Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 icephoenix84 Feb 21, 2009 12:24:04	OK let me start this off by explaining some things. My wife is going to run her first campaign, but I will be the only player. For story reasons I will be using the dragon character rules from Dragon 320 and 332 playing silver dragon half-dragon of some kind. She wants me to play gestalt so she doesn't have to tone things down too much. My dilemma: what should I gestalt it with? I have access to all base classes, CA classes, CAdv classes, Dragon Fire Adept, and many others (I have quite a book collection, though not all). I don't just want an ubercharacter, I want one with flavor as well. We don't use psionics for two reasons: neither of us are familiar enough with them, and we don't have any of the necessary books. Books I have access to: The three core DMG II PHB II MM II CA CM CAdv Draconomicon Dragon Magic Races of Dragon (are you beginning to see a pattern?) Dragon Magazine 320 and 332 (no others sorry) Heroes of Horror/Battle Frostburn Sandstorm Stormwrack Drow of the Underdark Forgotten Realms Campaign Setting Monster Compendium Player's Guide to Faerun Magic of Faerun MIC Epic Level Handbook Arms and Equipment Guide Cityscape
#2 true_shinken Feb 21, 2009 14:10:12	I suggest Dragon Spirit Cinture item from MIC. Very good for anything with breath weapons at a bargain price.
#3 CantripN Feb 21, 2009 14:58:50	So basically, you're telling us you want a PC, without telling us what you want or doing any work yourself? Thanks, but no thanks.
#4 icephoenix84 Feb 21, 2009 16:10:41	So basically, you're telling us you want a PC, without telling us what you want or doing any work yourself? Thanks, but no thanks. No not really, just recommendations for a class to gestalt with from the books I have. I have a few ideas: Dragon Fire Adept (gives breath affects that work with natural breath weapons and is equivalent to free breath feats), Sorcerer (levels stack with dragon sorcerer levels), Wu Jen (to build a Jean Gray type character), and Duskblade (to get some really nasty mêlée effects). As I said I just want to get some advice on which class to use. As I said in my OP I want a character with flavor, not just some ubercharacter. In this instance I want some of the flavor to arise from strange/unique combinations and class features mixed with a character who is four legged and flies. On the other hand I don't want to be getting a bunch or useless class features that will make me regret my decision later. I will build my character my self, I just don't want a suboptimal character with what I have to work with. And so I give it over to a community that has far more experience than I do with this sort of thing. Thanks true_shinken for the item idea!
#5 true_shinken Feb 21, 2009 16:29:58	A gestalt DFA//Duskblade gets some pretty solid stats. Unfortunatelly, you either cast spells or use invocations - I know a warlock could focus on 24h buffs but I don't really know if the DFA has stuff like this.
#6 icephoenix84 Feb 21, 2009 16:39:16	A gestalt DFA//Duskblade gets some pretty solid stats. Unfortunatelly, you either cast spells or use invocations - I know a warlock could focus on 24h buffs but I don't really know if the DFA has stuff like this. Yea that would be cool. Unfortunately the other half of my character in the gestalt is the dragon character progressing (as per Dragon 320 and 332 or SS if you prefer). So really, what I am looking for here is a class that compliments my natural abilities but doesn't shortchange me.
#7 madgryphon Feb 21, 2009 16:42:06	Warlock makes a good half of a gestalt. High endurance, and, if you pick your invocations properly, wonderful utility.
#8 icephoenix84 Feb 21, 2009 19:04:15	Would a Dragon Fire adept do the same thing? I know they don't have the best invocations list, but they do get breath altering abilities which should affect my main breath weapon as well shouldn't it? Thanks for the reply by the way. I really appreciate your input.
#9 true_shinken Feb 22, 2009 8:03:21	I think it's hard to go wrong with Sorcerer. I'm pretty sure there are spells that alter breath weapons, it stacks with your dragon casting and you get stuff like Wings of Flurry (you won't need another area attack spell ever). Your dragon hit dice already compensates the bad things about sorcerers anyway (hit points, base attack and skill points). Too bad you can't use Dragons of Eberron, there's a lot of cool stuff for dragon characters on that book.
#10 icephoenix84 Feb 22, 2009 9:08:40	I've been considering Sorcerer. Casters make me drool. So do dragons. Combined... get me a bucket and mop. The next question is: should I go Metamagic specalist and take obtain familiar later?
#11 CantripN Feb 22, 2009 9:59:21	No need for Familiars, unless you want something like a Winter Wolf...
