Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 FrogReaver Jun 10, 2015 10:53:16	Assuming a party of 4.   4x Abjuration Wizard 6 / Warlock 2   Primary Combo:  Every PC cast Armor of Agathys with a level 3 spell slot.  Make sure to take mage armor invocation.  Repeatedly cast it between combats to keep your arcane wards full.  Each Arcane Ward will Absorb 16 hp worth of damage.   In the worst case scenario where a single wizard gets focus fired that's 64 hp worth of wards that need gotten through in every battle before that wizard actually starts to get hurt.  Every melee hit taken deals 15 damage back until that 64 ward hp and 15 temp hp are gone.   You can also take the great old one patron for telepathic communication.  Very useful for a party to have that.     Not to mention the groups ability to counterspell any any mages.   Overall you are great against melee enemies.  Great against spell casters.  Groups of all ranged enemies are a problem but they are usually a problem for all groups of adventurers.     ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------ Anyone have any other ideas?
#2 Nevvur Jun 10, 2015 11:24:30	Worst case scenario isn't one wizard getting focus-fire, that's the best case.    The party is weak against an area effect that hits all of them (let's go dragon breath for no counterspell). Bypasses the backlash from Armor of Agathys, and burns through the Abjurer ward pretty quick. Still, it's a tough party for most situations, but it doesn't sound very fun.
(Reply to #2) FrogReaver	Nevvur wrote:
(Reply to #2) FrogReaver	Nevvur wrote:
#5 mellored Jun 10, 2015 11:40:00	A party of 3 moon druids / 1 cleric would do better at that level, IMO.
(Reply to #5) FrogReaver	mellored wrote:
(Reply to #5) FrogReaver	mellored wrote:
#8 steelwulf99 Jun 10, 2015 11:47:49	So theoretically speaking a DM sets up a game for their players to have fun, they all netbuild the simple combo above , trivializing combat encounters and removing tension from a large part of the game... and then what? Do they win D&D? I suppose a supermodel in a stealth helicopter lands in the back yard to recruit the players into a shadowy government agency which rolls for 20s in high stakes games to decide the fate of the free world.
(Reply to #8) FrogReaver	steelwulf99 wrote:
#10 Coredump00 Jun 10, 2015 12:01:51	FrogReaver wrote:
#11 intently Jun 10, 2015 13:22:31	Argument could be made that arcane wards don't "stack", because nothing "stacks" in 5e. Lots of stuff would be broken if you could stack it.   Otherwise, why not group of Paladin 7 for stacked Auras of Protection/Warding, Crusader's Mantle, Aura of Vitality, etc.
(Reply to #4) Nevvur	FrogReaver wrote:
#13 BRJN Jun 13, 2015 17:16:20	FrogReaver wrote:
(Reply to #13) FrogReaver	BRJN wrote:
#15 Xanchairothoss Jun 13, 2015 21:51:02	All of them Deep Gnomes Class Build: Abjuration 1-4 Skip Warlock, take Fighter for levels 5 and 6 to get *Action Surge [+ Second Wind and Fighting Style: Defense], then dual cast in Medium Armor with full Martial Weapons (not that you need them); I assume you're not bumping Strength for Heavy armor, anyhow, and will likely multi via Dex. Dipping Warlock becomes redundant (and not as optimal) by level 4, and the Cha 13 is a stat suck unless you begin in Warlock with a low Cha and eat a lot of poo for two levels until you take Wizard. Abjurer: 7-20 Key Feature: 4th level ASI: Svirfneblin Magic (Nondetection at Will renders Armor of Agathys moot and underpowered).   *Let's you take an extra action to cast Nondetection when your shield is low on HP.
