[Homebrew] The 5e Warblade - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Lawolf Oct 20, 2014 13:38:52	The 5e Warblade One of my favorite classes from 3e was the Warblade. It was the first time a completely martial warrior was able to perform truly heroic exploits on the battlefield, without needing to rely on the whimsy of the DM. It was also the first time a martial warrior was given interesting tactical choices to make on a round by round basis. I was hoping to see a mechanically interesting martial warrior in 5e, but was disappointed by the Battlemaster Fighter. If you are like me, and were similarly disappointed by the Battlemaster, take a look at the warblade. It is a dynamic martial warrior with a variety of maneuvers to choose from. The class is not supposed to be a replica of the 3e warblade, but rather a martial warrior that draws from the inpiration of Tome of Battle with mechanics more fitting for D&D 5e. Let me know your thoughts. Note: Damage comparison between Champion Fighter, Barbarian, and Warblade HERE
#2 Kiteless Oct 24, 2014 5:53:15	Definitely looks like a cool class, even if it is a bit lengthy, and it looks to be a perfect fit for a character I'm playing in a campaign right now., so I'd be happy to help guinea pig it for you. That said, there are a few kinks I'd like to point out: 1. For the level restrictions for learning new maneuvers, are they linked to your overall character level or your class level? 2. Discipline of the Tiger Claw's 20th level ability feels pretty underwhelming. Dipping 1 level into fighter and taking the two weapon fighting feat gives pretty much the same effect without wasting your combat focus, and you get the full effects of that much earlier on. 3. While some of the abilities fairly forgiveably borrow traits from other classes, "Awaken the Stone Dragon" is ripped straight from the Barbarian, and feels really uninspired. I'd imagine you could do something more interesting with that. 4. For Discipline of the Iron Will, I really don't like "Channel the Storm." Against some higher level encounters, it will be absolutely insane, as you'll be hitting every time with it, and other times, it'll be completely useless. Additionally, "Combat Rhythm" seems pretty abusive, or ambiguous at best. If it requires you to still have focus in order to use bonus/counter actions, even though it doesn't expend it, I suggest you emphasize that better. If it doesn't already do that, I suggest you change it to do so. 5. Once again with the level 20 abilities, "Perfect Clarity of Mind and Body" looks like it just gives too much. Otherwise, Diamond Mind looks pretty well thought out. The only thing I'd change would be to rename "Diamond Insight" to "Unarmoured Defense," simply for the sake of consistency with the rulebook. 6. I've noticed that there's no White Raven discipline. Is this intentional? 7. For your damage calculations, I'd strongly suggest you include the extra damage given from reactionary and bonus action sources (in the case of great weapon master, just use the chance from crit), since it might have a considerable impact on your numbers. I don't have time to go over the individual maneuvers right now, but I'll try to provide more feedback later. Looking really interesting so far though.
#3 cowleymen Oct 24, 2014 6:14:18	Reaping Talons When you make an attack with a light melee weapon that you’re holding in one hand, you can use a bonus action to attack with a different light melee weapon that you’re holding in the other hand
#4 Lawolf Oct 24, 2014 12:54:59	Kiteless wrote:
#5 Lawolf Oct 24, 2014 9:52:58	cowleymen wrote:
#6 Kiteless Oct 26, 2014 3:39:18	First, looking at some of the changes you've made, some of them look pretty good. Perfect Clarity of Mind and Body makes a lot more sense. For Awaken the Stone Dragon, resistance to damage from non-magical weapons is already insanely good, essentially a free Rage. You don't really need to keep the +4 strength bit. The ability already has enough overlap with Barbarian as it is, you don't need to outclass them entirely. Going over the maneuvers (I'll only note the ones that I find to be exceptionally good/well written, and the ones thatwould be in need of adjustment, any unmentioned ones can be assumed to be solid, albeit not specifically noteworthy from a design standpoint): Avalanche of Blades: Pretty cool ability, although combined with Channel the Storm and possibly the Nimble Blade weapon style, you can end up with a really good chance of getting all hits 95% of the time. That just feels kind of dirty. Hearing the Air: I'd