Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 willpower Oct 31, 2009 8:44:11	Well, its been a bit since I been on here. I am building another new chracter again. In case no one remembers, I am currently playing a Killer Gnome build, but with a human, still getting all the gnome benefits, who is also a Spellfire Channeler, Silverfire wielder and Chosen of Mystra. My DM's campaign is incredibly broken. I just went to 27th level, though we also have another player in the group who is also playing a caster, slightly lower level, but the player knows a TON more about playing wizards than I do. This is essentially my first full Wizzy. He is playing a Incantatrix, and as such even though I am higher level and much more adaptable, he really does better in combat situations. Soi much so that I end up usually, just doing essentially the same things he does, and not as good as he does it. (Kinda hard, when he puts out Twinned, Maximized, Empowered, Energy Admixtured Firebrands and does somewhere in the neighborhood of 450 points of damage, and I have to stick with Rods for most of my Metamagic, since most of my Feats were taken up making myself adaptable as hell, and I was never really sure how metamagic feats would work with shadow versions of a spell. So anyway, I am having my character step into the background of the campaign since he has a lot of resposibilities anyway and it makes campaign sense for him to do so, as well as the fact, that I am not enjoying him as much with thenew Wizzy. (Not his fault he knows how to play them better. (I am also getting tired of looking through the entire multiple books everytime I want to cast something and be really effective. I do good at it, I took out Terrasque with one spell, and no one else seemed to be affecting it, but getting tired of constant searches) What I am thinking about now is a more specialized caster. My DM is letting me make a 25th level to replace my 27th. He seems to like to run with a broken game, so I am thinking of going Pixie, which he is allowing as a +2 ECL instead of the +4 it normally is, because most characters in the game have a template of some sort. What I am thinking is making a Daggerspell Mage. Was originally thinking of going Rogue 3, Sor or Wiz 5, Invisible Blade 5 (to help with not wearing armor, and for occasional times when fighting something with True Sight), and then Daggerspell Mage 10. This would make me a 14th level Caster, was wanting Knowledge Devotion Feat, to help with things, and is why I was leaning to Wizard. Though I thought of an alternate way to do it I think may be better. This way won't have me looking for books for the best spell, since it is a Spontaneous Caster. What I am thinking of is going Rog 3, Duskblade 5, and Daggerspell Mage 15 (I know can't go over 10 levels in a PRC before 20, though I am 23 and am retraining Duskblade Levels into Daggerspell Mage levels after 20, please don't concentrate on this if I am wrong on how it works. Do tell if I am wrong, so I can correct it, but comment on more than it please) I am thinking this for several reasons. It improves my BAB. I become an 18th level caster, though I have access to lesser level spells with DB than Wiz. I won't have to worry about Invisible Blade for Armor, since I can now wear it without Spell Failure, I won't have the Imporved Feint ability, though that doesn't bother me much. Also, I will be able to channel spells into my melee attacks. When looking at Daggerspell Mage, which allows a similar feature, it doesn't make it part of the attack. For the Daggerspell Mage version I have to have cast the touch spells into the weapons first and then I can attack. If I want to use a Touch attack with two weapons, I have to cast on two different Rounds withou attacking on those rounds. That is fine for setting up, but in the middle of a combat it would be good to be able to cast it as I am attacking. What does everyone think of this idea?
#2 cru Nov 01, 2009 15:03:20	Daggerspell mage is not really helpful for duskblades. Daggers are generally not useful for duskblades; they prefer weapons with long reach. I don't see many synergies in your build. Perhaps find some inspiration in the duskblade handbook: brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.p...
