However, I've dug up enough interesting spells that I fancy it might be viable to specialise in Evocation and perhaps, with some work, play as a viable blaster. My thoughts on what Evocation could offer:
Burst Damage
Normally, if blasting, you want to blow something up quickly. Unfortunately, Evocation is not actually good at this. Damage is capped by level (getting more than a die per level is tough enough) and foes can often save. OK, you can Twin Empower Maximize your Scorching Rays but at the end of the day, a Wilder is probably better at nuking.
Sustainable Damage
It's not what you'd normally go in for, but how about just steamrollering them by putting out damage more efficiently? Something like a Flaming Sphere is kind of sucky, but you can cast it first, then keep it up whilst you fire off more spells. Think of it not as doing damage in its own right but buffing the damage of other spells. With something like Flaming Sphere + Tirumael's Energy Spheres, you can kick out a fair damage per round without actually burning any spells once they're up. OK, you're more of a Fighter than a Wizard, but you're still cooler than a real Fighter.
Secondary Effects
There are Conjuration-like spells such as Telekinesis, Shatterfloor (points for shattering the bridge beneath them or the ceiling above them) and Defenstrating Sphere (which is pretty cool) which can do other things than damage. With metamagics like those ones which add Shaken or a Negative Level to the spell (I forget where they're from), or Born of the Three Thunders or Flash Frost Spell (PHBII) you can make any spell into something like this. Energy Substitution, IIRC, doesn't need to be prepared, so you can always carry a backup acid spell. My favourite is the Stormcaster (Stormwrack) for adding a little sonic and most importantly Stunning to lightning spells.
Still, I'm not really sure where to go with this. The metamagic route looks promising but could be feat-heavy and might need metamagic tricks (e.g. Midnight Metamagic + Psycarnum Infusion?). In fact, a Cleric with Divine Metamagic might work better. There's also the energy type thing. Anyone tried using a blaster-esq Evoker with success?
(In core: Floating Disk, Darkness, Gust of Wind, Scorching Ray, Shatter, Daylight, Fireball, Wind Wall, Resilient Sphere, Wall of Fire, Wall of Force, Contingency, Forcecage, Telekinetic Sphere all have their uses)
At low levels, though, you're clearly better off using the classics - which include a lot of Conjurations.
- Not sure why a Wilder would be better at nuking? Arcane casters can stack metamagic feats (as you pointed out) where psionicists are limited by their psionic foci. I'll admit I'm not a wilder specialist by any means, so feel free to show me otherwise. I can see how they would have a window around levels 5-8 with Energy Missile, some nice surging, plus perhaps some Anarchic Initiate (if they qualify).
- Flaming Sphere is not going to be competitive. Even Maximized it's at most 12 damage per round.
I want to like Defenestrating Sphere but it allows too many saves to have its full effect. Shatterfloor is indeed interesting.
Moonbow (SC) is good for blasting. You get 1.5*CL*d6 dmg out of it.
- Energy Substitution does need preparation. Born of the Three Thunders is excellent when you're immune to daze.
A lot of the things that apply to the Mailman apply to an Evoker. Incantatar is king in the long run; Ultimate Magus is a contender once it starts getting into swing (levels 11+).
A DMM Cleric is not going to fare that well IMO.
Whatever the solution, you're going to be feat-starved: metamagic feats + metamagic reducers (Arcane Thesis, Easy Metamagic, Practical Metamagic, Metamagic School Focus) + Residual Magic (unavoidable IMO).
For a build that blooms earlier (levels 7-10), Recaster (RoE) is actually really good. (I'm thinking of writing a Recaster handbook, but I probably won't have the time.)
Something like Evoker 5/Recaster 5
1 Empower
3 -
5 Maximize
6 -
9 Residual Magic
With flaws it gets better, but at level 10 you can already Empower for free 5/day (and repeat the round after), Maximize for free 5/day (and repeat the round after). And that's any spell you have prepared; you can also shape them 5/day on the fly. And cast them stilled or silent.
In your 6th level feat slot, you could take Arcane Thesis: Scorching Ray (for instance - could be Combust or Fireball), but there are a lot of other valid options. In your 3rd level slot, e.g. Easy Metamagic: Empower if it's allowed. Spell Focus is a given if you're going to use save-based spells.
And as mentioned, Born of the Three Thunders if you manage to get daze immunity (e.g. via dragonmark).