#12 icephoenix84 Feb 22, 2009 13:23:17	My only reasoning for wanting a familiar is for their ability to cast from wands, and to maintain your spells for you. i.e. they give you extra actions in a round.
#13 icephoenix84 Feb 28, 2009 8:50:48	OK so I think I've settled on a Sorcerer. I think compared to other casters in this combination my character would be best as one. Now for spell selection. So far I have a few options: Orb of (something, probably force) Grease True Strike Glitterdust Ray of Enfeeblement Wings of Flurry Solid Fog Freezing Fog (or as I like to call it: Kill all Constructs) So far that is all I have, anyone got any other suggestions?
#14 icephoenix84 Mar 04, 2009 17:41:27	Well I think I have my progression ready. My DM changed up the Dragon Character prestige class as it sits so I would get to adult just after epic. This means I get five free sorcerer casting levels. I decided to use this to my advantage. Also, the prestige class Master of the Unseen hand from CW was made available to me so that is why it is in the progression. Sorcerer 5/Mage of the Arcane Order 7/Master of the Unseen Hand 4/Archmage 4 I take feats every odd level, get three flaws, and five feats scattered pretty randomly through the progression for being a dragon (It sticks to the progression of feats given in the Silver Dragon entry in Dragon 320). I think the total came out, with those granted by prestige classes, to 19 feats. I actually had trouble filling them all, but I wanted to read what the community thinks I should put in there before I post them so I can see if I'm on the right track.
#15 Balthanon Mar 04, 2009 18:37:04	The reason the feats are scattered through the silver dragon progression is because of the level adjustments scattered through the class. Those are supposed to be your basic feats that you get due to your hit dice-- in your case, apparently once every odd level. Your wife might have decided to grant them as bonus feats deliberately, but if she didn't, then you'll only be getting 13 feats. (1, 3, 5, 7, 9, 11, 13, 15, 17, 19 plus three flaws and class bonus feats.) For the feats, I would probably check the Draconomicon to see if there is anything in there that interests you. Some of the feats are fairly nice, though there are a fair number of epic feats. You might want to check out Draconic Aura (Dragon Magic) as well and maybe pick up Leadership to get a pet human or something.
#16 icephoenix84 Mar 04, 2009 20:04:36	Yea, she decided to grant them as bonus feats. I was going to take recover breath for my dragon side and (using RoD) take dragon breath to make my other breathweapon (from the Half-Dragon) a normal breathweapon. And the pet human idea is funny. I think she is intending on throwing in some companions here and there to help out though so I'm not sure if leadership is necessary, but the idea of a pet human... I'll check out the draconic aura. I had thought that was only for the dragon shaman but I'll have to check on that again.
#17 icephoenix84 Mar 05, 2009 19:45:47	Ok, I looked at draconic aura, it seems really tempting. My only question is: can I take the auras given in the dragon shaman class as well? (The one that grants fast healing if your health drops below half is why). As it stands I currently have the following feats on my roster in order:
#18 Balthanon Mar 05, 2009 23:43:14	There is some argument both ways, but I tend to lean towards no for the feat-- dragon shamans can take the auras in the book, but those with the feat can't necessarily take dragon shaman auras. Ultimately though, it's up to the DM, so ask your wife. They do have the same name. If you do go that route, I would consider picking up a second draconic aura feat (or for that matter, just taking them with spell slots since you're a true dragon) and the double draconic aura feat. You may also want to pick up Improved Familiar-- since familiars go off your base attack bonus and hit points, your familiar should have very good stats for its level. And finally-- quicken spell doesn't work for sorcerers unless you take the Accelerate Metamagic feat or Arcane Preparation.
#19 icephoenix84 Mar 06, 2009 18:08:30	I'm using the Metamagic Specialist alternative class feature from PHB II so that I can take quicken spell. I was toying with the Improved familiar, but I need one that can talk. My character is good so the imp and quasit are out. I would take the psudodragon but they don't speak. How do I take draconic aura's with spell slots? I never heard of this before.
#20 Balthanon Mar 07, 2009 10:53:44	It's described in the "Gaining Auras" section. Unfortunately, rereading it it definitely doesn't seem worth it, not with as many feats as you have to spare-- you would need to sacrifice a spell known and spell slot of 8th level to get a +4 aura. For familiars, there are bunches of options-- elementals, there's the dragon familiar feat out of Draconomicon for a wyrmling dragon, beguiler out of shining south, and many others. Check [thread=875062]this thread[/thread] for more information and a full list.