Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 kell_kheraptis May 03, 2009 11:14:41	Looking for a build to score these, and if possible integrate Swiftblade and Swift Hunter (the base of it at least, as it's good and versatile). 25 Levels to play with, and at least this early, I'm stumped. Have at it! EDIT : Well, sans Swift Hunter bits (Scout 3/Ranger 1), I can get BAB 18(+3 Epic)/IL 18/CL 17, while keeping Uncanny Dodge, but no Evasion or Mettle, and no Turning. Argh! EDIT #2 : Nevermind, found what I was needing. Mods can remove this if they wish!
#2 dawnmor May 03, 2009 12:04:53	Well I dont know much about Swiftblade. But Swift hunter, hmmmm, im not sure if it would work with a Gish type ? But........The question is what type of Spells are you going for? Divine or Arcane?. Im going to Assume Arcane for this one. Dwarf warblade 1, Wizard 4, Runesmith 1, JPM 10, Abj Champ 5 = ECL 21 Toss in hmmmm, another lvl or 2 of Warblade. Get Divine power threw Arcane Disciple: Competition. Now end result would be something like this..........Warblade 5, Wizard 4, Runesmith 1, JPM 10, Abj Champ 5. That nets you IL 20, CL 18 But im not done yet, OH NO!. Persist Divine power. Now you have a BAB of 25, CL 25, IL 20. Divine power grants BAB equal to your level. Martial Arcanist (Abj Champ) grants CL equal to your BAB. Get it? --------------------------- Same thing can be done with a Divine Gish but upon closer thinking, this could be done instead.......... Thri Kreen (LA buy off +1), Swordsage 4, Cleric 6, RKV 10, Abj Champ (Variant for Divine) 5, Woooooooooooo Divine power still . Grab Exotic armor prof (Gnome twisted armor), boost Dex and Wis, Shadowblade, Multi weapon fighting, Wooooooooo oh bring the pain .
#3 kell_kheraptis May 03, 2009 12:47:34	Well I dont know much about Swiftblade. But Swift hunter, hmmmm, im not sure if it would work with a Gish type ? But........The question is what type of Spells are you going for? Divine or Arcane?. Im going to Assume Arcane for this one. Dwarf warblade 1, Wizard 4, Runesmith 1, JPM 10, Abj Champ 5 = ECL 21 Toss in hmmmm, another lvl or 2 of Warblade. Get Divine power threw Arcane Disciple: Competition. Now end result would be something like this..........Warblade 5, Wizard 4, Runesmith 1, JPM 10, Abj Champ 5. That nets you IL 20, CL 18 But im not done yet, OH NO!. Persist Divine power. Now you have a BAB of 25, CL 25, IL 20. Divine power grants BAB equal to your level. Martial Arcanist (Abj Champ) grants CL equal to your BAB. Get it? --------------------------- Same thing can be done with a Divine Gish but upon closer thinking, this could be done instead.......... Thri Kreen (LA buy off +1), Swordsage 4, Cleric 6, RKV 10, Abj Champ (Variant for Divine) 5, Woooooooooooo Divine power still . Grab Exotic armor prof (Gnome twisted armor), boost Dex and Wis, Shadowblade, Multi weapon fighting, Wooooooooo oh bring the pain . Sexy builds, though I'm not a big dwarf guy (wonder if whisper gnome would qualify for those though...hmm...). I ended up getting by by using an alternate ranger on here. Not totally WotC, but serves the purpose and makes sense. Granted it uses the fishy mechanics of the Sword of the Arcane Order feat, but meh. Incidentally, what are the main perks of runesmith, or was it more for continuity of BAB/CL?
