| Post/Author/DateTime | Post |
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| #1parasynMar 19, 2011 16:57:25 | Posting for a friend here. My friend has been obsessed with playing a greatspear (CW) build, I recommended a charge build, but I don't exactly know what class would work best or feats to get. I couldn't find any charging threads (admitted I didn't look very hard). Was I correct in telling him charging was best or is there some other build better. All opinions are appreciated. |
| #2sleepyshadowMar 21, 2011 15:03:45 | A charger build can be many things, though regardless of class choice, they all have a few things in common: Power Attack Improved Bull Rush Shock Trooper Leap Attack Battle Jump As long as the character can get these feats relatively quickly, he should be a capable Uber-Charger. If I were to recommend a build for your friend, I might suggest something like this: Human Fighter 2/Lion Totem Barbarian 1/Crusader 3/Psychic Warrior 2/Crusader 12 Feats: 1st: Power Attack [Human Bonus], Improved Bull Rush [Fighter Bonus], Monkey Grip 2nd: Improved Toughness [Fighter Bonus] 3rd: Leap Attack 6th: Shock Trooper 7th: Push Back [Psychic Warrior Bonus] 8th: Combat Brute [Psychic Warrior Bonus] 9th: Battle Jump 12th: Leap of The Heavens 15th: Improved Critical 18th: Improved Initiative This character would have BAB +19, the almighty Pounce ability thanks to Lion Totem Barbarian, the ability to soak up considerable damage due to the Crusader's Steely Resolve, and (if you choose Expansion) the psionic ability to increase his size category. The feats, however, are the crux of any charger. Monkey Grip allows the use of larger weapons, thereby increasing damage. Leap Attack (when using a two-handed weapon) triples the Power Attack extra damage, while Battle Jump triples the normal weapon damage. Most importantly, Shock Trooper allows the charger to decrease AC instead of his attack bonus when using Power Attack and charge attacking, thereby allowing all of this extra damage being generated to actually hit the intended target. |
| #3Tempest_StormwindMar 21, 2011 15:29:54 | A charger build can be many things, though regardless of class choice, they all have a few things in common: Battle Jump is faerun-only and regional, which makes it hard to generalize. (That was the key problem with the first build designed to exploit this, the Lancer.) The rest of that thread, however, should still be informative. The *real* trick is finding a way to make Power Attack multiply. Leap Attack and a two-handed weapon increase your base return on power attack, Shock Trooper makes sure it'll hit, and the rest just add multipliers on to that. Classic examples include charging with a lance on a mount (double damage), using the Valorous enhancement (double damage on a charge), using one of the Raptorans' diving charges (I know there's a way to make that a double damage attack), and so on. Plus, of course, Pounce - the ability to make full attacks on a charge - gives you a multiplier as well, in the form of extra attacks that still count as charge attacks. If I were to recommend a build for your friend, I might suggest something like this: This won't work - Battle Jump is regional, and can only be taken at level 1. I'd suggest ditching Monkey Grip. Really, I do. If I recall correctly, a greatspear does d10 or 2d6 damage instead of d8. These correspond to an average damage increase of 1 or 3, respectively. Compare to Weapon Specialization. You're already using a greatspear, when most such chargers use a longspear, halberd, or a lance, depending on proficiencies and enhancements. If you need a large weapon, Powerful Build gives you that and better, and you can just buy off the LA (it's only found on, I think, Half-Giants and Goliaths). Hell, I think there's a racial substitution level for goliaths that lets them *actually* become Large when they rage. (Since I refuse to use Complete Champion, I don't know if it stacks with Lion Totem Barbarian.) Endaire's thread (linked above) should be informative. It's probably the single best repository for this exact type of attack. Nothing specific to greatspears, but everything there also applies to them if you can squeeze in the feat. I just wish he'd given himself more credit for it. |
| #4KruskMar 21, 2011 16:05:50 |
Thats why you don't waste them on monkey grip. The damage doesn't pay off in comparison to power atack until size huge or greater. Same class build as suggested earlier, but I'd revise your feats to look more like this.
Really from there just take whatever you feel like. You will already be a very effective charger. I'd honestly drop the whole crusader angle, and bounce a 2 more into fighter and some barbarian maybe. Exotic weapon master could be good. (After 2 more in fighter, you open up the melee weapon mastery line in PHB 2, that I really think is fairly solid.) I might grab another instance of extra rage, (I like 5/day) depending on how many barbarian levels you end up with. Also, I figured using a reach weapon tripping would be the ideal tactic? |
| #5sleepyshadowMar 21, 2011 16:13:42 |
My apologies. Swap Monkey Grip for Battle Jump, and vice versa.
If there are substitution levels like that, that would push him to Huge size after using his psionics to grow a size catagory further. Very nice. What book is this in, do you think?
Any reason why you are taking Improved Bull Rush twice? |
| #6Tempest_StormwindMar 21, 2011 16:24:02 | If there are substitution levels like that, that would push him to Huge size after using his psionics to grow a size catagory further. Very nice. What book is this in, do you think? Races of Stone, the only place to have Goliath support. Sorry, I should have been clearer. Krusk is right - Monkey Grip will not pay off at this point. Furthemore, with just 2 levels of Psychic Warrior, your power points are too limited and your ML too low to rely on it for buffs. |
| #7KruskMar 21, 2011 18:13:29 |
Twice the power? Duh? No, just a typo. |
| #8LordPhrofetMar 21, 2011 19:24:12 | I like using raptorans for this type of build with fleshgrinding on the spears. Have a pair of +1 valorous fleshgrinding greatspeears and most monsters are done in two fly by attacks. |
| #9parasynMar 24, 2011 23:10:28 | thanks guys, Greatspear (2d6) (exotic) As for tripping he wants to go straight damage as his last character was a spiked chain fighter (very effective but he wants to do something different with this one) What about Combat Brute? and as for tactics just charge the BBEG and hope to do enough damage to cripple him in the first round? |
| #10aelryinthMar 26, 2011 19:28:39 | charge builds are very one trick pony. Most go into Frenzied Berserker for the str buffs, unkillability, and especially Supreme Power Attack goodness. Dead enemies don't need to be controlled or tripped, after all. ==Aelryinth |