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| #1Christopher_DyAug 16, 2011 4:10:37 | I post the following reply on "The swithunter's Handbook" Thread (but i'm afriad i never will be answered,cause the last post there it's from a year ago, that why i'm reposting here): "How about that (someone please tell me if this it's posible xD) Mounted scouts can't use skirmish, but there it's a way to get out of your mount as a FREE action ("provided that you still have a move action available that round" PHB),so , if your mount moves , you got skirmish bonuses , but you can't use then while mounted, rigth? (Swifthunter's turn) *mounted* - mount run (gain skirmish bonuses) [Give combat mounts commands it's a free action] - dismount as free action (you haven't use your move action yet , so you can dismount) *shot with skirmish bonuses (full round)* [you can't remount cause you use your move action] (2º swifthunter's turn) -as a free action you mount (you can , cause you don't use your move action this tun) *mounted* - mount run (gain skirmish bonuses) [Give combat mounts commands it's a free action]... It's that posible?xD {i think i just discover how scouts can make full atacks using skirmish LOL}" Am i rigth or not? Thanks for the attention, and sorry for the bad english. |
| #2dumorimasoddaaAug 16, 2011 11:21:37 | No idea if that is possable however one can easly make their 5 foot step a 10 foot one. Free action so full atack remains via Cyran Gliding Boots. Free action once per round to move 10 feet triggers skirmish for no real action use. |
| #3Tempest_StormwindAug 16, 2011 12:31:15 | There are actually numerous ways of doing this. The other two that immediately come to mind are Flyby Attack and the Travel Devotion feat. I'm more of a fan of Greater Manyshot myself, as while it is not quite as hot as the others, it is far easier to implement. (Geez, I wonder why no one ever notices that feat. It's not like it's new or anything; the XPH came out in 2004.) See the revised Swift Hunter's Handbook for more. |
| #4ElVizardAug 16, 2011 13:12:45 | Actaully there are some other ways: 1) Press the advantage (5th lv maneuver frim the white raven discipline, TOB 93): You have 2 5' steps each turn, total 10' free movemente while in this stance. 2) Derviche let you move while doing a full attack, so you can move 10' and start attacking with skirmish 3) Using the boots of sidestepping (MIC 78): you get an additional 5' step 3 times per day And some other ways I don't remember by now hope you find this useful |
| #5Christopher_DyAug 16, 2011 15:12:43 | The main intention of this , was not do Full atacks SOMETIMES per day, all this things work only sometimes. And the TOB stance it's to high level im my opnion, you can get a horse on level 1 , and got enough riding skill to do this with no problem in low levels My friend Say that it's good , but it's dificult, cause mounts are large size , and some mounts lack of mobility, that could be fixed with an item that i don't remeber where it's is xD , it's a magical item ,that summon a mount from a statue of that mount (something like that) , anyone know where it's is? |
| #6Tempest_StormwindAug 16, 2011 15:50:04 | There are many, many insta-mount options available. Even a wand of Mount is cheap. You were probably thinking of the figurines of wondrous power in the DMG. Also, you didn't even tell us the important thing to you was reusability, so please don't get snarky when we suggest less-frequently-usable things. That said, the options I suggested are either unlimited (greater manyshot) or functionally unlimited (travel devotion: it already lasts a minute, which is basically an entire encounter, especially since it doesn't cost you an action to trigger it. Add a nightstick or a one level splash in cleric (with a respectable, say 14+, charisma) and it becomes usable over basically every encounter in a day. The splash also gets you the Travel Devotion feat for free, and if you use Cloistered Cleric, you retain both your high number of skill points AND you get a free Knowledge Devotion feat, which dramatically improves your accuracy.) |
