Beguiler - Silent but deadly - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Beguiler - Silent but deadly

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
arcaniss_ner
Aug 27, 2008 16:28:59 Ok so for my next campaign i wanted to try a Beguiler, we are using the 3d6 no choice system meaning the first 3d6 goes into str, second into dex, 3rd con and so forth.
I'm gonna play a Whisper Gnome with the Dark Template mostly doing this for flavor rather then optimization.
Ability Scores are as follow(including racial bonuses)>
STR 9
DEX 19
CON 13
INT 16
WIS 10
CHA 12
I generate my ability scores before choosing a class so it was either Beguiler or Rogue and I like the beguilers concept more but am thinking about multiclassing into a Rogue to be able to whip out some SA but i'm only considering (why would i be here otherwise?)
Edit: also considering Shadowcraft Mage.

Also I'm unsure on how i should play my little beguiler, need Tips!
any advice on what i should do with him or how i should level him would be welcomed and please DONT all say go here > Beguilers Handbook
I've read it through, i like it, it's the main reason why i took Whisper gnome and the dark template, but i need MOAR. I'm new to the game only been playing for about a year but my 3.5 supplement collection is quite big so dont worry about me not owning it, and if i don't I'm sure my friends do.

If you need more info please don't hesitate to ask and sorry if my English isn't perfect I'm Icelandic so not native. ;)
#2
ninjarabbit
Aug 27, 2008 19:24:55 Don't multiclass with rouge or anything else that won't advance your spellcasting, you'll just gimp your spellcasting.

A level of mindbender with the mindsight feat (Lords of Madness) is usually a good bet.

I'm a big fan of the Obtain Familiar feat for beguilers since your familiar will have the same skill ranks that your do.
#3
mdsummer
Aug 28, 2008 0:07:11 If your DM is loose with financials, Dual Wand Wielder with max UMD sounds fun.
#4
brainpiercing
Aug 28, 2008 6:58:32 To get Sneak attack:
Martial Study/Stance for Asassin's Stance (may not be necessary depending on DM interpretation)

Dip Divine Oracle for the +2CL on Divination, then take 2 or 3 Levels of Unseen Seer, not too many, just to get "Hunter's Eye" with your Advanced Learning. You may get away with not having to take Martial Study/Stance if your DM allows you to have no Sneak Attack dice count as zero, therefore allowing it to be raised with the Damage Bonus class feature. Also, any SA-dice you get with Hunter's Eye could be increased with the one D6 from Unseen Seer.

Another option would be dipping Mindbender, as in the guide, mostly only for Telepathy.

That build might look like this:
Beguiler7/Mindbender1/Beguiler Lvl 8/Divine Oracle1/Unseen Seer2/ whatever rest. Maybe Shadow Adept?

For versatility think about dipping Binder, and going into Anima Mage. Cha is an issue, but perhaps not overly so.
#5
vangrue
Aug 29, 2008 0:02:09 Your Charisma is a little lower than I'd like to see personally, but not a huge problem. Once you get third level casting, not even having 8 CHA would keep someone from believing most of your bluffs since you get Glibness. Having 16 Int would limit you to 6th level spells if you didn't have access to Int-boosting items, and if anything ever made those stop working, you'd probably have bigger problems anyway.

With a Beguiler, try to have a backup for if you're ever without your magic (As a customized Gnome Beguiler, I was terrible in combat during an adventure in Sigil without magic. Luckily I had my Intelligence, Charisma and fantastic Bluff and Diplomacy bonuses). For you, make sure to have some nice ranged weaponry. You've got an advantage over wizards and most other spellcasters since you're a little more durable.

I imagine this is why you wanted to m/c into Rogue, but that would indeed be a trap, as others have pointed out. Seeking out Shadowcraft Mage is always a good idea for any Gnome Beguiler, but the other suggestions aren't bad either. It's where I'm taking my character, though it'll be a long time before I get to play it again.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 arcaniss_ner Aug 27, 2008 16:28:59	Ok so for my next campaign i wanted to try a Beguiler, we are using the 3d6 no choice system meaning the first 3d6 goes into str, second into dex, 3rd con and so forth. I'm gonna play a Whisper Gnome with the Dark Template mostly doing this for flavor rather then optimization. Ability Scores are as follow(including racial bonuses)> STR 9 DEX 19 CON 13 INT 16 WIS 10 CHA 12 I generate my ability scores before choosing a class so it was either Beguiler or Rogue and I like the beguilers concept more but am thinking about multiclassing into a Rogue to be able to whip out some SA but i'm only considering (why would i be here otherwise?) Edit: also considering Shadowcraft Mage. Also I'm unsure on how i should play my little beguiler, need Tips! any advice on what i should do with him or how i should level him would be welcomed and please DONT all say go here > Beguilers Handbook I've read it through, i like it, it's the main reason why i took Whisper gnome and the dark template, but i need MOAR. I'm new to the game only been playing for about a year but my 3.5 supplement collection is quite big so dont worry about me not owning it, and if i don't I'm sure my friends do. If you need more info please don't hesitate to ask and sorry if my English isn't perfect I'm Icelandic so not native. ;)
#2 ninjarabbit Aug 27, 2008 19:24:55	Don't multiclass with rouge or anything else that won't advance your spellcasting, you'll just gimp your spellcasting. A level of mindbender with the mindsight feat (Lords of Madness) is usually a good bet. I'm a big fan of the Obtain Familiar feat for beguilers since your familiar will have the same skill ranks that your do.
#3 mdsummer Aug 28, 2008 0:07:11	If your DM is loose with financials, Dual Wand Wielder with max UMD sounds fun.
#4 brainpiercing Aug 28, 2008 6:58:32	To get Sneak attack: Martial Study/Stance for Asassin's Stance (may not be necessary depending on DM interpretation) Dip Divine Oracle for the +2CL on Divination, then take 2 or 3 Levels of Unseen Seer, not too many, just to get "Hunter's Eye" with your Advanced Learning. You may get away with not having to take Martial Study/Stance if your DM allows you to have no Sneak Attack dice count as zero, therefore allowing it to be raised with the Damage Bonus class feature. Also, any SA-dice you get with Hunter's Eye could be increased with the one D6 from Unseen Seer. Another option would be dipping Mindbender, as in the guide, mostly only for Telepathy. That build might look like this: Beguiler7/Mindbender1/Beguiler Lvl 8/Divine Oracle1/Unseen Seer2/ whatever rest. Maybe Shadow Adept? For versatility think about dipping Binder, and going into Anima Mage. Cha is an issue, but perhaps not overly so.
#5 vangrue Aug 29, 2008 0:02:09	Your Charisma is a little lower than I'd like to see personally, but not a huge problem. Once you get third level casting, not even having 8 CHA would keep someone from believing most of your bluffs since you get Glibness. Having 16 Int would limit you to 6th level spells if you didn't have access to Int-boosting items, and if anything ever made those stop working, you'd probably have bigger problems anyway. With a Beguiler, try to have a backup for if you're ever without your magic (As a customized Gnome Beguiler, I was terrible in combat during an adventure in Sigil without magic. Luckily I had my Intelligence, Charisma and fantastic Bluff and Diplomacy bonuses). For you, make sure to have some nice ranged weaponry. You've got an advantage over wizards and most other spellcasters since you're a little more durable. I imagine this is why you wanted to m/c into Rogue, but that would indeed be a trap, as others have pointed out. Seeking out Shadowcraft Mage is always a good idea for any Gnome Beguiler, but the other suggestions aren't bad either. It's where I'm taking my character, though it'll be a long time before I get to play it again.