Gestalt Charisma Caster - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Gestalt Charisma Caster

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
jedda
Apr 27, 2009 4:23:36 Although I would like to play this character it won't be any time soon so for the minute this build is a mental exercise. I am aiming at a a character who is an effective blaster, buffer and party face. There is a touch of magical trickster/fate manipulator in here as well. I feel that I have probably over synergised a bit.

Books: All 3.5 although I was avoiding setting specific (more than willing to change this though). Don't mind Dragon magazine ideas but please tell me which issue as I'm not that familiar with it.

Race: Probably human?
- I want to keep the Fey aspect, Fey touched would give me an extra level to play with but less goodies.
- Could also go for a fey race, pixie? If so I need to drop two levels

Attributes: Cha>Dex>Int=Con=Wis>Strength???
Alignment: CG

1. 1/2 Fey LA 1 / Sorcerer 1
2. 1/2 Fey LA 2 / Sorcerer 2
3. Bard 1 / Sorcerer 3
4. Bard 2 / Sorcerer 4
5. Bard 3 / Sorcerer 5
6. Paladin* 1 / Sorcerer 6
7. War Weaver 1 / Sorcerer 7
8. Marshall 1 / War Weaver 2
9. Paladin 2 / War Weaver 3
10. Bard 4 / War Weaver 4
11. Bard 5 / War Weaver 5
12. Fatemaker 1 / Sorcerer 8
13. Bard 6 / Mind Bender 1
14. Bard 7 / Fatespinner 1
15. Bard 8 / Fatespinner 2
16. Bard 9 / Fatespinner 3
17. Bard 10 / Fatespinner 4
18. Magical Trickster 1 / Sorcerer 9
19. Bard 11 / Magical Trickster 2
20. Bard 12 / Magical Trickster 3

*UA Paladin of Freedom

Hadn't thought much about feats although Melodic Casting is a given. Was thinking about Celestial Familiar for a Coure Eladrin.

As pointed out by Cru I need Enlarge Spell to get into War Weaver

Other Possible Feats:
Versatile Spell Caster - that's the one that allows you to use two lower level slots to cast a higher level spell right?
Snowflake Wardance - not that I really see this character in melee
Weapon Finesse - ditto
Nymph's Kiss -
Words of Creation -
Improved Flight - perfect manoeuvrability is always a plus.

Skills
Obviously perform skills
the Cha based social skills
Skill tricks?

I would like suggestions for improving this build. Other classes, races, feats (and flaws), equipment....
#2
jedda
Apr 28, 2009 4:36:18 *Bump*

Because I've added a bit to my original build
#3
cru
Apr 28, 2009 5:58:46 Nice how you have dead caster levels on the bard side of the build. Any particular reason why do you have 9 sorcerer levels? Running out of prestige classes?

Your PrC will eat up some feats:
War Weaver - Enlarge Spell
Fatemaker - Skill Focus (Bluff ), Skill Focus (Diplomacy), or Skill Focus (Intimidate)
#4
jedda
Apr 28, 2009 6:24:21
Nice how you have dead caster levels on the bard side of the build. Any particular reason why do you have 9 sorcerer levels? Running out of prestige classes?

Thanks. Out of ideas at that point. Any suggestions?

Your PrC will eat up some feats:
War Weaver - Enlarge Spell
Fatemaker - Skill Focus (Bluff ), Skill Focus (Diplomacy), or Skill Focus (Intimidate)

If I am recalling correctly Marshall gives Skill Focus (Diplomacy) at first level but you are right about enlarge spell, shall add that to feats
#5
Balthanon
Apr 28, 2009 12:21:19
Nice how you have dead caster levels on the bard side of the build. Any particular reason why do you have 9 sorcerer levels? Running out of prestige classes?

He can only have a prestige class on one side or the other and after 6 (which is about when you get into prestige classes), he has a prestige class balancing each level of sorcerer.
#6
widow
Apr 28, 2009 23:34:17 Well here are a few options I would go with. If you really want to be a bard, I would go:

Bard 20// Paladin 2/Battle Dancer 1/Cleric 1/ Marshall 1/ Dweomerkeeper 2/3 x/ Sublime Chord 2/Dwenomer Keeper 8

1)Battle dancer is from the dragon compendium volume 1. You add cha to ac like a monk adds wis to ac, but the class is chaotic.

