Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 4:53:03	So my group and I are about to take on an enemy camp located in the middle of a forest, big enough to accomondate 40 people in tents, and which possessess light fortifications, mainly some pointed sticks in its perimeter. Inside the camp the enemy numbers about 15 knights, equiped with plate's greatswords and shortbows, and about a dozen aracocras (flying creatures) equiped with bows and small swords. The knights are pretty tough, having lots of hp, a good AC, and 2 attacks, we fought 10 of them on our way there, and it was a challenging battle (worth mentioning they had the drop on us). I m pretty sure that the aracocras are modified to provide a similar challenge themselves. And of course there is their leader, who is just another knight, only stronger as I can imagine.    On the other hand, our group consists of a paladin (sword and board), a fighter (polearm master, sentinel), a ranger/rogue sharpshooter (amazing range and forest is his favourite terrain), a wizard (artificer) with area spells like slow and fireball, and an assassin (me), all of  us at level 6. We also have with us a cyclops (monster, cant remember its CR and dont have the MM handy atm, but he is quite strong) that we can most likely convince to help us in this fight (so assume he is part of the equation). Last but not least, we have the element of surprise, as the baddies in the camp think that we are dead.    What scares me, is that this fight is by no means important to progress the story, by which I mean, that it is up to us to decide if we will have it or not, it is absolutely not part of a linear storyline, and that scares me as I feel it might be a little over our heads. But there are several roleplaying reasons that prompt us to have it, and with a good plan I feel we can do it.    Any advice on how to approach this battle? Would really want to avoid a party's member's death, or worse, a TPK. The cyclops is of course expendable...       Some facts and thoughts that may be worth considering: 1) Once the aracocras take to the sky, only the archer and the wizard can damage them effectively (me in a lesser extent, and perhaps the cyclops who has reach 2 and is huge). Also, when airborne, the aracocras will have a chance to aim for the archer and the wizard who are the 2 main sources of damage our group has. 2) The element of surprise is important, especially to me, but we might have a problem approaching with stealth, considering that both the paladin and the fighter are tin cans, and the cyclops is huge and makes the ground tremble when he walks. I could always split up (maybe along with the archer who has levels in rogue) and try a simultaneous surprise attack, but splitting the party almost always results in bad things... 3) The paladin, the fighter and the cyclops could possibly block the camp's entrance, thus fighting only a percentage of the knights at a given time, and not all of them at the same time, though that would leave the most fragile members of the party that are sitting a bit behind vulnerable to an attack by the aracocras. 4) If I could manage sneaking in, I could probably one-shot the boss, as I opted for ridiculous damage on my surprise attacks. I am tempted to try it, although I really fear what will happen if I fail, as I would be cut off from the rest of the party. Should I dare it? 5) Another thought is to use the artilery (wizard and archer) to draw them out, so that the rest of us could potentialy surprise them in the woods. Do you think the positives outdo the negatives in this scenario? 6) Perhaps a mix and max of the above could work?     Cmon people, throw in some good ideas, collectively we can work out a masterplan!!!
#2 mellored Jul 01, 2015 5:28:48	Does the wizard have leomunds tiny hut? How about any illusions?  Invisibility? Arcane Lock (for the tents)? Tents and wooden palicades burn.   How close can you get to the entrance?   As an assassin, you should have a disguise kit. The fighter/paladin should have enemy armor from the previous knights.  How good is the paladins bluff check?
#3 Yunru Jul 01, 2015 5:14:37	Put the birds to sleep, watch them fall.
#4 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 5:24:13	Forgive this wall of text. A few ways to handle this. I suggest having the Cyclops take the long way around and flank the camp. Priority one is to take out the birds. I assume that when they're not on alert, they're on the ground. Wait til meal time or something to ensure they're on the ground. Have the character with the best sneak, possibly the Ranger with Pass Without Trace, pour oil on as much of the camp as he can. Anything flammable. As an Assassin, even if you're the melee type, have yourself, open with a ranged sneak attack while the Ranger and Wizard open up with AoE. I think the Ranger has a spell that restrains people at that level. Keep the birds from taking flight. After you open with AoE and your ranged sneak attack, the Wizards fireball should have set the camp ablaze. Anyone still in their tent should hopefully be a dead man. Paladin and Fighter focus their attacks on eliminating weak enemies to finish them off and take them out of the equation. The fireball should have been the signal for the Cyclops to charge in and handle the other side of the encampment, this drawing some attention away from your team. This should help give you and the Ranger some advantage for sneak attacks. You could argue it could give disadvantage on enemies trying to make saving throws to avoid more fireballs, though don't be surprised if your DM says no to that.
#5 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 5:27:57	Also, view your items. Got any bags of caltrops? Bags of ball bearings? While the Ranger is sneaking and pouring oil, he can also lay traps to close off entrances/exits of the camp to herd enemies certain directions.
#6 BoldItalic Jul 01, 2015 6:10:30	Employ some dwarves to tunnel underneath the camp then draw the knights down into the tunnels and fight them there. The aaracokras ability to fly will be negated and the knights won't be able to surround you in the tunnels. Fill the tunnels with traps if you like. Turn the tables - make your own dungeon with you as the defenders.
