Dwarven Werebear Barbarian Gestalt - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Dwarven Werebear Barbarian Gestalt

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
anonymoose
May 27, 2008 18:04:28 First time posting. Any ideas on optimizing this character? He's a CN Glacier Dwarf fighting primarily with a greataxe in Hybrid Werebear-Dwarf form. I know It is a little bit strange that a Dwarf becomes a Disciple of Thrym, but I figure it makes for an interesting backstory. He belongs to a small clan of Dwarves from the far north that still worship (and are enslaved by) Frost Giants. Our group usually picks from either rolling stats or using a high-powered array of: 18, 18, 16, 16, 14, 14. (Not as overpowered as it might look... our DM is REALLY evil.) I figure:

Stats:
Str 18
Dex 14
Con 20
Int 14
Wis 16
Cha 14

Leveling:
01 Barbarian 1/ Natural Werebear 1
02 Barbarian 2/ Natural Werebear 2
03 Barbarian 3/ Natural Werebear 3
04 Brown Bear 1/ Dwarven Fighter 1
05 Barbarian 4/ Warshaper 1
06 Barbarian 5/ Warshaper 2
07 Barbarian 6/ Warshaper 3
08 Barbarian 7/ Warshaper 4
09 Barbarian 8/ Warshaper 5
10 Barbarian 9/ Fist of the Forest 1
11 Brown Bear 2/ Disciple of Thrym 1
12 Brown Bear 3/ Disciple of Thrym 2
13 Brown Bear 4/ Disciple of Thrym 3
14 Brown Bear 5/ Disciple of Thrym 4
15 Brown Bear 6/ Disciple of Thrym 5
16 Barbarian 10/ Disciple of Thrym 6
17 Barbarian 11/ Disciple of Thrym 7
18 Barbarian 12/ Disciple of Thrym 8
19 Barbarian 13/ Disciple of Thrym 9
20 Barbarian 14/ Disciple of Thrym 10

Feats:
1 Great Fortitude
3 Extend Rage
6 Power Attack
9 Improved Unarmed Strike
12 Improved Critical (Greataxe)
15 Instantaneous Rage
18 Frozen Berserker

I went with Great Fortitude, Power Attack, and Improved Unarmed Strike for Fist of the Forest. Frozen Berserker is for Frostrager in epic levels (if we end up going that high). My main concerns are about low will and ref saves. I have access to most books. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
#2
theabyssdragon
May 27, 2008 22:22:28 I could be wrong, but I believe you have to take all your bear HD up front with the LA.
#3
anonymoose
May 27, 2008 22:48:04 Nope:

"Thus, in addition to the levels offered via the appropriate lycanthrope template class, each kind of lycanthrope also has a separate (optional) class progression for his animal abilities. Essentially, a character progressing as a lycanthrope multiclasses into the template class and can also multiclass into the appropriate animal class if desired.

The animal class is entirely optional. No would-be lycanthrope is required to take it, but doing so is an advantage, since a character without it is weaker than other lycanthropes of the same type. Taking levels in the appropriate animal template class gives the character the animal's Hit Dice and hit points (in all forms), saving throw bonuses (in all forms), skill points (in all forms), racial skill bonuses (in all forms), conditional skill modifiers (in animal form), ability score modifiers (in hybrid or animal form), natural armor bonus, and special attacks (such as the bear's improved grab). Levels in the animal class may be taken at any point after the character takes one level in the lycanthrope template class. He is also free to take levels in other classes between levels of the template class and the animal class, as desired. The animal class, like the template class, does not count when determining whether a character takes an XP penalty for multiclassing."

There is small bending of the rules required though, a werebear should have an alignment of Lawful Good, conflicting with the barbarian class. I do believe there are non-Lawful Good Werebears in Eberon or somewhere though...
#4
part-human2
May 27, 2008 23:07:27 I've done a few Werebear Dwarven Gestalts builds also.

The one I settled on was Duergar
Werebear (9)/ Battlesmith 1/Deepwarder 2/Hammer of Moridin 3/Exotic Weapon 1/somethine x // Cleric 4/ Fighter 1/Warshaper 4/Dwarf Paragon 3/Duergar 1 (CPsi)/Fighter x -- using an Exotic Heavy Warhammer two-handed.