2)Play an Illumian from Races of destiny and take the racial power that lets you spend turn attempts for free metamagic twice a day. This means free persistent spell. This is also a feat in the same book that improves your racial ability to 3 times a day. Favored class works like human, so bard will be favored and the rest will be with in 1 level.

3) Add the Unseelie template also from the dragon compendium volume 1. It turns you into a fey for a +0 LA. Also select a winter theme for the template which will impose a moral penatly to saves for all living non-fey creatures within 5 feet of you. Get close when casting those save or die spells, they will die.

4) Sublime chord sets your caster level equal to its level + one other arcane spell casting class. Note this ability is listed under spell casting so it will be advanced by Prestige classes that advance this class. The caster level applies to all arcane spell casting classes. Choose bard and your caster level will be 30 at level 20.

5) Dweomerkeeper is in the Complete Divine web enchancement. It will let you convert a number of spells a day into supernatural effects. This means one they cannot be dispelled and two they do not require any components. Free wishes. Use this class to advance sublime chord later, but you can push cleric early on. The class also reduces all your metamagics by one at level 10. If in faerun follow mystra with this class taking the Magic and rune domain. The rune domain will give you a free crafting feat which is required for entry, likewise for the magic domain.

I could not fit in your full warweaver, but might not be needed. Still leaves room for 3 more levels. You can throw the half-fey template in there if you wish or take another class. Mystic wander from Magic of Faerun could fit in if you took 2 more DK levels to advance cleric there and Mystic Wander 1. Mystic Wander adds Cha to AC as a sacred bonus at level 1.

Feats
L1
L3 Extend Spell
Cleric 3 Scribe Scroll
L6 Persistent Spell
L9 Enhanced Sigil (racial ability to +3)
L12 Words of Creation (take some damage, double bard song effects)
L15
L18

Spells to name a few

Spell compendium
L6 Nixie's Grace for +8 to Cha
L4 Sirine's Grace for Cha to AC as a deflection bonus
L4 Thunderlance Attack and do damage off of Cha with a 20 foot reach lance
L1 Undersong Make perform checks instead of concentration checks (saves you a feat)

Frostburn
L6 Snowsong Adds +4 bonus to cha as a moral bonus plus alot more

Some book
L4 Inner Beauty adds +4 sacred bonus to Cha and dex

I have a similar build using beguiler as the base and Eldrich Master from dragon 280. That lets the beguiler cast cleric and beguiler spells spontanously off of Int, and sorc and bard spells from sublime chord off of cha.
#7
jedda
Apr 30, 2009 4:21:32 I love those ideas widow, will have to think a lot about them, especially Battledancer.

And those spells...

I cross posted my original post to BG and with suggestions from there and here I've come up with the following.

Sunshine and Shadow
Picture this, a pair of Elven twins born with powers of the mind and the arcane. Over time further powers awaken one falls into darkness the other stays in the light.

Phrenic Magic-Blooded Star Elves LA 2
Racial adjustments: -2 Con, +2 Int, +8 Cha

Working to enhance their innate abilities leads both siblings to acquire the Half-Fey Template before/as

Build Stub:
1. LA 1 Phrenic / Sorcerer 1: Magic in the Blood, Versatile Spell Caster, Enlarge Spell
2. LA 2 Phrenic / Sorcerer 2
3. LA 1 Half-Fey / Sorcerer 3: Heighten Spell
4. LA 2 Half-Fey / Sorcerer 4

It is at this point that the siblings diverge

Sunshine
CG, Half-Fey Phrenic Magic-Blooded Star Elf
+2 Dex, -4 Con, +2 Int, +2 Wis, +12 Cha.