- Not sure why a Wilder would be better at nuking? Arcane casters can stack metamagic feats (as you pointed out) where psionicists are limited by their psionic foci. I'll admit I'm not a wilder specialist by any means, so feel free to show me otherwise. I can see how they would have a window around levels 5-8 with Energy Missile, some nice surging, plus perhaps some Anarchic Initiate (if they qualify).
An ardent with dominant ideal for the Energy mantle could also be competitive when using their chosen mantle, though that doesn't kick in until 10th level and spellcasters still have a larger range of metamagic feats from which to choose (on the other hand, Burrowing Power is fun).
Invoke Magic is a nifty evocation spell... not great, but still. Our DM threw a dead magic zone at us, so I chucked it up and had some fun. Expensive though
- Not sure why a Wilder would be better at nuking?
I did not really mean that literally (Wilders are not really great at nuking), but I was just highlighting the poor burst damage an evoker can get. Damage spells, at low levels at least, tend to be one die per level, whereas a Wilder could get 1d6+1 per level with an energy spell, plus maybe 2d6+2 from Wild Surge (at L3). A snapshot of 5d6+5 is way better than 3d6.
- Flaming Sphere is not going to be competitive. Even Maximized it's at most 12 damage per round.
Flaming Sphere kind of sucks, yeah, but a Blistering [PHBII] Flaming Sphere, as a random example, would do 2d6+4 with a minor debuff. I just wondered about something like a Sphere spell plus Energy Spheres. You just sit there and fire out 54+2d6 damage per round (at L10, reflex 1/2) without needing to cast anything else. Not fancy but it wouldn't need any kind of attack rolls.
The metamagics I was thinking of before were the Fell ones from Libris Mortis. A Fell Frighten Flaming Sphere would roll around Shaking people for 1 minute each time they took damage. It doesn't appear to require a save.
Defenestrating Sphere is L4, I thought it was L3, so maybe it's not so good. Still, Fort or prone is nice enough if you have a warrior to take advantage of it.
- Energy Substitution does need preparation.
I was going off the SRD version, "When employing a spell". It's kinda vague. I know it's been updates, though (and they added a +1 level to Subdual, I think).
Either way, it looks like Metamagic (Ab)use is going to be the best way. There are a lot of cool things which add secondary effects to energy spells (like those tactical feats) but I don't like being tied too much to an energy type like that.
How about something like this:
Round 1: Defenestrating Sphere
Round 2: Manyjaws (extended via rod) + Sonorous Hum
Round 3: Energy Spheres
Then, for four more rounds, you deal 3d6 + potential throwing from Defenestrating, 1d6/level from Manyjaws, and 50 (at L10) from Tirumael's Energy Spheres. It's Reflex 1/2, but that's still a lot of damage without burning any more spells.
Add in Metamagic School Focus and perhaps Arcane Thesis (Thesis Manyjaws for Empowered?) and it could get nice. It would use up 2 L3 slots and 2 L4 slots, but they're all Evocation, so maybe Focused Specialist or something? Meh, just an idea. I might try it out sometime for fun.
Extended Manyjaws + Sonorous Hum is the best combo of the lot.
And indeed, focusing on Manyjaws could be a good idea if you want a damage-over-time Evoker.
A fair question: how often does a fight last seven rounds?
- Evocation is not terrible. It just pales in comparison to most other schools. Conjuration can't do everything it does, but Shadow Evocation tends to be the nail in the coffin.
Evocation makes you a poor mans archer. When a non-caster is showing you up anywhere past level 3, your caster did it wrong. Even levels 1-3 you should be able to hold your own/dominate most encounters.
Plus the fighter with a bow has the added benefit of not looking like a munchkin and getting yelled at by the DM. The wizard player who says "I cast a twinned, maxamized, empowered [anything]" gets the stink eye. And thats a pretty important thing to keep in mind for any sort of practical optimization.
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Fred, I'm not sure your goal with this thread? Are you trying to make a decent evocation focused guy?
Evocation makes you a poor mans archer. When a non-caster is showing you up anywhere past level 3, your caster did it wrong. Even levels 1-3 you should be able to hold your own/dominate most encounters.
The Evoker at its peak should have better spike damage and/or better area damage.
Though if someone wants to run the numbers (or find a thread where people did) and prove me wrong, please do so. I freely admit I haven't done so myself.
The Splitting enchantment may change things, but it's expensive and then your remark below doesn't make much sense.
