Help me understand Warlocks (5e)

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

xirr2000

Sep 02, 2014 9:08:33

I have to say I'm having a little trouble getting the Warlock class.  It seems like it should be a caster class, but seems woefully limited in it's ability to cast spells.  I have not actually played the class yet so I will reserve final judgement until after some play testing, but it seems at first glance to be rather limiting.

 

I plan on making a Pact Blade warlock, with the hopes of making a Sith-like character.  Figured he can summon a glowing blade and at 9th level jump well so I thought it would be fun.  And say that my eldritch blast is purple lightning.  Cliche I know, but it makes me smile.

 

Anyhoo, being able to only cast 2 spells between short rests (up to lvl 9) seems very limiting for a caster class, no?  What is a warlock supposed to do after round 2?  I'd love to see builds or hear suggestions on how to properly use this class as my limited imagination is failing me here.  I don't see how a caster who even at 20th level can only cast 4 spells in a row is a very effective class.

 

Help me see the evil light here folks!

#2

1eejit

Sep 02, 2014 9:28:17

If you scroll down very slightly you'd see this thread: http://community.wizards.com/forum/player-help/threads/4133456

 

Which should answer all your questions.

#3

xirr2000

Sep 02, 2014 9:33:42

It does indeed, thank you.  Not sure how  I missed that when I searched.  

#4

Yunru

Sep 02, 2014 9:41:23

xirr2000 wrote:
#5

Mechatarrasque

Sep 02, 2014 9:42:01

The warlock gets a lot more use out of his/her cantrips than other classes, or more specifically, gets a lot more use out of the eldritch blast cantrip, which you can use several evocations to enhance.  That is the core of the warlock's offense.  Pretty much point and shoot.  

 

When you run out of spells and get tired of eldritch blasts, blade pacts can be pretty good melee types.  Based on past editions (and some threads on the current warlock), it seems likely that the fey blade pact warlock is good for hit and run dex weapon tactics and the infernal pact is good for front line strength weapon action.  The tome pact warlock is built to maximize utility rather than offense, since most of the time powered up eldritch blast is going to be the best cantrip damagewise.  The chain pact is kind of weird.  At low levels, the fighting familiar is nice, and they have some nice abilities against outsiders, which is nice at higher levels, but at midlevel......I figure this option exists for rolling new characters at higher level.

#6

Gruff_Ironfist

Sep 02, 2014 9:49:15

xirr2000 wrote:
#7

Ashrym

Sep 02, 2014 10:20:08

 

It's not just 2 slots. All casters rely on cantrips at lower levels and the short rest mechanic helps. The invocations give additional options and the class is pretty solid. A caster "even at level 20" casts 4 slots in a row plus 4 arcanum plus any invocations applicable plus any cantrips as useful or necessary. Then spends a minute to fill those 4 spell slots again. The fact that all the spells using those spell slots are at 5 the level provides potency over other casters using lower level slots. Warlocks can get at will spells earlier and some pretty good.

#8

NN1

Sep 02, 2014 10:36:23

All their spells are at level cap at the lower levels (or 5th level at higher levels with one each of the higher level spells), they recover spells with a short rest, they're eldritch-blast cantrip is possibly the best offensive cantrip in the game (1d10 FORCE damage, can be split to target multiple enemies or focus-fired and can be significantly upgraded with invocations), plus some interesting other powers.

 

I'm not saying that this necessarily beats other spell casting classes, but an eldritch-blast warlock that has fired all her spells will be far better off than the average mage that ran out of spells and the warlock can be back to full strength after an hour's rest.  A tapped out mage is pretty crippled until they have a good night's sleep while a warlock is still scary when they shoot a barrage of d10+cha mod missles with a hard to resist energy type (which may knock you back) while armored and can recover faster.  They also have some interesting scaling spells.  

 

I haven't played with 5e enough to figure out how powerful warlock is, but I wager some of its weirdness will end up more useful than it seems, especially when the party gets access to spells that can ensure a relatively safe short rest.  Of course, if your days have few encounters, then the warlocks won't shine.  It is a funky class.

#9

mellored

Sep 02, 2014 11:31:27

They are low on slots because they have better cantrips / invocations.

 

More at-will, and less daily.

#10

Polaris

Sep 02, 2014 11:37:29

mellored wrote:
#11

mellored

Sep 02, 2014 11:42:59

Polaris wrote:
(Reply to #11)

NN1

mellored wrote:
#13

Polaris

Sep 02, 2014 12:05:13

mellored wrote:
#14

Yunru

Sep 02, 2014 14:51:22

A Warlock can (potentially) go without getting a Long Rest all the way up until they access their "daily" powers without issue. Sure you don't refresh your Hit Dice, but that's the only negative I can think of.

(Reply to #11)

Ashrym

mellored wrote:
#16

Dyndrilliac

Sep 05, 2014 19:16:34

It largely depends on your DM. If your DM lets you take lots of long 8-hour rests, then Warlock is gimp city. If on the other hand your DM adheres to the resting rules and long rests are only available once or twice during a typical 2-hour game session, then the Warlock really shines because they regain spells on short rests and can be much more useful in individual encounters.

#17

wills2009

Sep 05, 2014 20:30:13
I think the inability to use higher level mystic Arcanum as slots for ranking up regular spells is a real problem for the class. That's one of the things I'm most excited about for casters and the Warlock can't take advantage of it at all. It doesn't help that the mystic Arcanum spells are a super limited list with only a couple good combat options that would be useful regularly.
#18

mellored

Sep 05, 2014 20:33:13

Ashrym wrote: