Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 wrathborn Mar 17, 2008 18:30:32	Defense, Attack rolls, Ability checks, Skill checks. All of these things are weakened as you slide down the condition track. And when you've hit the 5 level, you're out cold for 10 minutes before you can recover. Now, ya' all probably know this. What may have slipped your mind is that its nasty easy to pull some one down the condition track, very quickly. Scoundrel has Dastardly Strike, make an attack when the enemy has being denied dex, move him one step down the condition track Soldier has Stunning strike when you do damage with a melee attack, move the enemy one step down the condition track if you exceed the targets damage threshold (Remember this number can be lowered by 10, and is often very close to the enemies normal Ref defence). Bounty hunter has Hunters Mark, if you do damage and aim with a ranged attack, move the enemy down 1 step of the condition track. Gunslinger has debilitating shot, if you do damage and aim with a ranged attack, move the enemy down 1 step of the condition track. So, at the end of the day, using a ranged weapon, we can lower the enemy down 3 steps of condition track (with a single shot) on the first round of combat. 2 steps on the next round, and 2 steps again on the round after that. So how does that look in actual? Bad guy is losses Init. You shoot him. Bad guy now has -5 on pretty much everything. Bad guy panic's spends 3 swift actions to recover a condition track. You shoot him again. he now has -10 on everything He recovers again You shoot again He's now out cold for 10 minutes. Of course he might not recover, he might try to run. But thats ok. We have a sniper rilfe after all. Or maybe he'll try to hit us? Yeah, good luck with -5 to hit. Now for the amusing part of condition tracks. Lets say Bad Guy panics after first shot. Runs off and jumps in his vehicle. Lets say an AT-AT. Now Condition tracks work in strange ways with vehicles, they stack you see? Your condition stacks with the vehicles condition, so... Bad guy still at -5 suddenly hear's a sound of a single blaster round slaming into the side of the AT-AT. Suddenly the AT-AT (and everyone else on it) is at -5. Our poor bad guy, just got knocked out. (Or depending on your reading is now at -10, and rather useless) One more round into that AT-AT (from a blaster no less) will drop it. Now before ya'all go saying thats total haxor (which it is). Let us remember, that luke used the same awesomeness that is the condition track to take down an AT-AT at hoth. You think he used that lightsaber to cut a couple wires? Heck no, he spent a couple of actions hacking away using attacks to effect the condition track. So I present to this Co-Board that the targeting of the condition track, is the most combat effective way to kill.
#2 inkubus Mar 17, 2008 19:34:40	You forgot about inspire zeal and stun weapons. That way you can knock your opponents 5 steps down the CT with one shot in ranged combat or 4 steps in melee...
#3 farmboymdp Mar 17, 2008 22:03:24	In an IRL game I play a Force sorcerer with Skill Focus (Use the Force) and a completed Destiny with a bonus to UtF. I specialize in using Force Stun to bring down powerful enemies, and find the Condition Track very... helpful. Also, I've always wanted to play a Wookiee Soldier with Devastating Attack and Stunning Strike.
#4 wrathborn Mar 17, 2008 23:05:31	You forgot about inspire zeal and stun weapons. That way you can knock your opponents 5 steps down the CT with one shot in ranged combat or 4 steps in melee... I forgot nothing, I didn't know. Well I left out inspire Zeal for a reason, after all, you're not your own ally. As for stun weapons, I didn't have a clue. Edit* And after reading stun weapons, there not so grand. After all you still have to do enough damage to by-pass the damage threshold, and even by lowering that its rather hard to do.
#5 Nelyo Mar 18, 2008 5:13:22	Not trying to rain on your parade or anything, but this isn't exactly late-breaking news. There have already been several threads taking advantage of this. Lots of people toss Stun in, because at higher levels with (Greater) Devastating strike in the build it starts getting easy to top someone's DT, especially if you are using the options which Bounty Hunter/Gunslinger give you to increase your damage. As far as the vehicle thing goes, I could be wrong as I'm AFB but I believe it states that Dastardly Strike, Debilitating Shot, and Hunter's Mark don't work against vehicles. Cutting an AT-AT open with a lightsaber and then tossing an explosive charge inside is one thing, bringing it to a complete halt from 50 paces with a sporting blaster when its armor is "too strong for [airspeeder] blasters" is quite another. This also prevents a freighter from suddenly opening fire on a star destroyer with its shields down and disabling it.