5. War Weaver 1 / Sorcerer 5
6. Marshall 1 / War Weaver 2: Skill Focus (Diplomacy) bonus, Nymph's Kiss
7. Paladin of Freedom 1/ War Weaver 3
8. Paladin of Freedom 2/ War Weaver 4
9. Bard 1 / War Weaver 5: Melodic Casting
10. Virtuoso 1 / Sorcerer 6
11. Sublime Chord 1 / Sorcerer 7
12. Sublime Chord 2 / Sorcerer 8: Celestial Familiar
13. Sublime Chord 3 / Sorcerer 9
14. Sublime Chord 4 / Sorcerer 10
15. Sublime Chord 5 / Sorcerer 11: Words of Creation
16. Sublime Chord 6 / Sorcerer 12
17. Fatespinner 1 / Sorcerer 13
18. Fatespinner 2 / Sorcerer 14: (FEAT)
19. Fatespinner 3 / Sorcerer 15
20. Fatespinner 4 / Sorcerer 16

Shadow
CE, Unseelie Half-Fey Phrenic Magic-Blooded Star Elf
-2 Str, +4 Dex, -6 Con, +2 Int , +14 Cha

5. War Weaver 1 / Sorcerer 5
6. Marshall 1 / Mind Bender 1: Skill Focus (Diplomacy) bonus, Mindsight
7. Paladin of Slaughter 1 / War Weaver 2
8. Paladin of Slaughter 2 / War Weaver 3
9. Bard 1 / War Weaver 4: Melodic Casting
10. Virtuoso 1/ Sorcerer 6
11. Sublime Chord 1 / Sorcerer 7
12. Sublime Chord 2 / Sorcerer 8: (FEAT)
13. War Weaver 5 / Sorcerer 9
14. Virtuoso 2 / Sorcerer 10
15. Virtuoso 3 / Sorcerer 11: (FEAT)
16. Virtuoso 4 / Sorcerer 12
17. Virtuoso 5 / Sorcerer 13
18. Virtuoso 6 / Sorcerer 14: (FEAT)
19. Virtuoso 7 / Sorcerer 15
20. Fatespinner 1 / Sorcerer 16

