Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 ovinnik Jul 22, 2008 16:20:01	Hi folks, a friend of mine is starting up a small 2nd level Gestalt game tomorrow night, and I could use some ideas. He expects the players to twink it up a bit, and intend on having dangerous challenges to match. The group will have four players, ideally, but two of those players are somewhat iffy. So far, the only player to have a character is a half-ogre Barbarian/Fighter. So, since the beatstick job is taken, I'm probably looking to fill a different role(s). I haven't rolled attributes yet, but assume I'll have whatever I need for whatever combos you can think up (5d6 six times, reroll all 1s, drop lowest two dice). Books allowed are as follows: Core, PHBII, Complete Series, Races series, FRCS, PGtF, Magic Item Compendium, Spell Compendium, Book of Exalted Cheese(er, Deeds, no VoP though). No Bo9S, Tome of Magic, psionics, or anything else. Class variants from Unearthed Arcana are probably also available, and maybe the Factotum from Dungeonscape. Good alignment only, with the exception of class combos which make that impossible (druid/monk, for example). But no single classes which disallow good alignments. Racial Hit Dice aren't being used. Drop them all and everything gained from them and just use the level adjustment. LA is split between the two sides of the gestalt equally, meaning I could have, at most, a LA of +2, because the DM wants at least one full gestalt level. Templates are accepted on a case-by-case basis. Now I'm not really looking for full 20-level builds, unless you really want to throw them out there. General suggestion and examples would be great. So, any ideas?
#2 phoenix00 Jul 22, 2008 16:28:26	So let me get this straight. At ECL 2 If you do 1 LA race your class will look like this X 1/LA 1 X 2/Y 1 If you do 2 LA race your class will look like this LA 1/LA 2 X 1/Y 1 If you do 3 LA race your class will look like this LA 1/LA 2 X 1/LA 3
#3 ovinnik Jul 22, 2008 16:37:53	Yep. But he doesn't want any LA +3 races. Oh, I forgot: One free Regional or Racial feat.
#4 ikildkenny Jul 22, 2008 16:54:01	As the beatstick slot is "taken" why not go for a Spellcaster ... a not-so-bad idea could be a focused spec Wizard (conjuration)/Beguiler ... lots of skillpoints, INT only based casting, lots of spells as well and you can without any problem drop illusion, Enchantment and Evocation starting from lvl 6 you could go for ultimate Magus and shadowcraft mage (as a gnome of course - +1 LA Whispergnome anyone?) so for your 2 lvls you will be: whispergnome // focused conjurer 1 Beguiler 1 // FC 2 there is not even a need to use the practised spellcaster trick for Ultimate magus because you will have max CL anyways (because you take 2 CL advancing clases) ... probably going for archmage or master specialist (or even incantatrix/red wizard?!?!) after SCM
#5 phoenix00 Jul 22, 2008 17:01:18	Is Monster Manual III allowed? The Petal (LA 2) would be a good race as well as anything with a high charisma plus the BOED half celestial (with LA 2) if you can get either allowed. ---- Sadly your books don't allow ebberron or psionic. With your rules a primoridal half giant half fey sorcerer would have been awesome to play. This is what those templates/races give you for 3 LA Half Giant (LA 1) +2 Str, -2 Dex, +2 Con Primordial Giant(LA 0) -4 Str, -2 Con, +4 Int, +4 Cha Invisibility at Will Half Fey (LA 2) +2 Dex, -2 Con, +2 Wis, +4 Cha DR 5/Cold Iron Natural Flight Charm Person at Will SP abilities when you go up in hit dice. Total -2 Str, +0 Dex, -4 Con, +4 Int, +2 Wis, +8 Cha plus lots of nice abilities, and you get to play a classic gaelic feyish type creature. Part human, part giant, part fey.
#6 widow Jul 22, 2008 17:34:41	Looks like you should shoot for something that normal has alot of HD and a low level adjustment. Most of the beasties that come to mind are more for fighter types though. The minataur, centaur, barbaru (ick spelling), and oger are all +2 LA and are in the monster manual I. Although not optimized, I might be tempted to go with a dragon wyrmling. Both bronze and copper have a level adjustment of +2. Tiny size, land speed 40, fly speed 100, and natural armor. Too bad were creatures are all +3 in the MMI. Now if you can expand beyond the specific books listed, the underdark (forgotten realms) book contains the Gloura. It has 7HD and a level adjustment of +2. It has a nice mix of stat bonuses, flight, DR 10/cold iron, and casts spells as a 7th level bard. If you are allowed to search the other monster manuals, I am sure there are many more such beasties that could be useful (such as the petal despite the cohort rating).