#3 willpower Nov 02, 2009 23:53:20	Daggerspell mage is not really helpful for duskblades. Daggers are generally not useful for duskblades; they prefer weapons with long reach. I don't see many synergies in your build. Perhaps find some inspiration in the duskblade handbook: brilliantgameologists.com/boards/index.p... Thank you for the reply at least. I think I partly don't get many because of the length of my messages. Though, I don't see any basis for the comments presented. There is nothing in the duskblade description that would prevent them from using a dagger. As for liking to keep at range, that may be the way a lot of peoplke play them, in fact the one I have played so far used a spiked chain, but there is in fact no real reason for it. Daggers have the same reach, mechanic wise, as a long sword. Its true they don't get proficiency with daggers though, but in order to go Daggerspell mage, I would actually need 1 level of rogue anyway. As for the synergy, the way it is set up and with the level I am, I will still need 1 more level to make it work right, but I am level 23 and a pixie. I will be fighting invisible all the time. So distance isn't really that much a problem. I will be Duskblade 13/Rogue 1/Daggerspell Mage 10 in just one level. What that can give me, with the pixie is 4d6 SA with every attack fighting with 2 daggers, I will be able to channel a touch spell with every attack through my duskblade ability as part of my Full Attack Action. I can hold a different touch spell in both daggers. When I perform a Full Attack action with both of my daggers, I can use Daggerspell Flurry to cast a spell (doesn't have to be a touch spell) quickened. All of which means when I go into battle, I am not seen, when I choose to I attack with 5 attacks with 2 daggers, all of which get 4d6 SA, two different touch spells go off on my first hapless victim, my third touch spell, which can be a ray I channel into not only the first hapless victim, but all the other victims I have that round, and I can then also quicken a 4th spell to go off from my Daggerspell Mage ability. To top that off, Daggerspell Mage by itself then, would then need to waste rounds casting spells to hold in their daggers, since none of their abilities say they can cast the spell and attack with a weapon in the same round. (Some may assume this, and if your DM buys it, then that is fine, but the abilities don't say it, just that they can cast a spell and hold them in their daggerws and deliver them in their daggers, to deliver the spell as part of an attack in the same round the spell is cast would require an additional standard action, since it is a standard action to cast a spell and another to attack.) Though with the duskblade they can still channel touch spells through their full attacks without wasting rounds casting, and if they use the Duskblades free Quick Casts, they can also cast another touch spell to place in the dagger before their Full Attack, or just use another Daggerspell Flurry to quicken cast another spell. I think that pretty much says synergy
#4 willpower Nov 03, 2009 1:19:06	Oh, also, thanks for the link. That will be really helpful if I do decide to go with a Duskblade. I had the link before, but so many of the old links don't work anymore that it is good to see one that does.
#5 willpower Nov 03, 2009 2:52:26	K, I looked at the Duskblade Handbook again. (I have looked at it before, but the old link didn't work recently) And I think it is still a great guide for the most part. I do disagree with some of the things suggested. I disagreed with more, and then noticed the rationale for it and changed my mind. (That with Arcane Strike, I decided originally I thought it was good, though not worth the cost of say a 5th level spell to get +5 to hit and 5d4 damage, that I could get better than with channeling, though with the suggestions of the Rings of Wizardry, 3 of them, then I can see that it cheapens the cost of it enough that you wouldn't have to worry about it. I still do disagree with the Obtain Familiar Feat though. Even with a full Wizard I rarely find much use for a familiar, and they are too easy to kill and too tempting a target. They do have a couple features that are nice, though for me, not nice enough to sacrifice a Feat that can be better used. Also, the guide makes a really good rationale to use a 2H weapon. Though I play characters, based on a concept I create and try to optimize that, and don't just build an optimized build and assign a character to it. With the character I had described originally, I was looking for a casting rogue type to go with Daggerspell Mage. One of the options was to use Duskblade as a base class, another is to use Wizard or Sorceror, in a lot of ways I am leaning to wiz, though I like Duiskblades and as I mentioned I saw some synergy with the two. Another thing I disagreed with the guide with and you will more than likely lambaste me for being wrong about is some of its picks on spells. I look at the description for the Arcane Channeling and I see that it should be usable with Rays. Channeling is usable with Touch Attacks. It doesn't specify any more than that. Ranged Touch Attacks can therefore be argued to work with channeling as they are touch attacks, and the channeling description doesn't mention that the touch attacks need a range of touch. So Ranged Touch Attacks should work. In the description for how Rays work, they require a Ranged Touch Attack. Therefore Rays work as Ranged Touch Attacks work. With Rays it is a little more of a stretch than with Ranged Touch Attack, though since they work the same, I think it can be argued. It may , or may not be correct in the case with Rays, but the DM in the campaign I am in has already ruled that they do work that way, so regardless of what anyone else here thinks, it works in the game I am in, and that also means that the arguement has merit as it has been able to convince some people at least. When you add in Rays to the list of channeling spells a lot of spells that the OP of the guide didn't like becomes AWESOME. (BTW, one of the reasons I believe Rays were meant to work with Channeling is the sheer number of Ray spells they included on the very limited list of Duskblade Spells) For instance Seeking Ray becomes a Monster Spell. It only does 4d6 damage, but provides +4 to hit with other ray spells, including itself, and the +4 is an unnamed bonus, which means it stacks with itself. +4 to hit each time, you do it a few times and then Powe Attack to your heart's content.