#4 dawnmor May 03, 2009 12:55:59	The main Thing with Runesmith even a 1 lvl dip is that you can cast any arcane spell in heavy armor, which means you could be running around the battle field with say plate armor or mountain plate or whatever and you look like a fighter but your far from it, your a guy who can cast spells in plate and surprise those around you . Not to mention it Runesmith can only be used with Dwarf, I dont think it can be adapted to anything else. When I create a character I try to figure out what type of race I am wanting to play and go from their. If I want to play a heavy tank and dont want to just do the absorbing of damage, Ill play a Dwarf and get runesmith. If I want to play a Dexterity guy who goes and gets up in their faces and batter em to a pulp, Ill play a race that grats Dex bonuses or ill do a small character type. Right now Im considering a Warlock, Wizard, ET, Abj Champ (Will only cost me 2 feats to enter) If you dont mind a lil more fun to it, Play a Pixie, at epic lvls people can see you but that you dont care about . Cast Enlarge, toss in Righteous Might and now your a Collosal - Gargantuan invisible pixie . With Swordsage levels. If you want to do a Swordsage/Sorcerer to keep with the Pixies natural Class then go for it. But I preffer Wizards, more breadth of spells. The thing with Pixies though is their highest boosts are in Dex, Int, Cha, so anything that is from those and youll be fine.
#5 Senevri May 03, 2009 13:10:14	You must have 14 Martial Adept levels. Cannot be done without accelerated casting. Bard 3/Swordsage 3/JPM 4/Subchord 1/JPM+6/Swiftblade 3... ...Just barely loses BOTH. Replace the last three levels with Uncanny Trickster, and it gets 9th initiation and 8th casting, but that's an entirely diff'rent bunny. Let's rearrange: Bard 3/Swordsage 3/JPM 1/Swiftblade 3/SubChord 1/JPM +9. Doesn't qualify for swiftblade. Um. Suel Arcanamach 4... Um. Crusader 6/Suel 2/JPM 3/SubChord 1/JPM+6/Swiftblade 2 ... doesn't get there pre-epic, either. Hm. No way 'round it. Gotta be a Dragonwrought Loredrake Kobold. And it's still tricky. - You only need 16 spellcaster levels for 9th spells, swiftblade 3 loses one, JPM loses two. So.. Sorc 3/Swordsage 3/JPM 1/Swiftblade 3/SubChord 1/JPM +9... but how to qualify for SubChord? *sigh*. ALSO doesn't get 9th maneuvers Ways of getting bardic music, anyone? I'm starting to think best bet would be something like Sorc 5/Swordsage 2/Nar DB 1/JPM 10/Martial Adept 3 IL 17.5, full Nar DB casting, although the entry smells like cheese. Still no swiftblade, though.
#6 Kerrus May 03, 2009 14:06:23	Read the 'Adaption' entry under swordsage. The part that mentions the unarmed variant. Now go a little to the right. See the bit about arcane casting? There you go.
#7 dawnmor May 03, 2009 15:18:37	I was just looking at TOB and noticed something very entertaining. A Valkyrie Swordsage/Wizard/JPM/Abj Champ. You can pull it off by lvl 20. Their starting Stats are +14 Str, +16 Dex, +12 con, +4 Int, +3 wis, +6 Cha (Dont ask me on Wis, I think its a Typo). But you can easily pull it off. Valkyrie LA +5 (Treated as a 10th lvl Swordsage, Buy off +1), Swordsage 4, Wizard 3, JPM 9, Abj Champ 5 End Result would get you.......Dex to Attack and Damage, Wis to Damage. Not sure on BAB without Divine power. But IL 27, CL 16. Unless you do Martial Arcanist to get you a CL of 22, so you get 9th lvl spells and Tons of 9th level Maneuvers . Shadowblade, 2weapon fighting, maybe grab Exotic Armor prof (Gnome Twisted Armor), Knowledge Devotion (Get as many Knowledge skills as you can), Now you got your Full Dex to Touch and Range touch. Greater 2 weapon fighting, Imp 2 weapon fighting. And I think your good to go lol. Sure youll be fighting melee but atleast you can fight in melee with no problems. If you REALLY! wanna get freaky depending on if your DM is a Bastard or not like mine is, Grab VOP, Boost Dex, get AC bonuses, go Unarmed Variant Swordsage , NOW! your AC is insane, your stats are incredible and your good to go yet again lol. Too bad Swordsage and Warlock cant apply for JPM lol, if it could, OMG! lol. THOUGH! I suppose sense the Valkyrie already gets Maneuvers as a base of a 10th lvl swordsage already!, you could go and get Swordsage 4, Warlock 10, Hellfire warlock 3, XXX 3. Hideious blow, yeah I suppose it could work.