#7 ovinnik Jul 22, 2008 17:36:43	No Monster Manuals beyond the first, unfortunately. He's pretty set on which books he's allowing and which he isn't.
#8 keyes2k4 Jul 23, 2008 15:13:17	Try dragonkin, they're LA +2 and if you strip away the racial HD they're still broken for a +2. . . the question remaining is, are they in Races of the dragon (I originally found them in draconomicon) or any of the books you said were allowed? They get like +8 str, +2 dex, +4 con, +2 wis, +2 charisma, +7 Natural armor, fly speed 30 (good) and they're large (and in charge imo). With this, gestalt barbarian and sorcerer and enlarge yourself to huge before every battle. later levels you'll be able to go frenzied berzerker and probably kill the party lol.
#9 ookamikiba Jul 23, 2008 17:11:36	The first things that come to mind here are: Rogue/Swashbuckler with Daring Outlaw...that'll be a lot of SA damage Use a Paladin (icky, icky)/Druid sure you lose some heavy armor, but grab a mount and watch as, once you grab Track, you have a Supermount running around. That's some serious progression... Wizard/Archivest Not awesome, but that's basically every spell (except for the handful that somehow don't make it onto a list) available to you Artificer/Paladin (maybe of Tyranny or Slaughter so you can use the Sacrifice rules to get extra XP)...Cha to you UMD and saves, it isn't great, but that'd be a nice bit right there.... Rogue(or Ninja)((Or Spellthief))/Warlock grab a level of Incarnum and three levels of Hellfire Warlock, not to mention an item of (I think) Sniper's Shot Continuous...Eldritch Spear means that your SAs go off at 250 foot range. Warlock/Paladin Once again, the Cha is the big factor here. That and using a two handed weapon with Hideous Blow makes for some serious damage. I'm sure that the veterans here can give you better stuff, but this was what I could come up with on short notice...
#10 amadithegreat Jul 23, 2008 18:46:18	If you ever get to reroll character, black ethergaunt has 4 LA and 17 HD, and gives level 17 wizard casting. MM3 has Armand: 2 La, +6 Dex/Con, +4 natural armor and burrowspeed. Centaur is decent. MM4 has windrazor.
#11 triune Jul 24, 2008 3:01:17	not sure if this is allowed, but something that worked for me a while back was: race: human/wererat (natural) Classes: spellthief/ninja PrC: Warshaper (BAB +4 or +5 can't remember which) just play the classes until you can reach the PrC and then gestalt Spellthief or Ninja with Warshaper until finished (5 levels), and then resume the class before Warshaper. this build is interposable like Weretiger/fighter/warshaper build, Werebear/Barbarian/Warshaper build, Werewolf/Monk/Warshaper. hope this help, and these builds are high damage, and on the plus side, the wererat build is the rogue shtick character. Triune :D [EDIT] don't forget to ask your DM about alignment for lycanthropes, as a DM and asking other DMs i've found that alignment for a lycantrope depends on upbringing, so if you have trouble with choosing a werecreature based on alignment, then ask the DM if you can be a different alignment based on upbringing in a good society of werecreatures. [EDIT]
#12 spectre3541 Jul 24, 2008 3:35:53	I think that most non-gestalt progressions can really benefit from going Monk straight up on the other side. The survivability of a Monk makes it a great complement to almost any build. On the other hand, if you want to go a different route, I played a Cleric 20 // Ranger 2 / fighter 4 / Pious Templar 10 / Heirophant 4. Somehow I managed to get 19 feats in there.... Be sure to grab Battle Blessing. All Paladin spells as swift actions makes Paladin spellcasting good! There's also lots of room for DMM fun if you're so inclined. Or for more of a de-buffer type, you could do something like Wizard 3 / Master Specialist (necro) 10 / Wizard 7 // Hexblade 13 / Fatespinner 5 / Hexblade 2. Take the Dark companion and Skeletal Minion variants if you can, the Dark Companion is especially great. And the best for last.... I've always wanted to try a Monk 20 // Druid 20 with VoP. I just think it's be cool. And there's NO WAY you can die.... I mean... a ninja bear? Awesome. That's my 2cp.
#13 tshern Jul 24, 2008 7:22:43	so for your 2 lvls you will be: whispergnome // focused conjurer 1 Beguiler 1 // FC 2 Whisper gnome has LA 0, not LA 1.