| #7Christopher_DyAug 16, 2011 16:02:13 | The problem with manyshot and the improved version for me it's the penalty on atack rolls, and in some place there is a bow that alows me two-weapon figth with it (don't remeber if it's something commun , but my DM , allows), for TWF i need extra atack from BBA, with many shot i need so spend another talent to make one more atack (atack with both weapons on a standard action [miniatures hanbook]i think), i don't know if that would work with many shot ,by one side manyshot it's ONE extra atack ,and if i can make two atack in a standard action with the bow, i could get another many shot atack , but i dunno if that's posible. Sorry , i don't like to make 1-class-level-combos anymore, i was already punished a lot for that , and my DM take really serious our BG.The normal cleric it's maybe a good idea, but that variant, clearly don't have martial abilities. I think about paladin, cause i need to HAVE turn/rebuke to benefit from night stick(rigth?), and they're more combative class, and we got the talent that stack their levels for some thing |
| #8Tempest_StormwindAug 16, 2011 16:32:47 | The problem with manyshot and the improved version for me it's the penalty on atack rolls, Which is why Travel Devotion is more powerful. However, don't discount Greater Manyshot - the penalty on the attack rolls is actually lower than it is on full attacks. (For instance, if you attack four times, you full attack penalties are -0, -5, -10, and -15 - functionally, only the first two stand a decent chance of hitting. With Greater Manyshot, it's -4/-4, -6/-6/-6, and -8/-8/-8/-8. The two- and three- arrow versions are comparable to the actual number of attacks that have a decent chance of hitting, and with a small boost to overall attack rolls - like, say, Knowledge Devotion - you can make even the four-arrow version count.) With archer types, it's easy to boost your attack rolls so high that the first attack is greater than a guaranteed hit. At this point it's a waste, even on a full attack. However, with Manyshot, you can raise ALL of your arrows high enough to have a reasonable chance of hitting, and with Greater Manyshot, each of them gets Skirmish damage. and in some place there is a bow that alows me two-weapon figth with it (don't remeber if it's something commun , but my DM , allows), Elvencraft, Races of the Wild, counts as both a longbow and quarterstaff (double weapon) as needed. However, you still need to spend a massive number of feats with TWF to offset the penalties and actually get those extra attacks, and those feats not only take up room but require Dexterity, which you can put to better use by focusing on archery. for TWF i need extra atack from BBA, I'm not familiar with that acronym. with many shot i need so spend another talent to make one more atack (atack with both weapons on a standard action [miniatures hanbook]i think), i don't know if that would work with many shot ,by one side manyshot it's ONE extra atack ,and if i can make two atack in a standard action with the bow, i could get another many shot atack , but i dunno if that's posible. It isn't. Manyshot is its own standard action, not its own attack action. That's also why you can't make iterative Manyshots on a full attack. Note that even if you COULD TWF and manyshot together, you wouldn't want to - the extreme feat costs would limit it to the highest levels, and the stacking attack penalties wouldn't help. Sorry , i don't like to make 1-class-level-combos anymore, i was already punished a lot for that , and my DM take really serious our BG.The normal cleric it's maybe a good idea, but that variant, clearly don't have martial abilities. 1) Stop getting snarky at us over failing to meet requirements you didn't specify. It's just tacky. 2) "takes serious our [background]" implies that you think people who dip don't take their stories seriously, or that a dip character can't have a convincing story, and that you think classes are their own identity instead of part of the identity of their character. All of these points are demonstrably incorrect. 3) Your DM is a jerk. Dips already get their own punishment through either XP penalties and having to jump through a huge range of hoops to actually remain competitive. 4) Cleric doesn't have martial abilities? *spit-take* It's the C in C.o.D.zilla for a reason, pal. It certainly does have martial abilities, even if it's cloistered. And if your DM objects, start as a Cloistered Cleric - you've left your monastery behind and have taken up a life in the wilderness. I think about paladin, cause i need to HAVE turn/rebuke to benefit from night stick(rigth?), I'd have to double check, but I'm pretty sure you don't, actually. and they're more combative class, See above. Note that Scout 4 / Cloistered Cleric 1 has the same base attack bonus as Scout 5, and you seem to think that Scout is "combative" enough. and we got the talent that stack their levels for some thing The paladin multiclass feats always and only advance Smite Evil and only Smite Evil. Which is even more limited than anything else mentioned in this thread. The exception is Devoted