Roleplay: Practical, results oriented wizard. Uses spells as a bag of tricks, instead of blasting away with fireballs. Polymorph, however, won't be used and summoning spells will be used sparingly. Also has a thirst for knowledge (most of his skill points are going into knowledge skills).
Gameplay: If you guys could help me pick my last four feats (three from levels, one from Loremaster secret), and possibly re-arrange my feats and the order I take classes in, that would be great. I think the breakpoints I chose (Wizard 3, Full Master Specialist, Loremaster 7) are the best for what I'm trying to achieve, but optimize those too! Additionally, if you would please comment on Collegiate Wizard (pros/cons) I would appreciate it. I was thinking of dropping it, taking the knowledge skill focus instead, and taking a reserve feat (probably Acid Splatter) at level 3 (taking the crafting feats later).
1 - Wizard 1 - Scribe Scroll (class), Spell Focus [Conjuration] (level), Collegiate Wizard (race)
2 - Wizard 2 -
3 - Wizard 3 - Craft Wondrous Item (level)
4 - Master Specialist 1 - Skill Focus [Spellcraft] (class)
5 - Master Specialist 2 -
6 - Master Specialist 3 - Greater Spell Focus [Conjuration] (class), Craft Wand (level)
7 - Master Specialist 4 -
8 - Master Specialist 5 -
9 - Master Specialist 6 - Skill Focus [Knowledge(arcana)] (level)
10 - Loremaster 1 -
11 - Loremaster 2 -
12 - Loremaster 3 - Feat (level), Feat (class)
13 - Master Specialist 7 -
14 - Master Specialist 8 -
15 - Master Specialist 9 - Feat (level)
16 - Master Specialist 10 -
17 - Loremaster 4 -
18 - Loremaster 5 - Feat (level)
19 - Loremaster 6 -
20 - Loremaster 7 -
Books Available: Player's Handbook, Player's Handbook II, Dungeon Master's Guide, Dungeon Master's Guide II, Monster Manual, Monster Manual II, Complete Arcane, Complete Mage, Complete Scoundrel, Complete Divine, Complete Champion, Complete Warrior, Complete Adventurer, Spell Compendium
Thanks in advance!
-Mike
It gives you
i) Unlimited scouting within 30 ft
ii) Unlimited trap springers
iii) Free flight or waterwalking if your elemental has sufficient strength. Earth gliding is iffy
Collegiate Wizard isn't very good. Try converting those bonus 1st level spells known to scrolls and you have a gp value for that part of the feat. the +2 bonus to 1 specific knowledge is also no big shakes.
You could replace it with either
i) Apprentice (DMG2) - gives you 2 skill points and a +2 bonus to a skill and a bonus class skill. You also get a mentor which may be good or bad. you can convert it into the Mentor feat later if you desire.
ii) Able learner - You can use this to reduce the cost of your cross class skills, though if you purely do knowleges only, it won't be of much help. Consider putting a 1-3 ranks in skills such as sleight of hand and other trained only skills to make your character more diverse (you can give your party skill monkey +2 with a DC 10 check or try seperately from him). Able learner will also help you get sense motive ranks easier, to help defend you from Bluff attacks
You also have a number of craft feats so you might want to explore there. For the crafting feats, you might want to explore craft construct though it would require craft magic arms and armor in addition to craft wondrous. Constructs have a vast number of uses other than just combat and they tend to have a shelf life even after their combat usefulness expires (which you can extend with some tricks)
I personally tend to take the leadership feat but from the looks of your post, you would probably not be too interested.
I am a great fan of Collegiate Wizard as my DM is not too lenient with scrolls or vendors. Four spells per level is quite a bit and if you cannot access magical boutiques or simply don't want to risk suddenly being denied the priviledge of using them, I suggest you take it.
As for feats, I'm a huge fan of Cloudy Conjuration. It's not much of a debuff, but it's free extra battlefield control, especially at low levels - it blocks line of sight as a Fog Cloud does and defines a space your enemies will probably want to avoid, letting you funnel them where you want more easily. I'm also a fan of Sculpt Spell and Invisible Spell; those three feats together will make it very easy for you to make enemies' lives miserable in all kinds of interesting ways without them knowing what's going on. (Although Cityscape isn't on your book list; ask the DM, but it's probably not worth pressing the issue.)
It's my feeling that with Cloudy Conjuration, Acid Splash isn't worth it for a non-sneak-attacker. The damage Acid Splash does is pretty small, and with Cloudy Conjuration even a 0-level slot has some combat utility (Cloudy Conjuration + Caltrops is surprisingly good at making enemies unhappy). The exception is that Acid Splash is marvelous for carving through walls and doors; if you want it for noncombat usage then go right ahead.