suggest making this only effect creatures who are hidden/invisible through non-magical means. Mind Strike: Crazy good. On one hand, it's nice to see some anti-magic measures, on the other, you've got the possibility of locking down an enemy mage 50% of the time. Watch this one carefully. Rapid Counter: Being just a weaker version of the Fighter's Riposte, this one is pretty boring. Quicksilver Motion: Strictly a worse version of Bounding Assault. Freeing up the bonus action is nice, but Stance of Alacrity does that too, and offers a lot more mobility. In fact, when you consider the amount of abilities that the Warblade has that discourage or disable opportunity attacks against them, this does absolutely nothing meaningful.
#7 Kiteless Oct 26, 2014 4:20:10	Adamantine Hurricane: Not terrible, but I feel it's outclassed as an AoE by Earthstrike Quake. Strike of Perfect Clarity: Does this benefit from the +10 damage bonus from Great Weapon Mastery four times over, or just once? If it's the latter, this ability can become obscenely powerful. Supreme Blade Parry: Another one of those abilities that pales in comparison to what other classes can offer. It's not bad, and you can get it pretty early compared to some of the other similar abilities, but that doesn't really do enough to make it worth taking. Adamantine Bones: This one leans pretty far on the insanely powerful side. I'd suggest making it grant temporary HP equal to the damage dealt (even that might be pretty high, consider half the damage dealt) until the end of your next turn. Boulder Roll: This one's pretty interesting and characterful. Make sure to note that you cannot end your turn occupying the same space as another creature. Crushing Weight of the Mountain: It's nice to see something done with grappling, since it's typically really finicky and prays for DM benevolence, but restraining a foe for free feels like a bit much. Perhaps allow you to restrain a foe if you opt to grab with both arms, so that you may not grab two foes at once or wear a shield if you choose to do so. Iron Bones: As it is now, this maneuver overlaps with Awaken the Stone Dragon. It really has no reason for existing. Mountain Hammer: Similarly to Iron Bones, this one also overlaps with Battering Smash. Dancing Mongoose: Once again, overlap. This time with Bloodclaw Master. Fountain of Blood: This one's really cool. Prey on the Weak: Overlaps not only with Dancing Mongoose and Bloodclaw Master, but Great Weapon Mastery as well. This one is really uninspired. Rabid Bear Strike: Being just a weaker version of Reckless Offense, this one feels pretty bland. Raging Mongoose: Ditto. Soaring Raptor Strike: Another strictly worse version of Bounding Assault. Serves no purpose. Sudden Leap: Ditto. Wolf Fang Strike: Compared to the other shove based actions available to Fighter and Barbarian, this one has little going for it, and is completely outclassed by Shield Mastery. Battle Leader's Charge: Cool little ability, situational as it is. Bolstering Voice: Doesn't Paladin do this for free, but better? Carion Call: This one is quite nice, really interesting mechanic, but having to rely on your charisma modifier just kills it. Leading the Attack Same thing as Carion Call. Even if you'd had invested in charisma (which you very likely won't), this ability ends up getting completely outclassed by Exorcism of Steel. I'd suggest having it give an ally temporary hitpoints equal to half the damage done. Lion's Roar: No. Inspiration is a DM thing. Just no. Swarm Tactics: Giving up your reaction just to grant advantage on a single attack from an ally just doesn't really seem to be worth it, honestly. I'd say why not go the whole way and allow you to use your reaction to make an attack when an allied creature attacks, but that seems like a bit much for a stance. War Master's Charge: Similarly, having your opponents give up their reactions to make this ability work is asking a lot. Especially when you consider that not everyone in the party will be capable martial combatants. Compared to other Legendary Strikes, this one takes a lot but gives back comparatively little. I'd at the very least grant advantage on all of your ally's attacks. Overall, while some of the abilities are pretty cool, and most of the Legendary Strikes definitely offer something pretty cool, a lot of abilities also feel really rushed or uninspired, or even redundant to the point of wondering why they exist at all. Additionally, I feel that there's a poor balance of pre-level 3 strike maneuvers to everything else.
