Howdy once again, good and hopefully kind sirs and madams.
I've been tinkering with ideas in my head, namely with my old rogue I've been playing for years from 3.5, to 4E, and now to 5E.
I'm playing as Xion, a wood elf rogue (level 8 now, started at 5) and I've tried out using a longbow, which is a fine weapon, though my classic Xion always threw daggers a lot.
PROS of throwing daggers...
-You're following the rules when it comes to Two-Weapon fighting. Both are light weapons and it does allow you to throw both of them. Granted, you can only add DEX to damage once (unless you nab Fighting Style from multiclassing). Though, Sneak Attack is your bread and butter when it comes to damage.
-If you don't want to multiclass for whatever reason, but really wish you had something like Extra Attack, this strategy works fine. Also, since you're attacking twice, you're doubling your chances of landing a Sneak Attack.
-The feats, Sharpshooter and Dual Wielder seem more applicable to you. Can throw your daggers farther or be more defensive and quick-draw out two daggers at a time!
-The damage is roughly the same. I'm not a mathematician like some of you folks, though for simplicities sake:
Two Daggers = 2d4 (8 max) (You get two rolls when making an attack. If you snuff one of the rolls, it's still 1d4 + Sneak Attack!)
Longbow = 1d8 (8 max) (One shot, one roll. Hope you don't miss!)
CONS of throwing daggers...
-It eats up your bonus action. This is the biggest drawback, especially if you like to use your Cunning Action often. Though, you don't ALWAYS have to use CA soooo....
-Daggers are more expensive than a quiver of arrows. Unless you find some magic dagger that returns when you throw it. Even then, you'll want two of those.
-Your turn ends with you being considered unarmed so feats such as Dual-Wielder and Defensive Duelist won't really be active until you draw a dagger again unless your DM is somewhat nice to you. Though, if you're throwing them, you're honestly trying to play the ranged game to begin with.
-Longbow has MUCH better range (if you're proficient with it). I still keep my longbow on me if I need it.
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I'm not sure if I'm really mucking up the class, but these were just some of the discoveries I have made from my experience. Could dual wielding, dagger-tossing rogues be a popular concept? Especially to those who want to keep the dagger as an iconic rogue weapon.
It works...
but from a char-op perspective, if crossbow expertise > dual wielder. Not just because it's cheaper.
jaappleton wrote:
As far as magic daggers are concerned, I rather liked Bracers of Infinite Blades (as they existed in 4e) for such purposes.
Your sneak attack damage dwarfs the damage of a dagger. There is no reason to throw two if you can be using your cunning action to set up advantage (Attacking twice without advantage is the same as attacking once with advantage when only considering applying sneak attack damage). Trying to make a character that utilizes both defensive duelist and ranged attacks is not going to be optimal. Even if you get to use it (Say your DM lets you draw another dagger as part of the throwing attack) it shouldn't matter - the whole point of attacking from range is to avoid the dangers of melee combat. Speaking as a rogue specifically you also only have one reaction, and Uncanny Dodge is more reliable than Defensive Duelist.
Not to mention you can just pick up Moderately Armored to gain +2 AC from a shield, and while unlikely maybe a small AC bump from a Chain Shirt or Breastplate, depending on what your DEX mod is
@slumgum, that's the thing, as much as I want to use Cunning Advantage to its full potential (such as hiding) our battles thus far have been quick, lasting only a few rounds so I haven't truly been optimizing it's use and have mainly just experimented with various modes of attacking. Nothing wrong with that, really.
I'm hoping that WotC will release a feat or something for people who want to employ the use of throwing weapons. Something like extra damage, accuracy, or even throwing an additional weapon as part of an attack similar to Extra Attack.
I can also see the Bracers of Infinite Blades being an attunement item with a scaling rarity value as it conjures +1 (rare), +2 (very rare), and +3 (legendary) daggers.
Really a dip in fighter, 1 or 2 levels is what you want.
Getting archery style is the best way to increase your ranged accuracy in one level. Second level, which you don't need, gives you action surge which is useful for breaking the action economy. And in all honesty the fighter class is so vague on what it actually is, it can work with any existing non-caster build.
TopCheese wrote:
cowleymen wrote:
I was thinking a level 1 dip in fighter would be fine. Stroke of Luck just doesn't appeal to me that much. Accuracy, on the other hand, yes. I'm assuming that I get this bonus, even with throwing a dagger (but not making a melee attack with it)
If you're gonna dip fighter, 3 levels for Battlemaster nets you some very rogue friendly maneuvers. Such as Feinting Attack (a bonus action to grant advantage, +1d8 damage) and Riposte (you get sneak attack +1d8 on their turn too!). Plus one more of several other option that you prefer. But those too, in particular, are especially great.
Plus you'll grab up that useful Action Surge at Fighter 2...
I'm playing a halfling Battlemaster 5 / Thief 5 right now and it's been awesome.
ChrisCarlson wrote:
ChrisCarlson wrote:
By RAW, Sharpshooter does not work with Thrown Melee Weapons; Sharpshooter only works with Ranged Weapons, not ranged attacks made with weapons. It sucks, and I hate it, too 
Mobile is a good feat for two weapon fighting Rogues, IMHO.
jaappleton wrote:
Undrhil wrote:
I did say it was RAW, and that it bothered me.
What really bothers me is the Dart (Finesse, Thrown). It does NOT have the ammunition property, so it can be used to make a melee attack without being treated as an Improvised Weapon; Either STR or DEX apply; It is a Ranged Weapon, so Archery Style and Sharpshooter apply - even on melee attacks.
By RAW...
Bumpo wrote:
jaappleton wrote:
Bumpo wrote:
jaappleton wrote:
tdaelin wrote:
Bumpo wrote:
tdaelin wrote: