Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 masterjoda999 May 13, 2009 17:59:54	I was reading the archmage PrC in my DMG, and read the section on the Spell-Like Ability High Arcana. I noticed that while XP components were specifically not waived, the material components part of the spell being turned into an SLA only had a clause converting expensive material components to XP based on their price. Let's use, for example, the infamous Ice Assassin spell from Frostburn. Would archmage's spell like ability thus bypass the need for material components such as the DNA sample (I know, sounds too sci-fi when I say it like that, but it's essentially what it is) in Ice Assassin?
#2 user5127 May 13, 2009 18:09:05	I was reading the archmage PrC in my DMG, and read the section on the Spell-Like Ability High Arcana. I noticed that while XP components were specifically not waived, the material components part of the spell being turned into an SLA only had a clause converting expensive material components to XP based on their price. Let's use, for example, the infamous Ice Assassin spell from Frostburn. Would archmage's spell like ability thus bypass the need for material components such as the DNA sample (I know, sounds too sci-fi when I say it like that, but it's essentially what it is) in Ice Assassin? well, it probably would if the sample in question had little value. I don't recall a specific price tagged onto the material component of the spell in question...?
#3 true_shinken May 13, 2009 20:03:49	I was reading the archmage PrC in my DMG, and read the section on the Spell-Like Ability High Arcana. I noticed that while XP components were specifically not waived, the material components part of the spell being turned into an SLA only had a clause converting expensive material components to XP based on their price. Let's use, for example, the infamous Ice Assassin spell from Frostburn. Would archmage's spell like ability thus bypass the need for material components such as the DNA sample (I know, sounds too sci-fi when I say it like that, but it's essentially what it is) in Ice Assassin? I'm pretty sure you could do the same with Eschew Materials.
#4 masterjoda999 May 13, 2009 22:25:45	Perhaps, but I'd really much rather use something that explicitly does not use material components (spell-like ability) than something that seems to be arguing semantics (eschew materials).
#5 user5127 May 13, 2009 22:49:10	eschew + ignore material components. but having it as an SLA would do the same thing. you'd basically fire off the spell with out the component. I assume that this component doesn't have a listed price correct? I'm away from book, but if I recall correctly, the nature of a spell component pouch I think specifically says it satisfies the requirements for material components of negligable cost (ie: material components that don't specify a GP value). At least, that's how it works for fireball and so on. i dunno if it applies or not, but figured I'd mention it. RAW might say that the spell component pouch is enough.
#6 Senevri May 14, 2009 5:51:10	Wait, IIRC... Archmage's SLA does not circumvent component restrictions? Oh, wait.. it does. About as well as Eschew. . The archmage does not use any components when casting the spell, although a spell that costs XP to cast still does so and a spell with a costly material component instead costs her 10 times that amount in XP. The thing is, something being "priceless" and "having no cost" aren't exactly the same thing. Perhaps not by RAW, which doesn't put price on, say, dragon skulls, either, but "X of a God" is never cheap, I would think.
#7 dr_rocktopus May 14, 2009 14:34:14	Alert: You are traveling a dark road. explanation The technique you are using was pioneered for the development of a sirrukh-less pun-pun by the ever inventive Teilaxu_Ghola. It's pretty ridiculous even outside of that usage. It's a known trick, and widely considered a full game-break. I personally agree with Sen here and suggest that rather than lacking in value, the items you are trying to replace would in fact be priceless.
#8 risner May 14, 2009 14:44:38	Ice Assassin has expensive material components. They cost 20,000 gp. Eschew won't excuse them, and 20,000 * 10 XP is a lot of experience.
#9 masterjoda999 May 14, 2009 14:57:01	@risner: I realized that upon another reading of the archmage sla ability, only I didn't say anything on this thread, so yeah, rather lame. @Doc Roc: I hadn't actually planned upon using it in actual play, but gleemax doesn't seem to have a TO board anymore. Also, a link to that thread would be greatly appreciated.
#10 user5127 May 14, 2009 16:29:18	@risner: I realized that upon another reading of the archmage sla ability, only I didn't say anything on this thread, so yeah, rather lame. @Doc Roc: I hadn't actually planned upon using it in actual play, but gleemax doesn't seem to have a TO board anymore. Also, a link to that thread would be greatly appreciated. dude... totally at level 21 eschew + ignore material components. problem solved. (they really should have capped that epic feat on something :p)
#11 masterjoda999 May 14, 2009 18:44:01	Well, what I'm trying to do is manage it before epic levels. On that note, I saw somewhere sometime somehow mention of Geometer (CArc) using a spellglyph and achieving the same end result, just spending the 20k gp. Would that perhaps work?
#12 yawar May 14, 2009 22:36:22	Well, what I'm trying to do is manage it before epic levels. On that note, I saw somewhere sometime somehow mention of Geometer (CArc) using a spellglyph and achieving the same end result, just spending the 20k gp. Would that perhaps work? Go Venerable Dragonwrought Kobold!