Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 Arindurth Aug 30, 2012 19:52:48	I need help in stetting up my Half-Fiend character who want to be a full fiend and a Lichfiend.  I know I want him to be a wizard and a cleric.  As a Wizard I want him to be necromancer and as a cleric I want him to have the power of over the undead.  He is going to become True Necromancer (PrC; LM).  He is a 1st level character with the following unmodifed stats: Str 15; Dex 14; Con 13; Int 17; Wis 17 ; Cha 15;  If he is an demon half-fiend he wants to take over Orcus's place as master over the undead.  I am seeing him having thick muscled legs that resemembles those of a ram legs with large, black sharp-edged hooves and leathery wings. He has a fascination with death in all its forms.  He examines and studies ways one can die and kill, as well as implements of death, how the human (and nonhuman) body react/responds to the threat of death/fear reaction, tolerance to pain, survival responses, and even the philosophical concepts of death, soul, life after death and so on.
#2 StevenO Aug 30, 2012 20:14:29	What kind of "unmodified" stats are we looking at?  Am I looking at ePB 53 and going to throw Half-fiend on top of them or do they already include that bonus. So what kind of help are you looking for exactly?  Your ultimate goal would seem to be something you'll want an epic level character for but then you mention being 1st-level although there's also a +4 Level Adjustment in there.  As a PC that LA really hurts a spellcaster and then splitting you casting also cuts into that. Now I'm not nearly as hard on the True Necromancer as some people are and if you're looking at an epic character anyway I think you could do much worse.  A half-fiend ?? Cleric3/Necromancer3/TN14/Mystic Theruge 5 is an eCL 29 character who would have 20th-level casting as both a Cleric and Necromancer plus the added bonuses of TN.
#3 Arindurth Aug 30, 2012 20:52:20	What kind of "unmodified" stats are we looking at?  Am I looking at ePB 53 and going to throw Half-fiend on top of them or do they already include that bonus. So what kind of help are you looking for exactly?  Your ultimate goal would seem to be something you'll want an epic level character for but then you mention being 1st-level although there's also a +4 Level Adjustment in there.  As a PC that LA really hurts a spellcaster and then splitting you casting also cuts into that. Now I'm not nearly as hard on the True Necromancer as some people are and if you're looking at an epic character anyway I think you could do much worse.  A half-fiend ?? Cleric3/Necromancer3/TN14/Mystic Theruge 5 is an eCL 29 character who would have 20th-level casting as both a Cleric and Necromancer plus the added bonuses of TN.   When I said unmodifed I meant that I have not added the half-fiend bonuses. I use the Savage Pregression when play a half-fiend.  I am looking for the best way do this character. What is wrong with the True Necromancer?
#4 Maat_Mons Aug 30, 2012 21:13:25	My recommendation is to start with lesser tiefling (Player's Guide to Faerun, p191). It's like regular tiefling, except it's +0 LA and you're a humanoid instead of an outsider. You can later use the tiefling/half-fiend transition class, but I'd put it off until high level. At 3rd level, you can gain the necropolitan template (Libris Mortis, p114). It's +0 LA and changes your type to undead. The template can only be added to humanoids and monstrous humanoids, but lesser tiefling handles that. It's hard to tell from the table, but true necromancer doesn't advance both casting classes at levels 1, 2, 6, and 7.
#5 Arindurth Aug 30, 2012 21:38:40	If I go the necropolitan route I can not get Contagious Paralysis and Improved Paralysis.  I went with the Lichfiend becuase I want the ability to parlaysis my enemies and the the other thing that the Lichfiend gets.  How would I become a true fiend instead of a half-fiend?  Should I be a Demon, Deyil, or a Yugoloth? Where can I find info on the Yugoloth that has them as being more power like they where in 2nd Planescape for 3.5e?
#6 Slagger_the_Chuul Aug 30, 2012 21:41:48	It's quite a difficult goal, though it would become significantly easier if the true necromancer wasn't involved.  If you could go with something like the eldritch disciple or eldritch theurge from Complete Mage, you could combine warlock (to get the five CL 11+ spell-like abilities required for lichfiend) with a full casting class (to otherwise cover your necromancy needs).  Being a full fiend is expensive in terms of your Effective Character Level, and it's not technically necessary if you can otherwise achieve the requirements for becoming a lichfiend. It's not going to be a quick process no matter how you go about it, though I guess if you're expecting to replace Orcus, that's hardly surprising.
