Gestalting an incarnum character - Downloaded from the Wizards Community, all coding removed by Solauren

Gestalting an incarnum character

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
keyes2k4
Jul 01, 2008 15:38:16 I'm considering building a gestalt character of about 6th level.
Here are the guidelines:
1. for base ability scores roll 4d6, take top 3, reroll any ones, and if you get 4 of the same number, take the top 3 +1, and if you roll 4 1's as your initial score you have a 20 instead of rerolls

2. for gestalt classes you can't interchange between the individual classes (I.E. if you go rogue/barbarian 1 then you can't go rogue/wizard, you must find another rogue-like class to go with wizard)

3. you may take a prestige class, but rule #2 applies here as well so you can't continue with rogue/barbarian if you're going rogue/frenzied berzerker, you have to go frenzied berzerker/something else

4. Alignment restrictions are good or neutral options only, as evil characters aren't as much fun for me to play unless everyone else is evil.

5. Races are restricted to non-LA races, from pretty much any campaign setting

6. For hit points roll 3 of the hit dice from your highest hd class per level and take the top roll. If you roll low all 3 times, you were destined to have low hp :p.

Now, since that's finally out of the way, its time for my ideas.

Part 1: class selection
I want to play an incarnum character. I'm tossing between incarnate and totemist for one of my base classes, so here's a breakdown of what I have been considering as the secondary classes

1: incarnate/barbarian: good things: faster movement, constitution , could work with vow of poverty, things get hurt from hitting me and I can hit them rather hard in return, also 4 skills/lvl and soulmeld bonuses could make for a super-versitile character with lots of hitpoints and a scary rage.
bad things: there really aren't many, the barbarian's strengths are the incarnate's weaknesses (skills, fort save, proficiencies, and hit die). neither have much of a reflex save, heavy armor proficiency, or tower-shield proficiency. also alignment would be restricted to neutral good or chaotic neutral. other than that, good idea in my opinion.

2: Totemist/barbarian: good things: easily to make a story for such a character, the con/hit dice synergy remains, cool character abilities and strength from both classes, totemist weapons are cool, and barbarians have medium armor proficiency, taking some of the necessity for high dexterity out of the combo. a lot of the soulmeld skill bonuses match barbarian skills (but i'm also pretty sure the class list for totemist and barbarian are very similar).
bad things: not gaining much for saves or skills because both of the base classes have similar saves and skill selection/numbers. other than that, another good idea in my opinion.

3: warblade (ToB)/totemist or warblade/incarnate: I'd love to list the good things but I am not the person in our group who has the ToB, but from what I saw, its barbarian like except instead of a few of the barbarian class features, they get some very customizable maneuvers. If I took the time to look at the ToB, I'd probably rank this one about where I rank totemist/barbarian.

4: incarnate/druid: good things: constitution synergies, spells, soulmelds, ability to wild-shape, decent skill selection, some neat class abilities from druid make up for incarnate weaknesses, and save synergies.
bad things: reflex save is still low, pseudo-low hit dice could cause some survival issues. non-metal armor could cause issues. other than that, another great idea imo.

5: totemist/druid: good things: constitution synergies, spells, soulmelds, ability to wildshape, magical beasts AND natural beasts are your buddies. Easy to justify in a character story.
Bad things: not a whole lot gained in saves/skill points, armor restrictions which totemist would normally ignore would become a new problem. other than that, cool choice.

6: incarnate/rogue: good thing: Renouned skill monkey is skillful. Incarnate versitility applies well to rogue skills. save synergies.
bad thing: not a lot of hit points, but you'll probalby be skill-monkeying. Might be hard to justify anything but a chaos incarnate sneak-attacking anyone, so the alignment problem comes up. other than that, could be very cool. you may also have a little trouble coming up with 3 good ability scores (dexterity, constitution, and intelligence) to work well with both classes.

7: totemist/rogue: good things: blink shirt is awesome (depending on if your DM makes you make noise when "bamf"ing). saves synergize. totemist versitility applies well with rogue skills. skill set is just awesome.
bad things: a d8 hit dice isn't bad, but it isn't a barbarian. coming up with 3 good abil scores again could be a problem.