I also wanted a VoP Dwarf Werebear/Warshaper/War Hulk/Hulking Hurler//Monk/Erudite (CPsi). Using a simple quarterstaff and Decisive Strike (PHBII) and optimizing AoO and the Mind's Eye Web Enhancement for Erudite learning spells as Powers.

Lycanthropy get +2 to WIS and the Iron Will feat for free.
#5
theabyssdragon
May 27, 2008 23:33:37 I'm gonna assume that's from savage progressions (currently down for some reason), because the MM simply says the HD resulting from the template is the base HD + animal HD.

If you're gonna take barbarian anyways, you may be better off just taking 5 levels of bear warrior.
#6
anonymoose
May 28, 2008 0:26:22 I suppose that Deepwarden is an option. I would probably swap out Warshaper 5 and Fist of the Forest 1, so I would have a higher AC (Medium Armor + Con Mod in place of Dex to AC). Though I could up the AC and still be unarmored by swaping out Warshaper 5 for something like Ninja 1 or a Chaos-aligned Monk to get Wis mod to AC as well (netting about a +4) as Dex mod. A Chaos monk would also get me Improved Unarmed Strike for free, freeing up a feat at lvl 9... One of those options would be better I suppose as Warshaper 5 only has Flashmorph which reduces the time it takes to shift forms, and that isn't really a problem...

EDIT: I think I solved my will saves problem... not sure how I forgot about Steadfast Determination... Ref save is still a little low though especially since I'm going to swap out trap sense for spell sense. I suppose it is only a minor problem however.
#7
anonymoose
May 28, 2008 3:44:12 I think I've found the perfect Monk variant for this build. The Raging Monk from Dragon 310. Standard monk but swaps out flurry for rage, the problem is how to reconcile the alignment issues as the Raging monk still requires a lawful alignment even though its rage ability stacks with barbarian class levels. I'm assuming either the listing is incorrect (wishful thinking on my part perhaps) or it requires an alignment change, making it of very limited use. Any thoughts? Perhaps Ninja is the better choice as it gives trapfinding, +2 will saves through ki power, ref save improves, wis to AC, and sudden strike damage...

