Gestalt Jack of all Trades - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Gestalt Jack of all Trades

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
xandor_tikroth
Feb 22, 2009 23:00:50 Designing the BBEG for my campaign, kinda the ultimate wrap-up for everything. Doing the best with what I have though, I've decided to go the jack-of-all-trades route. Someone who could dish out damage equally well with spells, melee, fists and bows. So, this is what I've put together. I'm not going to post my stats (unless someone asks) because they're absolutely ridiculous. I will say that I'm going with a custom race and the Half-Dragon template. So, here goes.

Sorcerer 1 Barbarian 1
Sorcerer 2 Barbarian 2
Sorcerer 3 Barbarian 3
Sorcerer 4 Barbarian 4
Sorcerer 5 Barbarian 5
Sorcerer 6 Monk 1
Eldritch Knight 1 Monk 2
Eldritch Knight 2 Monk 3
Eldritch Knight 3 Monk 4
Eldritch Knight 4 Monk 5
Eldritch Knight 5 Monk 6
Cleric 1 Fist of the Forrest 1
Cleric 2 Fist of the Forrest 2
Cleric 3 Fist of the Forrest 3
Contemplative 1 Swordsage 1
Contemplative 2 Swordsage 2
Contemplative 3 Fighter 1
Mystic Theurge 1 Fighter 2
Sorcerer 7 Deepwood Sniper 1
Sorcerer 8 Deepwood Sniper 2

So, as you can see, I really wanted to have access to everything. This will make me deal tons of damage, I'll be casting as an 14th Level Sorcerer and 7th Level Cleric, be able to dish out unarmed damage like no one's business, and have some ranged abilities as well.

My character hasn't been set in stone yet, so I welcome any suggestions. On thing to note though is that Charisma is the highest of my spell-based stats, so something like Wizard wouldn't be very helpful. One thing that I tried to do was put in prestige classes on the spellcasting side that would help to continue my spellcasting abilities.

Thanks in advance for the advice.

Oh, one other thing, I still haven't quite learned my way around the abbreviations of the books, so if when you cite your sources you could spell the book out, that would be very helpful. I have access to most of the books, but almost none of the DragMag's, so that won't be helpful.
#2
xandor_tikroth
Feb 27, 2009 1:20:44 Also, I'm considering taking the ACF for the Sorcerer that lets me trade my familiar for an animal companion. More flavor.

Anyone have any suggestions?
#3
true_shinken
Feb 27, 2009 10:34:46 For a jack-of-all-trades thing, you sould probably go Factotum 10/Chameleon 10//Warblade 20 or something like that.
#4
phaedrusxy
Feb 27, 2009 12:03:23 Ok...

1) Why do you have all the spellcasting classes on the same side?
2) Making a "jack of all trades" is generally a bad idea. You'll get more bang for your buck by specializing.
3) A full spellcaster will pretty much own any non-full spellcaster, power-wise.

So... having said that, here's what I'd suggest: choose a casting class, and stick with it. Keep full or nearly full progression for that class, even going as far as putting the base class on the opposite side when you have a level of a PrC that doesn't advance spellcasting. Don't try to do both sorcerer and cleric, as it is silly. You can get most of the good sorcerer spells as a cleric, anyway, with some trickery (Spell domain, Magic domain, Divine Magician alternate class feature, be an Archivist instead, etc).
#5
ozgun
Feb 27, 2009 13:25:08
Ok...

1) Why do you have all the spellcasting classes on the same side?
2) Making a "jack of all trades" is generally a bad idea. You'll get more bang for your buck by specializing.
3) A full spellcaster will pretty much own any non-full spellcaster, power-wise.

So... having said that, here's what I'd suggest: choose a casting class, and stick with it. Keep full or nearly full progression for that class, even going as far as putting the base class on the opposite side when you have a level of a PrC that doesn't advance spellcasting. Don't try to do both sorcerer and cleric, as it is silly. You can get most of the good sorcerer spells as a cleric, anyway, with some trickery (Spell domain, Magic domain, Divine Magician alternate class feature, be an Archivist instead, etc).

Archivist/Wizard.
All versatility you will ever need, and more.
#6
phaedrusxy
Feb 27, 2009 14:51:57
Archivist/~~Wizard~~.
All versatility you will ever need, and more.

FTFY. There is no need for wizard when you're an archivist, because you can steal all the wizard's toys, anyway.