I am now looking for further suggestions. I am also trying to create a more martial build that sings and dances and slices and dices.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 jedda Apr 27, 2009 4:23:36	Although I would like to play this character it won't be any time soon so for the minute this build is a mental exercise. I am aiming at a a character who is an effective blaster, buffer and party face. There is a touch of magical trickster/fate manipulator in here as well. I feel that I have probably over synergised a bit. Books: All 3.5 although I was avoiding setting specific (more than willing to change this though). Don't mind Dragon magazine ideas but please tell me which issue as I'm not that familiar with it. Race: Probably human? - I want to keep the Fey aspect, Fey touched would give me an extra level to play with but less goodies. - Could also go for a fey race, pixie? If so I need to drop two levels Attributes: Cha>Dex>Int=Con=Wis>Strength??? Alignment: CG 1. 1/2 Fey LA 1 / Sorcerer 1 2. 1/2 Fey LA 2 / Sorcerer 2 3. Bard 1 / Sorcerer 3 4. Bard 2 / Sorcerer 4 5. Bard 3 / Sorcerer 5 6. Paladin* 1 / Sorcerer 6 7. War Weaver 1 / Sorcerer 7 8. Marshall 1 / War Weaver 2 9. Paladin 2 / War Weaver 3 10. Bard 4 / War Weaver 4 11. Bard 5 / War Weaver 5 12. Fatemaker 1 / Sorcerer 8 13. Bard 6 / Mind Bender 1 14. Bard 7 / Fatespinner 1 15. Bard 8 / Fatespinner 2 16. Bard 9 / Fatespinner 3 17. Bard 10 / Fatespinner 4 18. Magical Trickster 1 / Sorcerer 9 19. Bard 11 / Magical Trickster 2 20. Bard 12 / Magical Trickster 3 *UA Paladin of Freedom Hadn't thought much about feats although Melodic Casting is a given. Was thinking about Celestial Familiar for a Coure Eladrin. As pointed out by Cru I need Enlarge Spell to get into War Weaver Other Possible Feats: Versatile Spell Caster - that's the one that allows you to use two lower level slots to cast a higher level spell right? Snowflake Wardance - not that I really see this character in melee Weapon Finesse - ditto Nymph's Kiss - Words of Creation - Improved Flight - perfect manoeuvrability is always a plus. Skills Obviously perform skills the Cha based social skills Skill tricks? I would like suggestions for improving this build. Other classes, races, feats (and flaws), equipment....
#2 jedda Apr 28, 2009 4:36:18	Bump Because I've added a bit to my original build
#3 cru Apr 28, 2009 5:58:46	Nice how you have dead caster levels on the bard side of the build. Any particular reason why do you have 9 sorcerer levels? Running out of prestige classes? Your PrC will eat up some feats: War Weaver - Enlarge Spell Fatemaker - Skill Focus (Bluff ), Skill Focus (Diplomacy), or Skill Focus (Intimidate)
#4 jedda Apr 28, 2009 6:24:21	Nice how you have dead caster levels on the bard side of the build. Any particular reason why do you have 9 sorcerer levels? Running out of prestige classes? Thanks. Out of ideas at that point. Any suggestions? Your PrC will eat up some feats: War Weaver - Enlarge Spell Fatemaker - Skill Focus (Bluff ), Skill Focus (Diplomacy), or Skill Focus (Intimidate) If I am recalling correctly Marshall gives Skill Focus (Diplomacy) at first level but you are right about enlarge spell, shall add that to feats
#5 Balthanon Apr 28, 2009 12:21:19	Nice how you have dead caster levels on the bard side of the build. Any particular reason why do you have 9 sorcerer levels? Running out of prestige classes? He can only have a prestige class on one side or the other and after 6 (which is about when you get into prestige classes), he has a prestige class balancing each level of sorcerer.
#6 widow Apr 28, 2009 23:34:17	Well here are a few options I would go with. If you really want to be a bard, I would go: Bard 20// Paladin 2/Battle Dancer 1/Cleric 1/ Marshall 1/ Dweomerkeeper 2/3 x/ Sublime Chord 2/Dwenomer Keeper 8 1)Battle dancer is from the dragon compendium volume 1. You add cha to ac like a monk adds wis to ac, but the class is chaotic. 2)Play an Illumian from Races of destiny and take the racial power that lets you spend turn attempts for free metamagic twice a day. This means free persistent spell. This is also a feat in the same book that improves your racial ability to 3 times a day. Favored class works like human, so bard will be favored and the rest will be with in 1 level. 