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 anonymoose May 27, 2008 18:04:28	First time posting. Any ideas on optimizing this character? He's a CN Glacier Dwarf fighting primarily with a greataxe in Hybrid Werebear-Dwarf form. I know It is a little bit strange that a Dwarf becomes a Disciple of Thrym, but I figure it makes for an interesting backstory. He belongs to a small clan of Dwarves from the far north that still worship (and are enslaved by) Frost Giants. Our group usually picks from either rolling stats or using a high-powered array of: 18, 18, 16, 16, 14, 14. (Not as overpowered as it might look... our DM is REALLY evil.) I figure: Stats: Str 18 Dex 14 Con 20 Int 14 Wis 16 Cha 14 Leveling: 01 Barbarian 1/ Natural Werebear 1 02 Barbarian 2/ Natural Werebear 2 03 Barbarian 3/ Natural Werebear 3 04 Brown Bear 1/ Dwarven Fighter 1 05 Barbarian 4/ Warshaper 1 06 Barbarian 5/ Warshaper 2 07 Barbarian 6/ Warshaper 3 08 Barbarian 7/ Warshaper 4 09 Barbarian 8/ Warshaper 5 10 Barbarian 9/ Fist of the Forest 1 11 Brown Bear 2/ Disciple of Thrym 1 12 Brown Bear 3/ Disciple of Thrym 2 13 Brown Bear 4/ Disciple of Thrym 3 14 Brown Bear 5/ Disciple of Thrym 4 15 Brown Bear 6/ Disciple of Thrym 5 16 Barbarian 10/ Disciple of Thrym 6 17 Barbarian 11/ Disciple of Thrym 7 18 Barbarian 12/ Disciple of Thrym 8 19 Barbarian 13/ Disciple of Thrym 9 20 Barbarian 14/ Disciple of Thrym 10 Feats: 1 Great Fortitude 3 Extend Rage 6 Power Attack 9 Improved Unarmed Strike 12 Improved Critical (Greataxe) 15 Instantaneous Rage 18 Frozen Berserker I went with Great Fortitude, Power Attack, and Improved Unarmed Strike for Fist of the Forest. Frozen Berserker is for Frostrager in epic levels (if we end up going that high). My main concerns are about low will and ref saves. I have access to most books. Any suggestions would be appreciated.
#2 theabyssdragon May 27, 2008 22:22:28	I could be wrong, but I believe you have to take all your bear HD up front with the LA.
#3 anonymoose May 27, 2008 22:48:04	Nope: "Thus, in addition to the levels offered via the appropriate lycanthrope template class, each kind of lycanthrope also has a separate (optional) class progression for his animal abilities. Essentially, a character progressing as a lycanthrope multiclasses into the template class and can also multiclass into the appropriate animal class if desired. The animal class is entirely optional. No would-be lycanthrope is required to take it, but doing so is an advantage, since a character without it is weaker than other lycanthropes of the same type. Taking levels in the appropriate animal template class gives the character the animal's Hit Dice and hit points (in all forms), saving throw bonuses (in all forms), skill points (in all forms), racial skill bonuses (in all forms), conditional skill modifiers (in animal form), ability score modifiers (in hybrid or animal form), natural armor bonus, and special attacks (such as the bear's improved grab). Levels in the animal class may be taken at any point after the character takes one level in the lycanthrope template class. He is also free to take levels in other classes between levels of the template class and the animal class, as desired. The animal class, like the template class, does not count when determining whether a character takes an XP penalty for multiclassing." There is small bending of the rules required though, a werebear should have an alignment of Lawful Good, conflicting with the barbarian class. I do believe there are non-Lawful Good Werebears in Eberon or somewhere though...
#4 part-human2 May 27, 2008 23:07:27	I've done a few Werebear Dwarven Gestalts builds also. The one I settled on was Duergar Werebear (9)/ Battlesmith 1/Deepwarder 2/Hammer of Moridin 3/Exotic Weapon 1/somethine x // Cleric 4/ Fighter 1/Warshaper 4/Dwarf Paragon 3/Duergar 1 (CPsi)/Fighter x -- using an Exotic Heavy Warhammer two-handed. I also wanted a VoP Dwarf Werebear/Warshaper/War Hulk/Hulking Hurler//Monk/Erudite (CPsi). Using a simple quarterstaff and Decisive Strike (PHBII) and optimizing AoO and the Mind's Eye Web Enhancement for Erudite learning spells as Powers. Lycanthropy get +2 to WIS and the Iron Will feat for free.
#5 theabyssdragon May 27, 2008 23:33:37	I'm gonna assume that's from savage progressions (currently down for some reason), because the MM simply says the HD resulting from the template is the base HD + animal HD. If you're gonna take barbarian anyways, you may be better off just taking 5 levels of bear warrior.
#6 anonymoose May 28, 2008 0:26:22	I suppose that Deepwarden is an option. I would probably swap out Warshaper 5 and Fist of the Forest 1, so I would have a higher AC (Medium Armor + Con Mod in place of Dex to AC). Though I could up the AC and still be unarmored by swaping out Warshaper 5 for something like Ninja 1 or a Chaos-aligned Monk to get Wis mod to AC as well (netting about a +4) as Dex mod. A Chaos monk would also get me Improved Unarmed Strike for free, freeing up a feat at lvl 9... One of those options would be better I suppose as Warshaper 5 only has Flashmorph which reduces the time it takes to shift forms, and that isn't really a problem... EDIT: I think I solved my will saves problem... not sure how I forgot about Steadfast Determination... Ref save is still a little low though especially since I'm going to swap out trap sense for spell sense. I suppose it is only a minor problem however.
#7 anonymoose May 28, 2008 3:44:12	I think I've found the perfect Monk variant for this build. The Raging Monk from Dragon 310. Standard monk but swaps out flurry for rage, the problem is how to reconcile the alignment issues as the Raging monk still requires a lawful alignment even though its rage ability stacks with barbarian class levels. I'm assuming either the listing is incorrect (wishful thinking on my part perhaps) or it requires an alignment change, making it of very limited use. Any thoughts? Perhaps Ninja is the better choice as it gives trapfinding, +2 will saves through ki power, ref save improves, wis to AC, and sudden strike damage...