Help for a roleplayer

Post/Author/DateTimePost
#1

demetar_the_mage

Dec 29, 2008 3:26:16
Hey CO boards, I need your help. I am a serious roleplayer in my games. I focus completely on the fluff of the character, often taking mechanically inferior abilities and class options for the sake of building my perfect image of a character. However, I will soon be in a party where it really won't be acceptable to sacrifice my usefulness in favor of roleplaying.

That being said, I don't want a horribly broken build, just an effective one. My concept is a sort of scout [descriptor, not necessarily the Scout class] who favors melee damage. I have an image of him wielding an axe and a sword, or sneaking in for dagger kills. I want him to be able to stealth a little, but mostly be a fast and vicious warrior.

All books are open game, but I cannot guarantee I'll have it, though I can probably get a hold of it. The party is going to be ECL 10, although if you want to give me a build that stretches past that so I can continue with it, that would be great too. All help appreciated, thank you.

---Demetar
#2

zendu

Dec 29, 2008 3:48:55
Can you give us a bit more of the RP aspects you are looking for? What you have described is a plain-jane ranger. Also, someone in this thread is bound to bring up the fact that TWF is a worse choice than two handed weapons. (although skirmish might change that a bit).

I'd suggest a Swift Hunter (cs) build, that is one with ranger and scout levels.
#3

unundindur

Dec 29, 2008 3:53:14
As far as I know a multiclass ranger/scout with the multiclass feat isn't too shabby at what you describe. Its not super-powerful, but its well above useless. (EDIT: Ninjaed )

As for the dagger-kill I am not sure... Is that part really all that important? If so, my best suggestion would be a to simply use a +1 bloodstone spellstoring dagger with two vampiric touch spells in it.
#4

mahrke

Dec 29, 2008 4:08:16
Considering all sources allowed:

Human

Scout 1 Able Learner, OPEN FEAT
Barbarian 1
Scout 2 Weapon Finesse
Scout 3
Ranger 1
Ranger 2 Swift Hunter (CS), TWF
Ranger 3
Ranger 4
Ranger 5 Improved Skirmish (CS)
Ranger 6 Improved TWF

Take the Lion Totem variant for barbarian to get Pounce instead of Fast Movement. Also take Whirling Frenzy from UA. Your goal should be alot of charge attacks, since you'll be able to trigger Skirmish (of which you have 5d6, and a +4 bonus to AC to boot). Charge into melee, demolish with your pounce, and on your next turn, either charge another opponent, or full attack your current opponent. It's likely you'll be Dex based, if you want to have decent AC. In which case, you'll be a proficient ranged attacker, as well.

It's a decent enough build, with full BaB, you'll get 5 attacks dealing an extra 5d6 damage a piece, and have the excellent tracking abilities of Ranger, with the trapfinding of Scout tossed in for good measure. The whole thing reeks of a wilderness character, in an RP sense, and good favored enemy choices will put you in good shape. You should definately select undead, so you can apply your skirmish to them.

Next level, you should pick up the 4th level of scout to snag the bonus feat, and then continue down Ranger. Grab Valorous Weapons at character creation if you can, to snag double charge damage with them

PS: Don't be shy in picking up Greater Two-Weapon fighting when you get the chance, and then just retrain it out, once you gain it from Combat Style Mastery
#5

jaronk

Dec 29, 2008 4:37:12
Factotum would do the trick. Use a pair of Gnome Quickrazors while pumping Iajuitsu Focus for damage, and your melee is handled (there are some gloves in MiC that give TWF free. That's probably better than spending the feat. Stealth is easy... take Darkstalker so nothing can see you, and the Brains Over Brawn ability will handle the rest. Brains Over Brawn also gives Int to Initiative, which is great for speed, and Cunning Surge makes your speed incredible by level 8. Also, consider a level of Mindbender for Mindsight, which would make you stealthy as all heck. Wielding a pair of Feycraft Gnome Quickrazors (DMGII for Feycraft) removes the need for Weapon Finesse. Also, any excess feats should be Font of Inspiration.