I'd put something else on the other side, like a full BAB class, a class with good skills, something that grants turning for Divine Metamagic, stuff that gets you mettle, evasion, and cha to saves, etc. Or even better, some combination of that stuff.
#7
xandor_tikroth
Feb 28, 2009 0:12:03 With my progression as it stands, I get a full or very close to full BAB progression. My character is already ridiculous enough. I can single-handedly defeat any of the party members in one on one combat. The reason that I put all my spellcasting classes on the same side was for ease of my reading.

I'm not really trying to do spellcasting well, and I'm in fact considering removing the cleric from my progression, since I don't put much stock into divine spellcasting. Also, I enjoy not having to prepare my spells, which is why I chose to go sorcerer instead of wizard. Besides, I mainly melee anyway, so this was more for flavor.
#8
phoenix00
Feb 28, 2009 1:03:48 Scout 4//Ranger 13/Sorcerer 3 (take the sorcerer levels during the levels where you do not gain spellcasting with Dragon Devotee)//
Sorcerer 5/Unseen Seer 10/Dragon Devotee 5

Bab of 18
6 or 8 skill points at all levels
Full sorcerer spellcasting. Pick spellcasting designed to grant you mobility, defense, and actions.
Combined with Improved Skirmish your skirmish damage is 5d6+2d6+4d6+2d6=13d6. Now take blue draconic heritage feat from dragon magic and you can fire up to 9 electricity orbs that do a lot of damage.
Can melee if you pick the right spells. Alter Self into a dwarven ancestors+wraithstrike+a large club with greater mighty wallop on it.
#9
gorfnad_the_shiznit
Feb 28, 2009 1:29:28 Now this is more of a Jack of All Trades: Factotum of War. Although I still second Factotum 10/ Chameleon 10 // Warblade 20 or Archivist 20 // Warblade 20 if you want spellcasting. Is this your groups first time playing gestalt, because I'm wondering with your build how exactly do you beat them in one-on-one combat? I mean a full caster would have access to Time Stop and Gate which would easily handle your build.
#10
emansdrawkcab
Feb 28, 2009 2:56:45 Duskblade 5/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Arcane Archer 10 // Wizard 20

Good at all the things you wanted.
#11
xandor_tikroth
Feb 28, 2009 4:22:45 My character is the only gestalt character. So yeah, I guess its a little arrogant to say that I can beat them in single combat. Wasn't really thinking when I made my last post. I'm almost certain that right now, I can come pretty close to beating all four PC's in combat in a group. But I'm not really sure. I'm not looking to beat them into the ground, but to give them a really good challenge.

As far as your recommendation goes, ema, I specified in my previous post that I don't like to deal with preparing spells, which Wizard does nothing but. I'm up for suggestions on changes to my levels in Cleric, Contemplative and Mystic Theurge though. Might look into Arcane Archer.
#12
idontmuchcareforit
Mar 09, 2009 12:49:02 Your build can do a lot of different things... poorly.
A Wizard 20 or a Cleric 20 or Druid 20 would destroy you even without gestalting.

The other issue is that, while you can do a lot of different things, you can't do all or even some of them at the same time. Most of your abilities are standard actions, or, as is the case of rage, mutually exclusive to a lot of your other abilities. In addition, some of your abilities are just much much better than others to the degree that some of them should never see use.

I'm in a gestalt campaign right now, and it's pretty optimized. We have a house rule that stipulates that you can be in 2 prestige classes at once; however you can't take a prestige class if you have an unfinished one on the same side.

I'm playing a sorcerer/paladin that has spellsword, Iot7V, and abjurant champion. Also a perfect BAB no less than a d8 hit die for any level, and perfect spellcasting for 20 levels.

Another player has a rogue/swashbuckler//cleric that has black flame zealot and assassin. He has a perfect BAB, perfect divine casting, and no less than a d8 hit die for any level and a death attack with a DC that eventually exceeds 40.

The prestige class "Mage of the Arcane Order" will pretty much give you as much versatility as you'll ever use. Put ranger or monk on the other side and you'll never be unprepared.
#13
keyes2k4
Mar 09, 2009 13:01:00
Originally Posted by Heliomance
At high levels (16+), Rainbow Servant is the way to go. Assuming you follow the general rule of Text Trumps Table and give it full casting, anyway. Warmage 6/Rainbow Servant 10 can spont-cast off the entire Cleric spell list. This is a Good Thing.

This caught my eye before, you may want to try and implement it in a gestalt build.
#14
xandor_tikroth
Mar 10, 2009 0:12:39 Well, I've changed things around a little bit so I'm casting as a full-level sorcerer at every level. Also dropped a few levels in Barbarian and picked up a couple of levels in Rogue and Theif-Acrobat. The other DM that's approving my character has made it a rule that I can't use any custom classes, that only classes from the sourcebooks are allowed.