At levels 1-3 every wizard uses the same offensive spells anyway: Color Spray, Sleep, Glitterdust, ...
I'm not recommending Evocation over other schools; I'm saying it's not a bad school.
Plus the fighter with a bow has the added benefit of not looking like a munchkin and getting yelled at by the DM. The wizard player who says "I cast a twinned, maxamized, empowered [anything]" gets the stink eye. And thats a pretty important thing to keep in mind for any sort of practical optimization.
Er... I don't know how to respond to this. This is heavily table-dependent; each person can adapt the amount of optimization you put in to the level of the party (stick to Empower+Maximize for instance), and so on... DM psychology is not within the scope of this board's work.
Energy Spheres provides 1 orb/type/casting, not 1 orb/type/round.
As far as I can tell, the spheres are only expended when used defensively (a lame option, but could be handy for an emergency).
Fred, I'm not sure your goal with this thread? Are you trying to make a decent evocation focused guy?
Pretty much. I'm just exploring some options.
Is an archer better? Maybe. But Manyjaws or Energy Spheres or even the lame Flaming Sphere don't need attack rolls to hit (I guess for Flaming Sphere, the Reflex save is the attack roll). A Warlock or Dissolving Spittle dude might be better but a plain archer would need an equal amount of optimisation (I've never really bothered to try my hand at one, tbh).
Also, energy damage tends to be better than piercing, and you have force or even untyped options too.
I'd put a fighter with a splitting force bow, and a mount beating an evoker at the same game test any day. Without splitting I'd bet its still pretty clear. I'll work out an archer if someone wants to pick a level.
An archer may need an attack roll to hit, but the fighter is going to have +40 or so, and it just won't even be worth rolling for most foes in the MM.
Er... I don't know how to respond to this. This is heavily table-dependent; each person can adapt the amount of optimization you put in to the level of the party (stick to Empower+Maximize for instance), and so on... DM psychology is not within the scope of this board's work.
Who cares if you can put together the ultimate build if every DM who looks at it and says no. If it can't pass the DM sniff test its not worth doing. A build that uses core only is better to suggest than a build that uses splat books if both builds are equally good because it has a better chance of being allowed at a table.
I think a guy saying "I want a splitting bow once" goes over way easier than saying "I use extended, twinned, maxamized...".
There's everything under the sun.
Anyway, this is The_Fred's thread, and as long as his DM doesn't nix a metamagic stacking build (and I doubt sir Balthanon would) then we can keep discussing it.
To make things simple, I'll stick to Moonbow and won't assume too much stuff. I'll use the Recaster build above for levels 1-10 and no other fancy PrC for now. She'll take Practiced Spellcaster at level 3 and Arcane Thesis: Moonbow at level 12.
Level 10: CL 10, Maximized Moonbow for 90 dmg. To hit chances = 65% ?? => Expected dmg = 58,5
Level 15: CL 17, Empowered Maximized Moonbow for 186 dmg avg. To hit chances = 90% ?? => Expected = 167,4
Level 20: CL 22, Twin Empowered Maximized Moonbow for 465 dmg avg. To hit chances = 95% ?? => Expected dmg = 441,75
I'm not counting crits (but feel free to, they're better for you), I did only 1 attack instead of 3 and yes I completely pulled to-hit chances out of thin air. SR is assumed bypassed via Assay SR. This is back of the enveloppe stuff.
I expected the Splitting build will do better. Not sure about the non-Splitting one.
Midnight Metamagic is great, though it's pretty limited unless you use Psycarnum Infusion, and then one does have to consider what the DM would allow, since personally I would be tempted to say that you can't change which spell or metamagic gets the essentia. Thus, you could use it to spam a Gestalt Lightning Bolt but not just apply a free +whatever metamagic to everything you cast for only a move action.
Still, it's probably the best way to get recyclable metamagic. You need to be Psionic (possibly a feat) and spend two feats on it (plus the Metamagic) so it's also kind of feat-intensive, especially if you want more essentia, but an Azurin Wizard would tick all the boxes by L5 (also flaws).
I'm not sure about Splitting (is it Champions of Ruin? I don't think I have that) but if we are taking about the DM's mind, I hear that one is often banned too. Regardless, I'm not saying a blaster is necessarily better than an optimised archer (despite things like DR), otherwise people would be using them all the time, but mightn't it be viable or have some niches to fill? That's all I'm interested in exploring, for fun as much as anything else.