A basic super stealthy super fast build would be Human Factotum 9/Mindbender 1 (not quite in that order), taking EWP: Gnome Quickrazor, Font of Inspiration, Darkstalker, Mindsight, and Font of Inspiration. You'll automatically detect anything that's not immune to mind effecting within 100ft, be almost undetectable to nearly everything, and easily be able to hack enemies to pieces. If flaws are allowed, throw in TWF (the gloves give ITWF if you have it) and another Font of Inspiration. The general rule with Fonts of Inspiration is that you want about half your feats to be that feat.

JaronK
#6

tytalus

Dec 29, 2008 4:52:45
[...]

That's very good advice. A swift hunter (scout/ranger with the Swift Hunter feat) with a bit of pouncing barbarian is great fit and has good synergy.

You might want a second level of barbarian in case your DM uses multiclass XP penalties (standard rules):

Barbarian2/Scout3/Ranger++ (consider changing the order a bit)

BTW, the lion totem substitution level is in Complete Champion.

That means that you will need the following sources:

(necessary)
Complete Champion (Lion Totem Barbarian substitution level)
Complete Adventurer (Scout class)
Complete Scoundrel (Improved Skirmish & Swift Hunter feats)

(optional but very nice)
Unearthed Arcana (Whirling Frenzy alternate class feature)

If you want to place more emphasis on the sneaky dagger stuff, change the build to be scout-heavy (as opposed to being ranger-heavy), add one or two levels of rogue and pick up the Swift Ambusher feat [CS], e.g.:

Barbarian1/Ranger1/Rogue1/Scout++ (again, order is up to you)

Not quite as strong in direct melee (unless flanking) with the lower BAB, but nets you nifty sneak attack plus skirmish, among other things. Pick up Improved Initiative for a better chance to act first in combat and get a pouncing charge with both sources of extra damage.

Consider a second level of Barbarian (uncanny dodge), Ranger (weapon style), and/or Rogue (evasion) depending on what abilities you think fit your character, though it's not necessary.
#7

mahrke

Dec 29, 2008 5:06:57
Good point on the xp penalties. Remember though, that scout gets uncanny dodge anywho, so a second level of barbarian would be a bad choice. If you're playing the sneakier rogue character build suggested, though, I heartily suggest the second level to get an evasion. Your reflex will be through the roof with Scout, Ranger, and Rogue all having a good reflex save, and your character being dex-based. The ability to almost completely ignore most area of effect damage is pretty nifty.

PS: Actually, now that I look, Scout gets Evasion -too-...so...no needs for that second rogue level ^^.
#8

tos_shai_hulud

Dec 29, 2008 5:44:49
A monk (Passive WayUA)/rogue (or wilderness rogue, if you prefer the flavor/skill choices) would work well, too.

Race: Human
With 28 point buy, consider this:
Str 15
Dex 14
Con 14
Int 8
Wis 15
Cha 8
1st: Wilderness Rogue (Dodge, Skill Focus: Bluff)
2nd: Monk (Improved Unarmed Strike, Combat Expertise)
3rd: Monk (Mobility, Improved Trip)
4th: Monk (+1 to Str)
5th: Monk
6th: Monk (Ascetic RogueCAd)
7th: Monk (Improved Feint)
8th: Monk (+1 to Wis)
9th: Monk (Elusive Target CW)
10th: Monk

If you are flanking an opponent, then great, because you get 5d6 damage per attack. If you want, you can take two flaws to add in Combat Reflexes and Defensive ThrowCW (Move dodge to a bonus feat from a flaw, mobility moves to a 1st level feat, and Defensive Throw is gained at 3rd level).

When you are not near your opponent, you close the gap very quickly with your 60' move speed. Declare dodge against one opponent. Move such that you provoke an attack of opportunity from that opponent. Once you have provoked, if the attack misses, you get a free trip attempt against that target (if you have Defensive Throw from adding two flaws, you actually get two trip attempts, although one of them takes one of your attack of opportunity slots). If either attempt succeeds, you get an immediate attack against that opponent. If you still have a move action left (which likely, you will, as you have only used a move action so far), you can use it to feint your hopefully prone target. You will have to spend skills cross-class in Bluff for this combo to work, but nonetheless, you should have a +17 to Bluff (minimum) before magic items (13 ranks, +3 from skill focus, +2 from passive way, -1 charisma). Most opponents will not put ranks into Sense Motive, making this a fairly good bet that you will succeed. Now, on your opponent's turn, if he attempts to get up, he provokes an attack of opportunity, allowing you to strike him (he is hopefully denied dex because of your feint last round, allowing you to add 5d6 damage). If he was not tripped, he might make an attack against you. If the attack misses, and you have Defensive Throw, he provokes an attack of opportunity that must be made as a trip attempt. Honestly, this is really what you want, as now, he is denied his dex bonus, activating your Passive Way ability (you get a +4 on the trip attempt). Should your trip attempt succeed now, you get a free bonus attack (from Improved Trip) as though you hadn't made the trip attempt (meaning that the opponent is still denied his dex, but now he is also prone). This makes it extremely easy to hit him!!!

