Now here comes the problem, I cant make up my mind and my DM says a character who can do several things at once, pretty much Versatility.
All books with the WOTC 3.5/3.0 edition is allowed and I have almost all the books. on some format or another.
The character type I want to play im not sure would work due to the EPIC campaign part. Last time I created a character for his game my character was severaly messed up and I lost a very Expensive magic item and I never went back to the game after that.
So Vow of Poverty and Epic Vow of poverty is possible at this time.
Any suggestions?. Any template or race with a +3 LA would be welcome.
The type of character I wouldnt mind trying is a buffer or a caster of some type that casts spells that dont require saves or spell resistence on the bad guys part. Or some other way to deal with epic monsters that they dont get a way out of.
Singularity they get sucked into would work.
Wizard 5/Spellguard of the Silverymoon 5/Warweaver 1/Legendary Champion 10 (advancing war weaver and thus the gouda).
At level 21 you cast as an 18th level wizard (5+5+0+8), can do up to 9th level spells in your tapestry, can do any spell that heals, or most forms of defensive buffs (including shapechange in the tapestry). And can release 8 or 9 spells (don't remember) as a mere move action.
Oh bite of the werebear is also a healing spell do to increasing your con score. Say hello to +16 to str ;)
Druids run super well on no items, so you would barely even notice the penalty.
Since they've never released an extrapolation to Epic Vow of Poverty, are you using it from some where else? perhaps something created by the guys on the epic boards here?
I'm asking, because the feat does need proper extrapolation to epic, it's abilitys don't keep up pace properly, which is why the epic board guys wrote up an epic version of the feat specifically for epic play.
Sword Disciple sent this to me in a PM, but their are a few things I dont get on its legality or whatever, I dont know but anyways.
Shifter 6? what does that mean at the end of that build?
+4 Inherent bonuses to stats? where does that come from?
Where does the Ranger (Wildshape Variant) come from?
------------------------------------
SHIFTER BONUS FEATS:
1 Colossal Wildshape
2 Magical Beast Wildshape
I dont understand this either?
-----------------------------------
How does the Warshaper grant a +4 to Str and Con ?
Would a Unarmed Swordsage Variant 4 work better then monk 2? Only difference between Monk and Unarmed swordsage is to get Dex to Attack and Damage? then toss in Swordsage 4 to get The obviously high Wis to Damage on attacks?.
The thing with Wildshape and such, doesnt changing into the monster itself take away your already impressive str and Dex scores and add the monsters stuff str and Dex in its place?. Does the Con get replaced with the Monsters con?
I doubt thats understandable but hopefully in the confusion of my misunderstanding their is some light that shines.
Are the Exalted feats really neccessary for this? Because sometimes taking VOP later in the game to take advantage of the Tomes and manuels to increase your stats would be wiser rather then taking VOP early and missing out on the books?
The Warshapers 2nd Class ability is to grant a bonus of +4 to Str and Con
Wildshaping means you take on the creatures Physical Stats so yes to Str, Dex and Con.. Your hitpoints are determined by your own con score though so thats always good to have high.. Your Str in the WS form benefits from the Vow, and anything else that gives you bonuses as long as it is not your own base score - like leveling up (so always put those into your mental stats).
Wildshape Ranger is in Unearthed Arcana - I'd go Druid. You lose BAB but gain spells!!
The Shifter gets bonus feats - he chose those - in Epic Play you definately want access to Colossal forms!!
Hope that helps
It's the one I was reffering to. I recommend it, simply because the current feat will mean jack all in epic. You'll be so far behind it is not even funny. All you'll get from the feat in epic is bonus exalted feats (which are non epic feats), and stat/ac buffs. maybe damage reduction could be extrapolated as well.
but everything advances sooo slowly. it's not worth it in epic play. hence the variant epic feat by the name Epic Vow of Poverty.
as for worries about not getting inherent bonuses to stats, if you use the variant I linked, you get them in epic.
pre-epic, there are several ways to get them with out actually having the tomes. You just need to have wish cast on you 5 times in a row. An easy way is to get a caster to summon and bind to Efreeti's at the same time.
Once you have two efreeties you make their release conditional on each of them granting you 3 wishes. so 6 wishes get made total. 5 go to your stats, and the other 1 goes to what ever else you want.
repeat 6 more times and you get a +5 to all stats.:D
EDIT: I hope you understand how binging works. if not read up on the spell Planar Binding in the players handbook. Efreeti is a 10HD monster, and it shouldn't be hard to work out how to beat him in the charisma contest. good luck
Planar Binding is a 6th level Sor/Wiz spell. so you will either have to get your caster buddy to do it, or be the caster yourself. if you can pull off a +23 charisma check at level 13, then you win +5 to all stats. really.
you summon an efreeti and force him to cast wishes on your behalf. Afterwards the efreeti returns to the city of brass and complains to the Grand Sultan of the Efreeti, who uses his abilities as a greater power to snuff out your life with no save allowed or sends his divine rank 0, 30th level efreeti assassin hit squad to kill you and then snuff out your soul so you won't do anything so foolish again. This is what I will do to your character as DM if you abuse called creatures ability to use Wish spells.
To be nice I will make this information available to you beforehand with a DC 30 knowledge: the planes check or by asking any efreeti or balor before attempting such foolishness.
