Dust of *flop* - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Dust of *flop*

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
shizaru
Dec 29, 2008 2:17:04 I was recently trying to come up with a fairly innovative near-epic anti-caster build ('cause who doesn't hate facing near-epic casters?), and the thought popped into my head, "DUH! Beholder Wild Shape!" And then, of course, I perused the Beholder's non-magical damage capabilities, and I died a little inside... however, not to be deterred, I dusted off my copy of Lords of Madness and flipped through it. Now, in the past, I have generally considered this a fairly useless book, but I was determined to utilize anti-magic cone without resorting to befriending a floating head with fangs. And my friends...
EUREKA!

Dust of Negation: Antimagic Field in a little paper packet. Cheap, too. No, it's not a STRICTLY Beholder-based tactic, but I fell in love with it. I blame ADD.

Anyway, with a new (to me, at least) mechanic in mind, I set about building my character. My first thought was to use a bow and snipe enemies from within my dust cloud. Fail.
My next thought was, I think, the appropriate one. Tome of Battle. Sweet, sweet extraordinary abilities. And here's what I've got so far:
Swordsage 5/Monk 2/Shadow Sun Ninja 10/Swordsage 2

It caps at 19 because I'll most likely play a half-ogre or a feral something-or-other. Stunning Fist for the immobilizing, obviously, but if they make the save, I'm planning on using the Stalking Shadows maneuver and the Stand Still feat to keep them in the dust, or if they withdraw, Mirrored Pursuit and some Setting Sun Throw to put them back in it (Ballista Throw is a guaranteed 60ft). Also planning on taking the Falling Sun feat in case they have an unusually high movement speed. Oh yeah, and Belt of Battle for the extra standard action to use the dust after I charge or before I make a Stunning Fist attack. Shadow Sun Ninja uses mostly supernatural abilities, but it also meshes the Monk with the Swordsage nicely, and Swordsage gives me all the maneuvers I think I'll need, besides being very effective against BFMs. The only problems I can think of are: what to do if the enemy goes ethereal before I can use the dust, how to spend my gold on non-magical items, and how to be sure of hitting them with a capped BAB of 13 and no magical enhancement bonuses. :/

I'd love any advice or constructive criticism. Or even negative criticism, if it comes with a working alternative using the dust or a similar tactic. Comments from the peanut gallery are, as always, another man's treasure.
#2
deathlessjuan
Dec 29, 2008 11:29:07 1) Get antimagic field as a spell or spell-like ability
2) Crack open Epic Level Handbook
3) See epic feat: Permanent Emanation
4) Take said feat, using antimagic field
5) ?????
6) Profit

This is my answer for epic spellcasters.
#3
shizaru
Dec 29, 2008 16:23:33 No offense, but Permanent Emanation's kind of an obvious tactic, and one that isn't hard to defeat.

Regardless, I'm talking about sub-epic, and this is a character I'm going to build up to from level 1, not start at ECL 20. My DM hates dealing with epics, so if anyone looks like they'll get enough experience to reach level 21, he starts throwing negative levels and XP costs into the game (one reason I'm starting with a level adjustment.) This is a 3-man campaign, and I've agreed to play the tank this time (we rotate roles). I've got a skill-monkey and an arcane spellcaster, so I need to avoid needing healing. I don't need to worry about mass enemies, I just need to handle the BFMs and anything requiring strength checks or Fort saves. I decided to use area magic cancellation just for a fun new twist, and that's the basis for this character.