Also seconding Spontaneous Divination with a caveat: I have never yet met a DM who allowed the extremely liberal "any divination spell in the game" interpretation. Find out your DM's interpretation first; even if it's restricted to spells in your spellbook it's probably worthwhile but less of a no-brainer.
Here you hit the spot. If you have steady access to the Mage-Mart applying Spontaneous divination to the spells in your spellbook only is a good choice. If you have to resort to Collegiate Wizard, you might not have too many divination spells in your book anyway.
Here you hit the spot. If you have steady access to the Mage-Mart applying Spontaneous divination to the spells in your spellbook only is a good choice. If you have to resort to Collegiate Wizard, you might not have too many divination spells in your book anyway.
Well, that said: Spontaneous Divination does not have to be as good as it possibly could be optimized to in order to be worth taking. It simply has to be better than Loremaster 6+7.
Loremaster 7 is nothing special. You've already got the bonus feat, so another secret is nice but nothing special (at the level you're taking it, another 1st or 2nd level slot is not too great). Loremaster 6 is a slightly harder decision because free Identify is nice.. but at that point you've moved on up to Analyze Dweomer, which has a focus but no expended component. With Spontaneous Divination you never have to prepare it, either; use whatever slots you've got left over at the end of the day to ID everything you've found before going to bed.
Similarly, if you lack control over what non-leveling-up spells you are getting, Spontaneous Divination can help you get mileage out of some of the less valuable ones. Without Spontaneous Divination, a scroll of Detect Undead is kind of a booby prize as treasure goes because you'll never prepare it. With SD.. well, at least if it ever does turn out to be useful, you'll have it.
My first question is about Spontaneous Divination - are there really that many 'good' divinations that I want to slow my entry into Master Specialist / Loremaster for? Or are you suggesting that I sneak in the extra wizard levels (4th and 5th) at a later point?
Next we have Cloudy Conjuration - I did look at this while checking the reserve feats, and I'm just not sure... The cloud only lasts for 1 level. Oh, upon reading it more carefully I have an additional question - does it create a "one-square" cloud, or is it larger?
Finally, "Loremaster 7 is nothing special." Yes, I agree. I definitely want Loremaster 3, but I guess the extra level 1 or 2 spell slot isn't awesome-sauce. So I have Wizard 3, Loremaster 3, Master Specialist 10, still have 4 levels to go. I could definitely do Wizard 5, but I still need two more levels.
I guess I could do Archmage. I don't suppose Spell Focus in two schools of magic can be solved by Spell Focus/ Greater SF (Conjuration). Bleh.
Any suggestions?
Thanks for all the comments so far, really have me thinking. Collegiate Wizard will almost certainly be getting the axe (which sucks because it really fit with the character's background).
Thanks everyone for your great comments.
My first question is about Spontaneous Divination - are there really that many 'good' divinations that I want to slow my entry into Master Specialist / Loremaster for? Or are you suggesting that I sneak in the extra wizard levels (4th and 5th) at a later point?
[...]
I guess I could do Archmage. I don't suppose Spell Focus in two schools of magic can be solved by Spell Focus/ Greater SF (Conjuration). Bleh.
YES. Yes yes, a thousand times, yes. Divination spells are such that you rarely need them. But those situations that you need them, they END the encounter. Done. Finished. Owned. Spontaneous divination, under any interpretation makes you more versatile than batman⁚ could ever imagine. Archmage is awesome. Arcane reach + irresistible dance = gg.
What it has is a ton of spells that are useful in just the right situation. Sleet Storm solves a lot more of an adventurer's problems than Tongues does - but when you need Tongues to solve the problem, Sleet Storm won't do. Spontaneous Divination lets you prepare Sleet Storm for the most common situation, and ditch it for the one you need if the Tongues situation comes up.
My first question is about Spontaneous Divination - are there really that many 'good' divinations that I want to slow my entry into Master Specialist / Loremaster for? Or are you suggesting that I sneak in the extra wizard levels (4th and 5th) at a later point?
The alternate class features for Wizard for giving up the 5th level bonus feat slot are very nice. If Divination isn't your bag - you can also choose to trade it for any domain power (does not have to be a domain power of a God you worship or any such restriction).
Next we have Cloudy Conjuration - I did look at this while checking the reserve feats, and I'm just not sure... The cloud only lasts for 1 level. Oh, upon reading it more carefully I have an additional question - does it create a "one-square" cloud, or is it larger?
You definitely want Cloudy Conjuration
It is 5' radius - which means it's a 4-square cloud. This means 100% concealment from opponents on the other side.
This means you cast, cloudy conjuration in front of you providing full concealment, next turn cloudy conjuration drops, you cast, Cloudy conjuration is back up for 100% concealment again - repeat.