To quote fear of girls "You can't backstab the dungeon master."
Reis said it quite nicely I think
Worded:
I wish that after both of you are released from this binding circle, you forget everything that happened from the moment your were binded in this circle here today up to the point that you were freed from this circle here today.
*wish granted*
*binding is released*
they forget everything about being forced into servitude. they're evil and wonder why the HELL they're on the material plane.
I wish that after both of you are released from this binding circle, you forget everything that happened from the moment your were binded in this circle here today up to the point that you were freed from this circle here today.
*wish granted*
*binding is released*
they forget everything about being forced into servitude. they're evil and wonder why the HELL they're on the material plane.
at any rate, check my post for the DC 160 diplomacy check. it's better than charming some one. you basically make them your friends who'll do anything for you, gladly.
it's not servitude, so they aren't mad. you could even just go to their home plane and find a few of them who are in a small out post. befriend the lot. ask for wishes.
DC150 diplo check + 10 to DC to turn the 10 round check into a 1 round check = you turning people into fanatic.
I'd also like to see some published stats on the grand sultan. if he's anything like other "big baddies" that get published, I'll laugh. CR 40 Asmodeus.. lawl
Is my interpretation correct?
Where did you get the idea you could keep some of it?
A druid in our group got all ticked off when I quoted the RAWs for VOP and my group jumped down my throat including the DM at the time. I only gave the DM the info he needed to make the choice but the DM jumped down my throat saying the Druid at the time could have 49% of the cash gotten. But my interpretation was different and the DM didnt agree and used the Rule 0. End result was the group hating me and the person not playing because I was following the RAW's.
:D
Jarv: The DM is a newbie and didnt read all the books so. Hes one of the rare guys that him and me dont get along but face to face we smile and act like we get along.
But anyways.
Thats the level range ill be most likely be coming in with.
If I went Druid instead of Ranger (Variant) would the MoMF and the wildshaping stack? for the purpose of those wildshape feats?.
Does MoMF's duplicate the Exalted wildshape, frozen wildshape, sand wildshape, dragon wildshape abilities?
Which is better? druid or Ranger variant?
well. last wish is therefore used to make the efreeti both forget they granted the wishes or were even used in a Planar Binding.
The point of that spiel by the DM wasn't "if you can think up a way to bypass this particular example, I'll let you get free infinite wishes". It was-- "I am the DM, I am more infinite than you by definition. Don't push things too far."
Some players don't seem to get that.
Anything the player can do, the DM can do better, faster, and easier-- and it's justified in some cases. Infinite/free wishes are probably one of them.Which is better? druid or Ranger variant?
If you're going with a lot of levels of Master of Many Forms (i.e. the full 10), probably the ranger variant-- you'll have a much better base attack bonus and would still be 7 or 8 levels off of 9th level spells with druid levels. If you're just sprinkling in a few levels of MoMF, then epic spellcasting is nice to have...
Dragon Wildshape is actually very nice when combined with MoMF's and in epic-- MoMF's lifts the size restriction and the feat grants you supernatural abilities like the breath weapons. And in epic levels you'll be picking up enough hit dice to actually use some of the larger dragon forms.
If that's what the players really want to have, why try to force them for wanting that? some players also want god-hood, let em have it. it's just a game.
of course, it shouldn't be easy to get some things (like god hood status). And if getting free wishes is easy, chances are, other npcs have done it as well. hell, just get a hordeficer to craft +5 tomes for free.
if they're going to enslave some efreeti for the stats, make that a motivation for a new adventure. Perhaps the sultan does notice, despite the forget wish being used (he might be aware of any time his subjects become enslaved, so even if the efreet in question forgot, he certainly didn't). Maybe the players now "owe" him, they are epic. Why nuke the PCs? have the sultan give them a quest to perform and he'll forget their transgression against him.
Now you have an epic adventure hook, and the players get some minor buffs they wanted. And if they go to town trying to infinite free wishes, the sultan just intervenes sooner (say they stats trying to make millions of GP), probably gating their asses to the city of brass for a personal audience in the throne room.
If that's what the players really want to have, why try to force them for wanting that? some players also want god-hood, let em have it. it's just a game.
Because keeping the PCs to the estimated wealth guidelines makes it slightly easier to plan encounters. It makes the DMs job easier, which means it takes less time to plan and your on the fly adaptations/encounters are less likely to wipe out the party accidentally or be no challenge whatsoever. Godhood might also not fit in with the flavor of the campaign you have planned and losing that might mean you're not enjoying yourself, since you presumably had an idea that you wanted to run with when you volunteered for the job.
But the make up of the party as of now is.....
Mage/Archmage
Cleric
Warlock
Druid/MoMF (Not sure how long he will be with the group)
I think thats it.
From what my brother told me who is playing both the mage and cleric, is that I can play whatever I want in the Epic campaign.
A Crusader 11/Warblade 2/Swordsage 2/Master of Nine 5 (possibly inserting another martial adept prestige class if you want higher level maneuvers from warblade and master of nine) would have a tremendous amount of maneuvers available at epic levels, most of which would be available at all times. With the Swordsage Wisdom to AC and Unarmed Strike/Superior Unarmed strike you could probably even do Vow of Poverty without crippling your character.