If anyone's interested, I can post my updated progression along with current stats.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 xandor_tikroth Feb 22, 2009 23:00:50	Designing the BBEG for my campaign, kinda the ultimate wrap-up for everything. Doing the best with what I have though, I've decided to go the jack-of-all-trades route. Someone who could dish out damage equally well with spells, melee, fists and bows. So, this is what I've put together. I'm not going to post my stats (unless someone asks) because they're absolutely ridiculous. I will say that I'm going with a custom race and the Half-Dragon template. So, here goes. Sorcerer 1 Barbarian 1 Sorcerer 2 Barbarian 2 Sorcerer 3 Barbarian 3 Sorcerer 4 Barbarian 4 Sorcerer 5 Barbarian 5 Sorcerer 6 Monk 1 Eldritch Knight 1 Monk 2 Eldritch Knight 2 Monk 3 Eldritch Knight 3 Monk 4 Eldritch Knight 4 Monk 5 Eldritch Knight 5 Monk 6 Cleric 1 Fist of the Forrest 1 Cleric 2 Fist of the Forrest 2 Cleric 3 Fist of the Forrest 3 Contemplative 1 Swordsage 1 Contemplative 2 Swordsage 2 Contemplative 3 Fighter 1 Mystic Theurge 1 Fighter 2 Sorcerer 7 Deepwood Sniper 1 Sorcerer 8 Deepwood Sniper 2 So, as you can see, I really wanted to have access to everything. This will make me deal tons of damage, I'll be casting as an 14th Level Sorcerer and 7th Level Cleric, be able to dish out unarmed damage like no one's business, and have some ranged abilities as well. My character hasn't been set in stone yet, so I welcome any suggestions. On thing to note though is that Charisma is the highest of my spell-based stats, so something like Wizard wouldn't be very helpful. One thing that I tried to do was put in prestige classes on the spellcasting side that would help to continue my spellcasting abilities. Thanks in advance for the advice. Oh, one other thing, I still haven't quite learned my way around the abbreviations of the books, so if when you cite your sources you could spell the book out, that would be very helpful. I have access to most of the books, but almost none of the DragMag's, so that won't be helpful.
#2 xandor_tikroth Feb 27, 2009 1:20:44	Also, I'm considering taking the ACF for the Sorcerer that lets me trade my familiar for an animal companion. More flavor. Anyone have any suggestions?
#3 true_shinken Feb 27, 2009 10:34:46	For a jack-of-all-trades thing, you sould probably go Factotum 10/Chameleon 10//Warblade 20 or something like that.
#4 phaedrusxy Feb 27, 2009 12:03:23	Ok... 1) Why do you have all the spellcasting classes on the same side? 2) Making a "jack of all trades" is generally a bad idea. You'll get more bang for your buck by specializing. 3) A full spellcaster will pretty much own any non-full spellcaster, power-wise. So... having said that, here's what I'd suggest: choose a casting class, and stick with it. Keep full or nearly full progression for that class, even going as far as putting the base class on the opposite side when you have a level of a PrC that doesn't advance spellcasting. Don't try to do both sorcerer and cleric, as it is silly. You can get most of the good sorcerer spells as a cleric, anyway, with some trickery (Spell domain, Magic domain, Divine Magician alternate class feature, be an Archivist instead, etc).
#5 ozgun Feb 27, 2009 13:25:08	Ok... 1) Why do you have all the spellcasting classes on the same side? 2) Making a "jack of all trades" is generally a bad idea. You'll get more bang for your buck by specializing. 3) A full spellcaster will pretty much own any non-full spellcaster, power-wise. So... having said that, here's what I'd suggest: choose a casting class, and stick with it. Keep full or nearly full progression for that class, even going as far as putting the base class on the opposite side when you have a level of a PrC that doesn't advance spellcasting. Don't try to do both sorcerer and cleric, as it is silly. You can get most of the good sorcerer spells as a cleric, anyway, with some trickery (Spell domain, Magic domain, Divine Magician alternate class feature, be an Archivist instead, etc). Archivist/Wizard. All versatility you will ever need, and more.
#6 phaedrusxy Feb 27, 2009 14:51:57	Archivist/~~Wizard~~. All versatility you will ever need, and more. FTFY. There is no need for wizard when you're an archivist, because you can steal all the wizard's toys, anyway. I'd put something else on the other side, like a full BAB class, a class with good skills, something that grants turning for Divine Metamagic, stuff that gets you mettle, evasion, and cha to saves, etc. Or even better, some combination of that stuff.