8: incarnate/ninja: Good things: I love the idea of a ninja wearing windstep sandles and leaping between trees for some reason. class ability synergies are strong (invisibility, flying, skills) wisdom bonus to AC if you're unarmored, poison use, and you're pretty much golden if you want to go vow of poverty. saves also synergize
bad things: d6 hit dice is a bit yucky if you want to be up front, but you're probably going to be very quiet if you're not touching the ground. you need a LOT of good ability scores to pull this one off well (str, dex, con, wisdom, int). but if you have decent skills across the board, its a cool concept. alignment restrictions also set you lawful or chaotic neutral only.

9: totemist/ninja: good things: see incarnate, but take all the references to airstep sandles and replace them with blink shirt. bamf! saves synergies too.
bad things: need lots of high ability scores to do well.

10: totemist/monk or incarnate/monk: good things: good saves, good weapons included, good skills, good gear, set up for VoP, wisdom to AC. I likey.
Bad things: Monks only have d8 hd, require quite a few good ability scores to be effective. (str, con, wisdom, maybe dex)

I'm sure I'll want to add more later, but I'll stop here for lack of time (writing this between pages at work).

part 2: Race selection:
My #1 selection: Warforged
It is my personal opinion that warforged make possibly the coolest characters with almost any class because they don't eat, sleep, or require any equipment to be effective characters. I find the idea of a warforge taking totemist or incarnate as one of their base classes to be wonderfully synergized, as incarnates and totemists can be quite effective with a low wisdom score.
Good things: warforges don't eat or sleep, and thus are perfect for vow of poverty, which keeps popping up in this post for some reason (I really like this vow lol). Their bonus to con is also a plus, and they have interesting immunities.
bad things: wisdom penalty hurts my ninja and monk mixes I listed above.

#2 selection: human
Humans are very general, they fit in in most campaign settings, and versatility of backgrounds makes their stories easy to concoct. They get better skills and an extra feat at first level, making them cool for most classes.
good things: extra skills are good, extra feats are O.K.
bad things: no bonuses to stats make them lackluster if you didn't roll really well. You may be better off finding a race that fits what you have planned for your character more accurately.

#3 selection: raptoran
Raptorans are a cool race that you will find in the races of the wild. They gradually gain the ability to fly as they increase in level, and they have the storyline flare that you would find in any incarnum character.
good things: I'll get back to you on this one, I don't have the races of the wild book on me right now. I like having the abiity to fly though, it's one of the reasons i like incarnate so much (allbeit limited for incarnates.) This race also gets featherfall constantly, which saves me the 2000g and the ring slot I always take for my incarnum characters (blink drop and fly drop).
bad things: racial ability mods? I don't know what they are, but a birdman sounds like he would have less constitution, which is key to both incarnate and totemist.

I'll add more soon, I gotta get back to work.
#2
deathlessjuan
Jul 01, 2008 19:26:35 I have not played an incarnum character in gesalt before but I have played a Cleric / Monk / Apostle of Peace / Totemist / Sapphire Heirarch (basically a monk/cleric /-\ Totemist but in multiclass form).

I highly recommend some form of divine spellcasting / incarnum gesalt simply due to the fact of what you can pull off (even with the Vow of Poverty). The above character had 57 AC at lvl 17 (without any spell cast on him, only soulmelds) and it was 51 touch AC. A quaterstaff was his only weapon.

You wont need barbarian since totemist can get pounce with a soulmeld. A druid / totemist would mop the floor with anything due to the wildshape abilities. Hell, if you can go barbarian/Totemist /-\ Druid or even Totemist /-\ Druidic Avenger (UA variant that gets rage) and take Totem Rager prestige class, you could rip things to shreds.
#3
keyes2004
Jul 02, 2008 15:25:54 I always assumed that a VoP character would be prone to starvation, so I usually go warforged as race for them. Divine casters make food like crazy, so this is an awesome idea!

I think I'll go into divine stuff when i get home and have my books available. Thanks for the reply
#4
deathlessjuan
Jul 02, 2008 17:12:20 No problem. As for the starving thing, once a VoP character reaches a certain level, they no longer require food or water. They are allowed to carry a day's worth of food on them or accept food from others, as long as the food is not expensive.

A Druid /-\ Totemist will not only be insanely powerful but it can hunt for its own food. Survival will be a class skill
#5
detectivejabsco
Jul 02, 2008 22:02:30 Warforged Incarnate20/Atricifer20...
Or you could always look into the all-Powerful
WARFORGED BASKET WEAVER!!!!!