Tracker, which allows a paladin/ranger to designate his special mount as his animal companion. However, this is a problem for four reasons: Rangers only get half their level to their animal companion bonuses anyway (meaning they're several levels behind to begin with), the special mount duration is based on your paladin level alone and isn't boosted by your ranger levels (meaning you need to take paladin levels anyway, losing out on the better ranger class features at higher levels since the paladin ones past 5 are literally wasted space), the feat doesn't actually advance anything worth taking on your ranger side (your paladin level advances wild empathy, ooh, ahh... while favored enemy and combat style and similar all lay fallow), and finally the feat is really only useful if you can somehow double-up on its benefit AND use Druid instead of Ranger for the companion (see Supermount! for an example of this.) |
| #9ElVizardAug 16, 2011 16:57:27 | Actually the stance is only high-level when taking it with martial stance, with no martial level dipping. And the unmount-as-a-free-action tactic isn't a lv 1 tactic. You need to make DC 20 mount check to do that, so won't work all the time |
| #10Christopher_DyAug 16, 2011 17:15:20 | You're rigth , i'm trying to scape penaltys trying get more from Two-weapon-figth , sorry xD Thanks ,i'm trying to find that bow for some time TWF= Two-weapon-figth =] About TWF plus manyshot: hummmm, make sense , considering what you say , could be posible do make one many shot atack , and only a one extra atack from TWF WOW , calm down , i'm not snakying anyone xD, sorry if seems that ^^ I'm not saying that people who dip are nothing,, i say that he takes serious in the way that why i'm a cleric variant that doesnt figth , and sudenly decide to become a figther(ranger) lol My DM it's an storyteller DM too , he like to punish a lot xD If i don't need to have turn/rebuke i will just buy nithstikes lol If iget paladin , i probaly would get some variants to this classes features =] And about the ride check: DC20 ins't that hard on level 1(but turns to be really good at level 3) (considering that you get one 16 sta+elf , and got one magic item) 1level 4grad+4dex+2military saddle =10 3level 6grad+5dex+2 military saddle +2(handle animal 5rank)=15 I agree isn't simple, but ins't THAT hard Thanks for all the advices =] |
| #11Slagger_the_ChuulAug 16, 2011 18:50:03 | I'm not saying that people who dip are nothing,, i say that he takes serious in the way that why i'm a cleric variant that doesnt figth , and sudenly decide to become a figther(ranger) lol That's where you turn a problem into an opportunity and use your character build to put a pivotal event into your backstory. If he suddenly decided to become a warrior, it probably means that something traumatic happened in his past, so instead of it just being a 1 level throwaway that you picked for mechanical reasons, it also becomes a key part of your character's identity. As far as the mechanical power of your character and the roleplaying of that character go, you can have your cake and eat it too. |
| #12Tempest_StormwindAug 16, 2011 19:55:58 | The acronym I didn't recognize was BBA, not TWF. (I actually used TWF myself, in the line right above where I quoted you using BBA).hummmm, make sense , considering what you say , could be posible do make one many shot atack , and only a one extra atack from TWF No, it isn't. "Fight with two weapons" requires a full attack, which is a full round action. Manyshot is a standard action. Normally you cannot do both of them the same round. If you somehow get an extra standard action (such as the Action Surge feat in Eberron or the broken Celerity line of spells), you can TWF normally for that, then follow it up with Manyshot (provided you're able to switch between weapons as a free or swift action). Note that Manyshot affects bows, which take two hands to use. DC20 ins't that hard on level 1(but turns to be really good at level 3) (considering that you get one 16 sta+elf , and got one magic item) The base game assumes 15 as your higest stat, not 16 (15/14/13/12/10/8 is the elite array). Furthermore, you don't start with a magic item unless your DM allows it, and if your DM does, I can think of better choices than that. The issue I have with Ride isn't so much the trick you're using, it's that Ride isn't a good skill for scouts in general. You have to invest quite a few ranks in it to do this trick reliably, when you could be spending those ranks on, say, Disable Device. |
| #13Christopher_DyAug 16, 2011 22:40:54 | O sorry , its BAB , not BBA XD Thanks everyone xD |