The following trick is level 5 on the scale.
The Levels of Optimization
0 - Willful Bonehead: "I'm a ROLE-player!" Misses the point of the Stormwind Fallacy, and will ignore optimal design choices entirely. Often stubbornly against the very idea of optimization. Frequently uses terms like "munchkin" and "min/maxer" to describe those who do optimize, and "role-player, not ROLL-player" about him/herself. Sees the idea of playing a character with a story somehow antithetical to systemological considerations about function (e.g., "My Wizard took WP Focus because he got a dagger from his dad that symbolizes his clan and heritage, and he uses it whenever possible - even though he's not the best melee fighter!"). These guys have trouble understanding that a Ninja isn't a Ninja because he SAYS he is a Ninja (or his class is CALLED Ninja), but because he can hide in shadows, turn invisible, strike at pressure points, climb walls like a spider, disguise himself, etc.
1 - Greenhorn: "Wait - what do you mean I take an Aoo? What's that?" Has a sub-optimal or incomplete understanding of the rules, but is open to the idea of optimization (though he or she may find more optimal builds somewhat intimidating). Doesn't know what works together well - but will generally attempt to make choices to improve his or her character. Be nice to them - we all were there once, and they're willing to learn - remember, Greenhorns are the optimizers of the future!
2 - Novice: "Aww . . . he's cute! Like a puppy!" Has either gained knowledge from the boards or figured out some decent choices on his or her own. This is the level at which some basic understanding of what works and doesn't work is put into practice; low-level casters take spells like Glitterdust and Color Spray, melee types ignore choices like WP Focus in favor of Power Attack and classes granting pounce, etc. The level at which most informed gamers play.
3 - Practical Optimizer: "Slick" This is the level at which optimizers enjoy respect without starting to seem too threatening. Players at this level have gone beyond "basic" strategy to consider larger-picture character design goals. A Practical Optimizer tends to plan his or her character's development from the starting level of play through level 20, taking into consideration feat, maneuver, class, and ability choices to attempt to optimize effectiveness at most levels. Has an extensive knowledge of not only basic rules, but of supplemental rules (Incarnum, Martial Adepts, Psionics, etc.), and tends to be consulted by other players for advice on "tricks" that can allow for cross-book (and even cross-setting) synergies that prove extra effective.
4 - Creative Optimizer: "Mild Cheddar" Sharp, tangy, and a lovely complement to any sandwich - providing you have the palate! A Creative Optimizer's builds become even more elaborate by using "tricks" - bags full of explosive runes, necromantic exploding rat-bags, dust eggs from Oriental Adventures, Font of Inspiration for tons of standard actions on a Factotum, Frozen Wildshape for Cryo-Hydra form on Druids, etc. Tricks at this level are unquestionably legal, but often intimidate inexperienced DMs, and can prove difficult to balance without a party of similarly savvy players - the level at which some people start to get annoyed with you, and their unspoken rules prejudices come to the fore (in other words, because what you do is CREATIVE, not the standard level 3 Druid, they start saying no, but providing no logical reason why not). This is the level at which "new" or "innovative" combinations of feats, spells, classes, and abilities start to emerge.
5 - Theoretical Optimizer: "Limburger" This is when the stink of cheese gets overpowering (but many prefer strong flavors!). At this level of optimization, the flimsy fallacy of "balance" in d20 falls completely apart. Optimizers operating at this level ferret out the semantic and systemological faults of the rulebooks and exploit them, doing the equivalent of a post-modernist deconstruction of the game. Builds at this level take advantage of infinite loops, untyped bonuses (such as aid another), or unclear wording, and often result in new "world records." This kind of optimization is pure mental exercise, and is almost never suited for any kind of practical play.
1 - Greenhorn: "Wait - what do you mean I take an Aoo? What's that?" Has a sub-optimal or incomplete understanding of the rules, but is open to the idea of optimization (though he or she may find more optimal builds somewhat intimidating). Doesn't know what works together well - but will generally attempt to make choices to improve his or her character. Be nice to them - we all were there once, and they're willing to learn - remember, Greenhorns are the optimizers of the future!
2 - Novice: "Aww . . . he's cute! Like a puppy!" Has either gained knowledge from the boards or figured out some decent choices on his or her own. This is the level at which some basic understanding of what works and doesn't work is put into practice; low-level casters take spells like Glitterdust and Color Spray, melee types ignore choices like WP Focus in favor of Power Attack and classes granting pounce, etc. The level at which most informed gamers play.