I've also thought about barbarian/warblade with a focus on Diamond Mind and Tiger Claw, with Stone Dragon for support. Bloodclaw Rager being an obvious mid-game choice.
#4
deathlessjuan
Dec 29, 2008 17:29:35 Ahhh, nevermind them... I missed the 'near-epic'. My way of dealing with pre-epic magic is with better magic, but that doesn't help you much. I hope someone else can give you what you are looking for.
#5
vglcat
Dec 29, 2008 17:33:25 what about combating contingency celerity ect.? time stop. really.
#6
shizaru
Dec 29, 2008 21:37:03 Is it possible to cast Time Stop inside an Antimagic Field? I'm focusing on keeping them within the dust's raidus. Time stop is level 9, so it's not a problem for quite a while, and even when it is, they can't cast it within the dust, and by then, even if they are capable of Quickening Time Stop after a withdraw action, I've got Stand Still, Stunning Fist, , etc. to keep them from taking that action.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 shizaru Dec 29, 2008 2:17:04	I was recently trying to come up with a fairly innovative near-epic anti-caster build ('cause who doesn't hate facing near-epic casters?), and the thought popped into my head, "DUH! Beholder Wild Shape!" And then, of course, I perused the Beholder's non-magical damage capabilities, and I died a little inside... however, not to be deterred, I dusted off my copy of Lords of Madness and flipped through it. Now, in the past, I have generally considered this a fairly useless book, but I was determined to utilize anti-magic cone without resorting to befriending a floating head with fangs. And my friends... EUREKA! Dust of Negation: Antimagic Field in a little paper packet. Cheap, too. No, it's not a STRICTLY Beholder-based tactic, but I fell in love with it. I blame ADD. Anyway, with a new (to me, at least) mechanic in mind, I set about building my character. My first thought was to use a bow and snipe enemies from within my dust cloud. Fail. My next thought was, I think, the appropriate one. Tome of Battle. Sweet, sweet extraordinary abilities. And here's what I've got so far: Swordsage 5/Monk 2/Shadow Sun Ninja 10/Swordsage 2 It caps at 19 because I'll most likely play a half-ogre or a feral something-or-other. Stunning Fist for the immobilizing, obviously, but if they make the save, I'm planning on using the Stalking Shadows maneuver and the Stand Still feat to keep them in the dust, or if they withdraw, Mirrored Pursuit and some Setting Sun Throw to put them back in it (Ballista Throw is a guaranteed 60ft). Also planning on taking the Falling Sun feat in case they have an unusually high movement speed. Oh yeah, and Belt of Battle for the extra standard action to use the dust after I charge or before I make a Stunning Fist attack. Shadow Sun Ninja uses mostly supernatural abilities, but it also meshes the Monk with the Swordsage nicely, and Swordsage gives me all the maneuvers I think I'll need, besides being very effective against BFMs. The only problems I can think of are: what to do if the enemy goes ethereal before I can use the dust, how to spend my gold on non-magical items, and how to be sure of hitting them with a capped BAB of 13 and no magical enhancement bonuses. :/ I'd love any advice or constructive criticism. Or even negative criticism, if it comes with a working alternative using the dust or a similar tactic. Comments from the peanut gallery are, as always, another man's treasure.
#2 deathlessjuan Dec 29, 2008 11:29:07	1) Get antimagic field as a spell or spell-like ability 2) Crack open Epic Level Handbook 3) See epic feat: Permanent Emanation 4) Take said feat, using antimagic field 5) ????? 6) Profit This is my answer for epic spellcasters.
#3 shizaru Dec 29, 2008 16:23:33	No offense, but Permanent Emanation's kind of an obvious tactic, and one that isn't hard to defeat. Regardless, I'm talking about sub-epic, and this is a character I'm going to build up to from level 1, not start at ECL 20. My DM hates dealing with epics, so if anyone looks like they'll get enough experience to reach level 21, he starts throwing negative levels and XP costs into the game (one reason I'm starting with a level adjustment.) This is a 3-man campaign, and I've agreed to play the tank this time (we rotate roles). I've got a skill-monkey and an arcane spellcaster, so I need to avoid needing healing. I don't need to worry about mass enemies, I just need to handle the BFMs and anything requiring strength checks or Fort saves. I decided to use area magic cancellation just for a fun new twist, and that's the basis for this character. I've also thought about barbarian/warblade with a focus on Diamond Mind and Tiger Claw, with Stone Dragon for support. Bloodclaw Rager being an obvious mid-game choice.
#4 deathlessjuan Dec 29, 2008 17:29:35	Ahhh, nevermind them... I missed the 'near-epic'. My way of dealing with pre-epic magic is with better magic, but that doesn't help you much. I hope someone else can give you what you are looking for.
#5 vglcat Dec 29, 2008 17:33:25	what about combating contingency celerity ect.? time stop. really.
#6 shizaru Dec 29, 2008 21:37:03	Is it possible to cast Time Stop inside an Antimagic Field? I'm focusing on keeping them within the dust's raidus. Time stop is level 9, so it's not a problem for quite a while, and even when it is, they can't cast it within the dust, and by then, even if they are capable of Quickening Time Stop after a withdraw action, I've got Stand Still, Stunning Fist, , etc. to keep them from taking that action.