Archer has problems with DR? No problem. A bit of Warblade (level 9 and 10) followed by a bit of Eternal Blade (Level 11 and 12) and you can ignore the crap out of DR, as well as use Dancing Mongoose vs no-DR targets.
Building a real archer? Consider Bone Bow (Frostburn) over a composite bow, at least if you'd be using any kind of strength boosting or size changing buffs from allies.
Archer has problems with DR? No problem. A bit of Warblade (level 9 and 10) followed by a bit of Eternal Blade (Level 11 and 12) and you can ignore the crap out of DR, as well as use Dancing Mongoose vs no-DR targets.
Psst, you have a PM waiting for you. (If possible, give me some other way to contact you, e.g. email, since you don't seem to get PM notifications.
)People generally just use the Force enchantment to bypass DR. And hit incorporeals as a bonus. Of course Force Splitting makes it expensive, but on the other hand an archer doesn't need a ton of other gear.
What I'm especially interested in, since I haven't built an archer in ages, are the sources of bonus damage. A Fighter will have an easy time getting a ton of attacks (Rapid Shot, Haste, ...), but beyond Strength, Weapon Spec(!), Ranged Weapon Mastery and added damage from weapon enchantment (wich is costly), what can he tack on? (To reiterate: a Fighter, not a Swift Hunter.)
1d10+6 Str(??)+5 enhancement+4 WS&RWM is 20.5 average per hit only.
I believe there's a Ranged Power Attack in Complete Warrior.
There isn't. The only such effect was a class feature on a 3e Peerless Archer Faerun PrC.
...Oddly, chalk me up against the archer here. Two broad reasons.
1) Wind Wall. No spell shuts down mages completely (there's several that can impede it quite a bit, but that's slowing it down rather than stopping it) short of Antimagic Field, which is four levels higher than Wind Wall and available to fewer classes. Furthermore, Wind Wall is preferential; you can lock down enemy archers without impeding your mages or warriors much, while AMF hoses just about everyone except people built to use it. Both spells are problematic, because they're absolutes (and for a host of other reasons according to WotC themselves!), but they can't be ignored on these discussions.
2) Archers can excel in combat, but their best high-level choices for impact are either precision damage (see Swift Hunter builds, for instance - but note that this is just 30 feet!), or mass debuffing (via the best enhancement they can buy - Spell Storing arrows - but at that point you're not really playing an archer so much as a rapid-fire mage). Neither of these are directly comparable to your classical evoker.
I'm open to be proven wrong, though. And I do like archers quite a bit. (If you've read Untapped Potential, this should be obvious - although it shows its age in terms of design quality, the Marksman class there was originally my idea; I've also got something else in the works that arhcer-types should enjoy when it's finished. Now that my thesis is done I can actually focus on it...)
I believe there's a Ranged Power Attack in Complete Warrior.
There isn't. The only such effect was a class feature on a 3e Peerless Archer Faerun PrC.
I don't know why I keep thinking that, since there's a Ranged Disarm, Ranged Pin, and even Ranged Smite, there has to be a Ranged Power Attack.
Ah, well. There's always Hank's Bow for that.
Feel like wind wall isn't crazy hard to avoid. Especially as an archer. Note I assume all archers are mounted on a decent mount. (Horse at low levels, Griffon at level 7 or so, something better soon after. Either one they bought with money or one they got with wild cohort www.wizards.com/default.asp?x=dnd/re/200...)
I think a fighter 20 archer just spamming 12 attacks around for 1d8+5 magic+str+2/4feats damage a pop is going to be more effective. (12 attacks from haste and splitting)
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DM Sniff test. The idea that when you explain it to your DM he quickly understands your tactics and round by round actions. The quicker and easier he understands it, the more likely it will be allowed. "I go invisable, am flying all day and blast an orb of fire at the enemies" probably passes. As does "I ride a horse and shoot arrows". "I use these 4 feats on each of my spells" probably does not. Basically if you have to explain to your DM how, why and that it works it probably isn't going to pass.
I actually think that an Evoker would work best using spells with secondary effects, multi-threats like Great Thunderclap or Stormcaster/Born of Three Thunders for Stunning and so forth. However, it does kind of behoove us to compare with the archer.
