Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 blightersbane May 23, 2009 14:09:34	Our group is trying gestault and I have questions on my pc build. I will tell you the campaign, what the rest of the party is and all my pc's info, to help you, help me. 1st my pc... Pip, male, Gnome 8th level-gestault, the rest is where I am up in the air about. I wanted a combo of wizard-cleric-ranger-Mystic Theurge. As you could imagine, gestaulting 2 spellcaster classes can prove tedious beyond measure. I just dont have the time to sit down and crunch numbers and learn what I need to know about a wizards spell book not to mention the cost, oh my Im gonna go broke just making a darn spellbook! 100gp's a page and every spell level is a page, wizards have got it rough! DM will allow me to have MT prestige class only if I picked healing domain & discarded 3 schools of magic, I agreed, enchantment,necromancy and abjur - GONE! I am a Gnome so I felt it only appropiate to specialize in Illusion. On the otherside of my gestault build I chose Cleric, my domains TRAVEL & HEALING, because it is a bounty hunter themed campaign I wanted Ranger. So my 1st idea was to go 1C / W 2C / W 3C / W 4MT / R 5MT / R 6MT / R 7MT / R 8MT / R this would give me a 7 BAB, 8d8 h-pts, almost max saves in all, and a lot of spells albeit now very focused/limited. The other players are as follows 8th Barbarian / 8th Psion (Seer) 8th Fighter/8th Thief ?Fighter/?Swashbuckler/8th Scout 8th Druid / 4th Rogue / 4th Monk -summoner and me 3rd Wiz / 3rd cleric / 5th Mystic Theurge / 5th Ranger My questions are about the build, how to keep Pip up with the other pc's, who seem to be very strong thusfar. I want Pip to be the party buffer & healer. I am the fill in the gaps kind of pc and with 8th level Cleric and 8th Wiz spell casting I am loaded with spells. I felt I would be over powered when compared to the other players, coupling together gesault and cleric/wizard but if anything, with my restrictions, I am middle of the road. I wanted to know how high I should go in what classes. Gestaulting makes it easy to well-round a pc but creates difficulty with the build ESPECIALLY with two spell casting classes, very complex. I am very busy and finding it hard to learn all the ins/outs of spells, forming a proper spell list for a book, being specialized in school of illusion, being the parties healer and buffer, which illusionist spells? Then I got Cleric, but at least here its a daily list of spells most of which are defaulted to healing spells. Would it be easier to just go a whole new route? 8th Favored Soul / 8th Sorcerer? At least it would be 2 fixed spell lists thus simplify thus saving me time. I suppose I could still go 4th Favored Soul / 4th Sorcerer / 4th Mystic-Theurge / 4th Ranger. Excelent saving throws - all good. And I wouldnt have to be dependant upon 2 seperate main attibutes wiz & int, instead I could focus on just Cha, oh well and wiz for the favored souls DC saves, still mostly CHA as my FS spell list will probably have a lot of healing. OK so now I am conflicted on what I want this PC's build to be. HELP! cleric vs. favored soul...? wiz vs sor....? either way Pip will be the parties healer/buffer, why? because we need it, Im filling in the gaps left by above party. thanks Pip the Gnome ?/?/?/?
#2 emy May 23, 2009 15:09:48	It would be much clearer if you indicated which classes were being combined at each level, like so: 1: Wizard 1 // Cleric 1 2: Wizard 2 // Cleric 2 3: Wizard 3 // Cleric 3 4: Mystic Theurge 1 // Ranger 1 et cetera or by separating it into 'sides', which do not actually exist in gestalt but are a useful construct for talking about gestalt builds. For example, "4th Favored Soul / 4th Sorcerer / 4th Mystic-Theurge / 4th Ranger", to me at least, reads as "take 4 levels of favored soul, then 4 levels of sorcerer, then 4 levels of MT, then 4 levels of ranger". Separating it with // makes it clearer that you're not indicating a simple class progression. Example: "Favored Soul 4/Mystic Theurge 4//Sorcerer 4/Ranger 4" would show that. oh my Im gonna go broke just making a darn spellbook! 100gp's a page and every spell level is a page, wizards have got it rough! http://www.d20srd.org/srd/magicItems/WondrousItems.htm#blessedBook Might be a bit expensive for your level, though. Illusion specialization is good, but it seems like you're very set on healing/buffing already, which isn't illusion's strong point. (though it does have some good ones: like create magic tattoo via shadow conjuration, the invisibility line, mirror images) I'd recommend focusing very hard on the buffing part of healing/buffing. Healing is useful, sure, but you can just use wands of lesser vigor or cure light wounds outside of combat, maybe with the occasional emergency heal inside of combat. Well, that or swap your healing + buffing focus to a battlefield control + buffing focus. my domains TRAVEL & HEALING, because it is a bounty hunter themed campaign I wanted Ranger. Trade the Travel domain for Travel Devotion. Yes, the Travel domain granted power is good, but Travel Devotion is better. I also don't see any reason being in a bounty hunter themed campaign means that you need Ranger levels. Are there any class abilities you specifically want from it? Finally, which books are allowed? All of them? Are you using fractional BAB?
#3 hijaxx May 23, 2009 15:38:03	doesn't dual casting progression PrC's take up both sides of the gestalt?