3 - Practical Optimizer: "Slick" This is the level at which optimizers enjoy respect without starting to seem too threatening. Players at this level have gone beyond "basic" strategy to consider larger-picture character design goals. A Practical Optimizer tends to plan his or her character's development from the starting level of play through level 20, taking into consideration feat, maneuver, class, and ability choices to attempt to optimize effectiveness at most levels. Has an extensive knowledge of not only basic rules, but of supplemental rules (Incarnum, Martial Adepts, Psionics, etc.), and tends to be consulted by other players for advice on "tricks" that can allow for cross-book (and even cross-setting) synergies that prove extra effective.
4 - Creative Optimizer: "Mild Cheddar" Sharp, tangy, and a lovely complement to any sandwich - providing you have the palate! A Creative Optimizer's builds become even more elaborate by using "tricks" - bags full of explosive runes, necromantic exploding rat-bags, dust eggs from Oriental Adventures, Font of Inspiration for tons of standard actions on a Factotum, Frozen Wildshape for Cryo-Hydra form on Druids, etc. Tricks at this level are unquestionably legal, but often intimidate inexperienced DMs, and can prove difficult to balance without a party of similarly savvy players - the level at which some people start to get annoyed with you, and their unspoken rules prejudices come to the fore (in other words, because what you do is CREATIVE, not the standard level 3 Druid, they start saying no, but providing no logical reason why not). This is the level at which "new" or "innovative" combinations of feats, spells, classes, and abilities start to emerge.
5 - Theoretical Optimizer: "Limburger" This is when the stink of cheese gets overpowering (but many prefer strong flavors!). At this level of optimization, the flimsy fallacy of "balance" in d20 falls completely apart. Optimizers operating at this level ferret out the semantic and systemological faults of the rulebooks and exploit them, doing the equivalent of a post-modernist deconstruction of the game. Builds at this level take advantage of infinite loops, untyped bonuses (such as aid another), or unclear wording, and often result in new "world records." This kind of optimization is pure mental exercise, and is almost never suited for any kind of practical play.
Where's Flyby Breath from?
Of course, if you can provide a rationale as to why infinite free actions is 'reasonable' that your DM will accept....
Problem #1: Savage Species is 3.0. I've never yet played with a DM who let 3.0 and 3.5 mix, and I'm sure I'm not the only one like that!
Problem #2: The free actions of 3.0 generally become swift actions in 3.5. One per round.
The cheese fondue comes from mixing terms from two different editions.
But yeah, there's always something you can do to prevent something from working. Funny thing is, I've never played in a game that DIDN'T mix 3.0 and 3.5 - especially since it's explicit on the WotC site that if something hasn't been updated for 3.5, it stands as is - and counts as 3.5.
It is cute, isn't it? I think the broken-ness comes from where ALL broken-ness comes from: game designers who either 1) didn't know much about the rules outside of the book they were writing and/or 2) didn't forsee all the future developments in the mix.
Funny thing is, I've never played in a game that DIDN'T mix 3.0 and 3.5 - especially since it's explicit on the WotC site that if something hasn't been updated for 3.5, it stands as is - and counts as 3.5.
Same here. I myself, as a DM, allow 3.0 material assuming it hasn't been errataed or reprinted. I've always found it odd to see people who say "almost no DMs allow 3.0 material in a 3.5 game."
1) Is the action made up of other free actions (even if those actions aren't actually considered in a round)?
2) Can such things be performed multiple times simultaneously or near-simultaneously?
If yes to 1, or no to 2, then the free action may only be performed once during the round.
If no to 1, and yes to 2, I would also recommend a limit of using the same free action no more than 3 times a round, no matter what that free action is.
This is realistic if you think about it. A dragon breathing a constant trail of flame on the ground below it as it passes. Works, no?
Heh heh...
Where's Flyby Breath from?
Dragonlance Campaign Setting. ;)
"I shot an arrow I know not where. Oh there it is." Looking at arrow shaped boulder the size of a large creature.:D
In short, good work and nice build! You deserve a cookie!!!
I was happy to find the trick. Now I gotta get someone to let me play it! :D
It's not broken . . . unless it gets within 30 ft. of you and gets to go . . .
DM: Ok, you have slain the troll and obtained the ring of wrath you promised to obtain for Anastrana Trangralo. What do you do now?
