Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 kosmic_latte Feb 16, 2009 13:50:23	Well, I'm starting a new campaign soon. The DM and the group have decided that we're most comfortable with ECL 6 because it gives both sides some wiggle room such that no one caster or martial player is too obviously showing up the other side without heavy customization. The roles have so far been handed out and I decided to play the tank for the group. I'd like some help to be the best tank I can be for the group (i.e. soaking up damage and keeping the enemy's attention). Rules - ECL 6 (with chances of not going higher) - 25 Point buy - Core books with others on approval. - No dragons, Monstrous races or hybrids - Standard Wealth for a Level 6 I've so far thought of playing a Lizardfolk Boar Totem Barbarian 3/Fighter 1 that concentrated on it's bite attack.
#2 true_shinken Feb 16, 2009 14:49:15	Isn't lizardfolk a monstrous race?
#3 kosmic_latte Feb 16, 2009 15:27:15	Isn't lizardfolk a monstrous race? The DM means things like Minotaurs or something with an ECL so high you'd need to find a Savage Progression for it. Drow, Gnolls, stuff with low ECL if any is fine.
#4 agahi_renem Feb 16, 2009 15:45:20	Im thinking a Druid wildshaped into something nasty with an even nastier animal companion would get some attention from prospective baddies. If you are set on a standard melee class I reccomend you check the dragoon handbook for ridiculus charge damage that gets you noticed. Unless your DM plays monsters like an mmorpg where they typically attack the fighter just cause, the monsters and especially intelligent ones will no doubt be going for the casters that are hurting them worse. Unless you build something killer effective. Im thinking a human, warblade 4 fighter 1 kensai 1. (take some charging feats, and the prereqs for kensai). Maybe instead of a level of warblade take the feral template for all the goodness for only LA 1.
#5 agahi_renem Feb 16, 2009 15:48:01	actually take the warblade 4 fighter 1, and feral template. Make sure you get the prereqs for some sweet PrC though. I like kensai (my dm is stingy with gold) but there are several good choices. You probly want an item for flight, and you want iron heart surge as one of your manuvers.
#6 kosmic_latte Feb 16, 2009 16:02:11	I have a feeling he's going to ban Tome of Battle, but I'll ask about it. He does allow the LA Buy off rule though.
#7 agahi_renem Feb 16, 2009 20:01:18	Well that would suck, but you can always go with one of the builds in the dragoon handbook or massive damage (if you are set with a traditional melee type)... Also the dervish handbook is cool for the two weapon fighting type meleers. You should try to explain that ToB is harder to break then most other books, the classes are just harder to suck with also, which makes them seem broken to people that arent used to something(being melee) pretty much always being decent with not much effort.
#8 agahi_renem Feb 16, 2009 20:03:00	Definitly think about feral though either way (mineral warrior is also pretty good, though no pounce).
#9 kosmic_latte Feb 16, 2009 20:38:18	Definitly think about feral though either way (mineral warrior is also pretty good, though no pounce). He KOed the idea of letting something with a bite attack having Adamantine teeth replacement. So it's safe to assume he'll ban anything that's not a cliche from core.
#10 unundindur Feb 16, 2009 20:59:20	ok, its not core but its a "core cliche": Dwarf crusader (or warblade) 6 who focus on defensive and heavy hitting maneuvers. If its stricktly core (PHB?), I guess you are stuck with a fighter. I can saw that I had quite some fun in E6 with some simple full plate/tower shield guys, cause their AC is so high it takes forever to even touch them. YOu may considder dipping in barbarian if you can take the lion totem ability, and then go for a crazy dwarf build.
#11 jameswilliamogle Feb 16, 2009 21:02:54	Dang, I really want to help here, but with a strictly core-only setup I keep coming back to a Spiked Chain tripper with your "role-goals"... I've got some thoughts on a pretty awesome core-only TWF damage dealer, though. It really picks up around 6th-8th level. I put it here. Anyways, the Fighter's Handbook is here. You could do an anti-caster build, and it is a nice way to tweak the tripping builds... Hard to do that without the Mageslayer feat or Pierce Magical Concealment. Barbarians qualify for a really good feat combination that can practically auto-win initiative, unless the creature is immune to non-magical fear effects. Its very non-core So, I'm not a big fan of defense-only roles, as I get bored easily, but if you are stuck with only core (as it sounds its becoming, more and more), then you can pick up a few different strategies as a straight Fighter with lots of bonus feats. I really like the Power Attack sub-maneuvers, and think that every Fighter should use them more often. EDIT: Please find out what you can play with (ie, make your DM commit to it, so he won't nerf it further later). Its very hard investing in a build that one knows will never see play.
#12 kosmic_latte Feb 16, 2009 21:10:07	He banned Monks now, so....yeah
#13 jameswilliamogle Feb 16, 2009 21:18:15	He banned Monks now, so....yeah Awesome! They are too powerful, you know :P. See what is allowed and won't get nerfed :D. I say play a straight Fighter.
#14 unundindur Feb 16, 2009 21:22:59	Awesome! They are too powerful, you know :P. See what is allowed and won't get nerfed :D. I say play a straight Fighter. Well, with monks banned I wouldn't be surprised if your spiked chain is next I can tell that I would be much more inclined to ban the spiked chain before a lot of books (and the monk).
#15 agahi_renem Feb 16, 2009 21:28:38	Hmm id say either find a new game(if possible) or offer to Dm instead, and be more leniant to the players, then they will practicly demand he be more open next time when they realize how bad random banning is stupid, and counter productive. Anyway, go straight Druid 20, and show him what true power is (and yes druid 20 is a tank build).
#16 kosmic_latte Feb 16, 2009 22:12:10	Hmm id say either find a new game(if possible) or offer to Dm instead, and be more leniant to the players, then they will practicly demand he be more open next time when they realize how bad random banning is stupid, and counter productive. Anyway, go straight Druid 20, and show him what true power is (and yes druid 20 is a tank build). He knows better. I think I might just find a new game.
#17 agahi_renem Feb 16, 2009 22:51:13	probobly for the best, though you should still offer to DM to give him a break *wink wink* Though maybe you can have fun even in this instance, give it a try and if it sucks, explain to him that you are not feeling good about a game with random bannings for no apparent reason, and that you are going to go if it dosent stop..
#18 jameswilliamogle Feb 17, 2009 7:04:55	I think your DM needs to see the Tier System of Classes thread. There's other options. I like the TWF Fighter core builds. Dwarf TWF, iTWF, gTWF WF:Dwarven Waraxe, WSpec:Dwarven Waraxe, GWF:Dwarven Waraxe, GWSpec:Dwarven Waraxe Power Attack, Imp Bull Rush, Overrun PBS, Far Shot, Rapid Shot Then use a few +1 Throwing and Returning Dwarven Waraxes to kill things. Its really not abusive in the least.
#19 kosmic_latte Feb 19, 2009 19:10:46	Ok, my DM just laid down a ruling that has pretty much chosen my race for me. He ruled that Crucians from Sandstorm use their "Crucians as Characters" text for PCs, meaning they only have a +2 LA. He also is allowing the LA buy off rules. The two builds I have so far are Totemist 4 or Barbarian Boar Totem 4 (going into Fist of the Forest for a one level dip at ECL 7)
#20 jameswilliamogle Feb 19, 2009 19:21:30	Man, I am SO confused... so now its not just PHB?
#21 kosmic_latte Feb 19, 2009 19:26:54	Man, I am SO confused... so now its not just PHB? I said in OP that it's Core with other books on Approval.