#7 Arindurth Aug 30, 2012 21:55:42	It's quite a difficult goal, though it would become significantly easier if the true necromancer wasn't involved.  If you could go with something like the eldritch disciple or eldritch theurge from Complete Mage, you could combine warlock (to get the five CL 11+ spell-like abilities required for lichfiend) with a full casting class (to otherwise cover your necromancy needs).  Being a full fiend is expensive in terms of your Effective Character Level, and it's not technically necessary if you can otherwise achieve the requirements for becoming a lichfiend. It's not going to be a quick process no matter how you go about it, though I guess if you're expecting to replace Orcus, that's hardly surprising. His name is Arindurthbefore becoming a Lichfiend and Thanatos as a Lichfiend.  I wanted something that helped my character when to came to the undead is why I choose the True Necormancer.  Necromancer and Dread Necromancer happen to two of my favorite class.  If they had the 2nd Tome of Magic Elementalist for 3.5 I would make one of my characters an Elementalist.  I have been thinking I would like to have the powers and abilities of the Ultroloth and/or the Balor.  Also I would not mind him having some cold-based abilities and powers.  I like how the warlock abilities are spell-like abilities.  Tell me what you can about the Warlock. I am think that my character as a fiend might look like the description below. A humanoid male that stand ten feet tall walks in moving with grace and ease.  His broad body is muscular with sleek muscles rippling under his bronze skin.  Protruding from his back are a pair of vast dragon-like wings.  The joints of the wings are laced with razorlike claws.  The wings crest a foot higher than the shoulders and have a wingspan of thirty feet.  Eight horns, ring his head in a crown like fashion.  His black hair reaches down to his right shoulder.  Above his large eyes, which have a vertical slit, black sclera and a blood red iris is a large thick ridged brow.  Multiple wicked chains are wrapped around his chest and torso.  Both arms are bestial in appearance.  Both massive hands have five fingers and a thumb that each end in a large sharp claw that resembles a knife blade.  Extend from the end of his spine is a six feet long tail that ends in a sharp stinger.  The thickly muscled legs resemble the legs of a ram.  The legs end in large, black sharp-edged hooves.
#8 Slagger_the_Chuul Aug 31, 2012 3:45:40	I have been thinking I would like to have the powers and abilities of the Ultroloth and/or the Balor.  Also I would not mind him having some cold-based abilities and powers.  I like how the warlock abilities are spell-like abilities.  Tell me what you can about the Warlock. The powers of various fiends are nice, but you also tend to get what you pay for, so being a very powerful fiend will cost you a lot in terms of your ECL (Effective Character Level), since you basically have some of your levels spent on being a monster. As for the warlock, it's a class from Complete Arcane that's based around using invocations (a kind of at-will spell-like ability), and there are a couple of prestige classes that were published later on in Complete Mage that combine warlock with an arcane or divine spellcaster in the same way that the true necromancer combines two spellcasting classes. If you do end up becoming a full fiend with at least five of its own at-will spell-like abilities, you don't really have as much use for levels of warlock, but if you're trying to be something like an ultroloth or balor, you'd be solidly into epic levels before you even took your first class level under normal circumstances (and there aren't a lot of ways to turn into a fiend; even Savage Species primarily mentions changing your race as a less reliable use of the wish spell).
#9 Arindurth Aug 31, 2012 7:03:48	I have been thinking I would like to have the powers and abilities of the Ultroloth and/or the Balor.  Also I would not mind him having some cold-based abilities and powers.  I like how the warlock abilities are spell-like abilities.  Tell me what you can about the Warlock. The powers of various fiends are nice, but you also tend to get what you pay for, so being a very powerful fiend will cost you a lot in terms of your ECL (Effective Character Level), since you basically have some of your levels spent on being a monster. As for the warlock, it's a class from Complete Arcane that's based around using invocations (a kind of at-will spell-like ability), and there are a couple of prestige classes that were published later on in Complete Mage that combine warlock with an arcane or divine spellcaster in the same way that the true necromancer combines two spellcasting classes. If you do end up becoming a full fiend with at least five of its own at-will spell-like abilities, you don't really have as much use for levels of warlock, but if you're trying to be something like an ultroloth or balor, you'd be solidly into epic levels before you even took your first class level under normal circumstances (and there aren't a lot of ways to turn into a fiend; even Savage Species primarily mentions changing your race as a less reliable use of the wish spell). I do want to become a full fiend and gain some abilties that a fiend does not have.  So what would be the best way to about making this character then?
#10 Arindurth Sep 14, 2012 18:10:56	Would it better if I just stayed demon or devil and my character does not become a Lichfiend?
#11 Slagger_the_Chuul Sep 14, 2012 22:13:56	Would it better if I just stayed demon or devil and my character does not become a Lichfiend? "Better" depends on your priorities.  It's certainly easier if you don't have a need for certain things (like five at-will spell-like abilities for the lichfiend), but it depends a lot on how much you really want to be a lichfiend in the first place.  It's certainly difficult if you're trying to be a full fiend and a true necromancer and a lichfiend, since you've got three competing ideas, and they all require some investment to make them work. Depending on your exact style, if your build includes divine spellcasting you might be interested in the Walker in the Waste prestige class from Sandstorm.  It's a desert-themed class which gives almost full spellcasting and turns you into a dry lich at its 10th level.