Pun Pun: I sit in the corner and begin to exploit an infinite loophole involving myself and my familiar that will, slowly but surely, make me a GOD.
DM: Um... I don't think so.
Pun Pun: But it is totally legit! See how this works...
DM: I don't care, no exploiting infinite loops in this game!
Pun Pun: Fine, I will wait until we start our next session to become a god.
DM:
:headexplo 
Other Players::hoppingma
Now, if you use your build, you have the following advantages:
- Your build isn't famous ( less chance the DM won't see the signs of an uber build)
- Your build begins at level 1 ( so when the DM says you can't use your build, your character doesn't lose much versitility and you may not have to remake it )
- Most DMs only look briefly at the sheets. They won't stare at it for hours and make sure there is no exploits.
- Finally, they won't expect this type of stuff from a level 1 build, so they probably won't think about the possibility of your build being so broken. And unlike pun pun, it doesn't require in game acts, therefore they can't stop it before you show off your characters full potential.
Now, imagine using this build with the intent of making your group laugh. Imagine, one minute you begin a new game AS A TINY ANIMAL, and the next, you destroy a whole squad of enemys in one turn. Everybody would talk about it for weeks, although you would probaly have to remake your sheet.
What DM would allow that build in their game?
Your build is extremly powerful, as well as the lowest level build that I have seen that could, in theory, take on unlimited ememys and win. Additionally, it is new, unexpected, and quite funny to imagine. Think of a bird destroying thousands of grim faced footsoldiers as they move towards their destination. Sure they could fire arrows at it, but not without killing more of their men. Perhaps they fire a hail of arrows at it, kill thousands of their own troops, and impale the bird firty times, but if it was a high level, then with all its hp it STILL comes after them. Then, it flies toward the archers... and they break ranks and run all over the place! :D
In short, don't underestimate your build. Think of this build with some extra levels and feats! It is the newest broken build. And in my humble opinion it deserves to be remembered along with Pun Pun and the King of Smack.
Seriously though, I like the build, the imagery is great, and I actually might attempt it in my next game....followed shortly by dice being thrown at me and a new character sheet being written up. Regardless of this, is it really that rare that people find loopholes?
Geez guys, get a room... :D
Seriously though, I like the build, the imagery is great, and I actually might attempt it in my next game....followed shortly by dice being thrown at me and a new character sheet being written up. Regardless of this, is it really that rare that people find loopholes?
lol...
yeah ok point taken :D
I'll shut up now ;)
Another thing you can do, although I don't have the books infront of me and don't have the names, is use a candle to summon a creature that grants three wishes and then to use one wish to produce another candle.
Other than those two, no other endless loops come to mind. Im sure theres others, but I can't list any of them. What makes this so great is that this loop can be used at level one, and it is the first loop that I have seen that kicks in so early. Additionally, it is quite powerful. There is certainly other loops, but this loop is powerful, funny, and unique. That is why it is so great.
The omniscifer uses an infinite damage loop (to himself) coupled with a delay death spell to gain +infinite to all skills, doable at level 4.
The 1d2 crusader uses a feat from C.Champion and the Crusader ability Aura of Chaos to gain infinite damage on any melee attack made with a weapon that does 1d2 damage, achievable at level 12 or 14 (not exactly sure).
The Beast allows somebody to pump their constitution up to arbitrarily high levels, given the time to do so. Using the Shambling Mound's "Immunity to Electicity" EX ability (which requires either MoMF or Master Transmorgafist, among others) to get, you can gain +1d4 con per round, every round that you take electrical damage, and only lose 24 points per day (one per hour). Achievable at variable levels, depending on what route you take to get in... I got it at level 12 with a druid/MoMF, and am currently level 15 (Druid 5/MoMF 7/deepwarden 2/warshaper 1) with 45 billion HP, 1.5 billion to AC, fort saves, will saves, and concentration checks. I'm working on adding my con bonus to other things, although I haven't figured out how yet.
But yes, this one is quite impressive, and I would rank it up with Pun Pun and Omni. As far as usefulness goes... it's not as impressive as the results of either of the above two, but it is achievable at level one without dubious rules interpretations... beyond the whole "how many free actions" bit.
With the necro of this thread I found this build intriguing. Could anyone help with the actual specifics of this build? Like where I could find the class, and race? And are both the feats from Savage Species?