#7 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 6:22:07	mellored wrote:
#8 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 6:27:02	Yunru wrote:
#9 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 7:07:18	jaappleton wrote:
#10 mellored Jul 01, 2015 7:15:27	Corran21 wrote:
#11 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 7:18:43	BoldItalic wrote:
#12 mellored Jul 01, 2015 7:19:56	Corran21 wrote:
#13 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 7:37:51	There's only one entrance into the camp? This changes things drastically, depending on what your DM described. Please tell us all you can. Is there one entrance as in there are fortifications on the other sides? What are they made of? If wood, the Cyclops may be able to knock them down. If stone, perhaps not. Or is the camp surrounded on three sides by natural stone, as in its like a cul-de-sac? If that's the case, burn them all and they have to run past you to escape the flames. Give us more information, please!
#14 FrogReaver Jul 01, 2015 8:23:52	Does the Wizard have haste? Does the Wizard have fly?
#15 FrogReaver Jul 01, 2015 8:32:32	Please tell me that the Ranger has spike growth spell.  It's a level 2 ranger spell.   How many arrows does your archer have access to? ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I also think I need to know alot more about the camps fortifications.   Are there places on the walls for archers to stand? Is there any other entrance at all? How big is the encampment?  50ft x 50ft?  bigger?  smaller? Do the walls have arrow slits anywhere? How far away are the woods from the camp? Would it be difficult for the flyers to fly in the woods     What kind of weapons are the flyers equipped with?
#16 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 8:43:41	mellored wrote:
#17 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 9:22:15	jaappleton wrote:
#18 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 9:34:13	FrogReaver wrote:
#19 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 9:35:51	Even with the wooden stakes in the ground surrounding the perimeter, I don't see why a Cyclops can't bust through that like the Hulk to flank them. I agree with the casting Sleep on the bird men idea... They will fall. Hopefully on to those wooden stakes in the ground.
#20 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 9:46:54	Hey, this is a temporary fortification? So the stakes should just be stuck into the ground. No mortar or cement or anything, right? Why can't the Cyclops rip them out of the ground and throw them like spears at the enemies?
#21 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 10:15:56	FrogReaver wrote:
#22 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 10:17:42	jaappleton wrote:
#23 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 10:33:56	jaappleton wrote:
#24 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 10:40:26	Been thinking. Our wizard most likely has either haste or fly. Would any of those 2 be worth instead of another fireball?    If he has haste, the ranger competes with the cyclops for being the recipient, the cyclops obviouly because he can probably deal a lot of damage, though the ranger (who has dipped in rogue) is an excellent dps himself, and with ensnaring strike and haste on him, he will be able to take out the birdmen in no time.    If the wizard has fly instead, would the sight of a flying cyclops be worth the damage an extra fireball would deal?
#25 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 10:49:37	.....how large is the Cyclops? Is he the size of the encampment? Cast Fly on him and have him bellyflop onto the camp.
#26 Corran21 Jul 01, 2015 11:12:42	jaappleton wrote:
#27 jaappleton Jul 01, 2015 11:16:52	The rules are guidelines. At certain points, let your imagination fly and see what happens is what I say. But I have to tell you this: You won't have that Cyclops companion forever. At some point, he is going to part ways with your group. You might as well utilize him as much as possible while you have him.
#28 Danny_Montanny Jul 01, 2015 11:31:29	From your info it seems that you haven't done any recon yourself. You're relying on a cursory description from the DM and possible guesses in enemy strength. This is a bad idea, especially with a DM who is "evil". The last thing you want to do is plan a small unit battle without all of the variables, or at least as many you can get. That's when the wizards an priests pop out if the woodwork and wreck you. My suggestion is that you and the Ranger should go in at night to poke around the place, see what's to be seen and maybe do some throat slitting. Have your party ready to charge in if things go south. Most of the knights should be sleeping which means their plate armor isn't going to help them any. If assassination isn't at least a part of your plan, then what're you even there for?!
#29 draegn Jul 01, 2015 13:21:39	Cast slow on the birds. If slowed they may not be able to beat their wings fast enough to remain airborn and crash.
#30 BRJN Jul 01, 2015 16:05:42	- Does your Ranger have the 2nd-level "Minefield" spell?  Cast it and shoot 4 arrows into the middle of the camp - when somebody comes out of their tent to investigate, the arrows fly over and hit them. - If there is only 1 way in / out of the fortified camp, have your tanks go right up to the door and emulate "Horatius At The Gate" - fight the whole group three and only three at a time.  (It beats being surrounded by 12 at once.) - If the Paladin is Oath of Ancients, Moonbeam allows you to pester distant foes or fliers. - As an Assassin, you should be able to get in / out of tight spots.  Cunning Action can put Disengage on all your Movement, to reduce incidental attacks-on-the-fly. - Send the Cyclops off to the side to throw big rocks into the camp. - Invisibility yourself and go Stealth / Perception all around the camp.  You / we need to know more before we can craft a victorious plan. - Get that armor from your defeated enemies and use it - if nothing else, you can build a small shelter for the Wizard to hide inside.  - I would put the tanks in the captured armor and let the enemy try to figure out which friendly-uniformed guys really aren't - IRL this messes up enough troops in Afghanistan, for instance. - Plant Growth can be used to make a big area into "your speed = 1".  Drop that about 1/3 of the way deep into the camp. - Make a bunch of Javelins out of sharpened sticks.  Give the Fighter and Paladin a way to counter-attack distant foes
#31 Imaculata Jul 02, 2015 1:56:02	-The wizard turns himself invisible, or the rogue uses his stealth, sneaks into the camp, and poisons the food supplies -Set fire to the entire forest. Watch it and the camp burn from a distance. -Set fire to a distant part of the forest, thus luring part of the forces out of the fortress. Then surprise them and kill them outside their little fortification.