#8 Lawolf Oct 31, 2014 12:40:25	@Kiteless: thanks for the input. I have made a number of changes to help fix some of the problems you mentioned. I still have a few more ideas that I haven't yet implemented. A few points I want to address still though: 1. I don't mind if a level 17+ ability makes individual maneuvers obsolete. Most games don't make it to the "epic" tier and if a game does go from 1-20, the obsolete maneuvers will still be useful for the overwhelming majority of the time. That being said, I did try and reduce instances of maneuvers becoming obsolete at high levels. 2. I am also fine with certain maneuvers being worse versions of other class abilities (Rapid Counter, Bolstering Voice and Rabid Bear Strike in particular). This is because, in general, the warblade should not be better at imitating another class than the other class. 3. Inspiration. It is not strictly a DM mechanic. Players can give their inspiration to other players. Additionally, bardic inspiration exists which is very similar to regular inspiration. I see no reason why the inspiration mechanic cannot be expanded upon for use as a leadership ability. 4. Awaken the Stone Dragon. All of the warblade level 20 abilities come with a defensive and an offensive component. Awaken the Stone dragon needs the strength bonus in order for the warblades damage to "keep up". I'm not too worried about this ability making the warblade too similar to the barbarian for a number of reasons. Barbarian rage grants resistance to all weapon damage (not just non magical weapons), bonus weapon damage, advantage on Strength checks, and other useful features depending on subclass. Level 20 barbarians will have a lot more HP as well as having a higher AC. Simply, I feel that the Barbarian is unique enough that the Stone Dragon warblade does not step on its toes too much.
(Reply to #8) Kiteless	Lawolf wrote:
#10 Lawolf Nov 03, 2014 8:37:15	Kiteless wrote:
#11 Luciender Jun 16, 2015 22:09:10	This looks and sounds cool. I might wanna play it but in the google document, the third level feature for Discipline of the Iron Heart has nothing written for it.
#12 FactOfFiction Jun 16, 2015 23:17:47	Weapon Specialization is crazy good for a fighting style. Compare +2 to damage with +1 to attack, +1 to damage and 19-20 critical. Compare +3-5 damage to one attack per turn to +1 attack, +1 damage and 19-20 critical with all your attacks. Just +1 attack and +1 damage is already probably the best fighting style and you are giving it the whole champion lvl 3 feature for free. This is absolutely not balanced. The fact that the warblade uses the momentum mechanic makes it even more of an autopick. Battle Clarity is too strong with the rest of the warblade in mind. The warblade already has rogue-like defenses and fighter-like damage, he does not need paladin-like immunities on top of that. Advantage on those rolls will sit much better. Alternatively, you can go back to the roots of the class and make Battle Ardor, Battle Skill, Battle Clarity, and Battle Mastery give Intelligence bonus to initiative, athletics, acrobatics, charm/fear saves and number of reactions per round. You can give the Battle Cunning's Intelligence bonus to hit and damage to make high Intelligence warblade more attacktive option as well. Battle Mastery going from 1 to any is also too much in my oppinion. Consider limiting it to 2 instead or using the alternative suggestion above. Weapon Suppremacy needs to be clarified. What happens if you have a source of advantage and a source of disadvantage? Do you attack with advantage? Is canceling the advantage "and effect" of the disadvantage? Channel the Storm is missing text in the description. Ironheart Aura besides being stollen by the Paladin also makes little sense. I would personattly make it bonus to Constitution bonus to Constitution saves and Wisdom saves against fear. Charisma is more of a White Raven attribute anyway. Stormguard Warrior is too strong. I would make it "after missing a weapon attack, you gain advantage on your next weapon attack against the same enemy and you add you Constitution Modifier to the damage of that attack if successful". Strength of Stone I would make this give Increased carrying capacity and advantage on Strength saves and Strength checks instead. Awaken the Stone Dragon I would tone down this just a tiny bit and make it give resistance to slashing and piercing damage from nonmagical weapons in additiong to the Strength increase. Will read through the maneuvers latter and let you know my oppinion. As a whole I think that the class is interesting, but probably too strong.