#8 Senevri May 03, 2009 18:03:36	I was just looking at TOB and noticed something very entertaining. A Valkyrie Swordsage/Wizard/JPM/Abj Champ. You can pull it off by lvl 20. Their starting Stats are +14 Str, +16 Dex, +12 con, +4 Int, +3 wis, +6 Cha (Dont ask me on Wis, I think its a Typo). But you can easily pull it off. Valkyrie LA +5 (Treated as a 10th lvl Swordsage, Buy off +1), Swordsage 4, Wizard 3, JPM 9, Abj Champ 5 Er, that's a ECL 37 character. 36 with the buy-off. Ra-ci-al-hit-dice Anyway, here's the math: At most, 6 non-MA levels, One PrC with casting progression, 8/10 No other casting MA. Total max spellcaster levels: 14. By far the easiest solution for arcane powah is Crusader 6, Suel 4, Nar DB 1, JPM 8. Leaves us even with one "free level, which can be either initiator or not. 8th casting, 9th maneuvers. Alternatively, finishing with Sublime 1 / JPM 9, however you get there from the first ten levels, nets 9th casting. A dragonwrought loredrake kobold qualifies for sublime with Sor 4/Virtuoso 2, meaning missed it by _that_ much. So that's 9th casting, 8th maneuvers. Actually, if you are satisfied with 8th maneuvers, you only need 10 initiator levels, and you can even qualify totally cheese-free, with, say, Sor 6/Virtuoso 3/SSage-or-crusader 1, or... well, many ways.
#9 dawnmor May 03, 2009 18:49:42	Dont be a Prick Senevri. Im not an idiot and you just acted like an idiot, which had the opposite effect you were looking for. Just go Pixie 2 (Already LA buy off +2), Swordsage 4, Wizard 4, JPM 10, Abj Champ 5. That should work if you want to go Pixie. Grab the 2 weapon fighting tree, shadowblade, and your good as go, make sure you get Gnome twisted armor and Arcane Disciple: Competition. Gnome twisted armor is the only armor that allows you to get full dex to touch AC. Boost Dex, then Wis, then Int. That will get you full BAB (W/divine power), Dex and Wis to AC, CL 23, EIL 14. IL 18.
#10 Balthanon May 03, 2009 21:30:12	The original poster (who admittedly has apparently already found his solution), had 25 levels to play with-- you can go over 6 levels of non-martial adept at that point. A standard Warblade 1/Wizard 4/Jade Phoenix Mage 10 picks up 13th IL and 12th CL. Swiftblade 6 gives an additional 4 CL and 3 IL by 21st for IL 16 and CL 16. Assuming the same progression on Jade Phoenix Mage in Epic, an additional 4 levels of that should push the character up to IL 20 and CL 19, for 9th level maneuvers and spells. If the person can't get an epic progression for Jade Phoenix Mage (or doesn't want to take it), then Swiftblade 3/Warblade 1 picks up the last caster level and initiator level needed-- and gets the character the 9th level of Swiftblade that grants 3.0 haste. 9th level spells, 9th level maneuvers, and 9 levels of Swiftblade. Rather symetrical all around. It'll almost be a shame to take the 10th level of Swiftblade the following level and pick up 6th level timestops.
#11 Grumman May 04, 2009 21:48:16	Crusader 3 / Wu Jen 2 / Spellsword 1 / Jade Phoenix Mage 3 / Swiftblade 9 / Jade Phoenix Mage +7 B.A.B. +19 (+3 Epic), Base saves +12 / +8 / +13 (+2 Epic) Spellcasting as a lvl 17 Wu Jen, Initiator level 19, ignore 10% ASF, and (almost) all the goodies of both JPM and Swiftblade.
#12 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 04, 2009 22:56:27	Well you can get 9th level divine spells and 9th level maneuvers Human Expert or Human Paragon 1/ Crusader 7/ Ur- Priest 2/ Ruby Knight Vindicator 10 - BAB 18, 9th level divine spells, 9th level maneuvers Human Expert 1/ Crusader 4/ Ur-priest2 / RKV 10/ Master of Nine 3 - may need flaws or some mix of crusader/swordsage instead of straight crusader, but BAB 17, 9th level divine spells, and 9th level maneuvers from any discipline.