#16 Xanchairothoss Jun 13, 2015 22:08:58	Extra Cheese Background: Sailor[Pirate] (for Perception and Athletics) Feature: Bad Reputation (never pay for food or shelter again)   ...a group of diminutive, subteranean, wizard-pirates. I don't know WHY they'd decide to take to the seas, let alone become pirates, but I don't think that's the point of this thread. The only argument to go Fighter level 1 & 2 is to get Prof in Con saves, but you offset your Svirfneblin Magic by two more levels. Still, this is a strong approach, but you get less mileage as you don't use heavy armor. You do get Athletics and Perception for skill options at first level (if you want them). To make up for it, take the Sage background to get Arcana. I actually built this character as a pre-gen (though I went Strength route), along with a Minotaur Cleric of Life.   Character 1 Race: Deep Gnome Alignment: Lawful Neutral Languages: Common, Draconic, Dwarvish, Gnomish, Undercommon Background: Sage (wizard’s apprentice) Feature: Researcher Class: Fighter 1, 2, Wizard (Abjuration) 3-20 Spellcasting Focus: Component Pouch Fighting Style: Defense Proficiencies: Strength, Constitution Tools: None Skills: Arcana, Athletics, History, Perception Weapons & Armor: All armor, shields, simple weapons, martial weapons; Plate, shield, war pick Abilities: Str 15 (9), Dex 12 (3), Con 12 (4), Int 17 (9), Wis 10 (2), Cha 8 ASI: Svirfneblin Magic 6th, Warcaster 10th, Observant +1 Int 14th, Int +2 18th   Character 2 Race: Minotaur Alignment: Lawful Neutral Languages: Common, Giant, Primordial Background: Acolyte (*former slave who won his freedom by volunteering for, and surviving, the fighting pits; joined the church thereafter) Feature: Shelter of the Faithful Class: Barbarian 1, 2, Cleric (Life) 3-20: Painbearer of Ayuruk (Illmater), the Blood/Crying God, from the Church of Shared Suffering http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Cult_of_Shared_Suffering http://forgottenrealms.wikia.com/wiki/Ilmater Spellcasting Focus: Bloody open palm (cuts his hands on his horns) Proficiencies: Strength, Constitution Tools: Navigator’s tools, vehicles (water) Skills: *Athletics, Intimidation, Perception, Religion Weapons & Armor: Light armor, medium armor, shields, simple weapons, martial weapons, Lvl 3: Heavy armor; Plate, horns, whip, and a large-size Maul (p. 278 DMG “Double the weapon dice if the creature is Large […] A creature has disadvantage on attack rolls with a weapon that is sized for a larger attacker.”: Reckless Attack negates Disadvantage on that attack.) Abilities: Str 16 (9), Dex 10 (2), Con 14 (7), Int 8, Wis 16 (9), Cha 8 ASI: Lucky 6th, Warcaster 10th, Wis +2 14th, Str +2 18th Notes: Heals by cutting himself with his horns and drenching a target in his blood. Regains spells by self-flagellation with his whip. Employs a creatively masochistic means for spellcasting, such as crushing his own hand to cast an earthquake type spell, or breaking his fingers. The virtue of the magic auto-heals any self-wounding.
#17 Treantmonklvl20 Jun 14, 2015 6:48:46	BRJN wrote:
#18 Jared711 Jun 15, 2015 10:07:10	Your best party of four is a balanced group.  The game is not all about combat and how much damage you can absorb (unless that is your game).  Besides wizards are going to have a low armor class unless you get heavy armor shield somehow.   They are not as effective vs. a legendary creature.   I would rather have something like:   Paladin  (charisma and buffs) Wizard   (Int) Cleric or Druid   (wisdom and healing) Any (Rogue/Bard/etc).  (skills or any)   That way you can accomplish a wide variety of skill checks and have different skills and talents to handle different situations such as healing after battle.
(Reply to #18) Xanchairothoss	Jared711 wrote:
#20 Jared711 Jun 15, 2015 11:22:15	Xanchairothoss wrote:
#21 Xanchairothoss Jun 15, 2015 11:35:26	Jared711 wrote:
#22 Jared711 Jun 15, 2015 13:27:43	Xanchairothoss wrote:
#23 Xanchairothoss Jun 15, 2015 15:47:41	Jared711 wrote:
#24 Nevvur Jun 15, 2015 20:54:46	Everything is situational. Any party is only as powerful as the DM allows them to be.    64 Arcane Ward buffer is nice, I guess... A group of four level 6 moon druids going giant constrictor snake has a 480 HP pool on short rests and can restrain 4 targets. Have fun with that one.
#25 Xanchairothoss Jun 15, 2015 23:27:25	Nevvur wrote:
(Reply to #24) FrogReaver	Nevvur wrote:
#27 Nevvur Jun 16, 2015 1:20:50	Druids by their nature (hur hur) are pretty versatile. Just because they can wildshape into a huge stack of meatpoints doesn't mean they have to, if the situation calls for it.  They've still got a full arsenal of healing, crowd control and damaging magic in humanoid form.
(Reply to #27) Xanchairothoss	Nevvur wrote:
#29 Xanchairothoss Jun 16, 2015 12:50:14	Nevvur wrote:
#30 BRJN Jun 16, 2015 14:49:32	Jared711 wrote: