Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Justin2166 Mar 04, 2015 17:15:06	I'm joining a campaign soon that is currently level 5.  The group has a fighter, barbarian, monk and warlock.  Myself and one other player are joining the group.  We both seem to think the group would probably benefit most from a couple casters.  She decided on a bard, but I'm still trying to figure out what to play.   We're rolling for stats, so I'm not sure what I have to work with yet.  I'd be pretty equally happy playing a wizard, cleric or druid. I'm thinking that a wizard would be really useful in battlefield control as well as having a lot of out of combat utility.   But a divine caster would probably be a no-brainer?  Druids and clerics both seem pretty fun too.   Do you think that a bard would be enough to keep a group like this going, or do we specifically need a divine spell caster?  What would you play?
#2 supreme_slayer Mar 04, 2015 17:23:17	You don't necessarily "need" anything in a group. Having some function of healing does stop dropping to 0 from being a crapshoot to death though, but you really only need one person with healing, or someone on potion duty for this. They say that the most effective healing is out of combat anywat, so... You should be fine, unless your DM is especially deadly.
#3 mellored Mar 04, 2015 17:49:11	i suggest artificer. a little healing, and Int skills that are otherwise missing.
#4 Coredump00 Mar 04, 2015 19:07:12	IIRC, Monk and Fighter both have some healing for themselves... and everyone can heal after a short rest. So you don't need a divine caster... but it can help.
#5 Justin2166 Mar 04, 2015 19:13:18	I was sort of thinking of taking the healer feat to help with out of combat healing, coupled with the bard's song of rest.  I'd try to focus mainly on taking enemies out of the fight with battlefield control, and if someone drops down to zero hitpoints, the bard could get them up with healing word.  Thats what I'm thinking about in theory, anyway.
#6 Tony_Vargas Mar 04, 2015 20:01:45	Justin2166 wrote:
#7 mellored Mar 04, 2015 20:32:42	the thing with a bard is to prevent damage before you need healed. disabling an enemy (or using insperation dice to cause attacks to miss), = healing. sure you can still do actual healing, but it's generally better to not get hit in the first place.
#8 Archon007 Mar 04, 2015 20:43:54	Do you NEED a divine caster... No, but it sure does help. It also depends on the game. If you are able to take a lot of short rests a bard could be enough. If there are not a lot of rests then a cleric would be important. If the DM gives out or lets you buy lots of healing potions then the bard could be fine, if potions are limited a coercive could be important. Talk to the DM.
#9 Byakugan01 Mar 04, 2015 21:24:20	You dont have to have a healer but they are very helpful.    The reality is stuff happens.   If the wizard gets rended by a troll or eats a dragon breath weapon, odds are he is bleeding out on the floor.  Healers keep whoever is getting hammered alive, which keeps the action economy flowing in the groups favor.    Wizards and sorcerers excel at trading spell slots for high impact spells making encounters much easier.     Clerics keep the squishies from dying due to 1 unlucky hit.   Or they keep the tank standing 1 more round in the face of a nasty monster that would be destroying anyone else.  Very handy.    And then there is Bless....so good.
#10 Ravix Mar 05, 2015 2:15:42	We have two life clerics in my group and neither of them have ever cast bless.  *sob*
#11 SterlingRat Mar 05, 2015 4:03:51	Caster = yes. Divine.... well, I don't know. The thing that group seems to lack is utility & disabling. You might want to look at the abjurer - he might not be able to heal, but he does have a rechargable pool of THP that he can pass out, and damage prevention is as good as healing. He will have the best counterspells and dispell magics around (level 10 feature) and the level 14 feature is amazing. You will be able to provide all the utility that comes only from a true spellbook-toting wizard while also protecting the group from enemy magics. And it sounds like they need someone with brains. Do any of them have positive Int bonuses?
#12 crimfan07 Mar 05, 2015 5:53:02	I'd say the main thing that a divine/support caster brings is the ability to heal, though there are some very nice buff spells, too. The light cleric is a pretty capable more as a caster. Play one if you'd like, of course. The bard should be able to do the healing and buffing well enough if set up right. The artificer wizard is a real lowball to me in terms of artificer feel and I hope they make a more dedicated class, but it would work and the abilty to manufacture healing potions would take care of that issue nicely.    I recently ran something with a rogue, a barbarian, and a paladin and it worked fine. They had to potion a bit more often and the feel definitely changed, but it worked.
(Reply to #11) crimfan07	SterlingRat wrote:
(Reply to #6) crimfan07	Tony_Vargas wrote:
#15 TopCheese Mar 05, 2015 11:24:25	I would totally go with Urchin Forest Gnome Wizard (Diviner) You can heal (train for herbalism kit, grab healer feat), you can pick locks, you can investigate, and to top it all off you are a full caster.
#16 Justin2166 Mar 06, 2015 12:44:00	Update: I talked to the DM and got a little more information about the campaign so far.  The group did have a healer of some sort, but he died and made a warlock.  The group also had a wizard, but it was his first time playing D&D, he died, and is now playing a barbarian.  I kind of like that the DM probably won't fudge rolls or pull punches.   Since the group doesn't have a healer, the DM said that he's been giving out healing potions in loot as well as having healers accessable in town.  He also said that the group has a lot of solid damage characters, but he'd really like if things were a bit more balanced with crowd control and out of combat utility rather than more damage.  I mentioned (if I didn't play a divine spellcaster) I was thinking of playing a wizard with the healer feat, and he said I might be able to take the feat at a discount or sorts.  So thats sort of really neat that I might not only get a great feat to support everyone else, but still get some sort of bonus for my character on top of that (no idea what he has in mind.  Maybe add a +1 Int like how some feats add to a stat too?)   Because of the out of combat utility and ritual spellcasting, I'm slightly leaning towards a wizard.  Illusionist might not be the most powerful in combat, but I think if I'm really creative it could be extremely useful.  I'm also looking at Abjurer to help keep the party up, or evoker so I could blast around the melee heavy party.  Since we have a bard, we'd have song or rest and she's looking at taking inspiring leader.  Couple that with abjurer warding and healer, we might do pretty well.   I'm also looking at both of the divine spellcasters.  Druid in 5e looks like a blast to play.  Cleric also looks great, and if I happen to roll pretty well so I can manage a high wisdom plus melee stats, I might go for a tempest or death cleric build.  I'd love the idea of having martial weapon profficiency and maybe even getting a warhorse and lance at some point.  Either way, I still have almost a week to sort things out.  I'm really excited, and everyone in this thread has been extremely helpful!!  Thank you so much!
#17 miburo99 Mar 06, 2015 14:37:54	Have people found a Life Cleric 1/Lore bard X to be a decent healer? In theory the extra bonus to healing from Life domain and maybe grabbing Goodberry or some other healing spell sounds pretty sweet, but in practice is it a good enough substitute for an actual cleric?