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 keyes2k4 Jul 01, 2008 15:38:16	I'm considering building a gestalt character of about 6th level. Here are the guidelines: 1. for base ability scores roll 4d6, take top 3, reroll any ones, and if you get 4 of the same number, take the top 3 +1, and if you roll 4 1's as your initial score you have a 20 instead of rerolls 2. for gestalt classes you can't interchange between the individual classes (I.E. if you go rogue/barbarian 1 then you can't go rogue/wizard, you must find another rogue-like class to go with wizard) 3. you may take a prestige class, but rule #2 applies here as well so you can't continue with rogue/barbarian if you're going rogue/frenzied berzerker, you have to go frenzied berzerker/something else 4. Alignment restrictions are good or neutral options only, as evil characters aren't as much fun for me to play unless everyone else is evil. 5. Races are restricted to non-LA races, from pretty much any campaign setting 6. For hit points roll 3 of the hit dice from your highest hd class per level and take the top roll. If you roll low all 3 times, you were destined to have low hp :p. Now, since that's finally out of the way, its time for my ideas. Part 1: class selection I want to play an incarnum character. I'm tossing between incarnate and totemist for one of my base classes, so here's a breakdown of what I have been considering as the secondary classes 1: incarnate/barbarian: good things: faster movement, constitution , could work with vow of poverty, things get hurt from hitting me and I can hit them rather hard in return, also 4 skills/lvl and soulmeld bonuses could make for a super-versitile character with lots of hitpoints and a scary rage. bad things: there really aren't many, the barbarian's strengths are the incarnate's weaknesses (skills, fort save, proficiencies, and hit die). neither have much of a reflex save, heavy armor proficiency, or tower-shield proficiency. also alignment would be restricted to neutral good or chaotic neutral. other than that, good idea in my opinion. 2: Totemist/barbarian: good things: easily to make a story for such a character, the con/hit dice synergy remains, cool character abilities and strength from both classes, totemist weapons are cool, and barbarians have medium armor proficiency, taking some of the necessity for high dexterity out of the combo. a lot of the soulmeld skill bonuses match barbarian skills (but i'm also pretty sure the class list for totemist and barbarian are very similar). bad things: not gaining much for saves or skills because both of the base classes have similar saves and skill selection/numbers. other than that, another good idea in my opinion. 3: warblade (ToB)/totemist or warblade/incarnate: I'd love to list the good things but I am not the person in our group who has the ToB, but from what I saw, its barbarian like except instead of a few of the barbarian class features, they get some very customizable maneuvers. If I took the time to look at the ToB, I'd probably rank this one about where I rank totemist/barbarian. 4: incarnate/druid: good things: constitution synergies, spells, soulmelds, ability to wild-shape, decent skill selection, some neat class abilities from druid make up for incarnate weaknesses, and save synergies. bad things: reflex save is still low, pseudo-low hit dice could cause some survival issues. non-metal armor could cause issues. other than that, another great idea imo. 5: totemist/druid: good things: constitution synergies, spells, soulmelds, ability to wildshape, magical beasts AND natural beasts are your buddies. Easy to justify in a character story. Bad things: not a whole lot gained in saves/skill points, armor restrictions which totemist would normally ignore would become a new problem. other than that, cool choice. 6: incarnate/rogue: good thing: Renouned skill monkey is skillful. Incarnate versitility applies well to rogue skills. save synergies. bad thing: not a lot of hit points, but you'll probalby be skill-monkeying. Might be hard to justify anything but a chaos incarnate sneak-attacking anyone, so the alignment problem comes up. other than that, could be very cool. you may also have a little trouble coming up with 3 good ability scores (dexterity, constitution, and intelligence) to work well with both classes. 7: totemist/rogue: good things: blink shirt is awesome (depending on if your DM makes you make noise when "bamf"ing). saves synergize. totemist versitility applies well with rogue skills. skill set is just awesome. bad things: a d8 hit dice isn't bad, but it isn't a barbarian. coming up with 3 good abil scores again could be a problem. 