Post/Author/DateTime

Post

Lawolf

Oct 20, 2014 13:38:52

One of my favorite classes from 3e was the Warblade. It was the first time a completely martial warrior was able to perform truly heroic exploits on the battlefield, without needing to rely on the whimsy of the DM. It was also the first time a martial warrior was given interesting tactical choices to make on a round by round basis. I was hoping to see a mechanically interesting martial warrior in 5e, but was disappointed by the Battlemaster Fighter.

If you are like me, and were similarly disappointed by the Battlemaster, take a look at the warblade. It is a dynamic martial warrior with a variety of maneuvers to choose from. The class is not supposed to be a replica of the 3e warblade, but rather a martial warrior that draws from the inpiration of Tome of Battle with mechanics more fitting for D&D 5e. Let me know your thoughts.

Note: Damage comparison between Champion Fighter, Barbarian, and Warblade HERE

Kiteless

Oct 24, 2014 5:53:15

Definitely looks like a cool class, even if it is a bit lengthy, and it looks to be a perfect fit for a character I'm playing in a campaign right now., so I'd be happy to help guinea pig it for you.

That said, there are a few kinks I'd like to point out:

1. For the level restrictions for learning new maneuvers, are they linked to your overall character level or your class level?

2. Discipline of the Tiger Claw's 20th level ability feels pretty underwhelming. Dipping 1 level into fighter and taking the two weapon fighting feat gives pretty much the same effect without wasting your combat focus, and you get the full effects of that much earlier on.

3. While some of the abilities fairly forgiveably borrow traits from other classes, "Awaken the Stone Dragon" is ripped straight from the Barbarian, and feels really uninspired. I'd imagine you could do something more interesting with that.

4. For Discipline of the Iron Will, I really don't like "Channel the Storm." Against some higher level encounters, it will be absolutely insane, as you'll be hitting every time with it, and other times, it'll be completely useless.

Additionally, "Combat Rhythm" seems pretty abusive, or ambiguous at best. If it requires you to still have focus in order to use bonus/counter actions, even though it doesn't expend it, I suggest you emphasize that better. If it doesn't already do that, I suggest you change it to do so.

5. Once again with the level 20 abilities, "Perfect Clarity of Mind and Body" looks like it just gives too much. Otherwise, Diamond Mind looks pretty well thought out. The only thing I'd change would be to rename "Diamond Insight" to "Unarmoured Defense," simply for the sake of consistency with the rulebook.

6. I've noticed that there's no White Raven discipline. Is this intentional?

7. For your damage calculations, I'd strongly suggest you include the extra damage given from reactionary and bonus action sources (in the case of great weapon master, just use the chance from crit), since it might have a considerable impact on your numbers.

I don't have time to go over the individual maneuvers right now, but I'll try to provide more feedback later. Looking really interesting so far though.

cowleymen

Oct 24, 2014 6:14:18

Reaping Talons
When you make an attack with a light melee weapon that you’re holding in one hand, you can use a bonus action to attack with a different light melee weapon that you’re holding in the other hand

Lawolf

Oct 24, 2014 12:54:59

Kiteless wrote:

Lawolf

Oct 24, 2014 9:52:58

cowleymen wrote:

Kiteless

Oct 26, 2014 3:39:18

First, looking at some of the changes you've made, some of them look pretty good.

Perfect Clarity of Mind and Body makes a lot more sense.

For Awaken the Stone Dragon, resistance to damage from non-magical weapons is already insanely good, essentially a free Rage. You don't really need to keep the +4 strength bit. The ability already has enough overlap with Barbarian as it is, you don't need to outclass them entirely.

Going over the maneuvers (I'll only note the ones that I find to be exceptionally good/well written, and the ones thatwould be in need of adjustment, any unmentioned ones can be assumed to be solid, albeit not specifically noteworthy from a design standpoint):

Avalanche of Blades:

Pretty cool ability, although combined with Channel the Storm and possibly the Nimble Blade weapon style, you can end up with a really good chance of getting all hits 95% of the time. That just feels kind of dirty.

Hearing the Air:

I'd suggest making this only effect creatures who are hidden/invisible through non-magical means.