#6 wrathborn Mar 18, 2008 9:12:24	Not trying to rain on your parade or anything, but this isn't exactly late-breaking news. There have already been several threads taking advantage of this. Lots of people toss Stun in, because at higher levels with (Greater) Devastating strike in the build it starts getting easy to top someone's DT, especially if you are using the options which Bounty Hunter/Gunslinger give you to increase your damage. As far as the vehicle thing goes, I could be wrong as I'm AFB but I believe it states that Dastardly Strike, Debilitating Shot, and Hunter's Mark don't work against vehicles. Cutting an AT-AT open with a lightsaber and then tossing an explosive charge inside is one thing, bringing it to a complete halt from 50 paces with a sporting blaster when its armor is "too strong for [airspeeder] blasters" is quite another. This also prevents a freighter from suddenly opening fire on a star destroyer with its shields down and disabling it. I don't want to sound rude, but yeah no. There is no line in any of those talents saying they don't work on vechicles infact the closest condition put on them is from Gunslingers "all talents only work with pistols and rifles" And the reason I choose an AT-AT is because with greater penetrating attack (a fair choice for a talent) a standard blaster CAN punch through its armor, for like 1 or 2 damage. How much damage do you need to do to activate Hunters mark and Debilitating Shot? Awnser "Any" As for condition track being well known about, sure it is. But I have failed to see it used to the extend that it can be. Infact I have failed to see it even used apart from the comments reguarding force powers.
#7 inkubus Mar 18, 2008 10:29:14	In Starships of the Galaxy on page 16 it is explicitely stated that neither dastardly strike, nor hunter's mark nor debilitating shot will work on vehicles and objects in general...
#8 darthnizzy_dup Mar 18, 2008 15:51:24	In Starships of the Galaxy on page 16 it is explicitely stated that neither dastardly strike, nor hunter's mark nor debilitating shot will work on vehicles and objects in general... And regardless of whether they would or not with starship weapons, a GM is orchesrating his own game's demise by allowing personal wepaons tom damage vehicles in such a way. The ONLY expection may be heavy weapons knocking Walkers/Speeders/other atmospheric craft down the condition track, but even some of the heavier vehicles would be more or less immunue to it from the likes of rocket launchers and heavy repeaters. If that was the case, I'd just instal docking guns on my starships and man them. Much less cost for the same impact.
#9 Nelyo Mar 18, 2008 22:01:54	In Starships of the Galaxy on page 16 it is explicitely stated that neither dastardly strike, nor hunter's mark nor debilitating shot will work on vehicles and objects in general... Right, that's what I was thinking of, but somehow I forgot to add the "in SotG" qualifier.
#10 wrathborn Mar 18, 2008 22:11:39	In Starships of the Galaxy on page 16 it is explicitely stated that neither dastardly strike, nor hunter's mark nor debilitating shot will work on vehicles and objects in general... huh, Neither my GM or I have SotG yet. I always found it annoying that things that should be errata instead end up in another book. Oh well, Raw is raw, and while not effecting vehicles does weaken the attacks, it still doesn't reduce there strength in ground combat.
#11 wraithcat Mar 20, 2008 18:39:38	Do you have any builds to take advantage of this phenomenon?
#12 Nelyo Mar 20, 2008 21:22:38	I made a scout sniper build using this principle, but it looks like that thread has been archived. The basic idea was to combine Dastardly Strike, Debilitating Shot, and Hunter's mark along with Far Shot and a sniper rifle (see RavingDork's errata thread) to enable attacks at no penalty from up to 300 squares away that can drop the target 3 or 4 steps down the condition track at once. I ended up having to put in skill focus (perception) and give him a sensor pack in order to be able to reliably spot targets at that range, but that just means that it will be very hard for his target to find him. Melee is another good way to use condition track attacks, as Acrobatic Strike + Power Attack with a two-handed stun weapon like a Force Pike makes topping their Damage Threshold pretty easy for -2 steps, and if you throw stealth, Dastardly Strike, and Stunning Strike on top of that you can drop someone down 4 steps at once with a hidden attack, and the -10 on checks from being down that low makes you almost guaranteed to beat them on Initiative so that you can finish the job before they can react.