Need an easy mass combat system for 2nd edition AD&D - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Need an easy mass combat system for 2nd edition AD&D

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
dontheox
Jan 10, 2007 18:30:36 Hello All,

I need some ideas or suggestions on how to run a low detail mass
combat involving an army of around 500 troops, attacking a small
fortified town using the 2nd edition AD&D rules.

If you need more details about the scenario let me know, I will post
them later as I need to get to work right now.
#2
sgt_d
Jan 10, 2007 19:35:08 There's always the BattleSystem rules. I've used them in the past, and they've worked fairly well. Although, the books are hard to find.
#3
zombiegleemax
Jan 11, 2007 0:09:55 I think the "greyhawk wars" box set was used for even larger scale. (2ED rules)

TSR put out a game called "Battlesystem"
as sgt_d said: the battlesystem game is hard to find.

TSR later added Battlesystem Skirmishes ( 2ED rules to add PCs (converted) into the battles - as well as rules for PCs commanding troops - spell rules and other stuff included)
- you should be able to find this one online!

I've never used either of these. If you check out or use Battlesystem Skirmishes let us know how it went.
#4
ozbirthrightfan
Jan 11, 2007 0:11:08 If you PM me your email address I can send you an overview of the skirmish rules from the Birthright campaign setting. These don't require the use of miniatures, cards, battlemat or anything beyond the normal stats of the individuals that make up each unit.
#5
stefan_mi
Jan 13, 2007 1:35:34 The battlesystem rules are not easy to learn nor fast to play --- I'd consider using something else.
#6
fulnitus
Jan 15, 2007 1:27:40 I'd go with ozbirthrightfan's suggestion: get a copy of the birthright campaign setting and use those rules.
#7
zombiegleemax
Jan 15, 2007 8:22:46
I'd go with ozbirthrightfan's suggestion: get a copy of the birthright campaign setting and use those rules.

Oooh... Forgot about the Birthright stuff...

Definitely, go with that. Simple, slick and entirely believable when it comes to running large pitched battles.

Bought most of the BR stuff when it first came out, and have never had a chance to play it...
#8
zombiegleemax
Jan 15, 2007 8:53:30 i'd prefer the system in the mentzer-d&d-companion boxed set!
#9
agathokles
Jan 15, 2007 10:01:31
i'd prefer the system in the mentzer-d&d-companion boxed set!

With an average of 500 troops on each side, the OD&D system may be too much -- it's better for larger battles, where you want to quickly solve the battle with a single die roll, and let the PCs play out their roles. The Battlesystem and the Birthright system are IMO better for low-scale battles, where you want to play the battles on a tactical scale (using squads of 10-20 units, or companies of 100-200 rather than full armies).
#10
elondir
Jan 15, 2007 10:10:22 We tried doing a massive battle back in 1995 using Battlesystem. We got about five rounds in after the three hour setup before we got bored. I reccommend the Quick Battle Rating system in the OD&D Rules Cyclopedia, Chapter 9. It really glosses over combat though, so it's kind of not detailed enough. However, I like it for simulating a whole war in which several battles are fought, since it calculates how far the enemy retreats, and things like that.
#11
robertfisher
Jan 16, 2007 14:34:54 As long as most of your troops don't have special abilities...

Each 1 HD in one force destroys 1 HD in the defending force.

Or if you want some chance: Roll 1 die for each HD in each force. An even result destroys 1 HD in the opposing force. Or you could do it along the lines of Risk.

Or use the odds table from an old AH or SPI or GDW game.

Favorable/unfavorable conditions give a modifier to a force's HD.
#12
paladin2019
Jan 20, 2007 21:24:10 What's wrong with Battlesystem 2nd ED (the blue book, not the red box)? It's only got 5 stats.
#13
ozbirthrightfan
Jan 21, 2007 3:32:45
What's wrong with Battlesystem 2nd ED (the blue book, not the red box)? It's only got 5 stats.

The OP asked for "low detail" I have the 2e Battlesystem book and I wouldn't call it a low detail system.
#14
khyron1144
Jan 21, 2007 13:47:43
The OP asked for "low detail" I have the 2e Battlesystem book and I wouldn't call it a low detail system.

That and in a scenario like the OP's with Battlesystem's 10 guys= 1 figure system, you need 50 figures to represent that agressor force plus whatever you need for the city's defenders. I mean you can use poker chips or plastic army men or other econimical alternatives, but 50+ "figures" to keep track of can be a bit much.

