking from someone who likes wizards, it's interesting, but if spellcasting isn't your thing, I don't know if ranger is either. Fighter would be a better fit if you want "just archery".
#14 Chaosmancer Aug 18, 2014 12:27:54	I would go human ranger with sharpshooter myself. Part of the reasoning is the cool stuff you can do later with spell arrows and shooting lots of targets.   For pure and simple accuracy though elf or halfling if you want big dex (I'd prefer human still because sharpshooter allows you to ignore cover penalties) and go with a battlemaster fighter so she can pick the precision attack manuever and add a +1d8 to her accuracy. That's probably what you should go to if the goal is to try and stop missing as much as it sounds like she was
#15 Biktor Aug 19, 2014 19:32:23	id like to know what made her original archer build so bad.   from what the OP has been saying it sounds that no matter how theoretically powerful a build their girlfriend might have - she would still become frustrated with the game if she misses with bad dice. what i would like to suggest is try looking at character builds that offer some good utility for the party so that even if she isnt damaging anything, she would still feel useful.   i dont have the PHB yet (in Aus - hopefully the store has them in today) but for the last 3 Encounters campaigns we had a player rocking the bard. he was by no means a direct damage dealer BUT he was great source of damage through his bardsong and the go-to guy for making reliable skill checks. on top of that he also served as our healer as the group didnt have a cleric and gave advantage to other players with war college training. eventually he took a level of rogue for more skill profs and sneak attack.   even if his attacks missed - his character was still pretty heroic.
#16 Sorxores Aug 19, 2014 20:13:56	I think the build I made her will work fine, and she seems to liek the idea. starting of with 1 level of rogue (to get the skill and stuff) then 1 level of fighter for fighting style archery. 2nd level in rogue. Now she is going to increase rogue to level 4 to get her specialisation and her first stat increase or sharpshooter feat, depending on own annoying cover will be.   then she will bring the fighter to level 4 for the next stat/feat. Probably going to go with champion to crit on a 19 (with advantage she shall crit 20% of the time, doubling the sneak attack damage as well, and if I read the assassin entry correctly, doubling the assassination double damage   and for the second feat, I was thinking of battle master to obtain some fighter maneuver, more specifically precision for those high AC monster, and Menacing to force the melee caracter too close to run away (most melee class have lowish wisdom save)
#17 CorwynnMaelstrom Aug 19, 2014 23:32:11	As a note, nothing in the Crossbow Master description REQUIRES a crossbow to benefit from eliminating disadvantage in melee range. As far as I can tell, you can take the feat and apply that particular aspect to a bow. (Though a heavy crossbow is mechanically better since the loading property is removed by the feat.)
#18 Yunru Aug 20, 2014 1:02:27	At level 1 Crossbow Master (Expert?) is far superior to Sharpshooter. Being able to attack again, with full modifiers, vs ignoring some cover? So yeah, Dual Wield Hand Crossbows, take Crossbow Expert and go Archery Style Fighter. According to the DPR Kings thread you should be killing just under 1 monster per round.
(Reply to #18) 1eejit	It partly depends on what type of archer she wants to be. Champion is simplest single-target, followed by Rogue. Then you get Battlemaster and Hunter Ranger. Hunter is also the king of AoE archery, by a huge margin with spells and Volley at 11.    Sharpshooter is excellent for all builds.   Yunru wrote:
#20 Sorxores Aug 20, 2014 4:32:09	considering that the plan is to use the bonus action to use cunning action and hide, shooting with 2 crossbow won't work. Since she'll be an haflinng, light crossbow is the biggest weapon she can use.
#21 Yunru Aug 20, 2014 5:57:11	Actually Hand Crossbows are light so she would be able to use them. But yeah, Crossbow Expert (and the dual-wielding of H.Xbows) losses it's luster if you've already got something to do with your Bonus Action.   That said, if you're using 1d6 or lower weapons, using Crossbow Expert to get another full damage attack as a bonus action will out-damage sneak attack.     1eejit wrote:
#22 mellored Aug 20, 2014 6:00:22	Fighters's are best all around damage, multi-attacks (including action surge) divided up however you want, but little utility.   Rangers are better "blasters" with lot's of AoE attacks, but weaker single target.  And they some extra utility as well.   Rogues can only do single target damage, but get more utility.  And are better at running away.     Humans loose alot of their steam at level 4, when other races can pick up a feat, and keep their other benifits as well. Halfilngs for instance, would get sharpshooter, rerolls, and hiding benifits.