In addition to the more obvious and effective defensive uses - it can also be used as a minor Battlefield Control and Debuff (no save) - and can be activated with a simple cantrip.
Also - as mentioned before - the Summon Elemental Reserve feat is a great choice - Here's 10 reasons you should take it:
1) Use the Earth Elemental to glide through the walls, floor, or ceiling if they are rock and report what's on the other side.
2) Use the Earth Elemental to open any doors/chests etc you think might be trapped.
3) Use the Earth Elemental to test hallways you think might be trapped.
4) Use the Water Elemental to check out the "Murky Water" that seems to be in every dungeon.
5) Use the Water Elemental's Drench ability to put out fires and magical fires
6) Use the Fire Elemental to start Large fires
7) Combat: Use any elemental to flank giving your allies a minor buff
8) Combat: Use the Earth or Air Elemental to "Aid Another" on attacks or AC (90% to succeed)
9) Combat: Use the Earth Elemental to Bull Rush - with a touch attack it will likely hit - the Bull Rush is a long shot of succeeding though - but the chance isn't that bad (Total Bull Rush +2)
10) Combat: Use any elemental to provoke the attacks of opportunity from your enemy - now your allies and summoned creatures are no longer in danger unless the enemy has combat Reflexes. A way to open up your enemy for a Grapple Attempt by a summoned creature.
Finally, "Loremaster 7 is nothing special." Yes, I agree. I definitely want Loremaster 3, but I guess the extra level 1 or 2 spell slot isn't awesome-sauce. So I have Wizard 3, Loremaster 3, Master Specialist 10, still have 4 levels to go. I could definitely do Wizard 5, but I still need two more levels.
I guess I could do Archmage. I don't suppose Spell Focus in two schools of magic can be solved by Spell Focus/ Greater SF (Conjuration). Bleh.
Wizard 5/Master Specialist 10/Loremaster 3/Archmage 2 is a good build.
You can make it work with Collegiate Wizard and still get the other feats suggested if you go all 10 levels of Master Specialist before going into loremaster. This gives you some time to pick up those less valuable item crafting and skill focus feats until later levels.
-Mike
1: Wizard (1) Scribe Scroll (class), Spell Focus [Conjuration] (level), Cloudy Conjuration (race)
2: Wizard (2)
3: Wizard (3) Craft Wondrous Item (level), Collector of Stories Skill Trick
4: Wizard (4)
5: Wizard (5) Spontaneous Domain Alternative Class Feature
6: Master Specialist (1) Skill Focus [Spellcraft] (class), Extend Spell (level)
7: Master Specialist (2)
8: Master Specialist (3) Greater Spell Focus [Conjuration] (class)
9: Master Specialist (4) Summon Elemental (level), Swift Concentration Skill Trick
10: Master Specialist (5) Magical Appraisal Skill Trick
11: Master Specialist (6)
12: Master Specialist (7) Craft Contingent Spell (level)
13: Master Specialist (8)
14: Master Specialist (9)
15: Master Specialist (10) Spell Focus [Illusion] (level)
16: Archmage (1) Shaping,
17: Archmage (2) Arcane Reach,
18: Archmage (3) Quick Spell (level), Spell Power Ability
19: Paragnostic Apostle (1) Mind over Matter Ability
20: Paragnostic Apostle (2) Penetrating Insight Ability
Read a bunch more handbooks (due to comments you guys made) and here's what I came up with (ripped off Treantmonk's formatting from the GOD handbook!). What the hell was I doing with Craft Wand, for example? Dropped Loremaster for Paragnostic Apostle, since it gives me Lore (2xclass levels, not 1x) and more goodies on top. Now that I don't need the three crafting/metamagic feats, I wish I could trade Scribe Scroll for Improved Initiative (the UA variant), but UA isn't allowed. As it stands, do you think I should trade Craft Wondrous or Craft Contingent Spell for more +1 Level Metamagic Feats and then take Arcane Thesis at 18 instead of Quicken? Any comments/suggestions much appreciated. You guys have, as always, been amazing.
-Mike
1: Wizard (1) Scribe Scroll (class), Spell Focus [Conjuration] (level), Cloudy Conjuration (race)
2: Wizard (2)
3: Wizard (3) Craft Wondrous Item (level), Collector of Stories Skill Trick
4: Wizard (4)
5: Wizard (5) Spontaneous Domain Alternative Class Feature
6: Master Specialist (1) Skill Focus [Spellcraft] (class), Extend Spell (level)
7: Master Specialist (2)
8: Master Specialist (3) Greater Spell Focus [Conjuration] (class)
9: Master Specialist (4) Summon Elemental (level), Swift Concentration Skill Trick
10: Master Specialist (5) Magical Appraisal Skill Trick
11: Master Specialist (6)
12: Master Specialist (7) Craft Contingent Spell (level)
13: Master Specialist (8)
14: Master Specialist (9)
15: Master Specialist (10) Spell Focus [Illusion] (level)
16: Archmage (1) Shaping,
17: Archmage (2) Arcane Reach,
18: Archmage (3) Quick Spell (level), Spell Power Ability
19: Paragnostic Apostle (1) Mind over Matter Ability
20: Paragnostic Apostle (2) Penetrating Insight Ability
I would highly recommend Arcane reach at 16 and SLA [timestop] at 17.