8: incarnate/ninja: Good things: I love the idea of a ninja wearing windstep sandles and leaping between trees for some reason. class ability synergies are strong (invisibility, flying, skills) wisdom bonus to AC if you're unarmored, poison use, and you're pretty much golden if you want to go vow of poverty. saves also synergize bad things: d6 hit dice is a bit yucky if you want to be up front, but you're probably going to be very quiet if you're not touching the ground. you need a LOT of good ability scores to pull this one off well (str, dex, con, wisdom, int). but if you have decent skills across the board, its a cool concept. alignment restrictions also set you lawful or chaotic neutral only. 9: totemist/ninja: good things: see incarnate, but take all the references to airstep sandles and replace them with blink shirt. bamf! saves synergies too. bad things: need lots of high ability scores to do well. 10: totemist/monk or incarnate/monk: good things: good saves, good weapons included, good skills, good gear, set up for VoP, wisdom to AC. I likey. Bad things: Monks only have d8 hd, require quite a few good ability scores to be effective. (str, con, wisdom, maybe dex) I'm sure I'll want to add more later, but I'll stop here for lack of time (writing this between pages at work). part 2: Race selection: My #1 selection: Warforged It is my personal opinion that warforged make possibly the coolest characters with almost any class because they don't eat, sleep, or require any equipment to be effective characters. I find the idea of a warforge taking totemist or incarnate as one of their base classes to be wonderfully synergized, as incarnates and totemists can be quite effective with a low wisdom score. Good things: warforges don't eat or sleep, and thus are perfect for vow of poverty, which keeps popping up in this post for some reason (I really like this vow lol). Their bonus to con is also a plus, and they have interesting immunities. bad things: wisdom penalty hurts my ninja and monk mixes I listed above. #2 selection: human Humans are very general, they fit in in most campaign settings, and versatility of backgrounds makes their stories easy to concoct. They get better skills and an extra feat at first level, making them cool for most classes. good things: extra skills are good, extra feats are O.K. bad things: no bonuses to stats make them lackluster if you didn't roll really well. You may be better off finding a race that fits what you have planned for your character more accurately. #3 selection: raptoran Raptorans are a cool race that you will find in the races of the wild. They gradually gain the ability to fly as they increase in level, and they have the storyline flare that you would find in any incarnum character. good things: I'll get back to you on this one, I don't have the races of the wild book on me right now. I like having the abiity to fly though, it's one of the reasons i like incarnate so much (allbeit limited for incarnates.) This race also gets featherfall constantly, which saves me the 2000g and the ring slot I always take for my incarnum characters (blink drop and fly drop). bad things: racial ability mods? I don't know what they are, but a birdman sounds like he would have less constitution, which is key to both incarnate and totemist. I'll add more soon, I gotta get back to work.
#2 deathlessjuan Jul 01, 2008 19:26:35	I have not played an incarnum character in gesalt before but I have played a Cleric / Monk / Apostle of Peace / Totemist / Sapphire Heirarch (basically a monk/cleric /-\ Totemist but in multiclass form). I highly recommend some form of divine spellcasting / incarnum gesalt simply due to the fact of what you can pull off (even with the Vow of Poverty). The above character had 57 AC at lvl 17 (without any spell cast on him, only soulmelds) and it was 51 touch AC. A quaterstaff was his only weapon. You wont need barbarian since totemist can get pounce with a soulmeld. A druid / totemist would mop the floor with anything due to the wildshape abilities. Hell, if you can go barbarian/Totemist /-\ Druid or even Totemist /-\ Druidic Avenger (UA variant that gets rage) and take Totem Rager prestige class, you could rip things to shreds.
#3 keyes2004 Jul 02, 2008 15:25:54	I always assumed that a VoP character would be prone to starvation, so I usually go warforged as race for them. Divine casters make food like crazy, so this is an awesome idea! I think I'll go into divine stuff when i get home and have my books available. Thanks for the reply
#4 deathlessjuan Jul 02, 2008 17:12:20	No problem. As for the starving thing, once a VoP character reaches a certain level, they no longer require food or water. They are allowed to carry a day's worth of food on them or accept food from others, as long as the food is not expensive. A Druid /-\ Totemist will not only be insanely powerful but it can hunt for its own food. Survival will be a class skill
#5 detectivejabsco Jul 02, 2008 22:02:30	Warforged Incarnate20/Atricifer20... Or you could always look into the all-Powerful WARFORGED BASKET WEAVER!!!!!