Anyway, continuing the progression, you can continue with monk. At 12th level, you can finally take Stunning Fist that you missed out on all those levels earlier. Now, when your opponent is denied his dex bonus, you can add in a stunning attack (as a sneak attack) to keep your opponent stunned. Likely, he will be prone until he is defeated, taking 5d6 sneak attack with every strike (since your stunning DC goes up when delivering an unarmed sneak attack stunning strike).
#9

true_shinken

Dec 29, 2008 8:36:06
Swift Hunter is probably what you want. There is a pretty good sowrd-axe feat on Complete Warrior, check that.

A build that I always wanted to try was Scout 1/Paladin 4/Dragon Devotee 5/Unseen Seer 10. That's +7d6 skirmish, 12th level Sorcerer casting (on par with a Suel Arcanach), turn undead to fuel Travel Devotion and some very nice fluffs (a sneaky dragonblooded paladin of Bahamut!). Take TWF ftw and enjoy all the goodies of gishness.

At ECL 10, you'd have Scout 1/Paladin 4/Dragon Devotee 3/Unseen Seer 2. Travel Devotion, skirmish +3d6, BAB +8, casting as a 3rd level sorcerer (Wraithstrike and Critical Strike spring to mind... are Burning Sword or Blades of Fire level one spells? I think they are), pretty nice skills and all. Too bad there is not a Swift Knight feat.
#10

pithica

Dec 29, 2008 11:07:22
Have you looked at Jack B Quick?

While I agree with the above posters on the whole swift hunter thing, Axe Sword style is what Jack B Quick specializes in, though he's more of a duelist than a 'charge in and kill em' kind of character.

As far as I know, the above only uses PH/PH2/CW, so if you're short on books, that feat tree is pretty easy to follow.

...Just a thought
#11

demetar_the_mage

Dec 29, 2008 19:45:16
Thanks for all the advice. I apologize for not providing more info. I had an idea of a sort of feral stalker, who had the ability to fight like a savage, but the capacity to be a little more civilized if the situation called for it. I didn't go for a straight ranger because the spellcasting and animal companion were less important to me, and while I probably could of figured something out eventually, I trust you guys here more than I trust myself.

I like Mahrke's build, especially with Tytalus' revision to make it more of a dagger class, however thinking about it, I think that could just be another way to make myself focus too much on the image and less on what is useful, so I'll go with the Tytalus/Mahrke build [Tytalus for revising the order to fit XP penalties]

Thank you to everyone who helped out and major thanks to Mahrke and Tytalus for creating a build that fit what I was looking for perfectly.

---Demetar
#12

kell_kheraptis

Dec 29, 2008 20:26:54
Thanks for all the advice. I apologize for not providing more info. I had an idea of a sort of feral stalker, who had the ability to fight like a savage, but the capacity to be a little more civilized if the situation called for it. I didn't go for a straight ranger because the spellcasting and animal companion were less important to me, and while I probably could of figured something out eventually, I trust you guys here more than I trust myself.

I like Mahrke's build, especially with Tytalus' revision to make it more of a dagger class, however thinking about it, I think that could just be another way to make myself focus too much on the image and less on what is useful, so I'll go with the Tytalus/Mahrke build [Tytalus for revising the order to fit XP penalties]

Thank you to everyone who helped out and major thanks to Mahrke and Tytalus for creating a build that fit what I was looking for perfectly.

---Demetar

"I'm going to walk up and gut you like a fish, and there's not a bloody thing you or anyone else can do about it!" ~ [u]The Uber-Shifter[/u]

If you're into the whole feral nature warrior, that should fit to a T :D