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Help with an interesting build

Post/Author/DateTime Post
#1
shirokiba
Dec 21, 2010 10:10:42 Okay, I'm playing around with swordsage/monk/shadow sun ninja I've already built it up to this point Swordsage 5/Monk 3/ Shadow Sun Ninja 4

I plan to take Shadow Sun Ninja to 10 after that I was planning on going through Fist of Zuoken since my race is Githzerai and was wondering if there was possibly a better class to go into after Shadow Sun Ninja? We're being told to build as uber of a character as we can. The DM pretty much wants us to break the system in tiny little pieces (hence two people are using the risen martyr class -.-) Anyway, any advice on where to progress with this would be appreciated. My feat I currently have are Weapon Finesse, Extra Readied manuever, Exotic Weapons Proficiency (Tiger Claws), Superio Unarmed Strike, Combat Expertise, Superior Finesse

Monk bonus feats: Stunning Fist, Deflect Arrows

Thanks in advance for any help.
#2
ObsidianConspiracy
Dec 21, 2010 16:49:10 Use the unarmed swordsage variant so you can qualify for the monk fist stuff ect... i think that allows you to... though don't quote me.

Though that does mean you won't get stunning fist early on.

Shadow Sun Ninja is great fun, but not a great class IMO... that's not to say it isn't strong. Just I've found a straight swordsage is better
#3
Weezel
Jan 01, 2011 17:04:42 I threw together a SSN build up to mid-level a while back, was using a human base but with flaws you could make up the same feats easily enough.

Monk 1    Ability Focus (Stunning Fist), Weapon Finese, Pharoh's Fist
              Flurry of Blows, AC Bonus, Stunning Fist
Monk 2                      Combat Reflexes, Evasion, Fast Movement +10ft
Dark Moon Monk 3    Pain Touch, Darkvision 60ft
Monk 4                  Holy Strike, Wall Walker 20ft
Planar Monk 5          Resistant Body
Monk 6       Improved Natural Attack, Fast Movement +20ft, Wall Walker 30ft,
                                 Improved Trip
Dark Moon Monk 7     Shadow Blend
Monk 8        Wall Walker 40ft
Swordsage 1       Superior Unarmed Strike, Discipline Focus (Weapon Focus) Stone Dragon
ShadowSunNinja 1    Fast Movement +30ft, Touch of the Shadow Sun
ShadowSunNinja 2    Flame of the Shadow Sun
ShadowSunNinja 3    Adaptive Style
Swordsage 2
+ more swordsage

The idea is to be able to dump Str and focus on Dex/Wis as your main stats (using weapon finese to land hits). At lvl.11 you should have maxed out your base unarmed damage (effective monk level 11 (monk8+ssn3) plus 4 from SUS and 5 from Monk's Belt), which is pumped up with an Englarge Person (item or spell effect, even potions work) and a Greater Mighty Wallop from your party mage. Should work out to something like 10d6 unarmed damage if I recall the progression correctly.

So the idea is to have a verasile combatant, that can alternatively use Touch of the Shadow sun to deal a decent amount of negative energy damage as a touch attack (also providing healing the next turn), or disable groups of enemies using Stunning Fist with Pharoh's Fist and Pain Touch combined (5ft radius effect that will stun mobs for 2 turns). And when up against a single tough target you have your flurry of blows, for fights where you get to stand next to an opponent more than 1 turn at a time

This build uses the Dark Moon Monk alternate class levels, which only give d6 hd but provide darkvision at 3rd, and the excellent shadow blend at 7th level, which grants you concealment (50% miss chance) as long as you are not in a fully illuminated area (so avoid wide open fields and you get it basically all the time). Also using the alternate Holy Strike (replaces Ki Strike), and wall walker instead of slow fall (running up walls is better than falling down walls!).

Be sure to be enlarged for reach, and it's not a bad idea to carry a glaive as well for the extra reach. That was you can threaten 15ft, and with combat reflexes + improved trip that lets you do a little BFC. The +30ft movement bonus should let you get up in the enemy's face easily ehough.

Your martial moves would be focused more on counters and boosts, probably with a setting sun throw or two in there for extra BFC (and throwing people off cliffs). Because the first swordsage level comes in late, you can pick up 3rd level moves straight away, though the first stance has to be 1st level. I'd suggest picking up an item to grant Assassin's Stance for 3000gp right away, and later on picking up a stance like Hearing the Air.

Anyway, i know the levels are a bit different to what you already listed in your post, but IMO the Shadow Sun Ninja is nicely combined with more of the monk's unarmed and stunning fist abilities than with straight-up swordsage. Hope this is of some help!

**note -- why do you have EWP when you'd do more damage unarmed?
#4
Weezel
Jan 01, 2011 17:07:19 Probably should have asked this before posting all that....   what level is the game starting at? My build suggestion only really gets going in the mid-level.