#4 emy May 23, 2009 15:49:19	doesn't dual casting progression PrC's take up both sides of the gestalt? The gestalt guideline recommends that they aren't used at all. However, DM will allow me to have MT prestige class only if I picked healing domain & discarded 3 schools of magic So he's using it. Hm, buffing. What about Cloistered Cleric 7/Wu Jen 1 // Combat Wizard 6/Spelldancer 2? Feats: Wizard 1: Dodge 1: Academic Priest 3: Combat Casting Wizard 5: Mobility 6: Endurance Wu Jen 1: Persistent Spell Cleric domains: Planning, Time Variants here. Thought I guess Gnome wouldn't do anything for that build.
#5 gorfnad_the_shiznit May 23, 2009 18:04:30	Gnome Illusionist and no one has mentioned the Shadowcraft Mage or the Killer Gnome yet! Gnome Domains: Illusion, Shadow, Knowledge Domain (or Devotion) Wizard 3/ Master Specialist (CM) 4 /Shadowcraft Mage (RoS) 5/ Shadowcrafter (Und) 8 :: Cloistered Cleric (UA) 20 You'll probably want to pick up Spontaneous Domain Casting variant from PHB2 for this one.
#6 blightersbane May 24, 2009 17:07:26	Our group is trying gestault and I have questions on my pc build. I will tell you the campaign, what the rest of the party is and all my pc's info, to help you, help me. 1st my pc... Pip, male, Gnome 8th level-gestault, the rest is where I am up in the air about. I wanted a combo of wizard-cleric-ranger-Mystic Theurge. As you could imagine, gestaulting 2 spellcaster classes can prove tedious beyond measure. I just dont have the time to sit down and crunch numbers and learn what I need to know about a wizards spell book not to mention the cost, oh my Im gonna go broke just making a darn spellbook! 100gp's a page and every spell level is a page, wizards have got it rough! DM will allow me to have MT prestige class only if I picked healing domain & discarded 3 schools of magic, I agreed, enchantment,necromancy and abjur - GONE! I am a Gnome so I felt it only appropiate to specialize in Illusion. On the otherside of my gestault build I chose Cleric, my domains TRAVEL & HEALING, because it is a bounty hunter themed campaign I wanted Ranger. So my 1st idea was to go 1C / W 2C / W 3C / W 4MT / R 5MT / R 6MT / R 7MT / R 8MT / R this would give me a 7 BAB, 8d8 h-pts, almost max saves in all, and a lot of spells albeit now very focused/limited. The other players are as follows 8th Barbarian / 8th Psion (Seer) 8th Fighter/8th Thief ?Fighter/?Swashbuckler/8th Scout 8th Druid / 4th Rogue / 4th Monk -summoner and me 3rd Wiz / 3rd cleric / 5th Mystic Theurge / 5th Ranger My questions are about the build, how to keep Pip up with the other pc's, who seem to be very strong thusfar. I want Pip to be the party buffer & healer. I am the fill in the gaps kind of pc and with 8th level Cleric and 8th Wiz spell casting I am loaded with spells. I felt I would be over powered when compared to the other players, coupling together gesault and cleric/wizard but if anything, with my restrictions, I am middle of the road. I wanted to know how high I should go in what classes. Gestaulting makes it easy to well-round a pc but creates difficulty with the build ESPECIALLY with two spell casting classes, very complex. I am very busy and finding it hard to learn all the ins/outs of spells, forming a proper spell list for a book, being specialized in school of illusion, being the parties healer and buffer, which illusionist spells? Then I got Cleric, but at least here its a daily list of spells most of which are defaulted to healing spells. Would it be easier to just go a whole new route? 8th Favored Soul / 8th Sorcerer? At least it would be 2 fixed spell lists thus simplify thus saving me time. I suppose I could still go 4th Favored Soul / 4th Sorcerer / 4th Mystic-Theurge / 4th Ranger. Excelent saving throws - all good. And I wouldnt have to be dependant upon 2 seperate main attibutes wiz & int, instead I could focus on just Cha, oh well and wiz for the favored souls DC saves, still mostly CHA as my FS spell list will probably have a lot of healing. OK so now I am conflicted on what I want this PC's build to be. HELP! cleric vs. favored soul...? wiz vs sor....? either way Pip will be the parties healer/buffer, why? because we need it, Im filling in the gaps left by above party. thanks Pip the Gnome ?/?/?/? As I mentioned I am being allowed to gestault this build for a price; banned schools abjur. & enchant. & necro / and my cleric must have the healing domain, I get to pick other domain, I picked Travel because it seemed to give me access to movement spells Do any of you think Pip could/should/would be effective with the cha based route of the Favored Soul and Sorcerer combo? I can pick from all books and have all classes & class combos open to me. I'm not the most experienced spell caster so any help in spell selection, feats class selection, magic items that are suggested...heck basically everything I would most humbly ask for your enlightenment or if ya just got some advice for a spellslinger. Any info much appreciated. PS: I just received word that if I wanted to gestault Sorcerer / Fav Soul I could do so with no restrictions. I take up gametime with my spell selecting and the others know Im not an advanced player when it comes to spellcasters so this is what a couple of the guys are suggesting-thats why it keeps coming up. As far as my build goes I did show level progression in OP... So my 1st idea was to go 1C / W 2C / W 3C / W 4MT / R 5MT / R 6MT / R 7MT / R 8MT / R this would give me a 7 BAB, 8d8 h-pts, almost max saves in all, and a lot of spells albeit now very focused/limited. Pip the (random assortment of classes yet to be determined) LG Gnome.