Hello all...would like some guidance. I have a great set of scores and would like to try a fighter warlock 3/17. I want to go blade pact. I prefer the spells of "the fiend". But for role playing I am likely going with fey pact.
how much staying power would a warlock have? I was initially excited about them but after reading the guide in these forums, am concerned that they will generally blast with eldritch blast and that's about it. What are their best AOE spells?
As an aside, I am playing a half-Orc fighter who has a very high str and good con and Chr. Want to go two weapon with fighter and use the dual wielding feat. Eventually will add the 2 and 3 level fighter after 5th level warlock...I like a higher chance of crit as it matches my idea of a big swinging fighter with two non-light weapons...in my case it will be two war hammers after the feat is earned...
Thus:
a. Does the warlock have much variety in play?
b. Would they be fun as primary melee characters with some fighter levels?
C. Since I like the "fiend" but don't want to "be evil" is there any situation (non-cheese!) in which a basically good hero would continue to work with the fiend?
Lastly, I normally just read everything I can and don't ask for advice, but want to start 5e strong with a character I can enjoy over many levels. Thanks!
A: They have more variety then fighters. But not as much as other casters.
B: Fun is relative. But a fighter 1 for armor, 2 for action surge, and 3 for battlemaster dice all combine nicely with bladelocks. Fighter 5 does not.
C: You don't have to be evil to make a pact with a fiend. You could use their power against them. Or perhaps your parents did it for you.
warpiglet wrote:
I appreciate the food for thought...this is going to be a tough decision! I am squarely in the middle of min/max and
role player meaning I like effective (does not have to be te best!) characters who I like to role play and who add to the group'a fun...thus I have to consider my options carefully. Your suggestions are a great start...
warpiglet wrote:
I built one of these types too, and what I found is that I couldn't rationalize the blade pact. The concept is cool, but I found the weapon felt underwhelming compared to Eldritch Blast, mostly because it scales without class levels, so you don't get penalized as much for multiclassing.
In addition, you can use the booklock feature to get light versions of the other two pacts: shillelagh gives you a legitimate one-handed weapon attack that uses your spellcasting stat, and you can use one of your evocations to grab access to all ritual spells including find familiar.
The more I looked into class abilities, the more the flexibility of the booklock build outshone the other two.
Gnarl: I am into refluffing as well...maybe I found a way to tap the fiend power which angers the fiend. The DM could send some fiendish thugs to "discourage" my theft from time to time! Since I am thinking CG alignment and a devil to steal from, it could work!
RCanine: I have been so into blade that maybe the book needs another look...I am sort of wedded to combat though...again, something new to consider!
mellored wrote:
IxidorRS wrote:
I believe u can get 2 attacks with an eldritch invocation by 5th level warlock and u would still get the level 4 feat. I was looking at it...since this is the case and warlock d8 being close to a 10...same proficiency bonus...only improved crit an extra attacks make higher levels o fighter matter if you take 1-2 levels to start. I am doing 1 fighter, maybe 2 and then five warlock. Will eventually slip in the third level of fighter champion since I plan to use two weapons with a half Orc...this idea really was an evolution...first looked at the oath of ancients paladin and then thought oath of ancients and fey pact warlock would be a fun role play experience...then ah screw it just fighter warlock with similar fluff.
warpiglet wrote:
If your DM is amenable to the idea, perhaps your character does not realize he is making a pact with a fiend. Perhaps the fiend masquerades as a celestial!
Fiends have many many enemies.
... and almost all of the are other fiends.
And watching a mortal use your gifted power to smite down your competitors with self-righteous fury whilst knowing that his soul is damned to you is gloriously ironic.
Mortals – they're the best wind up toy!
… Oh wait... you wanted the other prospective!
Yeah, I'm a big fan of the “Only the weapons of the enemy are powerful enough to defeat the enemy” trope.
And given the standard D&D world, it makes a lot of sense to ask where the power of the good deities and similar are.
IxidorRS wrote:
1eejit wrote:
Polaris wrote:
Yunru wrote:
Yunru wrote:
Warlocks are quite fun to play, Hex is really useful as you can maintain concentration whilst fighting, using spells which do not require concentration. At later levels it can be maintained longer. You do not need a bag of rats either, once your victim has died, as a bonus action you can hex another. That bonus action could be 30 minutes later, in your next encounter.
Booklocks give the most bang for your buck and become the masters of ritual, to the envy of Wizards for the cost of an invocation.
Chainlocks have access to cool familiars and technically your familiar can be summoned as an imp, perform the ritual later on and your familiar is now a Pseudodragon, the next day you do the ritual again and it's a fish. Also an Invocation which can hold monster at will without expending spell slots 15th level character.