Post/Author/DateTime	Post
#1 shirokiba Dec 21, 2010 10:10:42	Okay, I'm playing around with swordsage/monk/shadow sun ninja I've already built it up to this point Swordsage 5/Monk 3/ Shadow Sun Ninja 4 I plan to take Shadow Sun Ninja to 10 after that I was planning on going through Fist of Zuoken since my race is Githzerai and was wondering if there was possibly a better class to go into after Shadow Sun Ninja? We're being told to build as uber of a character as we can. The DM pretty much wants us to break the system in tiny little pieces (hence two people are using the risen martyr class -.-) Anyway, any advice on where to progress with this would be appreciated. My feat I currently have are Weapon Finesse, Extra Readied manuever, Exotic Weapons Proficiency (Tiger Claws), Superio Unarmed Strike, Combat Expertise, Superior Finesse Monk bonus feats: Stunning Fist, Deflect Arrows Thanks in advance for any help.
#2 ObsidianConspiracy Dec 21, 2010 16:49:10	Use the unarmed swordsage variant so you can qualify for the monk fist stuff ect... i think that allows you to... though don't quote me. Though that does mean you won't get stunning fist early on. Shadow Sun Ninja is great fun, but not a great class IMO... that's not to say it isn't strong. Just I've found a straight swordsage is better
#3 Weezel Jan 01, 2011 17:04:42	I threw together a SSN build up to mid-level a while back, was using a human base but with flaws you could make up the same feats easily enough. Monk 1 Ability Focus (Stunning Fist), Weapon Finese, Pharoh's Fist Flurry of Blows, AC Bonus, Stunning Fist Monk 2 Combat Reflexes, Evasion, Fast Movement +10ft Dark Moon Monk 3 Pain Touch, Darkvision 60ft Monk 4 Holy Strike, Wall Walker 20ft Planar Monk 5 Resistant Body Monk 6 Improved Natural Attack, Fast Movement +20ft, Wall Walker 30ft, Improved Trip Dark Moon Monk 7 Shadow Blend Monk 8 Wall Walker 40ft Swordsage 1 Superior Unarmed Strike, Discipline Focus (Weapon Focus) Stone Dragon ShadowSunNinja 1 Fast Movement +30ft, Touch of the Shadow Sun ShadowSunNinja 2 Flame of the Shadow Sun ShadowSunNinja 3 Adaptive Style Swordsage 2 + more swordsage The idea is to be able to dump Str and focus on Dex/Wis as your main stats (using weapon finese to land hits). At lvl.11 you should have maxed out your base unarmed damage (effective monk level 11 (monk8+ssn3) plus 4 from SUS and 5 from Monk's Belt), which is pumped up with an Englarge Person (item or spell effect, even potions work) and a Greater Mighty Wallop from your party mage. Should work out to something like 10d6 unarmed damage if I recall the progression correctly. So the idea is to have a verasile combatant, that can alternatively use Touch of the Shadow sun to deal a decent amount of negative energy damage as a touch attack (also providing healing the next turn), or disable groups of enemies using Stunning Fist with Pharoh's Fist and Pain Touch combined (5ft radius effect that will stun mobs for 2 turns). And when up against a single tough target you have your flurry of blows, for fights where you get to stand next to an opponent more than 1 turn at a time This build uses the Dark Moon Monk alternate class levels, which only give d6 hd but provide darkvision at 3rd, and the excellent shadow blend at 7th level, which grants you concealment (50% miss chance) as long as you are not in a fully illuminated area (so avoid wide open fields and you get it basically all the time). Also using the alternate Holy Strike (replaces Ki Strike), and wall walker instead of slow fall (running up walls is better than falling down walls!). Be sure to be enlarged for reach, and it's not a bad idea to carry a glaive as well for the extra reach. That was you can threaten 15ft, and with combat reflexes + improved trip that lets you do a little BFC. The +30ft movement bonus should let you get up in the enemy's face easily ehough. Your martial moves would be focused more on counters and boosts, probably with a setting sun throw or two in there for extra BFC (and throwing people off cliffs). Because the first swordsage level comes in late, you can pick up 3rd level moves straight away, though the first stance has to be 1st level. I'd suggest picking up an item to grant Assassin's Stance for 3000gp right away, and later on picking up a stance like Hearing the Air. Anyway, i know the levels are a bit different to what you already listed in your post, but IMO the Shadow Sun Ninja is nicely combined with more of the monk's unarmed and stunning fist abilities than with straight-up swordsage. Hope this is of some help! **note -- why do you have EWP when you'd do more damage unarmed?
#4 Weezel Jan 01, 2011 17:07:19	Probably should have asked this before posting all that.... what level is the game starting at? My build suggestion only really gets going in the mid-level.