I would highly recommend Arcane reach at 16 and SLA [timestop] at 17.
And then take Shaping at 18? or should I stick with Spell Power?
And then take Shaping at 18? or should I stick with Spell Power?
What do you want shaping for?
Plus, the big kicker....its almost impossible NOT to qualify for it on your way to Loremaster. LM requires any Skill Focus:Knowledge. Divine Oracle requires Skill Focus: Knowledge(Religion). So, take 1 feat, count it for both classes, and then recover it with your Loremaster bonus feat.
Wiz5/DO2/LM3/MS5/AM5 would work. Swap levels of AM with MS if you want fewer High Arcanas or whatever. The best secrets to get are the feat, and then probably a toss up between the +2 fort saves and the +1 attack rolls. +1 attack rolls can be nice if you do a lot of ray gunning, and you can NEVER go wrong by having a higher fort save, since those are the saves that KILL you.
Now I just need to start playing the campaign!
>
1) Spontaneous Divination seems ridiculously overpowered as I read it - It says I can replace a prepared spell with any divination spell. It doesn't say it has to be a wizard divination spell, nor does it say it has to be in my spellbook. Am I suddenly able to cast any divination spell in existence (as long as I have a prepared spell of that level or higher) when I take this feat? It seems like it's supposed to be at least class restricted. Does this have an errata?
2) Cloudy Conjuration: Does anyone have any tips/tricks for this?
2b) I'm still confused on how the cloud works WITH the spell effect that causes it. The feat says that they happen at the same time, not before and not after. I understand how the cloud happening before would work (basically it would cause lots of problems due to concealment/lowered saving throws before the spell in question actually effects the target). I understand how the cloud happening after would work. I do NOT understand how the cloud happening at the same time works.
Any info would be much appreciated.
Color spray > Magic Missile!
-Mike
My Turn: Cast Cloud of Bewilderment overlapped with cloudy conjuration
Monster's Turn: Save vs cloud with -2
My Turn: Win.
EDIT: Oh yes, and you're right about colour spray - it's save-or-lose on multiple dudes at early levels.
Well I've started playing, and things are great. I have two questions though:
1) Spontaneous Divination seems ridiculously overpowered as I read it - It says I can replace a prepared spell with any divination spell. It doesn't say it has to be a wizard divination spell, nor does it say it has to be in my spellbook. Am I suddenly able to cast any divination spell in existence (as long as I have a prepared spell of that level or higher) when I take this feat? It seems like it's supposed to be at least class restricted. Does this have an errata?
2) Cloudy Conjuration: Does anyone have any tips/tricks for this?
2b) I'm still confused on how the cloud works WITH the spell effect that causes it. The feat says that they happen at the same time, not before and not after. I understand how the cloud happening before would work (basically it would cause lots of problems due to concealment/lowered saving throws before the spell in question actually effects the target). I understand how the cloud happening after would work. I do NOT understand how the cloud happening at the same time works.
Any info would be much appreciated.
Color spray > Magic Missile!
-Mike
1) No errata, nor do I expect any 3.5 errata from here on. My DM requires you have the spell in your spellbook - which is a balanced houserule IMO (but still a houserule).
2) Throw the cloud right in front of your wizard when you cast. This will give you full concealment (it is a 10' square) until your next turn. Cast again, raise the cloud again.
Use it to debuff enemies. An enemy in the cloud is sickened with no save until they get a chance to move out. This gives them -2 on all saving throws which other casters in your party may enjoy.
2b) Nobody knows - check with your DM. I would recommend not having spell or cloudy conjuration created by said spell affect the results of the other.
Generally, there are several suggestions:
1.Focused Specialist: A class alternative feature for Wizard in Complete Mage, look up the book.
2.Malconvoker: A class in Complete Scoundrel. It can give you the ability to cast evil Conjuration spell and a lot of benifit in the summon subschool.
3.Paragnotic Apostle: A class in Complete Champion. Can imporve your ability in many way. look up the book.
4.Thaumaturgist, : A class for the summoner.
5.Feats for healer: Augment Healing(Complete Divine), Sacred Healing(PHB2);
6.Feats for summoner: A lot....
6.Fields: Creation, Heal, and Summon.