Obviously, magical gear is key to a lot of characters and it's unfair to expect them to function without, but a Splitting bow is prohibitavely expensive until the higher levels (>10), particularly given you're going to want Bracers of Dex and suchlike. Meanwhile, I could spend that cash on a sack of Metamagic Rods or whatever. I don't know how much Force costs but it surely starts to add up. I guess you can get by without Seeking (Imp Precise Shot, say), though at low levels a mere Entropic Shield throws a spanner in the works. It's just generally easier to counter an archer.
The horse is great when you're on, say, plains, and not in a dungeon or house or whatever. Plus your horse can get killed. It's a fair point, but a lot of people dislike horses for a lot reasons.
When it comes to the DM "sniff test", I would say "I blast enemies with my evocation spells!" is going to get them to tell you to optimise your character more. At which point you can say, "OK, I'm boosting my capabilities with a few metamagic feats."
I actually think that an Evoker would work best using spells with secondary effects, multi-threats like Great Thunderclap or Stormcaster/Born of Three Thunders for Stunning and so forth. However, it does kind of behoove us to compare with the archer.
I think this is definatley the way to go for an evoker, but I also think non-evocation schools do it better.
A splitting bow is so good its an auto buy, but I think its a still a worthwhile comparison without one.
Side question. If you are an evoker are you a wizard. If so, what schools do you ban? Necromancy and enchantment maybe?
I think a fighter 20 archer just spamming 12 attacks around for 1d8+5 magic+str+2/4feats damage a pop is going to be more effective. (12 attacks from haste and splitting)
Well, no, the math says otherwise. 12*23.5 = 282 << 440 (I assumed 10 Str which is a bit high, but I do not account for crits: they won't be enough to tilt the scale anyway)
At level 15, assuming +4 enhancement and +8 Str: 10*20,5 = 205. Anyone has an evaluation of the to-hit chances? It seems the archer might win this one. (But I've been slightly more generous with him than with the wizard.)
The evoker wins without a doubt vs the non-Splitting bow.
Of course the Fighter can do this all day long while the wizard is slightly limited (but at high levels he has more than enough).
DM Sniff test. The idea that when you explain it to your DM he quickly understands your tactics and round by round actions. The quicker and easier he understands it, the more likely it will be allowed. "I go invisable, am flying all day and blast an orb of fire at the enemies" probably passes. As does "I ride a horse and shoot arrows". "I use these 4 feats on each of my spells" probably does not. Basically if you have to explain to your DM how, why and that it works it probably isn't going to pass.
Thank you for providing a definition. I do feel most spellcasters and martial adepts wouldn't pass it since they have a bunch of discrete abilities that are hard to sum up concisely ("I can throw people around and light my hand on fire and teleport and parry attacks and...").
I also feel that, while DM do like simplicity for obvious reasons, they also gauge mechanics based on perceived power level: hence the banning of Warlocks who can fly all day and zap all day(!!).
In the end I don't find your test is representative, so we'll agree to disagree.
@TS: I remember liking the Sublime Way Ranger, though I don't think a definitive version was posted. It was RT's and your work, was it not?
edit: I like the article preceding the article you linked to. It mentions the CharOp board making powerful builds with the True Necromancer(?), a debate about the power level of the Warlock(!), ...
I think this is definatley the way to go for an evoker, but I also think non-evocation schools do it better.
Well, yeah, that's why Conjuration and Necromancy are typically seen as strictly better (Conjuration has things like Acid Fog and Evard's which do damage and provide an effect).
I think Evocation might have some gems, though. Likely enough for specialisation, anyway.
Side question. If you are an evoker are you a wizard. If so, what schools do you ban? Necromancy and enchantment maybe?
Probably. Abjuration is a possibility, if you're not going for Incantrix (though Dispel is Abjuration, right? Also specialised Evoker into Incantrix would leave you will nothing to ban for your third school aside from Illusion or like... Transmutation. Yuck).
Something like a Beguiler/Wizard/Ultimate Magus could pump Metamagic with the UM ability which lets him burn spell slots, and still have a few illusions and enchantments available even if he banned those two schools as a Wizard. That might be a nice way to get more mileage out of metamagic.
The best spells are highly dependent on how much metamagic you can cheese, er, make efficient. The psycarnum method allows you to use it on your non-best spell, and pay for a fairly decent amount. On the other side, Arcane THesis takes off 1 from the cost of EVERY MM feat you use. You then go searching for maximum dmg out put/feat cost, assuming you have to stay inside the feat cap.