Mind Strike:

Crazy good. On one hand, it's nice to see some anti-magic measures, on the other, you've got the possibility of locking down an enemy mage 50% of the time. Watch this one carefully.

Rapid Counter:

Being just a weaker version of the Fighter's Riposte, this one is pretty boring.

Quicksilver Motion:

Strictly a worse version of Bounding Assault. Freeing up the bonus action is nice, but Stance of Alacrity does that too, and offers a lot more mobility. In fact, when you consider the amount of abilities that the Warblade has that discourage or disable opportunity attacks against them, this does absolutely nothing meaningful.

Kiteless

Oct 26, 2014 4:20:10

Adamantine Hurricane:

Not terrible, but I feel it's outclassed as an AoE by Earthstrike Quake.

Strike of Perfect Clarity:

Does this benefit from the +10 damage bonus from Great Weapon Mastery four times over, or just once? If it's the latter, this ability can become obscenely powerful.

Supreme Blade Parry:

Another one of those abilities that pales in comparison to what other classes can offer. It's not bad, and you can get it pretty early compared to some of the other similar abilities, but that doesn't really do enough to make it worth taking.

Adamantine Bones:

This one leans pretty far on the insanely powerful side. I'd suggest making it grant temporary HP equal to the damage dealt (even that might be pretty high, consider half the damage dealt) until the end of your next turn.

Boulder Roll:

This one's pretty interesting and characterful. Make sure to note that you cannot end your turn occupying the same space as another creature.

Crushing Weight of the Mountain:

It's nice to see something done with grappling, since it's typically really finicky and prays for DM benevolence, but restraining a foe for free feels like a bit much. Perhaps allow you to restrain a foe if you opt to grab with both arms, so that you may not grab two foes at once or wear a shield if you choose to do so.

Iron Bones:

As it is now, this maneuver overlaps with Awaken the Stone Dragon. It really has no reason for existing.

Mountain Hammer:

Similarly to Iron Bones, this one also overlaps with Battering Smash.

Dancing Mongoose:

Once again, overlap. This time with Bloodclaw Master.

Fountain of Blood:

This one's really cool.

Prey on the Weak:

Overlaps not only with Dancing Mongoose and Bloodclaw Master, but Great Weapon Mastery as well. This one is really uninspired.

Rabid Bear Strike:

Being just a weaker version of Reckless Offense, this one feels pretty bland.

Raging Mongoose:

Ditto.

Soaring Raptor Strike:

Another strictly worse version of Bounding Assault. Serves no purpose.

Sudden Leap:

Ditto.

Wolf Fang Strike:

Compared to the other shove based actions available to Fighter and Barbarian, this one has little going for it, and is completely outclassed by Shield Mastery.

Battle Leader's Charge:

Cool little ability, situational as it is.

Bolstering Voice:

Doesn't Paladin do this for free, but better?

Carion Call:

This one is quite nice, really interesting mechanic, but having to rely on your charisma modifier just kills it.

Leading the Attack

Same thing as Carion Call. Even if you'd had invested in charisma (which you very likely won't), this ability ends up getting completely outclassed by Exorcism of Steel. I'd suggest having it give an ally temporary hitpoints equal to half the damage done.

Lion's Roar:

No. Inspiration is a DM thing. Just no.

Swarm Tactics:

Giving up your reaction just to grant advantage on a single attack from an ally just doesn't really seem to be worth it, honestly. I'd say why not go the whole way and allow you to use your reaction to make an attack when an allied creature attacks, but that seems like a bit much for a stance.

War Master's Charge:

Similarly, having your opponents give up their reactions to make this ability work is asking a lot. Especially when you consider that not everyone in the party will be capable martial combatants. Compared to other Legendary Strikes, this one takes a lot but gives back comparatively little. I'd at the very least grant advantage on all of your ally's attacks.

Overall, while some of the abilities are pretty cool, and most of the Legendary Strikes definitely offer something pretty cool, a lot of abilities also feel really rushed or uninspired, or even redundant to the point of wondering why they exist at all.

Additionally, I feel that there's a poor balance of pre-level 3 strike maneuvers to everything else.