#7 xandor_tikroth Feb 28, 2009 0:12:03	With my progression as it stands, I get a full or very close to full BAB progression. My character is already ridiculous enough. I can single-handedly defeat any of the party members in one on one combat. The reason that I put all my spellcasting classes on the same side was for ease of my reading. I'm not really trying to do spellcasting well, and I'm in fact considering removing the cleric from my progression, since I don't put much stock into divine spellcasting. Also, I enjoy not having to prepare my spells, which is why I chose to go sorcerer instead of wizard. Besides, I mainly melee anyway, so this was more for flavor.
#8 phoenix00 Feb 28, 2009 1:03:48	Scout 4//Ranger 13/Sorcerer 3 (take the sorcerer levels during the levels where you do not gain spellcasting with Dragon Devotee)// Sorcerer 5/Unseen Seer 10/Dragon Devotee 5 Bab of 18 6 or 8 skill points at all levels Full sorcerer spellcasting. Pick spellcasting designed to grant you mobility, defense, and actions. Combined with Improved Skirmish your skirmish damage is 5d6+2d6+4d6+2d6=13d6. Now take blue draconic heritage feat from dragon magic and you can fire up to 9 electricity orbs that do a lot of damage. Can melee if you pick the right spells. Alter Self into a dwarven ancestors+wraithstrike+a large club with greater mighty wallop on it.
#9 gorfnad_the_shiznit Feb 28, 2009 1:29:28	Now this is more of a Jack of All Trades: Factotum of War. Although I still second Factotum 10/ Chameleon 10 // Warblade 20 or Archivist 20 // Warblade 20 if you want spellcasting. Is this your groups first time playing gestalt, because I'm wondering with your build how exactly do you beat them in one-on-one combat? I mean a full caster would have access to Time Stop and Gate which would easily handle your build.
#10 emansdrawkcab Feb 28, 2009 2:56:45	Duskblade 5/ Abjurant Champion 5/ Arcane Archer 10 // Wizard 20 Good at all the things you wanted.
#11 xandor_tikroth Feb 28, 2009 4:22:45	My character is the only gestalt character. So yeah, I guess its a little arrogant to say that I can beat them in single combat. Wasn't really thinking when I made my last post. I'm almost certain that right now, I can come pretty close to beating all four PC's in combat in a group. But I'm not really sure. I'm not looking to beat them into the ground, but to give them a really good challenge. As far as your recommendation goes, ema, I specified in my previous post that I don't like to deal with preparing spells, which Wizard does nothing but. I'm up for suggestions on changes to my levels in Cleric, Contemplative and Mystic Theurge though. Might look into Arcane Archer.
#12 idontmuchcareforit Mar 09, 2009 12:49:02	Your build can do a lot of different things... poorly. A Wizard 20 or a Cleric 20 or Druid 20 would destroy you even without gestalting. The other issue is that, while you can do a lot of different things, you can't do all or even some of them at the same time. Most of your abilities are standard actions, or, as is the case of rage, mutually exclusive to a lot of your other abilities. In addition, some of your abilities are just much much better than others to the degree that some of them should never see use. I'm in a gestalt campaign right now, and it's pretty optimized. We have a house rule that stipulates that you can be in 2 prestige classes at once; however you can't take a prestige class if you have an unfinished one on the same side. I'm playing a sorcerer/paladin that has spellsword, Iot7V, and abjurant champion. Also a perfect BAB no less than a d8 hit die for any level, and perfect spellcasting for 20 levels. Another player has a rogue/swashbuckler//cleric that has black flame zealot and assassin. He has a perfect BAB, perfect divine casting, and no less than a d8 hit die for any level and a death attack with a DC that eventually exceeds 40. The prestige class "Mage of the Arcane Order" will pretty much give you as much versatility as you'll ever use. Put ranger or monk on the other side and you'll never be unprepared.
#13 keyes2k4 Mar 09, 2009 13:01:00	Originally Posted by Heliomance At high levels (16+), Rainbow Servant is the way to go. Assuming you follow the general rule of Text Trumps Table and give it full casting, anyway. Warmage 6/Rainbow Servant 10 can spont-cast off the entire Cleric spell list. This is a Good Thing. This caught my eye before, you may want to try and implement it in a gestalt build.
#14 xandor_tikroth Mar 10, 2009 0:12:39	Well, I've changed things around a little bit so I'm casting as a full-level sorcerer at every level. Also dropped a few levels in Barbarian and picked up a couple of levels in Rogue and Theif-Acrobat. The other DM that's approving my character has made it a rule that I can't use any custom classes, that only classes from the sourcebooks are allowed. If anyone's interested, I can post my updated progression along with current stats.