The OD&D mass combat system is from what I can remember much more manageable becasue for one thing it meant to be done in an entirely pencil and paper way without moving figures around terrain and so on.
#15
zombiegleemax
Jan 21, 2007 18:11:09 my sugestion for a cost effective way, go with the rules in the maztica boxed set, wich you can download free off of the websites download section. i haven't looked through it thuroughly but i'm sure it's just fine.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 dontheox Jan 10, 2007 18:30:36	Hello All, I need some ideas or suggestions on how to run a low detail mass combat involving an army of around 500 troops, attacking a small fortified town using the 2nd edition AD&D rules. If you need more details about the scenario let me know, I will post them later as I need to get to work right now.
#2 sgt_d Jan 10, 2007 19:35:08	There's always the BattleSystem rules. I've used them in the past, and they've worked fairly well. Although, the books are hard to find.
#3 zombiegleemax Jan 11, 2007 0:09:55	I think the "greyhawk wars" box set was used for even larger scale. (2ED rules) TSR put out a game called "Battlesystem" as sgt_d said: the battlesystem game is hard to find. TSR later added Battlesystem Skirmishes ( 2ED rules to add PCs (converted) into the battles - as well as rules for PCs commanding troops - spell rules and other stuff included) - you should be able to find this one online! I've never used either of these. If you check out or use Battlesystem Skirmishes let us know how it went.
#4 ozbirthrightfan Jan 11, 2007 0:11:08	If you PM me your email address I can send you an overview of the skirmish rules from the Birthright campaign setting. These don't require the use of miniatures, cards, battlemat or anything beyond the normal stats of the individuals that make up each unit.
#5 stefan_mi Jan 13, 2007 1:35:34	The battlesystem rules are not easy to learn nor fast to play --- I'd consider using something else.
#6 fulnitus Jan 15, 2007 1:27:40	I'd go with ozbirthrightfan's suggestion: get a copy of the birthright campaign setting and use those rules.
#7 zombiegleemax Jan 15, 2007 8:22:46	I'd go with ozbirthrightfan's suggestion: get a copy of the birthright campaign setting and use those rules. Oooh... Forgot about the Birthright stuff... Definitely, go with that. Simple, slick and entirely believable when it comes to running large pitched battles. Bought most of the BR stuff when it first came out, and have never had a chance to play it...
#8 zombiegleemax Jan 15, 2007 8:53:30	i'd prefer the system in the mentzer-d&d-companion boxed set!
#9 agathokles Jan 15, 2007 10:01:31	i'd prefer the system in the mentzer-d&d-companion boxed set! With an average of 500 troops on each side, the OD&D system may be too much -- it's better for larger battles, where you want to quickly solve the battle with a single die roll, and let the PCs play out their roles. The Battlesystem and the Birthright system are IMO better for low-scale battles, where you want to play the battles on a tactical scale (using squads of 10-20 units, or companies of 100-200 rather than full armies).
#10 elondir Jan 15, 2007 10:10:22	We tried doing a massive battle back in 1995 using Battlesystem. We got about five rounds in after the three hour setup before we got bored. I reccommend the Quick Battle Rating system in the OD&D Rules Cyclopedia, Chapter 9. It really glosses over combat though, so it's kind of not detailed enough. However, I like it for simulating a whole war in which several battles are fought, since it calculates how far the enemy retreats, and things like that.
#11 robertfisher Jan 16, 2007 14:34:54	As long as most of your troops don't have special abilities... Each 1 HD in one force destroys 1 HD in the defending force. Or if you want some chance: Roll 1 die for each HD in each force. An even result destroys 1 HD in the opposing force. Or you could do it along the lines of Risk. Or use the odds table from an old AH or SPI or GDW game. Favorable/unfavorable conditions give a modifier to a force's HD.
#12 paladin2019 Jan 20, 2007 21:24:10	What's wrong with Battlesystem 2nd ED (the blue book, not the red box)? It's only got 5 stats.
#13 ozbirthrightfan Jan 21, 2007 3:32:45	What's wrong with Battlesystem 2nd ED (the blue book, not the red box)? It's only got 5 stats. The OP asked for "low detail" I have the 2e Battlesystem book and I wouldn't call it a low detail system.
#14 khyron1144 Jan 21, 2007 13:47:43	The OP asked for "low detail" I have the 2e Battlesystem book and I wouldn't call it a low detail system. That and in a scenario like the OP's with Battlesystem's 10 guys= 1 figure system, you need 50 figures to represent that agressor force plus whatever you need for the city's defenders. I mean you can use poker chips or plastic army men or other econimical alternatives, but 50+ "figures" to keep track of can be a bit much. The OD&D mass combat system is from what I can remember much more manageable becasue for one thing it meant to be done in an entirely pencil and paper way without moving figures around terrain and so on.
#15 zombiegleemax Jan 21, 2007 18:11:09	my sugestion for a cost effective way, go with the rules in the maztica boxed set, wich you can download free off of the websites download section. i haven't looked through it thuroughly but i'm sure it's just fine.