3) Add the Unseelie template also from the dragon compendium volume 1. It turns you into a fey for a +0 LA. Also select a winter theme for the template which will impose a moral penatly to saves for all living non-fey creatures within 5 feet of you. Get close when casting those save or die spells, they will die. 4) Sublime chord sets your caster level equal to its level + one other arcane spell casting class. Note this ability is listed under spell casting so it will be advanced by Prestige classes that advance this class. The caster level applies to all arcane spell casting classes. Choose bard and your caster level will be 30 at level 20. 5) Dweomerkeeper is in the Complete Divine web enchancement. It will let you convert a number of spells a day into supernatural effects. This means one they cannot be dispelled and two they do not require any components. Free wishes. Use this class to advance sublime chord later, but you can push cleric early on. The class also reduces all your metamagics by one at level 10. If in faerun follow mystra with this class taking the Magic and rune domain. The rune domain will give you a free crafting feat which is required for entry, likewise for the magic domain. I could not fit in your full warweaver, but might not be needed. Still leaves room for 3 more levels. You can throw the half-fey template in there if you wish or take another class. Mystic wander from Magic of Faerun could fit in if you took 2 more DK levels to advance cleric there and Mystic Wander 1. Mystic Wander adds Cha to AC as a sacred bonus at level 1. Feats L1 L3 Extend Spell Cleric 3 Scribe Scroll L6 Persistent Spell L9 Enhanced Sigil (racial ability to +3) L12 Words of Creation (take some damage, double bard song effects) L15 L18 Spells to name a few Spell compendium L6 Nixie's Grace for +8 to Cha L4 Sirine's Grace for Cha to AC as a deflection bonus L4 Thunderlance Attack and do damage off of Cha with a 20 foot reach lance L1 Undersong Make perform checks instead of concentration checks (saves you a feat) Frostburn L6 Snowsong Adds +4 bonus to cha as a moral bonus plus alot more Some book L4 Inner Beauty adds +4 sacred bonus to Cha and dex I have a similar build using beguiler as the base and Eldrich Master from dragon 280. That lets the beguiler cast cleric and beguiler spells spontanously off of Int, and sorc and bard spells from sublime chord off of cha.
#7 jedda Apr 30, 2009 4:21:32	I love those ideas widow, will have to think a lot about them, especially Battledancer. And those spells... I cross posted my original post to BG and with suggestions from there and here I've come up with the following. Sunshine and Shadow Picture this, a pair of Elven twins born with powers of the mind and the arcane. Over time further powers awaken one falls into darkness the other stays in the light. Phrenic Magic-Blooded Star Elves LA 2 Racial adjustments: -2 Con, +2 Int, +8 Cha Working to enhance their innate abilities leads both siblings to acquire the Half-Fey Template before/as Build Stub: 1. LA 1 Phrenic / Sorcerer 1: Magic in the Blood, Versatile Spell Caster, Enlarge Spell 2. LA 2 Phrenic / Sorcerer 2 3. LA 1 Half-Fey / Sorcerer 3: Heighten Spell 4. LA 2 Half-Fey / Sorcerer 4 It is at this point that the siblings diverge Sunshine CG, Half-Fey Phrenic Magic-Blooded Star Elf +2 Dex, -4 Con, +2 Int, +2 Wis, +12 Cha. 5. War Weaver 1 / Sorcerer 5 6. Marshall 1 / War Weaver 2: Skill Focus (Diplomacy) bonus, Nymph's Kiss 7. Paladin of Freedom 1/ War Weaver 3 8. Paladin of Freedom 2/ War Weaver 4 9. Bard 1 / War Weaver 5: Melodic Casting 10. Virtuoso 1 / Sorcerer 6 11. Sublime Chord 1 / Sorcerer 7 12. Sublime Chord 2 / Sorcerer 8: Celestial Familiar 13. Sublime Chord 3 / Sorcerer 9 14. Sublime Chord 4 / Sorcerer 10 15. Sublime Chord 5 / Sorcerer 11: Words of Creation 16. Sublime Chord 6 / Sorcerer 12 17. Fatespinner 1 / Sorcerer 13 18. Fatespinner 2 / Sorcerer 14: (FEAT) 19. Fatespinner 3 / Sorcerer 15 20. Fatespinner 4 / Sorcerer 16 Shadow CE, Unseelie Half-Fey Phrenic Magic-Blooded Star Elf -2 Str, +4 Dex, -6 Con, +2 Int , +14 Cha 5. War Weaver 1 / Sorcerer 5 6. Marshall 1 / Mind Bender 1: Skill Focus (Diplomacy) bonus, Mindsight 7. Paladin of Slaughter 1 / War Weaver 2 8. Paladin of Slaughter 2 / War Weaver 3 9. Bard 1 / War Weaver 4: Melodic Casting 10. Virtuoso 1/ Sorcerer 6 11. Sublime Chord 1 / Sorcerer 7 12. Sublime Chord 2 / Sorcerer 8: (FEAT) 13. War Weaver 5 / Sorcerer 9 14. Virtuoso 2 / Sorcerer 10 15. Virtuoso 3 / Sorcerer 11: (FEAT) 16. Virtuoso 4 / Sorcerer 12 17. Virtuoso 5 / Sorcerer 13 18. Virtuoso 6 / Sorcerer 14: (FEAT) 19. Virtuoso 7 / Sorcerer 15 20. Fatespinner 1 / Sorcerer 16 I am now looking for further suggestions. I am also trying to create a more martial build that sings and dances and slices and dices.