Bladelock is nice with 2 invocations, probably not a good idea to boost Eldritch Blast with Agonising or Repelling invocations, unless you wanted.
3 Levels of Fighter
1-,Fighting Style, Second Wind
2- Action Surge
3- Martial Archetype
Champion- Improved Critical
Battle Master- Combat Superiority has 3 maneuvers, 4 Superiority dice,
Student of War- plus a proficiency with an Artisans Tool Set
Eldritch Knight- 2 Cantrips, Two 1st level spell slots, 3 Wizard Spells (Intelligence)
Weapon Bond
Battle Master probably has better synergy with Warlock, although a couple of 1st level spell slots are useful to a Warlock, but Intelligence is not really required.
Regarding Patrons, a GOO could be good or not interested in good and evil. An Arch Fey could be the most evil force out there. A Fiend need not be evil, they could be really misunderstood. A fiend could be using proxies, actually be a Celestial or GOO or Arch Fey who has those powers. Rename for flavour maybe?
The Arch Fey Derrinea is the Queen of Fire and Chance, she has made deals with various entities and came out on top. Derrinea is Chaotic Good and has a fondness for those who take risks or gamble. She does not care wether those she pacts with are good, neutral or evil. If she deals with you, it's your lucky day...maybe?
Blessings of the Fire Lady- We'll done for killing that enemy, have a life force boost from Mother Nature. Derrinea is pleased with you and this was a boon she granted when you took a chance and made a pact with her.
Bright Ones Luck- again as Dark Ones Own Luck.
Derrinea's Protection- Fiendish Resilience
Hurl through Hell- transports a creature through a realm of horror which they create in a sub plane of the Faerie. It's their version of Hell, yet really it's pure chance that they are doomed by this.
Warlock
Warlock Patrons provide access to more spells, which are added to the limited list that they may choose. They enhance your characters choice
So a level 1 Warlock knows 2 Cantrips and 2 spells.
Fiend Pact: could take
Burning Hands & Command
or Hellish Rebuke & Hex
or any other Warlock spell of level 1 plus Fiend Pact spells.
I worked with my DM and completely refluffed the mechanics to kitbash an invoker; she is becoming a mortal weapon of the gods, obtaining incremental boons that represent their various domains/aspects/personalities (Book Warlock 4/Dragon Sorcerer1; will flip-flop between the two, ending with a W12/S8).
I've always felt that the best pacts with evil were made by Good (regardless of Law-Chaos dynamic) characters for reasons of need.
Examples:
- Save a dying loved one.
- Swap self to give another person a second chance.
- Protect an innocent you otherwise didn't have the power to protect.
- To save your life (verge of dying) in oder to protect others.
The list goes on and on and on. You just have to come up with a Back-Against-the-Wall moment that the Pact Master might respond to.
Jumuraa wrote:
A player at my table had the same issue as your C)
We reskinned the fiend to be an archangel of justice type of figure with a 'fiery' temper, and switched out Stinking Cloud for Slow on his expanded spell list. Will rename his higher level pact features with fluff as he acquires them (e.g. Hurl Through Hell becomes Castigation, no damage to celestials).
I like the concept of good guys having a pact with evil entities, but the player didn't, but this worked out fine for the overall narrative.
I'm always down with agreed upon home-brew. I'm just a lazy DM and prefer to make my players do more work so I can do less. 
As for Celestials always being "Good" Watch some of the Angel episodes on Supernatural . When a being is so "perfect" and "good" it has a hirrible failing, not understanding that it's concept of the "Greater Good" can cause horribly evil things to happen on the small scale. A Celestial will let a family die in a fire if it means catching the fiend that started it. A hero will rescue that family, even if it means the fiend gets away. Plenty of room for character/Pact Master conflict even with "good" overlords.
In 4E my hell-lock came from an isolated village of hereditary warlocks that worshipped their patron as a god and routinely sacrificed the firstborn male of a randomly chosen family each year to He Who Walks Behind The Trees. As one of the more powerful warlocks in the village, she's considered one of the village elders, even at her relatively young age.
Although some would define her culture as evil, she personally sees herself as a good person: she genuinely cares for her people and wants to be the best leader she can for them, she likes children, she's polite and thoughtful, etc. In fact, the reason she left her village was to search for the truth of their origins (after a captured wizard/amateur archaeologist told her they were actually a lost group of Pelorite heretics that had vanished nearly a thousand years ago) because she felt her people deserved to know the truth - despite having a personal pact with their patron that she considered a wedding vow and having sired a child with that patron, thus presenting a crisis of faith.
Soul Bonded and Pact Weapon at the same time? There's your dual Wielder who is never seen carrying his hammers, named appropriately of course, until battle is about to be met.
crimfan07 wrote:
Nevvur wrote:
Yunru wrote:
Napolean_Warlord wrote: