Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 10:13:28	I am playing in a dragon hunting campaign and unfortunately I have little to no experience fighting dragons, so I was hoping I could get some pointers on my spell list My class levels are Cloistered Cleric 5(Lawful good)/Divine oracle 2/Thamaugaurist 3. We currently have a spellwarp sniper, a paladin sorcerer gish, and a rogue/hordestealer (I dont really know the exact levels though) My domains are: Oracle, Dream, Knowledge, summoning (I can also spontaneously cast knowledge domain spells/via feat) 0th (6) Create Water x2 Detect Magic X2 Read Magic x1 Detect Poison x1 1st (6+1) Ebon Eyes x2 Omen of Peril x1 Shield of Faith x1 Command x2 D:Idenfity 2nd (6+1) Eagle's Splendor x1 Animalistic Power x2 Spiritual Weapon x2 Owl's Wisdom x1 D: Summon Monster II 3rd (5+1) Water Breathing x1 Conviction, Mass x1 Resist Enery, Mass x1 Mark of Doom x2 D: Deep Slumber 4th (4+1) Shield of Faith, Mass x1 Summon Monster IV x1 Freedom of Movement x1 Delay Death x1 D: Phantasmal Killer 5th (3+1) Sanctuary, Mass x1 Righteous Wrath of the Faithful x1 Summon Bralani x1 D: Summon Monster V I realize some of these spells will not be effective on dragons (IE: Deep slumber) but I dont know what type of minions the dragons will have. I have access to basically all the "completes" PHB 1 and 2, spellcompendium and various eberron books. Note I'm going for more of a utility/summonig build rather than offensive since we already have 2 DPS in the party.
#2 frerezar Dec 05, 2008 10:22:29	There are a lto pf dragon oriented spels, like hide from dragons, dodge breath weapon. Energy inmunity is a must obviously (or any kind of resistance). For an item i would suggest ring of evasion. Slow should stop the dragon from making his ten thousand attacks against your party. So if some of those are not clerical spells you might want to make a custom domain vida divine magician. Those are my two cents
#3 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 10:25:57	Well I already have a form of evasion via divine oracle and my domains are stuck the way they are since we have already started playing the campaign (we just tracked down the dragon (black) last session and we will hopefully be fighting him this session)
#4 gilfalas_elaandrin Dec 05, 2008 11:30:05	I beleive Mass Resist Energy is 4th or 5th level. It is a must have if your going after dragons as you can get your whole party with one spell and it lasts a good 10 minutes per level. I don't remember if there is a clerical version but Assay Spell Resistance is a must have for all casters. A no save, no SR spell that adds +10 to your spell penetration rolls for one creature is too good to ever pass up. The previously mentioned Energy Immunity is also worth it. Also, if you can, flip through the Draconomicon, Races of the Dragon and Dragon Magic for more spells that would be a real help against dragons. Free Action is also invaluable as it stops dragons from using grapple combat on you, which frankly nearly no adventuer can hope to win due to their Str and size. I believe there is a 3rd level spell in PHB 2 that is called Mark of Doom. It is no save, no SR and causes 1d6 holy damage every time the target attacks, casts an offensive spell or does anything that harms another creature. Always a nice bit of extra, especially when a creature has a lot of attacks per round.
#5 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 11:51:20	thanks for the input, I can only find divine retaliation in the PHB 2 and it is limited to when they make a melee attack against me and it requires an attack roll. unless you were thinking of a different spell. Edit: I found it, it is in complete champion though it allows saves and SR, and it is only discharged once.
#6 phaedrusxy Dec 05, 2008 12:14:18	I'd stick Divination and True Seeing in your 4th and 5th domain slots. Why Mass Shield of Faith and 2x normal Shield of Faith?
#7 gilfalas_elaandrin Dec 05, 2008 12:26:52	thanks for the input, I can only find divine retaliation in the PHB 2 and it is limited to when they make a melee attack against me and it requires an attack roll. unless you were thinking of a different spell. Edit: I found it, it is in complete champion though it allows saves and SR, and it is only discharged once. Sorry the spell is called Mark of Doom, it is 3rd level and in the PHB 2. Otherwise it is as I stated, 1D6 on the enemy every time they do anything offensive or harmful, no SR, no Save and has a decent duration. Edit: Thats what I get for trying to post off memory. Should have checked my characters spell notes for the book and page hehe.
#8 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 12:48:11	I'd stick Divination and True Seeing in your 4th and 5th domain slots. Why Mass Shield of Faith and 2x normal Shield of Faith? I wasnt sure what to fill it with, so I figured for a back up in case of a dispel. Just to reiterate I took the spontaneous domain feat (Knowledge) so I can spend a turn attempt to cast domain spells spontaneously. that why I didnt prepare true seeing or divination as for Mark of Doom, I finally found it and it is an amazing spell thanks for pointing it out, for reference though its in the PHB 2
#9 gilfalas_elaandrin Dec 05, 2008 13:02:27	as for Mark of Doom, I finally found it and it is an amazing spell thanks for pointing it out, for reference though its in the PHB 2 Yeah it is not a monster spell but for 3rd level, and no way to defend against it, it's not shabby at all. Can really chew up a duel wield enemey if they get a lot of attacks. And the longer the fight gets the better the spell gets since it has no die/damage limitations, only rounds. Assuming a dragon does Claw/Claw/Bite/Tail/Wing buffet x 2 twice then he has taken 12D6 right there with no chance to defend. That alone beats out your fireballs and lightning bolts, especially if you take into acount there is no save for half. Use a rod of maximise and that gets even better.
#10 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 13:04:43	I updated my spell list to include the suggestions from this thread and bonus spell ( I forgot to account for high wisdom before)
#11 volatris Dec 05, 2008 14:13:14	Dragons are easy to kill, just hard to survive, so I like to maximize my defense: I'd strongly recommend two each of: Mass Conviction Recitation Mass Resist Energy If you can take Protection Devotion, it's a great source of sacred AC (relatively rare) for your party.
#12 frerezar Dec 05, 2008 14:28:54	I still think slow could save you a word of hurt. With assay SR it shouldn't be problem. That covers the attacks, the energy inmunity o resistance takes care of te breath. Just throw in some bonuses against fear effects for the whole party (there isa ton of those) and you will be fighing the equivlent of a zombie lizard in no time
#13 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 15:09:46	I still think slow could save you a word of hurt. With assay SR it shouldn't be problem. That covers the attacks, the energy inmunity o resistance takes care of te breath. Just throw in some bonuses against fear effects for the whole party (there isa ton of those) and you will be fighing the equivlent of a zombie lizard in no time I agree slow would be good, but its not on my list and I can't forsee anyway of getting it, as my domains are locked in place. I will tell our spellwarp sniper to check it out though. As for fear effects, everyone in the party seems to have that covered ( The paladin/sorcerer and myself are immune, via aura of courage and dream domain, and the other two have high will saves and are haflings to boot). The only thing I'm worried about with AC buffs is that my ac is only 19 ( since i'm not proficient with shields) and a adult dragon has +24 to hit, so even with a bunch of AC boosts he is still pretty much always going to hit me. Unless I can get enough different types of bonuses. but they would have to be long term buffs as I dont want to spend the first 3 rounds of combat buffing my AC. On another note I also plan to have superior resistance on at all times (I have extend spell so the duration is 48 hours)
#14 frerezar Dec 05, 2008 15:24:35	when in need of AC, do the alternative. Buy an item that would give you displace,ment. A wad would sufice. No matter how hight someone's attack is there is a 50% chance he will miss you. Since you probably won't be ifighting ofensively, giving yourself partial cver or concealment via spells might also work. Obscuring mist, fog etc. If you are worried about plain dying just give yourslf delay death. It at least gives you a chance to heal yourself if everything else goes badly. Dragons kill by dealing damage, so it should be enought to keep you alive. If at all possible save a big healing spell until the very end in case you are forced to heal yourself back to -10 right before the spell wears off
#15 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 15:40:30	hmm thats a good idea. perhaps I should ditch on of the summon monster IV in favour of delay death, as I do not know if I will have time to summon 3 times, while trying to heal/buff as well
#16 phaedrusxy Dec 05, 2008 16:17:10	Delay Death + (scrolls of) Revivify is a pretty handy combo. Sorry I missed that you could cast the Knowledge domain spontaneously.
#17 frerezar Dec 05, 2008 16:23:33	Maybe vulnerability (i think thats th name of teh spell that lowers a creatures SR) cwould come in handy as there is another two casters on the party. Assay SR plus vulnerability, takign away 9 from its SR might be extremly helpfull and make your party love you
#18 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 17:22:00	I considered that but the spellwarp guy mentioned that he had a no SR rays, and the paladin/sorcerer will be more buffing himself
#19 feloniousela Dec 05, 2008 17:37:59	Just have the spellwarp sniper have a bunch of spellwarped Frost Breaths ready after he uses Assay Resistance. As long as the dragon's SR is lowered, he'll never do anything. Edit: Or even better the same idea using Wings of Flurry (only helpful if your SS is sorc casting based.) Also tell your SS that Ray Deflection will completely shut him down if the Dragon has it up/gets it up. Scintillating Scales hurts too. A big ol' dispel at the start of the fight is probably a good idea for all involved.
#20 flamepheonix182 Dec 05, 2008 17:51:42	Unfortunately he is is wizard based so no Wings spells. I'll be sure to mention that to him, though