Lawolf

Oct 31, 2014 12:40:25

@Kiteless: thanks for the input. I have made a number of changes to help fix some of the problems you mentioned. I still have a few more ideas that I haven't yet implemented.

A few points I want to address still though:

1. I don't mind if a level 17+ ability makes individual maneuvers obsolete. Most games don't make it to the "epic" tier and if a game does go from 1-20, the obsolete maneuvers will still be useful for the overwhelming majority of the time. That being said, I did try and reduce instances of maneuvers becoming obsolete at high levels.

2. I am also fine with certain maneuvers being worse versions of other class abilities (Rapid Counter, Bolstering Voice and Rabid Bear Strike in particular). This is because, in general, the warblade should not be better at imitating another class than the other class.

3. Inspiration. It is not strictly a DM mechanic. Players can give their inspiration to other players. Additionally, bardic inspiration exists which is very similar to regular inspiration. I see no reason why the inspiration mechanic cannot be expanded upon for use as a leadership ability.

4. Awaken the Stone Dragon. All of the warblade level 20 abilities come with a defensive and an offensive component. Awaken the Stone dragon needs the strength bonus in order for the warblades damage to "keep up". I'm not too worried about this ability making the warblade too similar to the barbarian for a number of reasons. Barbarian rage grants resistance to all weapon damage (not just non magical weapons), bonus weapon damage, advantage on Strength checks, and other useful features depending on subclass. Level 20 barbarians will have a lot more HP as well as having a higher AC. Simply, I feel that the Barbarian is unique enough that the Stone Dragon warblade does not step on its toes too much.

(Reply to #8)

Kiteless

Lawolf wrote:

#10

Lawolf

Nov 03, 2014 8:37:15

Kiteless wrote:

#11

Luciender

Jun 16, 2015 22:09:10

This looks and sounds cool. I might wanna play it but in the google document, the third level feature for Discipline of the Iron Heart has nothing written for it.

#12

FactOfFiction

Jun 16, 2015 23:17:47

Weapon Specialization is crazy good for a fighting style. Compare +2 to damage with +1 to attack, +1 to damage and 19-20 critical. Compare +3-5 damage to one attack per turn to +1 attack, +1 damage and 19-20 critical with all your attacks. Just +1 attack and +1 damage is already probably the best fighting style and you are giving it the whole champion lvl 3 feature for free. This is absolutely not balanced. The fact that the warblade uses the momentum mechanic makes it even more of an autopick.

Battle Clarity is too strong with the rest of the warblade in mind. The warblade already has rogue-like defenses and fighter-like damage, he does not need paladin-like immunities on top of that. Advantage on those rolls will sit much better. Alternatively, you can go back to the roots of the class and make Battle Ardor, Battle Skill, Battle Clarity, and Battle Mastery give Intelligence bonus to initiative, athletics, acrobatics, charm/fear saves and number of reactions per round. You can give the Battle Cunning's Intelligence bonus to hit and damage to make high Intelligence warblade more attacktive option as well.

Battle Mastery going from 1 to any is also too much in my oppinion. Consider limiting it to 2 instead or using the alternative suggestion above.

Weapon Suppremacy needs to be clarified. What happens if you have a source of advantage and a source of disadvantage? Do you attack with advantage? Is canceling the advantage "and effect" of the disadvantage?

Channel the Storm is missing text in the description.

Ironheart Aura besides being stollen by the Paladin also makes little sense. I would personattly make it bonus to Constitution bonus to Constitution saves and Wisdom saves against fear. Charisma is more of a White Raven attribute anyway.

Stormguard Warrior is too strong. I would make it "after missing a weapon attack, you gain advantage on your next weapon attack against the same enemy and you add you Constitution Modifier to the damage of that attack if successful".

Strength of Stone I would make this give Increased carrying capacity and advantage on Strength saves and Strength checks instead.

Awaken the Stone Dragon I would tone down this just a tiny bit and make it give resistance to slashing and piercing damage from nonmagical weapons in additiong to the Strength increase.

Will read through the maneuvers latter and let you know my oppinion. As a whole I think that the class is interesting, but probably too strong.