I made a Force Missile Mage specialist that could reliably put out 100 dmg/rd of any elemental type of damage by level 10. The first few levels you play as something else, because the damage is so low, and you can't get Arcane Thesis until 6th. Once you have it, a Twinned Empowered Magic Missile is 21d4+21 dmg, with a Quickened Empowered follow up for 10d4+10 x 1.5, or about 110 damage, that is no save, non-missing...all you might have to worry about is beating SR, and there's plenty of ways around that.
Since you're a Force Missile Mage, it'll even punch through a Shield spell.
After that point, it's just a matter of getting more dmg feats, Residual Metamagic lets you cast a second and following round volley of the above out of SECOND LEVEL SLOTS...and then you might possibly Admixture or Born of the Three Thunders or Repeat Spell or Energize spell (+50% dmg vs undead, +1 level) and so forth and so on.
Add Argent Savant to get a size of die increase of damage, and several other feats, classes to get + dmg/die, and go to town.
As for the 'I cast my Maximized Empowered' etc language, just relabel the spell to something shorter if it's going to hurt your standing in the party. Seriously, it's no worse then shouting "I Diamond Nightmare Blade him!" and so forth.
==Aelryinth
I believe there's a Ranged Power Attack in Complete Warrior.
There's something like that with Power Throw from Complete Adventurer, but that's only for thrown weapons.
Hmm, if I Extend Manyjaws with a rod, can I still use Residual Metamagic to fire off a second, even without the feat?
Probably. Abjuration is a possibility, if you're not going for Incantrix (though Dispel is Abjuration, right? Also specialised Evoker into Incantrix would leave you will nothing to ban for your third school aside from Illusion or like... Transmutation. Yuck).
I remember someone proposing to actually force Wizards into the Focused Specialist variant as a fairly simple fix to get them down to Tier 2. You'd probably need to force Conjurers to ban Transmutation and vice-versa (not unlike the more directive 3.0E forbidden schools scheme).
I find the concept interesting, in that every wizard would have a very different flair.
You could always use your own Extended Manyjaws, then follow up with a Residually-Extended, Empowered-via-rod (since it's still L3 so you can use a Lesser one) Manyjaws or somesuch.
I also like the idea of spamming Fell Frighten Magic Missiles. Arcane Thesis: Magic Missile (probably not a great idea tbh) would make these 2nd level, and they appear to give no save to the Shaken. Round 1: five foes are Shaken (-2 to hit, -2 to saves). Round 2: five foes flee in fear. Seems too useful.
Something like a forced Focused Specialist would probably work really well in conjunction with it, though (maybe only +2 slots, not +3), since giving up three schools limits your options a lot, and Wizards are all about options.
That was just a side reflection on how to reduce the power of wizards, without having to houserule a lot of spells individually: their options are the problem, to some extent. This is meant to apply to 3.5E, since PF already nerfed some spells and defensive casting.
I also like the idea of spamming Fell Frighten Magic Missiles. Arcane Thesis: Magic Missile (probably not a great idea tbh) would make these 2nd level, and they appear to give no save to the Shaken. Round 1: five foes are Shaken (-2 to hit, -2 to saves). Round 2: five foes flee in fear. Seems too useful.
Fear effects from the same source don't stack (RC). Not that it's hard to get other sources, e.g. the Fear spell (but it's Necromancy) or Intimidate (Voice of the Dragon helps).
Negative levels do stack, so Fell Draining MMs are actually a decent (and well-known) combo. 1 negative level per round doesn't get you that far, though, so you have to Twin/Repeat/Quicken for the penalties to add up quickly enough.
Fear effects from the same source don't stack (RC).
Don't they? I always thought they did. Typically effects state when they won't let the Shaken advance to Frightened. That kind of makes fear a lot lamer.
Fell Frighten would not really be Evocation in particular anyway. Could be very nice as a debuff to ride on damage spells (hmm, Fell Frighten Manyjaws?), but it's a +2 level modifier.
Same source don't stack. But you can stack lots of different sources.
For Wizards, I often consider telling them they can only cast from their school. Would definatley make them more diverse, and they would probably still hold their own.
Ray of Enfeeblement doesn't stack with itself: penalties from the same source don't stack. There's Escalating Enfeeblement in CM, though, that you can layer on top.
I kind of thought RoE did stack. Yeah, same source shouldn't be maybe 'cos it's ability damage.
Anyway, we digress (Nightmare Spinner Fell Frighten damaging illusions - Shadow Evocation? - could be cool, though).