#12 Arindurth Sep 15, 2012 2:33:09	Would it better if I just stayed demon or devil and my character does not become a Lichfiend? "Better" depends on your priorities.  It's certainly easier if you don't have a need for certain things (like five at-will spell-like abilities for the lichfiend), but it depends a lot on how much you really want to be a lichfiend in the first place.  It's certainly difficult if you're trying to be a full fiend and a true necromancer and a lichfiend, since you've got three competing ideas, and they all require some investment to make them work. Depending on your exact style, if your build includes divine spellcasting you might be interested in the Walker in the Waste prestige class from Sandstorm.  It's a desert-themed class which gives almost full spellcasting and turns you into a dry lich at its 10th level. I want to be a Lichfiend so I could have some of my spell-like abilities be Necromantic in origin.  I want my character to be a necromancer as a wizard unless I go with the Dread Necromancer.  I only choose the True Necromancer because it had the Necromantic Prowess.  I plan to some how gain the Title Lord and Master of Necromancy and the Undead. When should I give my character two extra arms, wings and a a tail that ends in a poisonous stinger?
#13 Slagger_the_Chuul Sep 15, 2012 4:03:06	I want to be a Lichfiend so I could have some of my spell-like abilities be Necromantic in origin. That's not very important on a mechanical level, and flavour is generally mutable.  If the spell-like abilities are duplicating necromancy spells, they're already basically necromantic in game terms. That said, transforming yourself into some kind of undead is generally desirable if you want to demonstrate your mastery of undeath. I want my character to be a necromancer as a wizard unless I go with the Dread Necromancer.  I only choose the True Necromancer because it had the Necromantic Prowess.  I plan to some how gain the Title Lord and Master of Necromancy and the Undead. The main downside I see with dread necromancer is that it's 20th-level ability is only granted to humanoids, so it's something you miss out on if you're a half-fiend or full fiend. When should I give my character two extra arms, wings and a a tail that ends in a poisonous stinger? Were you currently planning to get them from being a fiend or half-fiend, or by some other means?
#14 Arindurth Sep 15, 2012 5:24:52	I want to be a Lichfiend so I could have some of my spell-like abilities be Necromantic in origin. That's not very important on a mechanical level, and flavour is generally mutable.  If the spell-like abilities are duplicating necromancy spells, they're already basically necromantic in game terms. That said, transforming yourself into some kind of undead is generally desirable if you want to demonstrate your mastery of undeath. I want my character to be a necromancer as a wizard unless I go with the Dread Necromancer.  I only choose the True Necromancer because it had the Necromantic Prowess.  I plan to some how gain the Title Lord and Master of Necromancy and the Undead. The main downside I see with dread necromancer is that it's 20th-level ability is only granted to humanoids, so it's something you miss out on if you're a half-fiend or full fiend. When should I give my character two extra arms, wings and a a tail that ends in a poisonous stinger? Were you currently planning to get them from being a fiend or half-fiend, or by some other means? The extra two arms and the tail that ends in a poisonous stinger I want to get as a fiend.  I would like to as soon as possible to be able to get a pair of wings or start out with the winged temple. I also would like some help in making his description as a Lichfiend more more evil looking with out adding goat legs, rams legs, or hooves if possible. Thanatos is a figure in the shape of a nine feet tall humanoid with four arms.  His icy cold body is bony and terribly thin with sickly yellow-green shriveled (mummy-like) skin tightly drawn across bones and thin muscles.  Protruding from his back are a pair of vast rotting dragon-like wings.  The joints of the wings are laced with razorlike claws.  The wings crest a foot higher than the shoulders and have a wingspan of twenty-seven feet.  His head is monstrous in appearance and a nauseating sight to behold.  The bones on the  head are stripped of all flesh and muscle revealing bare bones.  Cold, evil, unnatural light glows from within the eye sockets.  The head has long powerful, jaws rimmed with six inches long sharp fang-like teeth.  The arms are covered in rotting, gangrenous skin with areas of bone showing through the skin.  Extend from the end of his spine is a six feet long tail that ends in a sharp stinger.  The armor he wears appears as a large rib cage complete with spinal column and shoulder blades.  The bone the armor is made from appears to be human in origin, and is bleached white.  He wears a billowing hooded black funereal robe over his armor with a belt of skulls.  The left side of the robe is rotting and tattered.
#15 Arindurth Sep 26, 2012 20:13:38	I found on this page a way in Pathfinder to become a full demon (www.d20pfsrd.com/bestiary/monster-listin...).  What do you think of using it to become a demon?  What PrC Class would be the best for my chracter since he is going to become a Cleric/Wizard?